Social Security Benefits being threatened

[joshua 1 9]

Man, just own up to it. As far as you're concerned , the disabled should just die of starvation because the Bible says it.

Is that what you think Paul was saying? My father was stationed in Germany right after the war. He was one of the first to see the German death camps. The director and principal of my high school were German "Jews" that escaped Germany right after the war. I am well aware of the Holocaust and the idea that unproductive unwanted people do not have a right to life.

Does that mean we should go to the extreme? Or perhaps we should practice moderation and avoid the extremes. I think this is a valid subject that needs to be explored and discussed even if it is very obvious that it is sore point for a lot of people. I have put a lot of thought into the subject over the last 50 years and I am still trying to understand God's plan and purpose for why He allows this world to be in the fallen condition that it is in.

I have no axe to grind here. I just want to get at the truth and see just what God's plan and purpose is in all of this. Should downs syndrome babies be aborted? Should old people be euthanized? I almost got euthanized 15 years ago when I was in some sort of a coma. In fact the doctor told me that the only reason he revived me was because I had a 12 year old son that needed a father so he decided that he would give it a shot. Otherwise I would not be here having this conversation with you. My son has one more year to go and he will get a degree in computer engineering with a minor in math. My other son had a degree in electronic engineering. Do I have a right to live or is it ok if the doctors just pull the plug and let me go?

 

[joshua 1 9]

According to you, I shouldn't have eaten.

Is that how you interpret that scripture? Should we cut it out of the Bible? Perhaps we should read the Jefferson Bible. "If a moral lesson was embedded in a miracle, the lesson survived in Jeffersonian scripture, but the miracle did not. Even when this took some rather careful cutting with scissors or razor, Jefferson managed to maintain Jesus' role as a great moral teacher, not as a shaman or faith healer." (wiki)

 

[Isilwen]

Is that how you interpret that scripture? Should we cut it out of the Bible? Perhaps we should read the Jefferson Bible. "If a moral lesson was embedded in a miracle, the lesson survived in Jeffersonian scripture, but the miracle did not. Even when this took some rather careful cutting with scissors or razor, Jefferson managed to maintain Jesus' role as a great moral teacher, not as a shaman or faith healer." (wiki)

Don't turn it around on me. This is what I got from what you are saying.

So this isn't on me!

 

[joshua 1 9]

This is what I got from what you are saying.

All I did was quote the Bible then I left the interpretation to you. Do you really think that is what Paul is saying that we should let people starve to death if it is in our ability to be able to help them? 2Peter3:16 "His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction."

It is not my personal belief at all that people do not have a right to life. God tells us to choose life - health - liberty - prosperity and so on. To be a Christian is all about being born again and a new creation in Christ. Jesus said by His stripes we are healed. He came to set the captive free from sin, sickness and disease. This can be a life long process though. It does not always take place in a instant.

The Bible says that Jesus went about preaching, teaching and healing the sick. That is what we are to do today. We are to follow the example that he set for us to follow. We are to live our life in the same way He lived His life. Which for 30 years did mean working because we are told He worked as a carpenter. Then He went into full time ministry for 3 years.

 

[Isilwen]

All I did was quote the Bible then I left the interpretation to you. Do you really think that is what Paul is saying that we should let people starve to death if it is in our ability to be able to help them? 2Peter3:16 "His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction."

It is not my personal belief at all that people do not have a right to life. God tells us to choose life - health - liberty - prosperity and so on. To be a Christian is all about being born again and a new creation in Christ. Jesus said by His stripes we are healed. He came to set the captive free from sin, sickness and disease. This can be a life long process though. It does not always take place in a instant.

The Bible says that Jesus went about preaching, teaching and healing the sick. That is what we are to do today. We are to follow the example that he set for us to follow. We are to live our life in the same way He lived His life. Which for 30 years did mean working because we are told He worked as a carpenter. Then He went into full time ministry for 3 years.

When you say everyone should work, even the disabled and then add that scripture how can someone not interpret what you're saying the way that I did?

All I see you doing is backtracking.

 

[Brightmoon]

That is a subject all in itself. We have a friend that sponsored her adopted daughter to come to america and now that the daughter is here all she wants to do is sit in her room and talk to people on facebook. They have tried to get her to work, they have tried to get her to take classes and she does not seem to want to. I was going to stay out of it but this girl has been texting my wife and claiming that they are abusing her.

When the rubber meets the road, how do you get this to work in the real world. What do we do with healthy 19 year old girls that do not to want to work and expect people to take care of her and buy her computers and iphones to play on?

Ah teenagers! They all act like that .... and ? A more realistic view would have had her help with planning the family budget at a younger age so she’d have had a more realistic view of where money comes from . I made that mistake with my oldest but he figured it out after a while

 

[joshua 1 9]

When you say everyone should work, even the disabled and then add that scripture how can someone not interpret what you're saying the way that I did?

I was raised that everyone should be productive and contribute to society. John Kennedy said: "Ask not what your country can do for you but ask what you can do for your country". It was a sad day when Kennedy was shot because we had hope that he could do something to make America a better place to life. If people want to sit down and do nothing and expect people to wait on them then I have a problem with that. Jesus came to be a servant. He set an example for us to follow. "If you want to be great, you must be the servant of all the others." (Matthew 20:26)

My son is working on his degree in computer engineering. He has very little regard for the people back in his high school that wanted to sit down and do nothing and refused to take their education serious. Perhaps you may want to talk to him and get his perspective as a young person. Or his mother that came from a third world country and she has worked hard all her life to help her family get an education so they can get a job. Where she comes from opportunities are few and far inbetween. She does not understand how people can live in the land of opportunities and not take advantage of what is available for them.

I know thousands of people that have immigrated to America and they all work and have something to contribute to making this a Great Nation. A lot of them are doctors and nurses that take care of the sick. If people think they can just sit down and do nothing then this may not be the right country for them. They may want to go to a third world nation and join the people there that want to sit down and do nothing all day long.

I personally think an education should be free for everyone. But we have to be very careful that people do not take advantage of that and they actually get an education.

 

[joshua 1 9]

A more realistic view would have had her help with planning the family budget at a younger age so she’d have had a more realistic view of where money comes from.

My wife talks about that growing up. They had to buy school supplies. They had to pay tuition. So that required some sacrifice. They did not always have money to buy candy. They learned the value of a good education and how important this is.

 

[Isilwen]

I was raised that everyone should be productive and contribute to society. John Kennedy said: "Ask not what your country can do for you but ask what you can do for your country". It was a sad day when Kennedy was shot because we had hope that he could do something to make America a better place to life. If people want to sit down and do nothing and expect people to wait on them then I have a problem with that. Jesus came to be a servant. He set an example for us to follow. "If you want to be great, you must be the servant of all the others." (Matthew 20:26)

My son is working on his degree in computer engineering. He has very little regard for the people back in his high school that wanted to sit down and do nothing and refused to take their education serious. Perhaps you may want to talk to him and get his perspective as a young person. Or his mother that came from a third world country and she has worked hard all her life to help her family get an education so they can get a job. Where she comes from opportunities are few and far inbetween. She does not understand how people can live in the land of opportunities and not take advantage of what is available for them.

I know thousands of people that have immigrated to America and they all work and have something to contribute to making this a Great Nation. A lot of them are doctors and nurses that take care of the sick. If people think they can just sit down and do nothing then this may not be the right country for them. They may want to go to a third world nation and join the people there that want to sit down and do nothing all day long.

I personally think an education should be free for everyone. But we have to be very careful that people do not take advantage of that and they actually get an education.

I'm not talking about able bodied, able to work people. I'm talking about those who are disabled and their doctor's have deemed them incapable of working.

Imo, if someone is disabled and a doctor has said they are unable to work, then they don't have to work and yes, they should if they so choose, sit and do nothing. They are disabled and I wouldn't expect them to do anything at all. If they choose to work anyway. Good for them! That is their choice. We cannot force the disabled to work in order to eat.

To force a disabled person to work who clearly shouldn't be is inhumane and cruel!

 

[dqhall]

You should visit them. It's amazing what those people built back then.

I walked along a 100 mile section of the Appalachian Trail 38 yrs ago. I suppose building trails is better work than laying mines or carpet bombing.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I walked along a 100 mile section of the Appalachian Trail 38 yrs ago. I suppose building trails is better work than laying mines or carpet bombing.

For sure. They also built roads and many of the great lodges that still are in use in the National Parks. But that only scratches the surface.


How Did The WPA Change U.S. Infrastructure? 'It Did Just About Everything,' Scholar Says

 

[miggles]

Since some here are worried about whether their benefits which they paid into will be taken from them, this new article shows the latest in threats to such benefits:
Trump administration's cuts to disability benefits among the cruelest

Terrible. Let's get other people into office who will not take away the benefits we pay into and need.

maybe this hasn't kicked in yet with me. my ss is increased since trump's been in office.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

maybe this hasn't kicked in yet with me. my ss is increased since trump's been in office.

Mine has increased via the COLA increases, but mostly because I have continued to work and increase my earnings. My SS benefit has increased by over $400 per month since I first began to draw it. However I do have to pay taxes on it as I'm above the income limit.

 

[miggles]

Mine has increased via the COLA increases, but mostly because I have continued to work and increase my earnings. My SS benefit has increased by over $400 per month since I first began to draw it. However I do have to pay taxes on it as I'm above the income limit.

i love your avatar. is that a wolf?

 

[joshua 1 9]

I'm not talking about able bodied, able to work people. I'm talking about those who are disabled and their doctor's have deemed them incapable of working.

Then you should have NO problem with the Government wanting to make sure they really are disabled and they really are not able to work. Why is that a problem for you that Trump wants to verify that they really are disabled and they really are not able to work? The point I am trying to make is that there are degrees in between. For example I had issues where I could not do construction work anymore. But there was a lot of work I could do and I just got a job in sales. Just because someone can not do one kind of work does not mean they can not be retrained or reeducated to do a different kind of work.

In our state if you want to collect workman's comp you still have to show up for work. Even if you can not work. The idea is for them to find work for you that you can do. Even if it is just to answer the telephone. Can you imagine that, real people to answer a phone instead of a machine. The company has to pay half their check so I would think they will try to find something they can do to earn what they are getting. Last I checked the program was very well funded. There was something like 29 billion dollars in funds available. If people do not want to jump through the hoops then they do not qualify for the money. The issue here has to do with who is qualified to collect the money and who is not qualified to collect.

 

[Isilwen]

Then you should have NO problem with the Government wanting to make sure they really are disabled and they really are not able to work. Why is that a problem for you that Trump wants to verify that they really are disabled and they really are not able to work? The point I am trying to make is that there are degrees in between. For example I had issues where I could not do construction work anymore. But there was a lot of work I could do and I just got a job in sales. Just because someone can not do one kind of work does not mean they can not be retrained or reeducated to do a different kind of work.

Because of statements like these. Had you said from the beginning that you want to be sure they are indeed able to work, then I would have no issues with that. That only makes sense. However, that is not what you said.

You said in response to my question about those with MS, "They should work. They should not be allowed to sit down and do nothing."

Then you added this in after someone called you heartless and you basically countered with no I'm not you are, "For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat." (2Thes3:10)

If you had said that you believe that the government should be sure that they are truly disabled and unable to work, I would have no issues. It's the other stuff like above that I have an issue with.

Just so you know, it's not just the person's doctor that says they cannot work they are disabled, those deemed disabled and unable to work are also seen by government appointed doctors to verify that they are indeed disabled. So, in essence, they are already being verified.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

i love your avatar. is that a wolf?

Yes, an old gray wolf. Toothless and impotent...like me.

 

[joshua 1 9]

that is not what you said.

Actually it is, but I must not have been making myself clear.

 

[joshua 1 9]

So, in essence, they are already being verified.

Yes but the article has to do with a two year review. Lots of people on disability have a job where they make money under the table.

 

[Isilwen]

Lots of people on disability have a job where they make money under the table.

Source?