Small church advantage: "Everybody knows everybody" but is that necessarily a good thing?

[justme6272]

Like a small town, do you really want that many people getting up close and personal? Where everybody knows everybody's business, such that if you tell one person, the smaller gossip mill makes it such that you might as well have told everybody?
If even one sick man shows up and starts shaking hands with every guy they can find (as certain outgoing church men are prone to do for some reason, while women don't do that), now the entire church is deathly ill with a stomach virus. It happened to me last week and I don't want to shake another hand, ever, anywhere. I was totally bedridden, incapacitated, and one breath short of the emergency room. With a stomach in knots and throwing up my guts profusely, I thought I was going to die, comparable to food poisoning, maybe worse.

How is that good? Someone suggested doing a 'fist bump.' Have you ever known men who only do 'fist bumps' for that very reason? I think it's awkward to offer a fist to someone who is offering a handshake, but if that's what I have to do to avoid that illness again, so be it. I will do whatever it takes to not go through that again. And who is to say there aren't germs on their knuckles? I've gotten to where I either avoid the greeters at the door, (who never took or forgot their microbiology), and are spreading germs like they're going out of style, in favor of a back door entrance, or else I IMMEDIATELY go to the restroom and wash my hands, only to quickly run into other men who insist on shaking hands after that.

Medical professionals know that churches are like elementary schools and cruise ships - filled with rapidly spreading germs due to everyone being in confined spaces. It doesn't require a handshake. What's needed is the right proportions of bleach and water and a lot of disinfecting. And people washing their hands after they use the restroom.

People trash talk megachurches due to them being so impersonal, such that you could show up and leave without anyone even knowing you were there. But at least you don't leave with a disease you didn't show up with.

I don't understand why the long-standing tradition of handshaking continues in ANY sized church. I guess there just haven't been ENOUGH people get sick ENOUGH to convince them to stop it. I have, and if it were up to me, I'm done with the handshaking. Forever.
There are probably other disadvantages to small churches I haven't thought of. Feel free to leave your own.

 

[~Anastasia~]

You really wouldn't like our Church then - we generally still exchange the kiss of peace. Not every person, but a lot of kissing goes on (both cheeks for the Greeks).

And we've got a lot of kids, and a lot of elderly who could easily get sick. Yet there's essentially never disease spread at Church.

I work in the school system, and I often fight sickness from the kids. My immune system is still weak (but much better than it was from cancer treatment). But it's the schools that concern me - not Church.

I prefer what most would probably call a medium-sized Church. Or maybe it's small. I guess it depends on your point of view.

 

[Basil the Great]

Before my aunt died a few years ago, she told me a story about my grandmother that I had never heard. After attending church one Sunday, grama went to my aunt and uncle's home for dinner. I guess grama was complaining about certain people at church and my uncle said something to her about it, asking her what good did church do her if she talked negatively about others. Grama responded by saying, "Just think how much more I would talk about others if I did not go to church".

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

People trash talk megachurches due to them being so impersonal, such that you could show up and leave without anyone even knowing you were there. But at least you don't leave with a disease you didn't show up with.

? what... The disease that people do show up with, they leave with, instead of being set free from. Is that what you mean ?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I don't understand why the long-standing tradition of handshaking continues in ANY sized church. I guess there just haven't been ENOUGH people get sick ENOUGH to convince them to stop it. I have, and if it were up to me, I'm done with the handshaking. Forever.
There are probably other disadvantages to small churches I haven't thought of. Feel free to leave your own.

Do you know, did you read in Scripture, what Jesus and the Apostles did all thru their ministries , in small meetings, house to house , etc ... ?
EVERYWHERE they went, they healed people .... NOT people got sick....

SO large or small, if you find the meeting where people are healed , instead of being sick and leaving sick, or becoming sick,
as Scripture says "find those who are true and faithful in the town you go to, and stay with them ...."

 

[justme6272]

Before my aunt died a few years ago, she told me a story about my grandmother that I had never heard. After attending church one Sunday, grama went to my aunt and uncle's home for dinner. I guess grama was complaining about certain people at church and my uncle said something to her about it, asking her what good did church do her if she talked negatively about others. Grama responded by saying, "Just think how much more I would talk about others if I did not go to church".

It's that kind of thing that makes me not want to say anything to anybody. Months ago, one guy asked me a question about my personal finances. When I told him today how I had to take leftover pain medication to get relief from my severe illness, he asked me what the medication was originally prescribed for. He thinks my finances and medical history are his business.

 

[Phil W]

Like a small town, do you really want that many people getting up close and personal? Where everybody knows everybody's business, such that if you tell one person, the smaller gossip mill makes it such that you might as well have told everybody?
If even one sick man shows up and starts shaking hands with every guy they can find (as certain outgoing church men are prone to do for some reason, while women don't do that), now the entire church is deathly ill with a stomach virus. It happened to me last week and I don't want to shake another hand, ever, anywhere. I was totally bedridden, incapacitated, and one breath short of the emergency room. With a stomach in knots and throwing up my guts profusely, I thought I was going to die, comparable to food poisoning, maybe worse.

How is that good? Someone suggested doing a 'fist bump.' Have you ever known men who only do 'fist bumps' for that very reason? I think it's awkward to offer a fist to someone who is offering a handshake, but if that's what I have to do to avoid that illness again, so be it. I will do whatever it takes to not go through that again. And who is to say there aren't germs on their knuckles? I've gotten to where I either avoid the greeters at the door, (who never took or forgot their microbiology), and are spreading germs like they're going out of style, in favor of a back door entrance, or else I IMMEDIATELY go to the restroom and wash my hands, only to quickly run into other men who insist on shaking hands after that.

Medical professionals know that churches are like elementary schools and cruise ships - filled with rapidly spreading germs due to everyone being in confined spaces. It doesn't require a handshake. What's needed is the right proportions of bleach and water and a lot of disinfecting. And people washing their hands after they use the restroom.

People trash talk megachurches due to them being so impersonal, such that you could show up and leave without anyone even knowing you were there. But at least you don't leave with a disease you didn't show up with.

I don't understand why the long-standing tradition of handshaking continues in ANY sized church. I guess there just haven't been ENOUGH people get sick ENOUGH to convince them to stop it. I have, and if it were up to me, I'm done with the handshaking. Forever.
There are probably other disadvantages to small churches I haven't thought of. Feel free to leave your own.

Christians don't "gossip".

 

[public hermit]

It's a give and take. Only the men shake hands at our small church. The elderly women will hug you. They ain't heard about no "me too."

They do get right nosey, too. I am a private person. I like some space. When they get into my personal business I just smile real big and say, " C'mon on now, Betty. Are you trying get all in my personal business?" I laugh like it's the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard and it's forgotten. Even if they know you're trying to avoid answering, they will often let it go. That's some folks, of course.

But, I also know that when you're down and out, small church folks can be the best. If they're a real loving crowd, they'll look after you. It's weird. I love people I would have never been around except for the fact we're Christians together. But, as I say, it's a give and take.

 

[~Anastasia~]

That's another thing about my Church ... they are truly a huge family. Yes, everyone knows quite a bit about everyone's business, but not because of gossip. More like how you know what your cousin Henry is going through - because he's your cousin and probably told you himself.

The Greeks started the Church here really AS families coming over. And since ancient times, whenever a person is baptized, or married, they have people already in the Church to receive them as family. Real family bonds are created. For example if you receive in baptism a boy and a girl, those two can never marry each other because they are essentially brother and sister.

The Church was meant to be a close family-community. So yes, we know all about each others' struggles so we can help each other and pray for each other, and about each others' joys so we can celebrate with them.

That's another reason I like a Church of a certain size. If it gets TOO big, there can no longer be those kinds of connections.

 

[justme6272]

The Greeks started the Church here really AS families coming over. And since ancient times, whenever a person is baptized, or married, they have people already in the Church to receive them as family. Real family bonds are created. For example if you receive in baptism a boy and a girl, those two can never marry each other because they are essentially brother and sister.

Well that's a new one on me.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Well that's a new one on me.

Maybe.

But it's been that way for many centuries. I'm curious now when it started as well. Some things go back to the Apostles, but some don't. Now I'm curious.

 

[Phil W]

That's another thing about my Church ... they are truly a huge family. Yes, everyone knows quite a bit about everyone's business, but not because of gossip. More like how you know what your cousin Henry is going through - because he's your cousin and probably told you himself.

The Greeks started the Church here really AS families coming over. And since ancient times, whenever a person is baptized, or married, they have people already in the Church to receive them as family. Real family bonds are created.

For example if you receive in baptism a boy and a girl, those two can never marry each other because they are essentially brother and sister.

That is absolutely ridiculous.
The men and women of your own church are the best folks to marry.
By being familiar with the other, ahead of "dating age", it gets rid of any "dating" issues.
It sure beats marrying someone from the world.
And what if there are no other Christians in the area?
Celibacy?

You had better come up with some teaching by Paul or Peter etc. about this "idea".

 

[Phil W]

Maybe.

But it's been that way for many centuries. I'm curious now when it started as well. Some things go back to the Apostles, but some don't. Now I'm curious.

Who do you marry?

 

[~Anastasia~]

That is absolutely ridiculous.
The men and women of your own church are the best folks to marry.
By being familiar with the other, ahead of "dating age", it gets rid of any "dating" issues.
It sure beats marrying someone from the world.
And what if there are no other Christians in the area?
Celibacy?

You had better come up with some teaching by Paul or Peter etc. about this "idea".

Thanks for your opinion, lol.

I'm still looking for the time it started but I can assure it's a very old Christian custom.

Who do you marry?

It's often solved easily enough by families (especially in smaller areas) baptizing only boys, or only girls. This prevent creating relationships that would later prevent marriage.

It's worked in Greece for many centuries. They've been Christian since the travels of the Apostles.

 

[Halbhh]

do you really want that many people getting up close and personal?

YES!

(note that's not about shaking hands, but about real love)

(I have used all caps like about twice ever on CF I'm guessing)

Why though?

Here's why:

34“A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

John 14:23 Jesus replied, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word. My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.

There is nothing better here on Earth than this.

---------
I'm really sorry to hear you got a virus from shaking hands. Many here at our church will not shake your hand if they are sick. They just smile and hold their hands back and love you without shaking hands.

 

[Halbhh]

That's another thing about my Church ... they are truly a huge family. Yes, everyone knows quite a bit about everyone's business, but not because of gossip. More like how you know what your cousin Henry is going through - because he's your cousin and probably told you himself.

The Greeks started the Church here really AS families coming over. And since ancient times, whenever a person is baptized, or married, they have people already in the Church to receive them as family. Real family bonds are created. For example if you receive in baptism a boy and a girl, those two can never marry each other because they are essentially brother and sister.

The Church was meant to be a close family-community. So yes, we know all about each others' struggles so we can help each other and pray for each other, and about each others' joys so we can celebrate with them.

That's another reason I like a Church of a certain size. If it gets TOO big, there can no longer be those kinds of connections.

I'm not sure I understand the recieve as family about not being able to marry later. It appears as if saying that strangers accept newcomers and make them like "family", love them, but then...?? there can't later be a marriage between these people that are not actual family members by genetics?

 

[~Anastasia~]

YES!

(note that's not about shaking hands, but about real love)

(I have used all caps like about twice ever on CF I'm guessing)

Why though?

Here's why:

34“A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

John 14:23 Jesus replied, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word. My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.

There is nothing better here on Earth than this.

---------
I'm really sorry to hear you got a virus from shaking hands. Many here at our church will not shake your hand if they are sick. They just smile and hold their hands back and love you without shaking hands.

That's us too ... when I AM sick I keep my distance and hold up my hands to keep people from coming and kissing. There are many folks dear to me in their 80s and 90s, and I wouldn't want to make them sick. Others do the same.

 

[~Anastasia~]

I'm not sure I understand the recieve as family about not being able to marry later. It appears as if saying that strangers accept newcomers and make them like "family", love them, but then...?? there can't later be a marriage between these people that are not actual family members by genetics?

It has to do with sacramental family.

At a baptism or a marriage, there are one or two people who accompany the person/people being baptized or married. Those people become family. And no, they can't later marry. Also their immediate families can't marry.

There are good reasons for this. Spiritually, you would usually mentor a person you stand with in baptism. That creates the kind of relationship that doesn't mix well with sexual attraction.

It creates strong family connections. I'm still looking for when it started, but I think it was St. John Chrysostom who said people should not baptize each others' children, because they miss the opportunity to create even wider family connections (because the first baptism would join the families). But he was born around 349 so that would mean it was an established practice before then. I'm still looking to be sure though.

There are ways of not creating problems - like each family baptizing only boys or only girls so that none of them would grow up and want to marry.

Remember too people often came from small villages where they WERE genetically related to a degree. Often people went looking in other villages or islands for a husband/wife. The Church is also a major networking tool for matchmaking.

 

[Phil W]

Thanks for your opinion, lol.
I'm still looking for the time it started but I can assure it's a very old Christian custom.
It's often solved easily enough by families (especially in smaller areas) baptizing only boys, or only girls. This prevent creating relationships that would later prevent marriage.
It's worked in Greece for many centuries. They've been Christian since the travels of the Apostles.

So you leave the boys (or girls) in their sins, in their flesh, till they marry for the sake of marrying?
That is not Christianity.
What happens to them if they die before marrying?[/QUOTE]

 

[~Anastasia~]

So you leave the boys (or girls) in their sins, in their flesh, till they marry for the sake of marrying?
That is not Christianity.
What happens to them if they die before marrying?

[/QUOTE]
No one said they couldn't marry.

Of course they marry.

They just don't marry their sisters, aunts, or nieces. Including those related by sacrament as well as blood.

I'm still looking for solid date evidence but it appears it's been a Christian practice for at least 17 centuries, and perhaps longer.

OT Jewish law forbids a man from marrying his father's wife, for example, and this is a relationship not by blood but a created one due to ties of marriage. Perhaps that's the precedent but I'm only speculating. Still looking for hard info.