Should atheists be allowed to serve in the US military?

[madaz]

That being the case, should atheists be allowed to serve in the US military or might their presence there offend God with their disbelief in His Divine Providence?

If God exists, I'd expect Him to be more offended by the actions of His war mongering followers than by lack of belief from unbelievers.

 

[stevevw]

Steve, the misunderstanding between us is clear.

I thought you were using the word "Christian" in a moral sense but you were actually using the word "Christian" in the religious sense.

Can we at least agree on that?

But even if you use the meaning in the moral sense do you think morally Bush for example was being a Christian and standing up for Christian morals.

 

[madaz]

But even if you use the meaning in the moral sense do you think morally Bush for example was being a Christian and standing up for Christian morals.

Bush and Blair prayed to God for guidance regarding the war, who am I to question their origin of morality?

 

[stevevw]

If God exists, I'd expect Him to be more offended by the actions of His war mongering followers than by lack of belief from unbelievers.

Yes those who claim that they are for God and are His representative and then do things that are against God will be judged more harshly. Thats why it says those who are first will be last and those who are last will be first. As those who say they know Jesus and are doing all those good works haven't really got him in their lives. There are even non Christians who will inherit the kingdom of God before so called religious people who claim to be saved.

There is a parable about the two sons that speaks of this.
Matthew 21:28-32 The Parable of the Two Sons

28 “What do you think? There was a man who had two sons. He went to the first and said, ‘Son, go and work today in the vineyard.’
29 “‘I will not,’ he answered, but later he changed his mind and went.
30 “Then the father went to the other son and said the same thing. He answered, ‘I will, sir,’ but he did not go.
31 “Which of the two did what his father wanted?”
“The first,” they answered.
Jesus said to them, “Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you. 32 For John came to you to show you the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and the prostitutes did. And even after you saw this, you did not repent and believe him.

 

[stevevw]

Bush and Blair prayed to God for guidance regarding the war, who am I to question their origin of morality?

Just like the pharisees in the bible.

Matthew 23:14
14"Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you devour widows' houses, and for a pretense you make long prayers; therefore you will receive greater condemnation.

Matthew 6:5
5"When you pray, you are not to be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and on the street corners so that they may be seen by men. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full.

 

[madaz]

But even if you use the meaning in the moral sense do you think morally Bush for example was being a Christian and standing up for Christian morals.

I don't think I addressed this question properly Steve so I will do it again.

First of all we need to define what exactly Christian morals are, from my experience "Christian" "morality" is as varied as there are different Christians.

So to answer your question, historically when we look at how often war mongering Christians have attacked Muslims, I think Bush was being a typical Christian and standing up for "Christian" morals yes.

 

[stevevw]

I don't think I addressed this question properly Steve so I will do it again.

First of all we need to define what exactly Christian morals are, from my experience "Christian" "morality" is as varied as there are different Christians.

So to answer your question, historically when we look at how often war mongering Christians have attacked Muslims, I think Bush was being a typical Christian and standing up for "Christian" morals yes.

I think there is a world view that the US and the western nations as they are called like Australia and England are seen as Christian Nations. Or at least were founded on Christian principles. But I believe this is an outdated view as much as the US dollar bill has on it in God we trust. Yet that dollar bill has been the destruction of so much that is Christian and you cannot serve money and God at the same time. So there lies the hypocrisy.

But I dont think Bush or the US entered any war on Christian morals. It was more political and what they called instilling a democratic system into Iraq. It was about stopping a dictator as they said from getting to much power and threatening the world. It was also about protecting US citizens in the area.

But if we are honest the true reason the US and the coalition of the willing went in was about money and power. Iraq was trying to get Kuwait's oil reserves. The US knew this would threaten economies and didn't want to lose control of this to some mad man in the middle east. So it was really about money and power not Christian morals. I think it was the second time when they went in certainly wasn't based on Christian morals because it has now been proven that the bases they used that Iraq had WMDs was a lie and they knew it. George Bush junior just wanted to finish what his dad started. I think this can also be the reason for the Afghanistan war as there was no Christian morals for that either and it was based on a lie. I would say the same as the Vietnam war which was all about money. In fact if we knew the truth about many of these situations I think you will find there are all sorts of corrupt deals and decisions going on behind the scenes that would shock many. I I can tell you they were not based on Christian morals.

 

[madaz]

But I dont think Bush or the US entered any war on Christian morals.

Well that may be so, but you cant deny Bush (a Christian admired by millions of Christians) once said-

'I am driven with a mission from God'. God would tell me, 'George go and fight these terrorists in Afghanistan'. And I did. And then God would tell me 'George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq'. And I did, I feel God's words coming to me, 'Go get the Palestinians their state and get the Israelis their security, and get peace in the Middle East'. And, by God, I'm gonna do it."