~ Son wants to join a death metal band ~

[faroukfarouk]

I understood you the first time... I just don't agree. I think "Christian death metal" is an oxymoron and the origins were to give glory to that which stands opposed to the true God. Sorry... that is just how I see it.

I see; but in my humble judgment the example of lyrics is actually Biblical and challenging. (I don't come from a mindset that wants to police other people's styles, whether musical or whatever.) We'll just have to remain with our different viewpoints, friend.

 

[brinny]

The lyrics are discernibly Christian.

See post #18.

 

[faroukfarouk]

See post #18.

Are you saying (seemingly) with Ken Rank that the musical style is more important than the lyrics and that any lyrics in what one person thinks is the "wrong" style are therefore projected to a state of valuelessness to everyone, even if the lyrics are strongly Biblical?

 

[Ken Rank]

I see; but in my humble judgment the example of lyrics is actually Biblical and challenging. (I don't come from a mindset that wants to police other people's styles, whether musical or whatever.) We'll just have to remain with our different viewpoints, friend.

That's fine.... if you read the OP, his wife, it sounds, has the same view I do. And mine as stated is... you don't take something designed to take from God's name (reputation, character, authority) and change the meaning and assume it will now add to His name.

If you like metal.. like metal... I don't care. I was thinking about his wife, not you.

 

[Ken Rank]

Are you saying (seemingly) with Ken Rank that the musical style is more important than the lyrics and that any lyrics in what one person thinks is the "wrong" style are therefore projected to a state of valuelessness to everyone, even if the lyrics are strongly Biblical?

Did you know that certain music groups are not allowed to be played in certain Christians cultures because the style of the drumming is exactly the same in those (seemingly harmless) songs as it is in songs designs to summon foul spirits or pay homage to a pagan god?

Heavy metal was designed by satanists, atheists and secularists to rebel against authority... including God. You change the words and now it is suddenly pleasing to the Father's ears? I just don't see it that way and won't. You would have just as hard a time with this as trying to convince me that abortion should be ok.

 

[brinny]

Are you saying (seemingly) with Ken Rank that the musical style is more important than the lyrics and that any lyrics in what one person thinks is the "wrong" style are therefore projected to a state of valuelessness to everyone, even if the lyrics are strongly Biblical?

I asked you why it's called "Christian DEATH metal". ken's responses to you are spot on, especially since we are responding to a member who's wife is concerned about her son's spiritual condition, and there is disagreement between the Op and his wife.

We all need to be verrrry careful here and halt these wheels. In no way whatsoever should there be any disrespect for this man's wife or any belittle-ment of her concerns.

As i asked before, why is it called "Christian DEATH metal"?

Thank you kindly.

 

[faroukfarouk]

... as trying to convince me that abortion should be ok.

Frankly, most Christians would regard the singing of these lyrics, on the one hand:

"The Son of God
Who has come to take the sins of the world
He was crucified
For all our sins and iniquities, like a lamb led to be slaughtered
He was in the world, and the world was made by Him,
And the world knew Him not
Persecuted and defamed like a malefactor
Cursed for the goodness of His acts
Finally sentenced to the uttermost death
No one knew what this man was intended to do
The Son of God
Who has come to take the sins of the world"

... and abortion - a subject you have introduced - as being categorical matters of apples and oranges in their dissimilarity.

We are not getting anywhere in this discussion, friend.

 

[Ken Rank]

I asked you why it's called "Christian DEATH metal". ken's responses to you are spot on, especially since we are responding to a member who's wife is concerned about her son's spiritual condition, and there is disagreement between the Op and his wife.

We all need to be verrrry careful here and halt these wheels. In no way whatsoever should there be any disrespect for this man's wife or any belittle-ment of her concerns.

As i asked before, why is it called "Christian DEATH metal"?

Thank you kindly.

This is why I asked him to start a new thread... this is NOT the place for this. Time to move on... unless CoolDude chimes back in. Blessings brinny.

 

[faroukfarouk]

I asked you why it's called "Christian DEATH metal". ken's responses to you are spot on, especially since we are responding to a member who's wife is concerned about her son's spiritual condition, and there is disagreement between the Op and his wife.

We all need to be verrrry careful here and halt these wheels. In no way whatsoever should there be any disrespect for this man's wife or any belittle-ment of her concerns.

As i asked before, why is it called "Christian DEATH metal"?

Thank you kindly.

It's a style. The name of a style. 'Christian' refers to the sort of lyrics.

 

[Ken Rank]

Frankly, most Christians would regard the singing of these lyrics, on the one hand:

"The Son of God
Who has come to take the sins of the world
He was crucified
For all our sins and iniquities, like a lamb led to be slaughtered
He was in the world, and the world was made by Him,
And the world knew Him not
Persecuted and defamed like a malefactor
Cursed for the goodness of His acts
Finally sentenced to the uttermost death
No one knew what this man was intended to do
The Son of God
Who has come to take the sins of the world"

... and abortion - a subject you have introduced - as being categorical matters of apples and oranges in their dissimilarity.

We are not getting anywhere in this discussion, friend.

I took one extreme to make a point to show how extreme the other is. You have no chance to convince me abortion is ok... that was used as a TOOL to depict how little of a chance you have to convince me that heavy metal and praise to a holy and righteous God is ok. It isn't to me anymore than celebrating Halloween is because somebody changed the meaning to something related to Christianity.

What's next... throw our children in the fires of Molech but claim it is being done to the glory of the TRUE GOD?

 

[brinny]

This is why I asked him to start a new thread... this is NOT the place for this. Time to move on... unless CoolDude chimes back in. Blessings brinny.

God bless you too Ken.

 

[faroukfarouk]

I took one extreme to make a point to show how extreme the other is. You have no chance to convince me abortion is ok... that was used as a TOOL to depict how little of a chance you have to convince me that heavy metal and praise to a holy and righteous God is ok. It isn't to me anymore than celebrating Halloween is because somebody changed the meaning to something related to Christianity.

What's next... throw our children in the fires of Molech but claim it is being done to the glory of the TRUE GOD?

Actually I don't 'celebrate' Halloween, or - what was it? - throw children into the fires of Molech, etc.

The sort of thing I do identify with is likely already clear, such as the Biblical lyrics I quoted above from the band Renascent.

 

[Kit Sigmon]

Hey everyone, I would like to get some opinions from others on something. Our son (18) is a very talented drummer but he's only interested in one type of music - that hardcore death metal stuff.

Is your son a christian?

Well, a talented local band recently contacted him seeking a drummer and he wants to join them. He's obviously not a Christian, nor are any of the band members, so my wife is having an issue with this and doesn't want him to join. I have an opposite view of this but would like opinions. I say let him join and learn from the experience while we pray for his safety and leave it in God's hands. If we don't let him he will rebel and his talents will go to waste.

If he joins and gets the exposure then maybe some other band might discover him, which may lead to bigger and better things, or even guys who might be Christians. There are Christian metal bands. He claims he doesn't even care about the lyrics which I get, you can't even understand them and he says he just likes it because he can play fast.

I looked up the guys on FB and they are the typical kids. No, they aren't Christian and they do some cussing and normal fallen-world behavior stuff but that's expected. Nothing they were posting really surprised me. They don't post stuff like Satan worship or anything extreme going against God. Really, there's no mention of religion in their posts so they're typical lost souls like most of the world.

Now, I haven't listened to their lyrics because I can't understand that type of scream singing and I can't find their words online. Anyway, what I'd like to do is invite the group over the our home and show an example and get to know them. After all, who am I to judge? The problem is the wife wants absolutely no part of that. She's quick to judge so-to-speak.

What the Bible speaks against is judging hypocritically.


Any advice on how to handle this or what to say to my wife? I'd really like to meet these guys and I don't want to keep denying our talented son from enjoying his gift God has given him.

What if you helped your son by sharing his talents with other groups? record
your son playing the drums and put it on social media, send to music labels/
bands/groups, talent scouts etc?
You all believe in your son and his talent, put your words into action...help
your son to find a suitable place to display his talent.

 

[brinny]

It's a style. The name of a style. 'Christian' refers to the sort of lyrics.

"Christian DEATH metal" backs up everything that Ken has already posted about.

Let's step very carefully here, and think reeeeeally hard what exactly is being defended here.

Praying for the OP and his wife and their son.

 

[tryintogrow]

I think Paul's advice in 1 Corinthians 8 can help us here. Some people can hear Christian music in any style and feel just fine about it. Other people can be more sensitive. Neither is more right nor wrong than the other. We all have to obey our personal convictions.

As for the OP, the original question was, in essence, how to get a prudish wife to come around. I agree with @brinny that it's extremely dangerous to go out in public talking that way about a spouse. That's a big open door for division to enter. If the son is himself already not a Christian, it's understandable that the mom would be worried.

My advice to the OP is to not argue with his wife. Having them over to your house for a jam session will not achieve much if your house is ice cold from reluctance and disagreement. And if the son is not a believer, he won't exactly be witnessing to them anyway.

I would take a passive approach (at least for now) in saying you can't stop him but you agree with your wife that you won't subsidize it. Then wait to see how God develops it. If they turn out to be nice boys, and God opens doors, your wife will eventually notice. If the whole thing turns out to be a dead end, let the door close on its own, and you won't have to hear her say she told you so.

 

[CoolDude68]

Hey guys, no need to argue about music styles, this isn't about that right now. I've listened to the Christian version of "metalcore" music and I don't know if it's called "deathcore" or not, but it sounds exactly the same and I personally don't like it but the words are also different. Is it pleasing to God? I can't answer that. To me, it's disturbing but that's my personal music taste. Regardless, the band my son wants to join is a traditional "metalcore" band, not a Christian band. So, the lyrics are not really positive.

Now back to the original point...

My wife doesn't want him to join, I think we shouldn't hold him back and to pray to God for protection and allow my son to make his own choices. We can meet the band members as human beings (which they are) and there's our opportunity to lead by example and also a chance to witness, or plant seeds in a subtle way, not force anything. I don't even know these guys, nor does my wife. They might be really cool and loving kids who just prefer that style of music. Again, we are never to judge.

 

[Faith Alone 1 Cor 15:1-4]

Hey everyone, I would like to get some opinions from others on something. Our son (18) is a very talented drummer but he's only interested in one type of music - that hardcore death metal stuff.

Well, a talented local band recently contacted him seeking a drummer and he wants to join them. He's obviously not a Christian, nor are any of the band members, so my wife is having an issue with this and doesn't want him to join. I have an opposite view of this but would like opinions. I say let him join and learn from the experience while we pray for his safety and leave it in God's hands. If we don't let him he will rebel and his talents will go to waste. If he joins and gets the exposure then maybe some other band might discover him, which may lead to bigger and better things, or even guys who might be Christians. There are Christian metal bands. He claims he doesn't even care about the lyrics which I get, you can't even understand them and he says he just likes it because he can play fast.

I looked up the guys on FB and they are the typical kids. No, they aren't Christian and they do some cussing and normal fallen-world behavior stuff but that's expected. Nothing they were posting really surprised me. They don't post stuff like Satan worship or anything extreme going against God. Really, there's no mention of religion in their posts so they're typical lost souls like most of the world.

Now, I haven't listened to their lyrics because I can't understand that type of scream singing and I can't find their words online. Anyway, what I'd like to do is invite the group over the our home and show an example and get to know them. After all, who am I to judge? The problem is the wife wants absolutely no part of that. She's quick to judge so-to-speak.

Any advice on how to handle this or what to say to my wife? I'd really like to meet these guys and I don't want to keep denying our talented son from enjoying his gift God has given him.

Salvation is more important than being scared of him engaging in some sort of bands , first make sure he is saved , ask him if he believes in Christ , show him these verses :

1 John 5:13
John 3:3
Rom 3:23
Rom 6:23
Rev 20:14
Acts 16:30-31
John 3:16
2 Cor 5:21
1 Cor 15:1-4
Eph 2:8-9
1 Peter 1 18-19
Eph 1:13


You want to be first sure that he is not damned to hell because of unbeliev , before you ever think that he is doing some wicked stuff , because even if he was good person he would still go to hell by him alone .
It's like buying a used car , you want to make sure that engine works before you even consider what is looks like inside or outside , or what it need to be changed for it to work properly , without engine even if you restored that car to be perfect it would still not drive .

So make sure your son has Christ engine inside him before anything else .
Worst case scenario for you would be when you were in heaven and knew that your son is burning in hell , because you did not tell him the gospel (1 Cor 15:1-4) . And it would be forever and ever . Not trying to scary you just saying the truth . If this is true in Revelation what could happen , can you imagine from heaven watching your son left behind on earth slowly dying then after that pain going to hell to have even more pain ?

Then after you are sure he is saved , you can tell him that every time he does something bad , he is losing or gaining his inheritance in heaven based on - good works ( sharing , caring for other ) or bad works ( cursing , idolatory , satanistic music ect ) .

 

[CoolDude68]

What if you helped your son by sharing his talents with other groups? record
your son playing the drums and put it on social media, send to music labels/
bands/groups, talent scouts etc?
You all believe in your son and his talent, put your words into action...help
your son to find a suitable place to display his talent.

Been there, done that. The problem is he only wants to play "metalcore" style music and will not budge or open his mind to anything else right now. He's not matured yet into anything else.

 

[CoolDude68]

We can't force religion on him right now, he's not ready. I've tried some and it's not his time. I'm letting God handle that one at the moment.

 

[brinny]

Hey guys, no need to argue about music styles, this isn't about that right now. I've listened to the Christian version of "metalcore" music and I don't know if it's called "deathcore" or not, but it sounds exactly the same and I personally don't like it but the words are also different. Is it pleasing to God? I can't answer that. To me, it's disturbing but that's my personal music taste. Regardless, the band my son wants to join is a traditional "metalcore" band, not a Christian band. So, the lyrics are not really positive.

Now back to the original point...

My wife doesn't want him to join, I think we shouldn't hold him back and to pray to God for protection and allow my son to make his own choices. We can meet the band members as human beings (which they are) and there's our opportunity to lead by example and also a chance to witness, or plant seeds in a subtle way, not force anything. I don't even know these guys, nor does my wife. They might be really cool and loving kids who just prefer that style of music. Again, we are never to judge.

Honoring and respecting your wife and presenting as a united front, as one (for your sake, your wife's, and ultimately your son's) is more important than if your son joins a band or not, regardless of what kind of band it is.

Praying.