Smile, God doesn't Love everyone -- the Bible says so!

[Eph4:26]

Yes, your qualifier that Jesus was speaking to a Jewish audience is true. It is also true that Paul was preaching to the Gentiles when he wrote Timothy with words of encouragement to strive for Christ.

Yes, Jesus' flock has grown. IMHO, its growth ratio to the general populace has remain constant.

 

[Eph4:26]

God's love is conditional.

love = doing the commandments (2 John 6)

God hates those that do not do the commandments (Psalm 5:5).

 

[A New Dawn]

God's love is conditional.

love = doing the commandments (2 John 6)

God hates those that do not do the commandments (Psalm 5:5).

So you believe in a works-based salvation. Cool. It completely contradicts the scriptures, but cool!

(But I think I should tell you that that 2 John scripture is a sanctification scripture, not a justification scripture. It has to do with those who have already been saved. How to demonstrate your love to God (which only can be done after you have already been justified.))

 

[Eph4:26]

So you believe in a works-based salvation.

Yes, I do. But not in the sense that you are referring to. God working thru me to do the commandments is part of a continues process of being saved.

With respects to the rest of your statement, if I understand you correctly, those that are saved don't have to do anything. Is that what you are suggesting?

 

[brinny]

[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]

Contrary to popular opinion, the Bible doesn't support the notion that God love is unconditional. [/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]Also, [/FONT]popular opinion has ambiguously combined love with saved -- that to is in error. [FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]
I might as well say it right here in Post #1:

[/FONT]John 3:16 is not a freewill 'get out of jail' card that can be played to guarentee universal salvation for everyone that ever lived. Pardon the brevity of what I'm about to say for the moment, the context of John 3:16 is 'Look to Jesus for eternal life'!

NOT . . . . Jesus loves me, so I get to go to heaven when I die

'tis the truth my brother.....our God says so Himself.

 

[A New Dawn]

Yes, I do. But not in the sense that you are referring to. God working thru me to do the commandments is part of a continues process of being saved.

With respects to the rest of your statement, if I understand you correctly, those that are saved don't have to do anything. Is that what you are suggesting?

No, does saying we need to follow the commandments out of respect and love sound like we don't have to do anything? Otherwise, that would be considered antinomianism, and I don't see anyone promoting antinomianism.

 

[Eph4:26]

No

Please forgive me. I really don't understand what you are trying to say. When you say, 'no', is that your answer to my question '. . . those that are saved don't have to do anything?'

 

[brinny]

No, does saying we need to follow the commandments out of respect and love sound like we don't have to do anything? Otherwise, that would be considered antinomianism, and I don't see anyone promoting antinomianism.

of course if we love our Lord, we have a passion and a heart's desire to out-pour those things He has placed in our hearts...it comes as naturally as breathing....it is because our hearts are changed....

 

[A New Dawn]

of course if we love our Lord, we have a passion and a heart's desire to out-pour those things He has placed in our hearts...it comes as naturally as breathing....it is because our hearts are changed....

We can't have a passion that leads to a desire to please God as a result of being born again, and yet have them be the basis for our salvation. They are either the result of our salvation, or the cause of it. They can't be both.

 

[A New Dawn]

Please forgive me. I really don't understand what you are trying to say. When you say, 'no', is that your answer to my question '. . . those that are saved don't have to do anything?'

You asked a question at the end of your post.

With respects to the rest of your statement, if I understand you correctly, those that are saved don't have to do anything. Is that what you are suggesting?

My answer was the answer to your question, was I suggesting that those that are saved don't have to do anything. No, I am not suggesting that in the least. I am suggesting that salvation is not based on works, though.

 

[Eph4:26]

. . . I am suggesting that salvation is not based on works, though.

The Scriptures makes a distinction between the works of man ('look what I did God' -- pride) and the works of God thru man ('whatever you command me to do God, I will obey'). Now, back to the topic.

If God hasn't written the commandments into the hearts of His believers, it's because God does not love them.

 

[A New Dawn]

The Scriptures makes a distinction between the works of man ('look what I did God' -- pride) and the works of God thru man ('whatever you command me to do God, I will obey'). Now, back to the topic.

Thank you for making that distinction, but just to be clear, we are still not saved on the basis of any work except God's.

 

[Eph4:26]

God only loves those that obey His commandments
Everyone else, don't hear God's word because God didn't give them a hearing ear to hear.

 

[martymonster]

God only loves those that obey His commandments
Everyone else, don't hear God's word because God didn't give them a hearing ear to hear.

Mat 5:43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
Mat 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.
Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
Mat 5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Hmm, if that's the benchmark then I'd think that God would more than live up to it.

Don't you?

 

[Eph4:26]

martymonster . . .

I'm unclear what you are implying.
Do you believe that love is conditional?

 

[martymonster]

martymonster . . .

I'm unclear what you are implying.
Do you believe that love is conditional?

Implying?

I'm not implying anything, that's scripture I posted about the very thing that your saying as well and you think I'm implying something?

Read it again and if you still don't get I explain it to you.

 

[Eph4:26]

martymonster . . .

Let me rephrase my previous post, "I'm unclear as to what your point is?"

Do you believe love is conditional?

 

[martymonster]

martymonster . . .

Let me rephrase my previous post, "I'm unclear as to what your point is?"

Do you believe love is conditional?

Love is love is definitely not conditional.


1Jn 4:19 We love him, because he first loved us.
1Jn 4:20 If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?

 

[Eph4:26]

IMHO, I believe you are taking two verses out of context and drawing a conclusion that is contrary to the spirit for which John is describing the conditional nature of love.

I'll try my best to clearly and concisely explain.

First off, if we can't love God unless God loved us first, isn't that a conditional statement?

More over, John defines the conditional nature of love . . . .

And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it. (2 John 6)

Therefore, everywhere John writes about love, it must be within the context of obeying the commandments. Is 1 John 4:19, 20 within the context of John's conditional definition of love? Yes. For, the very next verse (21) puts the condition on love . . .

[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva] 21 And this commandment we have from Him, that the one who loves God should love his brother also.

[/FONT]

 

[Eph4:26]

Continuing with the previous post. The conditional nature of love doesn't mean to love our natural brothers and sisters, it means to love our spiritual brothers and sisters.

Lu 8:21 -
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]But (Jesus) answered and said to them, "My mother and My brothers are these who hear the word of God and do it." [/FONT]

But you can't hear the word of God by your own free-will.

Prov. 20:12
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]The hearing ear and the seeing eye, The LORD has made both of them.

A hearing ear is equated to obeying.

Ps. 18:44

. . . As soon as they hear, they obey me.[/FONT]

Obedience is a condition for eternal life.

Joh 3:36 - [FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]"He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

[/FONT][/FONT]John's description of love harmonizes within the context of the whole Bible. God gives His children ears to hear. The children obey the commandments that they along hear. They love God because God loved them first.