Should President Trump Apologize to Obama?

[pat34lee]

Where is the evidence? Trump's DoJ says none, so I guess Trump's "agency" is corrupt? It has turned out to baseless charges...and it has happened before with the birther issue. At some point people, especially Christians, will realize Trump is a pathological liar.

Last point here is irrelevant.

And Trump has no DOJ until the moles are gone.
The release of Obama's inaugural day letter to
Trump proves there are still people actively trying
to depose him from inside the administration.

 

[Jamsie]

Last point here is irrelevant.

And Trump has no DOJ until the moles are gone.
The release of Obama's inaugural day letter to
Trump proves there are still people actively trying
to depose him from inside the administration.

I don't think the truth of the statement is at all irrelevant, it informs many of the issues being discussed. Attempting to excuse and deny the obvious appears to be the new standard.

Who is the Attorney General? Who oversees and heads the DoJ? So who had the final authority to release the "No Evidence" rendering? Yes, leaks are common with all administrations... it is also true that Trump showed the letter from Obama to many people.

 

[NothingIsImpossible]

Is the "everybody else does it" really a valid defense? And is it one that should be defended by Christians?

Yes it is. All politicians lie. Excepting them to apologize for every lie is like expecting a con man to admit to conning. Not defending it as a christian though, just saying from a moral stand point politicians aren't that moral.

In this instance we are talking about Trump who claims to be a Christian

Never heard him claim to be one. Hes even said hes not. He just tried gaining christian support by saying he was for us.

Who is "they"? It has been investigated by Trump's own DoJ under Sessions...they found no evidence, why is it necessary to create all sorts of excuses, other possibilities, and false analogies to avoid the obvious?

Is it possible that there was massive voter fraud although every federal, state, independent, and republican investigation has come up empty of such...? Is it possible that Trump was correct and that his inaugural audience was the largest ever even though it was shown to be false...well, maybe tens of thousands of people were wearing invisible suits, maybe all of the photos were photoshop manipulated, maybe, maybe, maybe... and sometimes maybe we should face the facts as we know them. (or at least until some legitimate evidence provides otherwise)

Well your talking about other instances which are obvious that he was wrong (like about the crowd). I'm talking about the wire tapping. Doesn't matter if the DoJ looked into it. Governments can and will lie. Lets for example say the JFK assassination really was an inside job. Do you really think the gov would admit to it? The higher ups would tell anyone investigating to say they found nothing.

Nor directed at you per say but I find many christians to be nieve about how the world works. Especially the government. All have state secrets that no one will ever know about. Such as I said about the black ops that are done. We are told the money is for black projects, but other then that we are never told what the projects/ops are. Because its a secret.

Actually when we took out Osama it was made public of course but with very limited details. And when the one member of the SEAL team was revealed on accident, the gov was super mad about it. It was suppose to be a secret for a reason. People aren't suppose to know who carries out such tasks.

 

[Monk Brendan]

Well let's see...the claim that the British did it fell quickly to the wayside, and so great a new conspiracy theory. Obama made a call to the local "Wires Tapped "R" Us and then...what?

No, you're wrong. He went to K-Mart!

 

[Monk Brendan]

should Trump apologize for such a defamatory claim?

He will, if Hillary will apologize to him for all the inflammatory and untrue statements she made during the campaign, and continues to make TEN months after Trump was elected.

 

[Jamsie]

Yes it is. All politicians lie.

I would tend to differentiate in the general us of "lie". A lie defined as an attempt to deceive or a complete bungling of basic facts, an exaggeration - within reason, or a misstatement not intended as deceitful but more ignorant of the truth/facts. Of course intent is not always easy to determine...but not all statements that are false or mostly false have the intent of deception. That being said, shouldn't one be much more discerning when evaluating a candidate?

Never heard him claim to be one. Hes even said hes not. He just tried gaining christian support by saying he was for us.

When did he state that he wasn't?

“I know that President-elect Trump has a personal relationship with the Lord Jesus Christ,” she added. “We’ve had in-depth conversations about God.” Paula White
Paula White, Trump’s Spiritual Adviser, Says He Has ‘a Hunger for God’

"Only the Lord knows the condition of a person’s heart. I can only tell you what I’ve heard. First, Trump appears to be tender to things of the Spirit." James Dobson

He succeeded in gaining support from many "Christian leaders" (F. Graham, Falwell, Jr., etc.) who tend to defend and support him in spite of his obvious proclivity to assault the truth.

I'm talking about the wire tapping. Doesn't matter if the DoJ looked into it. Governments can and will lie. Lets for example say the JFK assassination really was an inside job. Do you really think the gov would admit to it? The higher ups would tell anyone investigating to say they found nothing.

Actually it is more typical that at some point someone will come forward with some basis of fact to counter the prevailing belief. Again, in this case why would Sessions seek to cover for Trump who he obviously worships? (The JFK assassination was over 50 years ago and all we have really are various conspiracy theories)

We are told the money is for black projects, but other then that we are never told what the projects/ops are. Because its a secret.

Actually when we took out Osama it was made public of course but with very limited details. And when the one member of the SEAL team was revealed on accident, the gov was super mad about it. It was suppose to be a secret for a reason. People aren't suppose to know who carries out such tasks.

Certainly some things, black ops for one, are best kept under wraps. And we can agree to a point concerning the government however, at this point in time much less is able to be kept from the public. Whistleblowers and even leaks are much more common, and though journalism at one level is ratings oriented there are still those with connections to unpack the behind the scenes goings on.

I have always been quite able to admit when I am wrong, but I won't fall pray to speculation without even a modicum of evidence...conspiracy theories run rampant through our society at large, because many will believe anything especially when it enforces a bias.

 

[Monk Brendan]

And I'm neutral..not being from the states I could care less. But he is not a deciple of the Lord JESUS .

OOOps! You're not supposed to say that. CF rules state, "Stating or implying that another Christian member, or group of members, are not Christian is not allowed."

While Trump might not be a member (although you can never tell), he CLAIMS to be a Christian, and we should all give him the respect that we want when we are confronted by a Christian calling us "lost."

 

[Monk Brendan]

Never heard him claim to be one. Hes even said hes not. He just tried gaining christian support by saying he was for us.

George W Bush did the same thing. So did Bill Clinton and Jimmy Carter.

I do believe that Carter is.

 

[Jamsie]

He will, if Hillary will apologize to him for all the inflammatory and untrue statements she made during the campaign, and continues to make TEN months after Trump was elected.

K-Mart... actually that would be a wise choice as they are seriously under the shopping radar!

Hillary is another story but we are talking Trump. Anyway, nothing is Hillary's fault it is the Russians, NY Times, Facebook, misogyny, the DNC, the universe, and of course Bernie Sanders that cost her the election ... and probably a bushel full of other factors. (and a tiny little hardly perceptible amount is on her)

If person A somehow does me wrong that is on them but if I do person B wrong I will take responsibility to apologize or correct the wrong. How person A conducts their life doesn't conflict with my personal ethic towards person B.

 

[Hal A Peno]

dry

 

[Hal A Peno]

dfg

 

[Jamsie]

Open the window and smell the roses, there's constant 'wire tapping' going on between the parties and their mobs.

Outside my windows on both ends of the house are Lilacs, and at one end apple tress...boy, K-Mart must be busy!

 

[Hal A Peno]

zdfh

 

[Jamsie]

Me too. Lilac's and apple trees are everywhere, sometimes side by side. The farm I'm on planted them over 200 years ago and some of the lilac bushes are over 20-30 feet at the base. I wish they would bloom for a month instead of a week or so. K-Mart is going down the tubes along with Sears by the way.

Yes, sad about Sears...wasn't ever that familiar with K-Mart. Love the Lilacs, and ours too are more like trees than bushes. Bad year here for the apple trees there are apples but pretty bare of leaves, very strange. Ours is a horse farm, and so much rain this year that we just finished our first cut about a week ago...have had very few windows of at least 4 days. I think the farm house here is about 150 or so, love the quiet ...

 

[jsn112]

As if anyone is surprised that within the incessant lying of Trump a particularly outlandish falsehood was made against Obama concerning wire tapping. Though it had been dismissed by many at the time now his own DOJ has confirmed that there is absolutely no evidence for such an abhorrent false statement. In spite of Huckabee-Sanders constant fumbling defense of Trump regardless of the truth and simply dismissing with "That is old news", should Trump apologize for such a defamatory claim? After all Trump, with his overinflated ego fully in tact, stated that "Nobody loves the Bible more than I do" ... does a Christian have a responsibility to "right a wrong" against someone?

No, Trump did not lie. Trump vindicated? Manafort wiretapping report lends credence to claim


However, Obama should apologize to Americans for all of his lies. Where is my $2,500?!

 

[Jamsie]

No, Trump did not lie. Trump vindicated? Manafort wiretapping report lends credence to claim
However, Obama should apologize to Americans for all of his lies. Where is my $2,500?!

Nice try, but not even close. The key point was that Obama had "wire tapped", but as I'm sure that you are aware a president has absolutely no authority to do so. Further, you would realize that the FBI focused on Mannafort even before he was Trump's campaign manager. So I'm not sure where your $2,500. is, but you'll need to do better, and by the way Obama having the British tap Trump already was tried, and failed...so maybe you can come up with another conspiratorial theory.

 

[Traveling teacher]

Lets see a setting President wiretapped another political party breaking into there headquarters and stealing tapes and information......
Then orquestrating a coverup by sending all his cronies from the Department of Justice
To Lie under oath during an investigation.....

This is Nixon 1973 watergate coverup......

No its Obama wiretapping Trump during a campaign and sending Clapper and Loretta Lynch to flat out lie under oath and said no one was unmasked..........
By the way FBI headComey knew this and lied about it....

They all knew it cause they are the ones that were over it.......

NIxon was tarred and feathered and run out of town

TRust me our government is so corrupt this is going on all the time and nothing will ever come of it.....
No one will be indicted.......
No one will apologise.....
We have turned into a deep state....
That is no different than Communism in Stalins day
Or Any dictatorship that destroys its oponents......

I remeber when this happened to Nixon I was ashamed to be a republican..........
And my dad as a devout republican said Nixon deserved it...

 

[Jamsie]

No its Obama wiretapping Trump during a campaign and sending Clapper and Loretta Lynch to flat out lie under oath and said no one was unmasked..........
By the way FBI headComey knew this and lied about it....

Yes, one no longer needs one iota of proof just make blanket unsupported statements. So the FISA court lied too... when you have some legitimate proof let me know or you might stop reading all of those far right fake news sites. If there is or were any truth to these so far unfounded allegations they will come out in legitimate news sources.

 

[Zatek]

Nice try, but not even close. The key point was that Obama had "wire tapped", but as I'm sure that you are aware a president has absolutely no authority to do so. Further, you would realize that the FBI focused on Mannafort even before he was Trump's campaign manager. So I'm not sure where your $2,500. is, but you'll need to do better, and by the way Obama having the British tap Trump already was tried, and failed...so maybe you can come up with another conspiratorial theory.

The government records conversations of people all the time, especially ones with people in foreign countries. Lots of people, including Trump, have their conversations recorded by the government not because they are suspect, but the government is interested in what powerful people in other countries are doing. Intelligence groups black out all information that could possibly identify who the US citizen is but leaves the information about the foreign person available for other government agencies to use. To have the information about the US citizen "unmasked" they're supposed to have to obtain a warrant from a FISA court just like any other search per the 4th amendment.

And obviously there isn't any proof Obama was involved. They aren't stupid enough to leave a trail, and there really isn't any need have meetings about stuff like this anyway. Liberals know what their job is, they know they're supposed to do anything they can to destroy any opposing candidates and to deny everything and let the media cover for them if they get caught. Lois Lerner didn't need to go and have a meeting with Obama to know that she should target conservative groups and prevent them from get non-profit status, and Susan Rice does need Obama to tell her to get information on the Trump campaign and make sure it gets leaked to the media.

So sure, it's correct that Obama didn't order trump to be surveilled, but he fostered an environment where that kind of illegal abuse of power was encouraged, as is evidenced by his protection of Eric Holder, Lois Lerner, Loretta Lynch, etc. And sure, "wiretapping" might be the correct technical term to describe what happened, but information about Trump and his campaign was surveilled and illegal obtained and leaked. If your argument is nothing but "Trump said the wrong word, lets ignore what he actually mean tand all the facts about government misuse of power, and just laugh at Trump instead", then it's clear you have no integrity.

 

[Jamsie]

And obviously there isn't any proof Obama was involved.

You should have stopped there, but you couldn't...

If your argument is nothing but "Trump said the wrong word, lets ignore what he actually mean tand all the facts about government misuse of power, and just laugh at Trump instead", then it's clear you have no integrity.

The things you learn on CF, I'm called liar, and if my argument is based on your presumptive expectations then I have no integrity. You also might want to check on exactly why specific individuals were under "surveillance" ... no that only might give you some actual information, and that is an abominable thing for one's bias.