Serious Question, Does God hate "Some" people ?

[Gregory Thompson]

"now we know that a murder has no eternal life in him" 1st John speaking about when someone hates a brother.

If God hates in that sense, then He has no eternal life to give to us. So experiencing the opposite for myself .. it would not make sense that God does not "hate" in the 1st John sense.

... Something to consider ... at the very least ...

 

[The Righterzpen]

--Those that end up lost does not mean God did not love them, Romans 5:8. Those lost in hell are the ones that rejected God's love, they put themselves in hell where God did not desire them to be (2 Peter 3:9)

--Love is just one aspect of God (Romans 11:22). God is perfectly just, there then must be justice for those that abuse their free will and go against God. Even in this world, we see there needs to be consequences (fines, penalties, jail time, etc) for those who do wrong (murder, thief, rape) and there is nothing unjust or unloving in that. In God's mind, hell is fair justice for the wicked and heaven is fair for the righteous, nothing unloving in that. God will not force one to be heaven if one does not want to be there.... would it be just to force something upon a man that man did not want? No. Nor can man violate God's law and expect to avoid justice thinking God's love will save him...this would not be justice either.

As far as the eternity of hell, if it takes a bank robber 10 minutes to rob a bank, is 10 minutes in jail just? No. So there is nothing unjust or unloving about punishment time exceeding the crime time. Is 15 years in jail just for a 10 minute crime? Yes. Is eternal hell just for man spending a long life time doing evil? Yes. Does man have the right to determine for God how long the punishment should be? NO!

God's wrath against the wicked is righteous, Romans 2:5.
Psalms 62:12 God is merciful in rendering to each one according to his works. Whether God's sentence is heaven or hell, it is merciful.

--When it comes to free will, logic and understanding, you cannot compare a 2 year old to a responsible, accountable, understanding, reasoning adult. Children are innocent before God and will be saved if they die as children, which is loving and just on God's part.

Romans 5:8 & 2 Peter 3:9 are talking about those who become redeemed. The discussion of this thread isn't about whether Jesus loved those He atoned for. (That should be an obvious "Well duh, of course He did.") The question of the thread has to do with who God hates.

Also, no one is arguing about God's justice and those being under His wrath are justly condemned.

Ultimately this thread is about limited atonement and election. Which "free will" never enters into because the will of fallen man is not free. Adam forfeited that when he disobeyed - and he did so for the rest of humanity too.

The only person born post fall who had a free will was Jesus and that's because he was not the seed of Adam. He was connected to humanity because he was the seed of the woman; which made him fully human. Yet being conceived by the Holy Spirit, the Divine nature made him also fully God. Jesus was not encumbered by a fallen nature, or sin. In this, he even had a certain advantage over Adam, because Adam was limited by the temporal nature of being a created entity; where as a portion of Jesus's personhood was eternal.

Rendering each according to their works is not "mercy" because if all received according to their works, all would be under God's wrath. No one would be saved. Jesus took on the penalty of the wrath of God for those He atoned for. This is the only reason they escape judgement. Jesus did not atone for every human being that ever lived. If he had, than no-one would be condemned, regardless if they believed or not!

Belief only happens because one is indwelled by the Holy Ghost and that only happens to those who are atoned for.

 

[Dave L]

Here's how it works. Jesus paid for all of my sins, past, present, and future. And just as in America you cannot be punished twice for the same crime, as a Christian, I cannot be punished for any sin no matter how serious. But, in view of that, God gave me a brand new nature that loves him and hates sin. So even if free to sin, It repulses me and I love the fullness of the Spirit that comes from holiness more than anything else.

 

[Not David]

You are ignoring the fact people have to want to be saved. Not all do.

True, forcing people to love you by taking away their free will is not love either

 

[Not David]

The implication is what kind of love is it that God allegedly has for those who end up in the lake of fire paying for their sin?

It's like the parent who tells their 2 year old. I love you too much to interfere with your free will; now you can go play in the traffic on the freeway.

Is that really "love"?

Do parents interfer with the free will of their 30 years old child?

 

[Not David]

--Those that end up lost does not mean God did not love them, Romans 5:8. Those lost in hell are the ones that rejected God's love, they put themselves in hell where God did not desire them to be (2 Peter 3:9)

--Love is just one aspect of God (Romans 11:22). God is perfectly just, there then must be justice for those that abuse their free will and go against God. Even in this world, we see there needs to be consequences (fines, penalties, jail time, etc) for those who do wrong (murder, thief, rape) and there is nothing unjust or unloving in that. In God's mind, hell is fair justice for the wicked and heaven is fair for the righteous, nothing unloving in that. God will not force one to be heaven if one does not want to be there.... would it be just to force something upon a man that man did not want? No. Nor can man violate God's law and expect to avoid justice thinking God's love will save him...this would not be justice either.

As far as the eternity of hell, if it takes a bank robber 10 minutes to rob a bank, is 10 minutes in jail just? No. So there is nothing unjust or unloving about punishment time exceeding the crime time. Is 15 years in jail just for a 10 minute crime? Yes. Is eternal hell just for man spending a long life time doing evil? Yes. Does man have the right to determine for God how long the punishment should be? NO!

God's wrath against the wicked is righteous, Romans 2:5.
Psalms 62:12 God is merciful in rendering to each one according to his works. Whether God's sentence is heaven or hell, it is merciful.

--When it comes to free will, logic and understanding, you cannot compare a 2 year old to a responsible, accountable, understanding, reasoning adult. Children are innocent before God and will be saved if they die as children, which is loving and just on God's part.

Love is not a part of God. God is love.

 

[PaulCyp1]

No good parent is capable of hating any of their children. All the more so for the only perfect Father, God. He loves every one of His beloved children, and desires to have them with Him in perfect happiness for all eternity. He hates the evil they freely choose to do, because it draws them away from Him and away from eternal happiness. But He never hates one of them.

 

[Contenders Edge]

I mean I know that He loves humanity in a general sense because He gave us His Son so we could have forgiveness, but I'm asking does God hate "some" people on an individual bases because of their sin and hatred for him ? (Esau ? )

People who have blasphemed The Holy Spirit and have no chance or even a desire for redemption and people who worship the Beast and take the mark of the Beast does God hate them ?

That God is not willing that any should perish but that all might come to repentance (2 Pet. 3:9) should be enough to make plain that God does not hate anyone; far from it. But sadly, men will hate God to their own destruction and eternal damnation.

 

[The Righterzpen]

Do parents interfer with the free will of their 30 years old child?

The theological question regarding "free will" has nothing to do with "age of child". It has to do with the validity of the concept of "free will" as it applies to human ability to respond to God, outside of God first interceding.

 

[Not David]

The theological question regarding "free will" has nothing to do with "age of child". It has to do with the validity of the concept of "free will" as it applies to human ability to respond to God, outside of God first interceding.

God can intercede, it does not mean we lose our free will.

 

[The Righterzpen]

God can intercede, it does not mean we lose our free will.

Define "free will". You don't have a will that's free. It's encumbered by both your fallen nature and your sin. Both of which make you incapable of pleasing God because of your inherent lack of desire to repent and believe.

 

[Not David]

Define "free will". You don't have a will that's free. It's encumbered by both your fallen nature and your sin. Both of which make you incapable of pleasing God because of your inherent lack of desire to repent and believe.

The Gospel is not about pleasing God.
God is not subjected to pleasure.

 

[TheSeabass]

Romans 5:8 & 2 Peter 3:9 are talking about those who become redeemed. The discussion of this thread isn't about whether Jesus loved those He atoned for. (That should be an obvious "Well duh, of course He did.") The question of the thread has to do with who God hates.

God 'hates' no one.

Also, no one is arguing about God's justice and those being under His wrath are justly condemned.

Ultimately this thread is about limited atonement and election. Which "free will" never enters into because the will of fallen man is not free. Adam forfeited that when he disobeyed - and he did so for the rest of humanity too.

The only person born post fall who had a free will was Jesus and that's because he was not the seed of Adam. He was connected to humanity because he was the seed of the woman; which made him fully human. Yet being conceived by the Holy Spirit, the Divine nature made him also fully God. Jesus was not encumbered by a fallen nature, or sin. In this, he even had a certain advantage over Adam, because Adam was limited by the temporal nature of being a created entity; where as a portion of Jesus's personhood was eternal.

Man was made in and still is made in the image of God (James 3:9) meaning man shares certain traits that God possesses as in rational thinking, creative mind and free will.

Free will does NOT mean man has the freedom to do as his will pleases but his will must operate within the boundaries/laws of nature, of man and of God.

Free will is choosing between 2 or more options. Of course, free will choices are not made in a vacuum but there are external influences that can have an effect upon a person choices but in the end a person still makes his own free will choices.​

Rendering each according to their works is not "mercy" because if all received according to their works, all would be under God's wrath. No one would be saved. Jesus took on the penalty of the wrath of God for those He atoned for. This is the only reason they escape judgement. Jesus did not atone for every human being that ever lived. If he had, than no-one would be condemned, regardless if they believed or not!

Belief only happens because one is indwelled by the Holy Ghost and that only happens to those who are atoned for.

You posted "Rendering each according to their works is not "mercy" because if all received according to their works, all would be under God's wrath. No one would be saved."

That is not quite the case ,Romans 2:6-11. Not all in this context are rendered as being lost..."Who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:....But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:"

Man determines his own eternal fate by the TYPE of works he peforms, two different types of works are found in the context of Romans 2, good works, evil works. On judgement day, all God will do is hand out the sentence that fits the type of work a man, of his own free will, chose to do.

Christ tasted death for every man Hebrews 2:9 but every man will not be saved because every man will not use his free will to obey Christ Hebrews 5:9 in order to be saved.

THe BIble does not teach one must first have a literal indwelling of the Holy Spirit before one is able to believe. Such an idea would make God respecter of persons. Romans 10:17 faith comes by hearing God's word not by a literal miraculous personal indwelling of the HS apart from the word or hearing of the word.

 

[JacksBratt]

I think God might hate me.

Ya... well... That's Satan telling you that... That is what Satan does...

Tells you that he is not real.
Tells you that God is not real.
Tells you that hell is not real.
Tells you that heaven is not real.
Tells you that you are no good.
Tells you that you are a failure.
Tells you that you will never be good enough.
Tells you that you can lose your salvation.
Tells you that sins of other generations are OK now.
Tells you that God lies.
Tells you that the bible was only relevant for ancient times.

He even brings up past sins or hurtful things that you have done to others, to get them upset with you... or to make you feel like you are not forgiven.. or that others have not "paid enough" for the wrong that they did you.....to make you have difficulty forgiving them....

All lies.... That is Satan's mandate. He is the accuser. He is a liar.. deceiver..... and general jerk..Stirring up doubt and assumption and twisting facts and even scripture.

 

[TheSeabass]

Love is not a part of God. God is love.

God is also Holy and Just. My point being love is not the only aspect of God.

 

[Grip Docility]

God is also Holy and Just. My point being love is not the only aspect of God.

(1 Corinthians 13 ; 1 John 4:8 ; Colossians 3:14 ; 1 John 4:16)

106 Bible Verses about Love

 

[The Righterzpen]

The Gospel is not about pleasing God.
God is not subjected to pleasure.

The gospel isn't about pleasing God? The gospel isn't about obedience? The gospel isn't about repentance or believing? (Both of which you are commanded to do!) What is it about?

 

[The Righterzpen]

God 'hates' no one.

Man was made in and still is made in the image of God (James 3:9) meaning man shares certain traits that God possesses as in rational thinking, creative mind and free will.

Free will does NOT mean man has the freedom to do as his will pleases but his will must operate within the boundaries/laws of nature, of man and of God.

Free will is choosing between 2 or more options. Of course, free will choices are not made in a vacuum but there are external influences that can have an effect upon a person choices but in the end a person still makes his own free will choices.​

You posted "Rendering each according to their works is not "mercy" because if all received according to their works, all would be under God's wrath. No one would be saved."

That is not quite the case ,Romans 2:6-11. Not all in this context are rendered as being lost..."Who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:....But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:"

Man determines his own eternal fate by the TYPE of works he peforms, two different types of works are found in the context of Romans 2, good works, evil works. On judgement day, all God will do is hand out the sentence that fits the type of work a man, of his own free will, chose to do.

Christ tasted death for every man Hebrews 2:9 but every man will not be saved because every man will not use his free will to obey Christ Hebrews 5:9 in order to be saved.

THe BIble does not teach one must first have a literal indwelling of the Holy Spirit before one is able to believe. Such an idea would make God respecter of persons. Romans 10:17 faith comes by hearing God's word not by a literal miraculous personal indwelling of the HS apart from the word or hearing of the word.

"God hates no one." (Except Esau - and a whole list of other people named in various passages like Proverbs, Psalms etc. LOL)

So you believe you are saved by works then; right?

 

[S.O.J.I.A.]

God doesn't throw sin into hell, but sinners.

Hate in scripture is some cases means to forsake or to neglect

 

[Sistrin]

Which makes it conditional as I've said...

That is not what you said.

So why are you accusing me of ignoring a fact? I think you misread my post.

I read and understood your post exactly. You proposed an if/then construct, one which ignored the fact some people do not want to be saved. The fact some do not want to be saved does not render God's love conditional.