Spiritual experiences.

[Carl Emerson]

I have noticed members feel uncomfortable when one shares about ones encounters with Jesus and how He has impacted our lives.

In some cases it is because folks don't believe He does that stuff in this age - we just have the bible and our belief - there should be no talk of healings or anything miraculous - in fact those who claim such are considered deceived.

I posted part of my testimony here Jesus's Ministry not to draw attention to myself but to encourage others that there is a dynamic life to be lived with Him - He is the same yesterday, today and forever.

Here is a typical post from a member...
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Men today have all kinds of spiritual experiences; That does not mean they are correct in what they are doing.

I believe faith is not based on experience, but faith comes by hearing and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).
===============

Now the scripture he quotes - in the Greek - refers to faith coming from hearing a 'word of Christ'. Now this is commonly thought to be Scripture but the original language does not support this. What is meant is a living word from Jesus.

And this is the rub...

We have many teachers but very few fathers - why - because fathers have experience and teachers have knowledge.

I note that when Paul went to Jerusalem to testify concerning his ministry, he presented what was happening, not his theology.

It is a matter of some walk on the road and others study the map.

Those who walk on the road have to hear Jesus speak in order to be doing His appointed works.

Those who study Scripture want you works to align with their theology.

I have arrived at the age when I don't care so much about what folks think - I have spoken to many who have encountered Jesus directly in this age but wont talk about it. This is because such experiences don't fit the neat theology of our teachers.

So I will continue to share my walk with Jesus because I believe many have been 'short changed' into believing there is nothing valid beyond what the bible actually says, when there is a world of opportunity to walk with Him in obedience which brings Glory to Him and attracts the unsaved into the Kingdom.

 

[Amittai]

...

We have many teachers but very few fathers - why - because fathers have experience and teachers have knowledge.

I note that when Paul went to Jerusalem to testify concerning his ministry, he presented what was happening, not his theology.

It is a matter of some walk on the road and others study the map.

Those who walk on the road have to hear Jesus speak in order to be doing His appointed works.

Those who study Scripture want you works to align with their theology.

...

I think that the disciples in Damascus revealed excellent theology to Paul. Peter had a bad moment when he lost his vision about the application of the law to gentiles. We'll all need each other to feed into each other. Some of those who don't see unexpected remissions and don't pray (in conjunction with others) in a rounded way, instinctively realised that some triumphalists were omitting parts of the truth but couldn't sufficiently apply the lesson in their own field of specialism as well.

Thank you for drawing attention to your other thread which I hadn't spotted. I have posted to it about Jonah and Rev 3:20.

The current circumstances afford God a test whether we are seeking out our brother. To feed him is to exercise him (to pass on the example in continuing repentance and interceding) and help him gain his crown.

 

[TruthSeek3r]

I've never had an undeniable spiritual experience myself, but I've spent countless hours watching and reading hundreds of testimonies of spiritual experiences from other people. This includes testimonies of miraculous healings, intense paranormal activity, demonic oppression, demonic deliverances, mystical experiences, people being led by the Holy Spirit to talk to a complete stranger with a super specific message that there is no way he or she could've known that, testimonies of baptism of the Holy Spirit, people seeing demons and/or angels, astonishing conversion testimonies of people leaving Islam, New Age, Satanism, Witchcraft, etc. People with deeply rooted addictions having powerful born-again experiences that set them free from their addictions immediately like they were nothing, etc.

Feel free to check out this link for many testimonies like this.

 

[Dave G.]

Above I agreed with your post. To a degree the living God certainly interacts with us. I've had many experiences myself but we shouldn't just blatantly trust all experiences that seem beyond the natural and associate them with God. Somehow we need to test the spirit behind it. Because not every experience is from God. On the other hand scripture is true, it's safe so to speak. We may not be deceived by an experience but we could be, Satan is a mocker and deceiver and can come as if good light. And God can come as a powerful force sometimes. The message isn't always clear or we learn the meaning two years later or even later in life etc....

People shouldn't be caused to fear telling of experiences though because some are the real deal. As I said I've had many myself, plus am a bible reader.

 

[Anthony2019]

I believe that the Christian faith was always meant to be experiential. We only have to look at the Lord's promises in the scriptures:
He gives strength to the weary (Isaiah 40:29-31)
He protects (Joshua 1:9)
He gives us peace (Phillipians 4:6-7)
He gives us good gifts (Matthew 7:9-11)
He is our Helper (John 14:15-16)
He promises to draw near to us (James 4:8)
He gives us joy (Psalm 16:19)
It is undeniable that throughout the history of Christianity, God has touched people's lives in very profound ways. He has turned some of the hardest sinners into saints, He has healed people of all kinds of illnesses and infirmities, He has given his people visions, gifts of teaching and preaching,

 

[HatGuy]

I have noticed members feel uncomfortable when one shares about ones encounters with Jesus and how He has impacted our lives.

In some cases it is because folks don't believe He does that stuff in this age - we just have the bible and our belief - there should be no talk of healings or anything miraculous - in fact those who claim such are considered deceived.

I posted part of my testimony here Jesus's Ministry not to draw attention to myself but to encourage others that there is a dynamic life to be lived with Him - He is the same yesterday, today and forever.

Here is a typical post from a member...
===============
Men today have all kinds of spiritual experiences; That does not mean they are correct in what they are doing.

I believe faith is not based on experience, but faith comes by hearing and hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17).
===============

Now the scripture he quotes - in the Greek - refers to faith coming from hearing a 'word of Christ'. Now this is commonly thought to be Scripture but the original language does not support this. What is meant is a living word from Jesus.

And this is the rub...

We have many teachers but very few fathers - why - because fathers have experience and teachers have knowledge.

I note that when Paul went to Jerusalem to testify concerning his ministry, he presented what was happening, not his theology.

It is a matter of some walk on the road and others study the map.

Those who walk on the road have to hear Jesus speak in order to be doing His appointed works.

Those who study Scripture want you works to align with their theology.

I have arrived at the age when I don't care so much about what folks think - I have spoken to many who have encountered Jesus directly in this age but wont talk about it. This is because such experiences don't fit the neat theology of our teachers.

So I will continue to share my walk with Jesus because I believe many have been 'short changed' into believing there is nothing valid beyond what the bible actually says, when there is a world of opportunity to walk with Him in obedience which brings Glory to Him and attracts the unsaved into the Kingdom.

I've come to think that Romans 10:17 refers to the gospel of Jesus (the "message / word of Christ").

The trouble with experience is a lot of people find that, when they experience nothing, they doubt whether they are saved or whether God loves them. So while I can say there might be experience, I don't think we can say there should.

 

[Francis Drake]

I have no interest in a mere theological walk.
In my view these people are like those who have an instruction book on how to swim, can shout all sorts of instructions from the side, but never get their feet wet in the water.

I have thousands of testimonies small and large going back to the early 60s when I first heard God speak, a good 10 years before I heard the gospel.
My walk with God is so exciting, like living on an amazing joy filled roller coaster.
And my wife and I have been to church for over 10 years now!!!

 

[TruthSeek3r]

I've come to think that Romans 10:17 refers to the gospel of Jesus (the "message / word of Christ").

The trouble with experience is a lot of people find that, when they experience nothing, they doubt whether they are saved or whether God loves them. So while I can say there might be experience, I don't think we can say there should.

For salvation I think you are right, but for the great commission the baptism of the Holy Spirit should be a must, and that is definitely an experience:

Acts 1:4-8

4 On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. 5 For John baptized with[a] water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”
6 Then they gathered around him and asked him, “Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?”
7 He said to them: “It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority. 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.”​

 

[HatGuy]

For salvation I think you are right, but for the great commission the baptism of the Holy Spirit should be a must, and that is definitely an experience:

Acts 1:4-8

4 On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command: “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. 5 For John baptized with[a] water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.”
6 Then they gathered around him and asked him, “Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?”
7 He said to them: “It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority. 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.”​

Yeah I get it, but Charismatics these days are more interested in the experience and the gifting itself rather than its purpose. Have you noticed how many churches advertise a "worship experience" of their Sundays? What's that about?

 

[Amittai]

There aren't supposed to be any dichotomies here. The disciples in Damascus gave Paul excellent theology. Isn't that what God intended them to do?

 

[Amittai]

Look at the man (in the other thread) who was in a hurry for his dinner and God made the child at the next table well so the restaurant (as well as that family) wouldn't have to cope with any extraneous incident.

That's an "experience". No-one got anyone worked up or "excited".

Tech companies and shops that are wheedling about our "experience" are only copying the wheedling of the (often minor) celebrities in their high profile churches these 40 years.

 

[Amittai]

...
My walk with God is so exciting, like living on an amazing joy filled roller coaster. ...

A generous interpretation of this is rather tangential.

 

[TruthSeek3r]

Yeah I get it, but Charismatics these days are more interested in the experience and the gifting itself rather than its purpose. Have you noticed how many churches advertise a "worship experience" of their Sundays? What's that about?

So you agree that there is an experience, it's just that you don't agree with the erroneous focus given to experiences in some Charismatic groups, right?

 

[Carl Emerson]

I have no interest in a mere theological walk.
In my view these people are like those who have an instruction book on how to swim, can shout all sorts of instructions from the side, but never get their feet wet in the water.

I have thousands of testimonies small and large going back to the early 60s when I first heard God speak, a good 10 years before I heard the gospel.
My walk with God is so exciting, like living on an amazing joy filled roller coaster.
And my wife and I have been to church for over 10 years now!!!

Yes and Amen... You described it very well...

 

[Carl Emerson]

I've come to think that Romans 10:17 refers to the gospel of Jesus (the "message / word of Christ").

The trouble with experience is a lot of people find that, when they experience nothing, they doubt whether they are saved or whether God loves them. So while I can say there might be experience, I don't think we can say there should.

Is this not experiencial???

1 Jn 2:

26These things I have written to you concerning those who are trying to deceive you. 27As for you, the anointing which you received from Him abides in you, and you have no need for anyone to teach you; but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you abide in Him.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Yeah I get it, but Charismatics these days are more interested in the experience and the gifting itself rather than its purpose. Have you noticed how many churches advertise a "worship experience" of their Sundays? What's that about?

Yes, that is a different topic I think...

 

[Carl Emerson]

There aren't supposed to be any dichotomies here. The disciples in Damascus gave Paul excellent theology. Isn't that what God intended them to do?

Yes but one is not a substitute for the other...

 

[HatGuy]

So you agree that there is an experience, it's just that you don't agree with the erroneous focus given to experiences in some Charismatic groups, right?

Well, I think that there are a number of things going on, but one of the things is that a lot of Charismatics have practically hinged their assurance of their salvation on their experiences. But when the experiences disappear or grow cold, or if they have a similar experience with something not necessarily related to Christianity, it's like their foundation is ripped out from them and they question whether God loves them still or whether it was all real in the first place.

That's why I think it's good to say one "can" have an experience, but not that one "should". I've often seen Christians judged by a lack of experience too - if you experience less then your commitment to Jesus is questioned, or your passion is under question, and the most mature Christians are those with the most "experiences".

 

[HatGuy]

Is this not experiencial???

1 Jn 2:

26These things I have written to you concerning those who are trying to deceive you. 27As for you, the anointing which you received from Him abides in you, and you have no need for anyone to teach you; but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you abide in Him.

Well yes, everything is an experience, broadly speaking, but what kind of experience is being described here?

 

[HatGuy]

I'm not sure, however, if this is the right forum for debating - I don't mean to debate and apologise if it's out of place.