Sept 23 -For Serious Student of Eschatology

Lulav

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Those who are interested only in this Sign from Revelation 12

It was not my intention as taken by some in the other threads in this forum on this subject to say all that what was presented by the maker of the video would happen.

I wanted to concentrate on the Rev 12 sign and what it could mean.

I never said that any particular thing would happen, yet this sign as seen over Israel and for Israel I believe will be the beginning of something.

You can down load free Stellarium There you can view what's happening in the sky this very moment.
Also since the sign was shown as rising over Jerusalem not Australia or anywhere else, it would be best to set your location there.

Also you can watch the Temple mount from a Live Cam

Here is another Earth Cam

The weather there tomorrow is to be clear and Sunny

Sunrise is 6:28 AM
Saturday, September 23, 2017 (GMT+3)
Sunrise in Jerusalem, Israel

In the US that would be 9 hours from now

EST--10:28PM Tonight
PT----7:28 PM Tonight

Here we can watch together as Sept 23 at sunrise and the sign comes to Jerusalem.

NOTE: Any heckling, goading or flaming posts will be removed.
 
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Lulav

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I've found another Live Cam I've watched on TV before it's from the Christian Station from Daystar.

They show a further back view of the Temple mount, but you will be able to see the sky more in this one.

Be sure to use the full screen option at the bottom right.
 
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Saucy

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So, what do people supposed will happen? Is it the start of the tribulation? I know others have tried to say earth will slam into a rogue planet or whatever, but that's nonsense, as we'd already see this rogue planet with our naked eyes.

I know God created signs in the Heavens, and this very may well be something, as we can see things on earth rapidly deteriorating, but no one has really been specific on what they expect to happen.
 
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Lulav

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Also for those who have wondered about the Second wonder in the sky from Revelation 2:3-4 I found this. I know we've talked about the Dragon in the sky before but this is interesting.

upload_2017-9-22_14-16-18.png
 
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Lulav

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So, what do people supposed will happen? Is it the start of the tribulation? I know others have tried to say earth will slam into a rogue planet or whatever, but that's nonsense, as we'd already see this rogue planet with our naked eyes.

I know God created signs in the Heavens, and this very may well be something, as we can see things on earth rapidly deteriorating, but no one has really been specific on what they expect to happen.
Good intelligent and non scoffing question, thank you.

I've been studying this for awhile, I mistakenly posted a video and a transcription of it and it was taken the wrong way.

There are two 'wonders' which are described as seen in heaven in Revelation 12. Now if we believe God and what he told us in Genesis 1 why he created the heavenly bodies was for us and that they were to be:

And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

I notice that the first thing he says they are to be for is 'SIGNS' so to me that takes priority over what they are used for counting time.

So since this is a one time only Sign in the heavens and we also have it described in the book of Revelation I think it deserves our utmost attention.

Also since it seems to be concentrated on Israel it also bears watching.


THE GREAT WONDER
1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:
2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

Genesis 37 tells us that this sign is about Israel.
For Millennia Jews around the world have Read the Torah every week and know this dream Joseph had was speaking of Israel at it's very begining. And the Revelation shows it in the very last book.

Notice that His father, Jacob interpreted this

And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me.
10 And he told it to his father, and to his brethren: and his father rebuked him, and said unto him, What is this dream that thou hast dreamed? Shall I and thy mother and thy brethren indeed come to bow down ourselves to thee to the earth?
11 And his brethren envied him; but his father observed the saying.

The word here, 'observed' means to keep or to preserve.

So we know this sign is about Israel

Now the second part

ANOTHER WONDER
3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.​


I used to study Revelation quite a bit when I was younger and then put is aside for deeper study in Genesis, they are both my favorite books in the bible.

I used to view this sign in the sky as something that had already come to pass, for we as believers that Messiah has come thought it was speaking of that. But now I see it differently.

Also the second part about the dragon was interpreted as speaking of The Satan and the stars being his angels but now I think it's something different.
 
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Handmaid for Jesus

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So, what do people supposed will happen? Is it the start of the tribulation? I know others have tried to say earth will slam into a rogue planet or whatever, but that's nonsense, as we'd already see this rogue planet with our naked eyes.

I know God created signs in the Heavens, and this very may well be something, as we can see things on earth rapidly deteriorating, but no one has really been specific on what they expect to happen.

It means something, what I don't know. But with the storms and earthquakes, wars and pestilences that are happening, I think something is beginning.
 
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Saucy

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It means something, what I don't know. But with the storms and earthquakes, wars and pestilences that are happening, I think something is beginning.
I agree. I think the eclipse triggered something in the U.S., as right afterward, we had the hurricanes. We also have had major wildfires burning all over the west (which haven't received much news coverage thanks to the hurricanes), earthquakes in various places, wars and rumors of wars, threats of nuclear war, pestilences...and it's all going on not just here, but around the world. Now there are signs in the Heavens as well. It's all coming together at one time in history, which is interesting as well.
 
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tampasteve

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Good intelligent and non scoffing question, thank you.

I've been studying this for awhile, I mistakenly posted a video and a transcription of it and it was taken the wrong way.

There are two 'wonders' which are described as seen in heaven in Revelation 12. Now if we believe God and what he told us in Genesis 1 why he created the heavenly bodies was for us and that they were to be:

And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

I notice that the first thing he says they are to be for is 'SIGNS' so to me that takes priority over what they are used for counting time.

So since this is a one time only Sign in the heavens and we also have it described in the book of Revelation I think it deserves our utmost attention.

Also since it seems to be concentrated on Israel it also bears watching.


THE GREAT WONDER
1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:
2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

Genesis 37 tells us that this sign is about Israel.
For Millennia Jews around the world have Read the Torah every week and know this dream Joseph had was speaking of Israel at it's very begining. And the Revelation shows it in the very last book.

Notice that His father, Jacob interpreted this

And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me.
10 And he told it to his father, and to his brethren: and his father rebuked him, and said unto him, What is this dream that thou hast dreamed? Shall I and thy mother and thy brethren indeed come to bow down ourselves to thee to the earth?
11 And his brethren envied him; but his father observed the saying.

The word here, 'observed' means to keep or to preserve.

So we know this sign is about Israel

Now the second part

ANOTHER WONDER
3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.​


I used to study Revelation quite a bit when I was younger and then put is aside for deeper study in Genesis, they are both my favorite books in the bible.

I used to view this sign in the sky as something that had already come to pass, for we as believers that Messiah has come thought it was speaking of that. But now I see it differently.

Also the second part about the dragon was interpreted as speaking of The Satan and the stars being his angels but now I think it's something different.

But short of the stars aligning the particular way (which is still debatable) what are we expecting to see that will verify that this is indeed the start of the prophesy and not just a natural event? What are we expected to see above Jerusalem tomorrow to confirm this?
 
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Also for those who have wondered about the Second wonder in the sky from Revelation 2:3-4 I found this. I know we've talked about the Dragon in the sky before but this is interesting.

View attachment 208216

This illustration finally makes it clear to me why this date is supposed to be so special. However, there is one thing about it that makes me wonder. If the sun is in Virgo and near the other constellations as shown in the picture, none of it would appear in the sky for anyone to see. Also, the moon being that close to the sun would only be a slim crescent in the daytime, and therefore be extremely hard to see unless one knew right where to look with a telescope.
 
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@Lulav
Thank you for this information. It is certainly worth noting, as the other comments have observed with the natural disasters which recently have occurred. Jesus told us not to be concerned about the natural disasters, however, but still worth noting.
 
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Lulav

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This illustration finally makes it clear to me why this date is supposed to be so special. However, there is one thing about it that makes me wonder. If the sun is in Virgo and near the other constellations as shown in the picture, none of it would appear in the sky for anyone to see. Also, the moon being that close to the sun would only be a slim crescent in the daytime, and therefore be extremely hard to see unless one knew right where to look with a telescope.
It is intriguing, right?

That too is what makes this something to watch, that being that the two constellations (Leo and Virgo) are rising with the sun it would be almost impossible to see. That is why there is speculation on how it can be seen. There are various theories on this but one is that something we aren't aware of will actually block out or 'eclipse' the sun at noon and stay that way until 3pm, just like the day of Crucifixion.

We know that lunar and solar eclipses only last minutes, perhaps that's why so much was made of the Great American Total eclipse a month ago to remind people that it doesn't go on for hours.

If something does eclipse the sun during this event and it lasts for hours instead of minutes I think that would put the seal on it so to speak.
 
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Lulav

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Thank you for this information. It is certainly worth noting, as the other comments have observed with the natural disasters which recently have occurred. Jesus told us not to be concerned about the natural disasters, however, but still worth noting.

Yes, he told us these things would come but the end was not yet. However the frequency and magnitude of these 'natural disasters' bears watching.

I also think that all these hurricanes, and the subsequent flooding that is following are to remind us of this:

But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only. 37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.​


And in this day and age of technology I think we can safely say this has happened. Even those in third world countries have been given Iphones and there's satellites everywhere.


And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
 
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It is intriguing, right?

That too is what makes this something to watch, that being that the two constellations (Leo and Virgo) are rising with the sun it would be almost impossible to see. That is why there is speculation on how it can be seen. There are various theories on this but one is that something we aren't aware of will actually block out or 'eclipse' the sun at noon and stay that way until 3pm, just like the day of Crucifixion.

We know that lunar and solar eclipses only last minutes, perhaps that's why so much was made of the Great American Total eclipse a month ago to remind people that it doesn't go on for hours.

If something does eclipse the sun during this event and it lasts for hours instead of minutes I think that would put the seal on it so to speak.

It certainly would! At least we don't have to wait much longer to know what's going to happen. It's tomorrow.

I guess this sign certainly could be valid even if not visible. Astronomers (and astrologers) know where the stars are even when the sun is in the sky, and it would be hard for Virgo to be behind the sun at night and be visible since the time when the sun is up is obviously daytime.

The whole thing put together though--the historic eclipse recently making a diagonal path through the USA, the crazy lineup of hurricanes this year after a decade of quiet, the new nuclear threat, etc., and I wouldn't be all that surprised if this thing tomorrow turned out to be something. It could be a sign, even if nothing actually happens tomorrow. Nothing happened when the eclipse occurred, but just like this sign, it could be simply one sign of many in a line of them.
 
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visionary

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Also for those who have wondered about the Second wonder in the sky from Revelation 2:3-4 I found this. I know we've talked about the Dragon in the sky before but this is interesting.

View attachment 208216
What would happen if seven of those horns are gone, and there is only three left?
 
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visionary

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God, being the greatest time setter, then instructs His people to "know" the time. He instructs us to study, and know the "time" of His visitation.

1 Chronicles 12:32 And of the children of Issachar, which were men that had understanding of the times, to know what Israel ought to do; the heads of them were two hundred; and all their brethren were at their commandment.

Ecclesiastes 9:12 For man also knoweth not his time: as the fishes that are taken in an evil net, and as the birds that are caught in the snare; so are the sons of men snared in an evil time, when it falleth suddenly upon them.

Jeremiah 8:7 Yea, the stork in the heaven knoweth her appointed times; and the turtle and the crane and the swallow observe the time of their coming; but my people know not the judgment of the Lord.

Daniel 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

Romans 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

2 Thessalonians 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
 
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Lulav

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It certainly would! At least we don't have to wait much longer to know what's going to happen. It's tomorrow.

I guess this sign certainly could be valid even if not visible. Astronomers (and astrologers) know where the stars are even when the sun is in the sky, and it would be hard for Virgo to be behind the sun at night and be visible since the time when the sun is up is obviously daytime.

The whole thing put together though--the historic eclipse recently making a diagonal path through the USA, the crazy lineup of hurricanes this year after a decade of quiet, the new nuclear threat, etc., and I wouldn't be all that surprised if this thing tomorrow turned out to be something. It could be a sign, even if nothing actually happens tomorrow. Nothing happened when the eclipse occurred, but just like this sign, it could be simply one sign of many in a line of them.

Yes, God is patient and he like it says that he will make sure the Gospel is know to everyone, make sure everyone is paying attention.

Today most are looking down, into their Iphones and Ipads. I think he's trying to get all to look up!
 
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