Self-preoccupation/self-love and loving the other

[SingularityOne]

*You are in an Orthodox Forum - Orthodox Answers Only Please*

I’ve been thinking that self-preoccupation/self-love and it’s opposite in the dichotomy being fear of man/man-pleasing are extremes and loving the other/“my brother is my life” is the discerning “middle path” that is couples with fear of God.

My question here is: In relation to others, how does one love the other and be attentive to them and focus on “Christ in them” (their hypostatic principle) without being self-preoccupied that one is deviating from God’s commandments in “forgetting oneself” in conversation with them?

I’m trying to figure out how to focus on Christ in the other, while at the same time, not become too focused on my thoughts in self-preoccupation/self-love and saying things that aren’t out of accordance with Christ’s commandments when with the other...?

I’m trying to figure out the difference between self-love/self-preoccupation and Christ-love/Christ-preoccupation so anxiety doesn’t come up in conversation with others I’m trying to maintain a peaceful presence with in love.

tldr: anxiety in relationship that is rooted-in/coming-from self-preoccupation/self-love is preventing me from acquiring the Spirit or Peace and saving thousands around me.

 

[friend of]

I do know that excessive self-love is not a virtue.

 

[Pavel Mosko]

tldr: anxiety in relationship that is rooted-in/coming-from self-preoccupation/self-love is preventing me from acquiring the Spirit or Peace and saving thousands around me.

I would think maybe Dosteovsky might have something on this.

Will Beauty Save the World?

 

[archer75]

This is really not a question to try to handle with strangers online. I don't mean to shoot it down or anything, but really, the best advice I can offer is to get spiritual advice from an "actual" person. Even if you can't do it in person right now. Reach out by email, phone, whatever.

 

[SingularityOne]

I would think maybe Dosteovsky might have something on this.

Will Beauty Save the World?

Thanks! I’ll check this out.

 

[SingularityOne]

This is really not a question to try to handle with strangers online. I don't mean to shoot it down or anything, but really, the best advice I can offer is to get spiritual advice from an "actual" person. Even if you can't do it in person right now. Reach out by email, phone, whatever.

Why do you say that? Not that I fully disagree. But, a both/and approach is usually how I do things. Would you say that a both/and approach isn’t good?

 

[archer75]

Why do you say that? Not that I fully disagree. But, a both/and approach is usually how I do things. Would you say that a both/and approach isn’t good?

Sometimes, but not here. This question is so complex. You're never going to get a personalized answer here. Maybe you don't see what you're asking the same way I do? Basically you're asking for spiritual guidance. You could spend the rest of your life on this question. Working and working and praying and praying and so on.

In my opinion, you don't need my opinion or that of anyone else on here. I say, take six months off CF. Put that time into spiritual reading (appropriately directed), prayer, and following Christ as best you can. One person should be your guide here. I say, go talk to that person right now (or message them, whatever).

And I'm not trying to chase you off here. But this is the best answer I have.

 

[jacks]

I'm not Orthodox, but I will venture a comment I hope is proper. First I think your question is excellent and while as archer75 mentioned asking it here may not get you what you want, it is beneficial for others to think about the issue you raised.

My thoughts:
All love stems from God's love for us. We in turn must Love God, which requires that we are aware of His presence and surrender our "self" which is only possible if we trust God without reservation. This gives birth to our new life in Christ born from the resurrection. This new life manifests itself as selfless love for others because we see the Christ in them and have developed a true love of God. There is no self-love because the old self died on the cross.

I apologize in advance if anything I said is improper in this forum.

Edit: From Pavel's Dostoevsky link I found what I was trying to say, in a much more coherent way.

The beauty that will save the world is the love of God. This love is both human and supernatural in character, but it germinates, flowers, and comes to fruition only in a crucified heart. Only the heart united with Christ on the Cross is able to love another as himself, and as God loves him. Only such a heart can pass through the narrow gate of the Cross and live in the light of Resurrection.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I think this is a very practical question, and it would depend on who you are talking to. for some it might be easier to see Christ in the other, for others it might be harder.

all I can say is if you are nervous, pray before you talk.

 

[SingularityOne]

I think this is a very practical question, and it would depend on who you are talking to. for some it might be easier to see Christ in the other, for others it might be harder.

all I can say is if you are nervous, pray before you talk.

I see. So just pray before each conversation/meeting and just trust the Holy Spirit will provide new with the words to say that will be in line with the Commandments/Dogmatic-Consciousness?

 

[ArmyMatt]

I see. So just pray before each conversation/meeting and just trust the Holy Spirit will provide new with the words to say that will be in line with the Commandments/Dogmatic-Consciousness?

that's what I would do.

 

[SingularityOne]

that's what I would do.

Thank you Fr. Matt.

 

[ArmyMatt]

no probs