Sodom and Gomorrah
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fromdownunder said:
In 1955, researcher H.K. Beecher published his groundbreaking paper "The Powerful Placebo," in which he concluded that, across the 26 studies he analyzed, an average of 32 percent of patients responded to placebo.
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JohnR7 said:
You misread what I wrote. You are wrong. I have evidence that your original statistics are incorrect.
Norm
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LittleNipper
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LittleNipper
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The story of Sodom & Gomorrah is very interesting. It is more then just GOD punishing a bunch of horney perverts. The last city mentioned is Zoar. Zoar meaning little. Apparently Lot asked that GOD spare Zoar so he'd hava a place to stay and because it was such a little place near by. GOD relented and spared Zoar, but what happened to the other cities and his wife, so rattled Lot, that he eventually fled to the mountains with his daughters to live in a cave. This is found in Genesis 19:17-30
Lot's daughters were under the impression that all humanity was wiped out. So they get their father drunk and have relations with him
over a two day period. See Genesis 19:31-38 We are reminded of Noah found in Genesis 9:20-25. Now Lot's daughters WERE married, but it would seem that either the husbands had ignored their wives for a roll with the boys or they were simply engaged, compare Genesis 19:8 with Genesis 19:14. It is possible that Lot lied in verse 8 in an attempt to steer the men of the city away from the angels, or again , the husbands might have been preoccupied. In any case they both died in the city. I can imagine them both saying, "Don't be such a little silly, Pops. We both just got new apparel and you're spoiling all our fun. We're expecting Will & Grace to arrive any minute. My that Will is a cute little looker."
Lot's daughters were under the impression that all humanity was wiped out. So they get their father drunk and have relations with him
over a two day period. See Genesis 19:31-38 We are reminded of Noah found in Genesis 9:20-25. Now Lot's daughters WERE married, but it would seem that either the husbands had ignored their wives for a roll with the boys or they were simply engaged, compare Genesis 19:8 with Genesis 19:14. It is possible that Lot lied in verse 8 in an attempt to steer the men of the city away from the angels, or again , the husbands might have been preoccupied. In any case they both died in the city. I can imagine them both saying, "Don't be such a little silly, Pops. We both just got new apparel and you're spoiling all our fun. We're expecting Will & Grace to arrive any minute. My that Will is a cute little looker."
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JohnR7 said:
How does the existence of Sodom and Gomorrah prove anything regarding the bible?
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JohnR7 said:
Even if that statistic were true, it shows that people who put their faith in things that are even non-existent, they will improve because they improve their life themselves.
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LittleNipper
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Asimov said:
It proves such places ACTUALLY existed , and that these actual places were REALLY destroyed. That would prove another ACTUAL SOMETHING regarding the Bible.
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Prince Lucianus
Old Goth
If they are Sodom and Gomorrah!
And if there was evidence that it was destroyed the way described in the bible.
So far, there's no evidence showing either to be true.
Lucy
And if there was evidence that it was destroyed the way described in the bible.
So far, there's no evidence showing either to be true.
Lucy
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LittleNipper
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Prince Lucianus said:
There is plenty of evidence that something happened there.
<http://s8int.com/sodom-gomorrah.html>
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OdwinOddball
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This all goes back to my original point in the thread that started this one, which you blew off.
The historical accuracy of the Bible in regards to locations such as Rome, Jerusalem, etc is not in question. You know this very well, and are being disingenuous in continuing to debate this.
You are debating the wrong point. Even if it could be conclusively proven that the ruins shown in the above documentary were in fact Sodom, this would not prove that the Hebrew god destroyed the city. You would need to find evidence that this happened. Conclusive evidence that could not be more readily explained as evidence for a natural disaster.
You know this. You cannot claim Spiderman just because New York exists and thats where the comics say he lives. You must actually prove Spiderman exists separately.
Stop arguing the geography of the Bible. Of course it mentions real places. it was written by people living in the region.
What we do not have, never have had, and continue to lack is absolutely any evidence that any of the divine occurrences in the Bible have happened as the Bible described them. Produce this evidence and stop this ridiculous argument that a geographic location prove the Bible.
Otherwise, show me where I can find Spiderman in New York.
The historical accuracy of the Bible in regards to locations such as Rome, Jerusalem, etc is not in question. You know this very well, and are being disingenuous in continuing to debate this.
You are debating the wrong point. Even if it could be conclusively proven that the ruins shown in the above documentary were in fact Sodom, this would not prove that the Hebrew god destroyed the city. You would need to find evidence that this happened. Conclusive evidence that could not be more readily explained as evidence for a natural disaster.
You know this. You cannot claim Spiderman just because New York exists and thats where the comics say he lives. You must actually prove Spiderman exists separately.
Stop arguing the geography of the Bible. Of course it mentions real places. it was written by people living in the region.
What we do not have, never have had, and continue to lack is absolutely any evidence that any of the divine occurrences in the Bible have happened as the Bible described them. Produce this evidence and stop this ridiculous argument that a geographic location prove the Bible.
Otherwise, show me where I can find Spiderman in New York.
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OdwinOddball said:
Genesis 19:24
Then the Lord rained brimstone and fire on Sodom and Gomorrah, from the Lord out of the heavens.
Ok, so you do not question that there was a Sodom and a Gomorrah, and the Bible records the historical event of when they were destroyed by fire. What you question then is if there is a God and if God had anything to do with the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. Also, we have a question of the salt pillars that we read about in the Bible and what the significance is of them, sense they are still there to be found also.
So what do you suggest then, that this is just a ploy that the religious leaders used to control the people? For example they would point to a natural disaster and then tell the people that this was a judgement from God for not listening to them the religious people?
Maybe they could set up a protection service. Give them money and then you could be sure to go to heaven and that would protect you from the wrath of God. Or better yet how about seed faith giving. Give them as much money as you could afford to "invest" and God would mulitply your money and give you back more than what you give Him.
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rmwilliamsll
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It strikes me as odd. How YECists jump at really bad evidence for the scientific accuracy of the Bible and yet discard the extraordinary evidence for TofE. You're willing to accept a PBS special which talks about a city maybe being in the wasteland and jump to the assertation that this proves that God destroyed S&G.
Yet you dismiss HERV and Vit C GLO pseudogene as being "inconclusive".
odd.
Yet you dismiss HERV and Vit C GLO pseudogene as being "inconclusive".
odd.
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OdwinOddball said:
Perhap you can find him at the comic book store next to Hulk Hogan.
No wait, Hogan is a real person that sold out madison square garden over 52 times.
What is he doing in the comic books next to the Spiderman?
Maybe this story of Hulk Hogan and Andre the Giant is a little to wild for me, they could not be real people.
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rmwilliamsll said:
There is no maybe involved here. It is a scientific fact that there were two citys there and that they were destroyed by fire. There actually is quite a bit of evidence that they were the citys that we read about in the Bible. There is a lot of scientific fact that science has proven to be true. Of course Science can not say that they were actually destoryed by God. Nor can science tell you that the death and destruction in Thailand was due to the sex and the sin there.
But science can tell you that they can verify that at least there were two cities and they were destroyed by fire. That much of the Bible is known to be true. Actually people do not even agree on what the sins were that caused God to destory them.
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