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Featured So why Seven Heads

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Just The Facts, Feb 19, 2019.

  1. Just The Facts

    Just The Facts Senior Veteran

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    Hello All

    Why Does Daniels Fourth Beast have seven heads?

    Why Does The Beast in Rv 13 have seven Heads?
     
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  2. Pethesedzao

    Pethesedzao Well-Known Member

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    The 7 heads are the foot of clay - Islamic nations.
     
  3. tranquil

    tranquil Newbie

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    One lion head+One bear head + 4 leopard heads + 1 dragon head ( Daniel 8 little horn ) + 10 dormant horns = 7 heads, 10 horns.

    At the 7th trumpet, 1 lion head+ 1 bear head + 4 leopard heads + 1 dragon head (now the Daniel 7 little horn) with 10 kings= rev 13’s beast from the sea.
     
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  4. parousia70

    parousia70 I'm livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    They represent the 7 Herods.
    & the ten Horns represent the 10 Caesars that reigned during the time of the 7 Herods.

    Pretty simple really.
     
  5. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    The seven heads are the seven incarnations/iterations of the Roman empire, from first to end time last.
     
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  6. HTacianas

    HTacianas Well-Known Member

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    The Revelation describes seven puppet kingdoms of the Roman empire. Some are not kings " but received power as kings one hour with the beast". It describes an audience one would have with Caesar to have power bestowed as a client "king" answerable to the emperor.
     
  7. Revealing Times

    Revealing Times Well-Known Member

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    Daniel NOWHERE describes 7 Heads. It Describes Four Different Beasts and a Little Horn Beast that comes up along with 10 horns [ and horns arise from a Head].

    Daniel was shows what was to come going forward.

    John was shown everything looking from the End Ties back through all time, thus he sees ONE Conglomerate Beast all together, in Rev. 12 he shows how Satan is connected, in Rev. 13 he shows how the Anti-Christ is connected to it, and in Rev. 17 he shows how Apollyon is connected to it.

    He also reveals who this 7 Headed Beast is by naming the Animals {Nations} involved via Rev. 13, he names the Leopard, Bear and Lion, along with a Mortal Wound {Rome} and the Mortal Wound being healed {Anti-Christ}. All we need to do is add in the FIRST TWO Beasts, Egypt and Assyria,.
     
  8. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    The Daniel 7 fourth beast has one head, with iron teeth. It also had ten horns, plus a little horn.

    The Revelation 13 beast, has a mouth as of a lion. And 7 heads, one of which was mortally wounded but healed.

    So we can conclude, I think, that the wounded/healed head is the one head with the mouth like a lion, right?

    That leaves 6 other heads - which are the 6 heads in Revelation 17:10, the five fallen kings and the one ruling king (at the time of John).

    Which we can conclude that one head wounded/healed is the little horn person forthcoming who will emerge out of the ten king fourth kingdom in Daniel 7.

    _______________________________________________________________________

    little horn, king of the Roman Empire endtimes.

    at some point is killed (Ezekiel 28:1-10) for claiming to be God (2Thessalonians2:4) ;

    brought back to life in Isaiah 14:18-20.

    As the beast that was wounded by the sword (Revelation 13:14), but lived.
     
  9. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    ...thus, changing the meaning and text of the bible.
     
  10. Just The Facts

    Just The Facts Senior Veteran

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    Hi Dougg

    I am with you to a small degree.

    The seven heads is simple to me. In Daniel it says the fourth beast absorbs the other kingdoms. There are 6 other heads on the first three beasts plus one head for the fourth beast. That is seven.

    Rv 13 says one head has a blasphemous name. That is the head that represents Rome which is also the head that gets the deadly wound. It then comes back as the Beats of Rev 17 which is why that whole beast is blasphemous.

    The 10 horns in Daniel 7 and Rv 13 are the same ten horns. The 10 horns in Rv 17 are not the same 10 horns of Daniel 7 and Rv 13.

    Daniel 7 is Pagan Rome………………… Rv 13 starts off as Pagan Rome has a deadly wound (when Rome is Sacked and run by Barbarians for over 70 years. Then comes back as The Holy Roman Empire ie the Beast in Rev 17.
     
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  11. Melody Suttles

    Melody Suttles SingPeace

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    An angel is giving Daniel the interpretation of the vision and Daniel asks specifically about the fourth beast and its horns (Daniel 7:19).

    The angel explains that the beast’s ten horns are ten kings who will arise from that kingdom (verse 24). The little horn with eyes and mouth of a human represents a later 'evil' king to which three of the original kings will be subdued. This evil king “will speak against the Most High and oppress his holy people” (verse 25). He will seek to exert oppressive power over God’s people for three and a half years and is the Antichrist, the “ruler who will come” who sets up the abomination in Daniel 9:27.

    In the end times, there will be a “revival” of the Roman Empire, featuring a coalition of ten world leaders. The Antichrist will take his position of leadership at the expense of three of those leaders, and he will eventually wield global authority.(see Revelation 13:16–17).
     
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  12. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    There is one head, a king, on the fourth beast in Daniel 7. It has iron teeth. That one head is the healed head, a king, on the Revelation 13 beast (kingdom).

    The Revelation 13 beast, as a kingdom is the Roman Empire (of the end times).

    [when claims to be God]
    Mortally wounded - as king 7. Healed to be king 8 - the beast person [to the world will appear to validate his claim].

    Thus, the head on the fourth beast in Daniel 7 is king 8 in Revelation 17:11. The little horn on the fourth beast is king 7.

    Revelation 17:10 - king 7,(Daniel 7:8 little horn) the forthcoming king, who continues for a short space.
    Revelation 17:11 (Daniel 7:7 head) - king 8, the beast. The short space, the 42 months.

    simplified, in order:

    little horn - King (7) of the Roman Empire in the end times

    Antichrist - King of Israel for a short time before claiming to have achieved God-hood.

    beast - King (8) of the Roman Empire in the end times.

    ____________________________________________________________________
    The Roman Empire was far stronger than the previous empires in Daniel 7.

    The Roman Empire in the end times will, by the middle of the seven years, have control over the territories once held by the three ancient empires. That's why the composite make up in Revelation 13:2 .
    _______________________________________________________________________

    In both Daniel 7 and Revelation 13:1, the beasts are said to be coming out of the sea. This is the indication of the beast as kingdoms.

    However, in Daniel 7:17, because the beasts also represent four kings, the angel in the explanation saying coming out of the earth. Which represents four men.

    Which are:

    Nebuchadnezzar - Babylon
    Cyrus - Medes/Persians
    Alexander - Greeks
    Arch villain of the end times - Roman Empire (of the end times).
     
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  13. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    The 10 horns in Daniel 7. The ten horns in Revelation 12, 13, 17. The ten toes in Daniel 2.

    They are all the same ten kings.

    In Daniel 7, the ten horns are around when the little horn meets his demise. So those horns are the same horns in Revelation 17, on the beast as a kingdom.

    Three of the ten kings are removed and replaced during the little horn's time. So three of the actual persons will not be the same, than initially.

    You are going off on a wrong foot. The beast is a kingdom.

    The heads, horns are all kings - persons. One of the heads, a person, is what will be mortally wounded. It is talking about king 7, a person, who continues for a short space of 42 months as king 8, when that head is healed.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2019
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  14. Revealing Times

    Revealing Times Well-Known Member

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    Rev. 13 speak of 7 Heads.................. so again Douggg you are wrong.
     
  15. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Yes, 7 heads - 7 kings. I am not wrong.

    Julius Caesar
    Augutus Caesar
    Tiberius
    Caligula
    Claudius
    Nero
    Arch villain of the end times - in his little horn role, king 7

    king 8 - Arch villain of the end times - in his role as the beast

    ___________________________________________________

    You are claiming the person comes out of the EU final form - right? Well, the EU is the fourth kingdom in the end times - if you are going by the text in Daniel 7. Not 7th kingdom.
     
  16. Messenger 3k

    Messenger 3k New Member

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    RT is right here...to some extent. The woman of Revelation 17 represents the world's religious system; especially as it doesn't recognize the one true God.
    Verse 9 says the 7 heads are seven hills. "Hills" here imply empires or kingdoms; but kingdoms are also associated with kings so the angel goes on to say in 10, "They are also seven kings..."

    The seven heads are empires (along with their kings) who oppressed and held Israel captive since inception. Verse 10 goes on to say, "Five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come..." Understand that the angel was speaking with reference to John's time. The five fallen empires before John's time were: Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Medo-Persia and Greece. Now "one is" meant that one empire was currently existing at the time the angel was speaking, in John's time. I'm sure you can guess which empire that was. Yes, Rome. Israel was under Rome in the time of Jesus and His disciples.

    For the identity of the 7th and 8th kingdoms/kings we include Daniel 2.

    Revelation 17 is a parallel of Nebuchadnezzar's forgotten dream in Daniel 2 and Daniel's four beast vision in Daniel 7. The difference is Nebuchadnezzar's dream and Daniel's vision began only from the empire that concerned them: Babylon.

    If we compare Revelation 17 and Daniel 2, then we can agree that the 7th kingdom is the foot of iron and clay in Daniel 2:33, which comes just right after the legs of iron (Rome). The 8th kingdom are the 10 toes which are also made of iron and clay. The 7th and 8th kingdoms are made of iron and clay, meaning they're the same Roman empire but now with mixed races and ideologies. Therefore, to be simply put, the 7th and 8th kingdoms are today's EU.

    Generally, the difference between the 7th and 8th kingdoms is that the 8th kingdom involves the antichrist, he is the 8th king in Revelations 17:11, the same as the beast. 17:8 says about the beast (the 8th king): "it once was, now is not, and yet will come..." Meaning the antichrist once existed, he wasn't currently existing as at the time of speaking to John, but will come again in the future. 17:11 gives us another clue, it says, "He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction..." meaning the 8th king (the antichrist) was also one of the 7 kings. In other words he was the king of one of the seven kingdoms. Stay with me.

    So which of the seven kingdoms also had the antichrist? The 6th kingdom was Rome, but 17:8 says he wasn't existing at the time of the 6th kingdom, John's time: "it once was, now is not..." So kingdom 6 is out. We are left kingdoms 1-5 and 7. Again 17:8 says, "it once was..." but kingdom 7 was yet to come as at the time of speaking to John: "Five have fallen, one is, the other (kingdom 7) has not yet come..." So the antichrist couldn't have existed in a kingdom that had not yet come. Kingdom 7 is out. We are left with kingdoms 1-5.

    Revelations 13:3 gives us yet another clue: "One of the (seven) heads of the beast seemed to have had a fatal wound, but the fatal wound had been healed..." This corresponds with 17:8, "it once was, now is not..."

    If a wound was fatal then it means the wound killed it. Meaning the wound came from a fatal blow, the blow came from God. In other words the antichrist once existed but was killed by God.

    Now you must understand the antichrist not just as a person but as a spirit.

    1 John 4:3, "This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world."

    Therefore God killed the person of the antichrist once but the spirit will return through another person after which God will finally destroy both its spirit and body in hell.

    So who did the antichrist come as previously?

    It's Antiochus IV Epiphanes. The biblical antichrist of the Jews who tortured and persecuted the Jews. Daniel prophesied about him and he was used as an allusion to the coming antichrist. He was a king in one of the 5 fallen kingdoms namely, Greece. After which God dealt him a severe blow.

    The book of Maccabees has this to say about him;

    "But the all-seeing Lord, the God of Israel, struck him with an incurable and invisible blow. As soon as he stopped speaking he was seized with a pain in his bowels, for which there was no relief, and with sharp internal tortures— and that very justly, for he had tortured the bowels of others with many and strange inflictions. Yet he did not in any way stop his insolence, but was even more filled with arrogance, breathing fire in his rage against the Jews, and giving orders to drive even faster. And so it came about that he fell out of his chariot as it was rushing along, and the fall was so hard as to torture every limb of his body.

    2 Maccabees 9:5-7


    This is why the Jewish remnant having already gone through their own antichrist, will not be going through the coming one with us but will be sealed and protected in the wilderness for the three and half years. They are the 144,000 in the book of Revelations, 12,000 from each tribe of Israel. This will include the lost 10 tribes returning.

    So technically, this coming antichrist is for us "gentiles". There's no escaping it. Prepare your mind ahead.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2019
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  17. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Wow... Can't believe with all the replies here. They have no clues on how to allow Scripture to define 7 heads.

    [Face palm]
     
  18. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    The 7 mountains are the 7 hills of Rome, and the whore in present terms, which the ten kings will destroy by fire is the Vatican in Rome.

    The beast in the bottomless pit is likely Nimrod. And the woman in Nimrod's day is likely Semiramis. Which all of the false religions were spun off the tower of babel days. Elements thereof making it's way into some of the beliefs of the RCC.
     
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2019
  19. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Revelation 17 gives the status of the beast at John's time - first century
    Revelation 12 gives the status of the beast right a the beginning of the 7 years
    Revelation 13 gives the status of the beast with 42 months left in the 7 years.

    Revelation 17:8a - the was, is not - is the ancient person
    Revelation 17:8 b - the was, is not, yet is - the end times person

    It is the end times person who will be killed and brought back to life, sometime in the middle part of the seven years..
     
  20. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    It is not Antiochus. And the spirit of antichrist in 1John is not tied to Antiochus because Antiochus was not even aware of the Father and Son - which the spirit of antichrist denies.
     
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