So regarding the term "bible believer"

Halbhh

Everything You say is Life to me
Supporter
Mar 17, 2015
17,173
9,191
catholic -- embracing all Christians
✟1,152,895.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Normally, it means someone who is guided by the Bible rather than social convention,
In America, very often the word 'biblical' is used to signal some kinds of familiar social convention are to be imposed onto the scripture in that church, sadly. To use scripture to broadly support conservative politics (even the wrong parts) for example (which is exactly as wrong as using scripture to broadly support all of liberal politics, or any other kind of worldly stuff).

I integrate "Bible believing" into a phrase I like to use to indicate what I believe constitutes a true Christian.

I believe that someone who is a "Born-again, Bible-believing, fundamental Christian" would have a solid understanding of The Word, and who doesn't stray from the important doctrines to chase down heretical rabbit holes, who doesn't try to jackhammer Scripture in order to make room for scientific "truths" or changing worldly cultural norms.

In my view, all three characteristics are important, the lack of any one of which shows up in the strange doctrinal views that we see so often here on CF.

BTW, please don't lock in on the term "fundamental" and castigate me for saying it. I'm not using it in terms of legalistic, fundamentalist, almost-cult-like religions. I mean it merely as a foundational type of belief in God's word. If I could think of a different, less triggering word for it I would use that instead. :)

Tragically, many churches claiming to be 'biblical' preach some of Christ says, and they leave out other things Christ says....

Guess whether that will be ok on the day of judgement for those that intentionally avoided parts of what He said, by aware intention. We can learn from His words that no, that won't be ok.
 
Upvote 0

_Dave_

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 3, 2019
413
232
73
Arizona
✟144,719.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Tragically, many churches claiming to be 'biblical' preach some of Christ says, and they leave out other things Christ says....
I agree. And that's why I include "fundamental" in my phrase. It's one thing to believe in the Bible, but it's another thing entirely to believe it is the foundation for all belief.

For example, straying from the absolutely unambiguous, completely clear first seven words in the Bible (in the Hebrew) leads to a cascading series of misinterpretations, misunderstandings and disbeliefs that echo throughout one's whole approach to Scripture.

Look at the tragic human history that has resulted from just that one example of "believing the Bible" but not believing it is fundamental.

I believe there is a very small remnant of those who actually fall into that fundamental Bible-believing group; which is why Jesus says, "I never knew you."
 
Upvote 0

PaulCyp1

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Mar 4, 2018
1,075
849
78
Massachusetts
✟239,255.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
It's a Protestant term, and unfortunately what it actually means is "Believe whatever you think the Bible says", or "Believe whatever your denomination thinks the Bible says", which of course is different in every denomination.
 
Upvote 0

Tree of Life

Hide The Pain
Feb 15, 2013
8,824
6,243
✟48,077.00
Country
United States
Faith
Reformed
Marital Status
Married
What's the term "bible believer" mean exactly? At times it comes off as in contrast to "Jesus believer"

I don't see how these things could be in contrast to one another. To believe the Bible is to believe in Jesus who is both the author and the subject of Scripture. To believe in Jesus is to believe in the Bible which he authored and which testifies to him.
 
Upvote 0

Hieronymus

Well-Known Member
Jan 12, 2016
8,427
2,998
52
the Hague NL
✟69,862.00
Country
Netherlands
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
What's the term "bible believer" mean exactly? At times it comes off as in contrast to "Jesus believer"
I think it is to distinguish themselves from "Christians in name only" or "church following Christians" or otherwise Christians who don't believe what's in the Bible and / or follow teachings / teachers who apparenly don't either.
 
  • Like
Reactions: _Dave_
Upvote 0

Halbhh

Everything You say is Life to me
Supporter
Mar 17, 2015
17,173
9,191
catholic -- embracing all Christians
✟1,152,895.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I agree. And that's why I include "fundamental" in my phrase. It's one thing to believe in the Bible, but it's another thing entirely to believe it is the foundation for all belief.

For example, straying from the absolutely unambiguous, completely clear first seven words in the Bible (in the Hebrew) leads to a cascading series of misinterpretations, misunderstandings and disbeliefs that echo throughout one's whole approach to Scripture.

Look at the tragic human history that has resulted from just that one example of "believing the Bible" but not believing it is fundamental.

I believe there is a very small remnant of those who actually fall into that fundamental Bible-believing group; which is why Jesus says, "I never knew you."
To understand the Matthew 7:23 verse you quoted, a person must listen to Him, that full passage, verses 21-27.

If they believe in Him, they should listen to all His words in the gospels. What He tells us in verses 24-27 we can know is truth, even if it seems challenging (at first). When we read (and listen to) all of verses 21-27, then we get the real meaning of verse 23 -- those that are His listen to Him and do what He said to do in the gospels.
 
Upvote 0

PoppyB

Active Member
Apr 5, 2019
299
262
Bolton
✟30,915.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
What's the term "bible believer" mean exactly? At times it comes off as in contrast to "Jesus believer"
I would think that if people don't believe the bible then they aren't really Christian at all whatever they may call themselves.
 
Upvote 0

redleghunter

Thank You Jesus!
Supporter
Mar 18, 2014
38,116
34,054
Texas
✟176,076.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
It's a Protestant term, and unfortunately what it actually means is "Believe whatever you think the Bible says", or "Believe whatever your denomination thinks the Bible says", which of course is different in every denomination.
That's actually the very opposite of the term.
 
Upvote 0

anna ~ grace

Newbie
Supporter
May 9, 2010
9,071
11,925
✟108,146.93
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
What's the term "bible believer" mean exactly? At times it comes off as in contrast to "Jesus believer"
I think it infers that one believes that Scripture, all of Scripture (66 books for Protestants), is inspired, of God, contains Truth, history, and divine instructions.

I like the term. In an era where increasingly, Christians feel free to ridicule, undermine, or cast aside many parts of Scripture, it is good to know that others still obey and believe, even if this goes contrary to the world.
 
Upvote 0

Loversofjesus_2018

Well-Known Member
Nov 13, 2018
653
198
33
West coast
✟32,008.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
I don't see how these things could be in contrast to one another. To believe the Bible is to believe in Jesus who is both the author and the subject of Scripture. To believe in Jesus is to believe in the Bible which he authored and which testifies to him.
I have a question...I’ve heard that the story of the adulteress woman isn’t in the oldest manuscripts available and scholars believe it was a later addition by a scribe..... if this is true how was it authored by Jesus? Wouldn’t that show that everything isn’t from God in the Bible?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Halbhh

Everything You say is Life to me
Supporter
Mar 17, 2015
17,173
9,191
catholic -- embracing all Christians
✟1,152,895.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I think it infers that one believes that Scripture, all of Scripture (66 books for Protestants), is inspired, of God, contains Truth, history, and divine instructions.

I like the term. In an era where increasingly, Christians feel free to ridicule, undermine, or cast aside many parts of Scripture, it is good to know that others still obey and believe, even if this goes contrary to the world.
I like that.

Now, if only the people claiming to be 'biblical' would listen humbly to more of the scripture, seeking what they don't have.

But, we are all at some point in our walk, though.
 
  • Friendly
Reactions: anna ~ grace
Upvote 0

Loversofjesus_2018

Well-Known Member
Nov 13, 2018
653
198
33
West coast
✟32,008.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
I would think that if people don't believe the bible then they aren't really Christian at all whatever they may call themselves.
Does anybody ever truly believe the Bible, or do we mix and match our interpretations in to help the Bible mean what we want it to mean?..... for example I’ve never met a person who thinks Jesus really meant cut your right hand off. We will say he didn’t mean it literally which we are assuming. And we do that a lot of places. So how can one say they believe the Bible?
 
Upvote 0

Halbhh

Everything You say is Life to me
Supporter
Mar 17, 2015
17,173
9,191
catholic -- embracing all Christians
✟1,152,895.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Does anybody ever truly believe the Bible, or do we mix and match our interpretations in to help the Bible mean what we want it to mean?..... for example I’ve never met a person who thinks Jesus really meant cut your right hand off. We will say he didn’t mean it literally which we are assuming. And we do that a lot of places. So how can one say they believe the Bible?

Good questions. If you read whole passages, the sense of meaning usually becomes more clear. Here though, we are in the Sermon on the Mount, which goes for 3 chapters.

Let's look at that section, including a little more, to better get the overall way He is speaking.

21“You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘You shall not murder, and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’ 22 But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.

23 “Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, 24 leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift.

25 “Settle matters quickly with your adversary who is taking you to court. Do it while you are still together on the way, or your adversary may hand you over to the judge, and the judge may hand you over to the officer, and you may be thrown into prison. 26 Truly I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.

27“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell."

-------------

Notice how in the passage just above that calling another believer a "fool" is a very serious wrong, that if we didn't confess/repent of, would leave us liable to the fiery end. We can surmise it's not only this one word, but also any equivalent word also, any kind of dismissive condemning judgement of another's personality really.

So, the particular instance is about a general thing. In the next passage, we learn that the intentional continued lusting after another person not one's spouse is already adultery, even when only in the mind. Christ says then, to paraphrase, to do whatever it takes to avoid that temptation, if you are falling into it.

The hyperbolic extreme of gouging out an eye is how we know this is a do-whatever-it-takes instruction.

In real life situations, it could be something like turn-away-and-look-elsewhere, or more, even to avoid going to a certain place that tempting person is at. Do whatever it takes. Of course, we know that prayer is very powerful to help us, so the first step would be to pray the prayer Christ said to us to pray, daily, in Matthew chapter 6. Then if still falling under the temptation, take more steps. I'd suggest not only to avoid that person as needed, but to also pray for specific help to have that specific feeling changed.

(A key prior step I assumed, but it's so crucial, is to confess directly to God your wrong (1rst John chapter 1))
 
Upvote 0

Loversofjesus_2018

Well-Known Member
Nov 13, 2018
653
198
33
West coast
✟32,008.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Good questions. If you read whole passages, the sense of meaning usually becomes more clear. Here though, we are in the Sermon on the Mount, which goes for 3 chapters.

Let's look at that section, including a little more, to better get the overall way He is speaking.

21“You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, ‘You shall not murder, and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.’ 22 But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.

23 “Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, 24 leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift.

25 “Settle matters quickly with your adversary who is taking you to court. Do it while you are still together on the way, or your adversary may hand you over to the judge, and the judge may hand you over to the officer, and you may be thrown into prison. 26 Truly I tell you, you will not get out until you have paid the last penny.

27“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30 And if your right hand causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell."

-------------

Notice how in the passage just above that calling another believer a "fool" is a very serious wrong, that if we didn't confess/repent of, would leave us liable to the fiery end. We can surmise it's not only this one word, but also any equivalent word also, any kind of dismissive condemning judgement of another's personality really.

So, the particular instance is about a general thing. In the next passage, we learn that the intentional continued lusting after another person not one's spouse is already adultery, even when only in the mind. Christ says then, to paraphrase, to do whatever it takes to avoid that temptation, if you are falling into it.

The hyperbolic extreme of gouging out an eye is how we know this is a do-whatever-it-takes instruction.

In real life situations, it could be something like turn-away-and-look-elsewhere, or more, even to avoid going to a certain place that tempting person is at. Do whatever it takes. Of course, we know that prayer is very powerful to help us, so the first step would be to pray the prayer Christ said to us to pray, daily, in Matthew chapter 6. Then if still falling under the temptation, take more steps. I'd suggest not only to avoid that person as needed, but to also pray for specific help to have that specific feeling changed.
Hi thanks for responding. I see what your saying. So is it basically inevitable that we have add our own thoughts and opinions to scipture to help us understand?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Halbhh

Everything You say is Life to me
Supporter
Mar 17, 2015
17,173
9,191
catholic -- embracing all Christians
✟1,152,895.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Hi thanks for responding. I see what your saying. So is it basically inevitable that we have add our own thoughts and opinions to scipture to help us understand?

That's the human weakness we should be aware of, that we will tend to want to stop listening, and start talking over the words with our own ideas or agendas or goals.

But that won't be so good to do, just as it would not be good to do in a classroom either, and for much the same reason -- it's hard to hear what we don't listen to, or talk over, even mentally.

So, with faith, remembering Who we are reading/listening to....then it becomes more possible (with that awareness of Who is speaking) to listen well. That's always humble it seems to me. It's humble to assume we always have more to learn from Him. It's humble to listen. He did tell us that we have to be humble too, see.
 
Upvote 0

Albion

Facilitator
Dec 8, 2004
111,138
33,258
✟583,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
In America, very often the word 'biblical' is used to signal some kinds of familiar social convention are to be imposed onto the scripture in that church, sadly. To use scripture to broadly support conservative politics (even the wrong parts) for example (which is exactly as wrong as using scripture to broadly support all of liberal politics, or any other kind of worldly stuff).

Well, of course everyone speaking that way is thinking that the Bible supports their POV. However, it is rare that a liberal would use the term Bible believer when arguing for any liberal reinterpretation of Scripture or to describe any person who agrees with it.
 
Upvote 0

OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
Supporter
Feb 4, 2006
46,773
10,981
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟960,122.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Halbhh

Everything You say is Life to me
Supporter
Mar 17, 2015
17,173
9,191
catholic -- embracing all Christians
✟1,152,895.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Well, of course everyone speaking that way is thinking that the Bible supports their POV. However, it is rare that a liberal would use the term Bible believer when arguing for any liberal reinterpretation of Scripture or to describe any person who agrees with it.
Yes. That's very interesting.

Even for the clear, outright group communism (pure form) in Acts chapter 2, still we don't hear people saying that they believe in limited group (such as inside a church) communism because they are a "bible believer", or not nearly as often as the other side.

Maybe they should. I mean in different wording of course, since 'communism' of course means the state-totalitarian kind to most everyone, and not the voluntary kind most all families practice.

It would look something like: "We should all be sharing and caring for each other more in churches, helping each other, because we are bible believers".

Now, for many churches this would be simply preaching what is already happening, to some extent.
 
Upvote 0