Seeking advice. I'm in an odd situation w/2 guys courting me, 1 is a pastor.

[truelove1]

what the pastor is doing sounds to me like a police officer who is using his title, badge and uniform to manipulate and control weak people that are innocent.
I dont know what the pastor truly saw but regardless of what he saw, hey a lot of people appear in people's dreams. If every guy that appeared in my dream was meant for me. WOW....that would be a lot of 'husbands'

You are a child of God, you have a mind, body, soul and a brain. You WILL decide what you want and who you want in your life. Of course by seeking God along the way. HE will reveal the truth to you. You don't allow a man to manipulate and control you. As much as the pastor can see something from God concerning you. You can even see MORE from God concerning yourself.

I have been in a slightly similar situation before as well, but this person was not a pastor, just a regular congregation member that our pastor liked very much. This member showed interest in me and told the pastor rather than tell me. I was newly seeing someone else at the time by the way. The pastor told me he would like me to get to know this member. I didnt even know what the guy looked like. We never spoke, he only probably saw me around the church.

I told the pastor i was 'kind of getting to know' someone else at the moment, and he said "I will really prefer you to get to know this person" he meant the member of his church. WHAAAATTT??? My pastor hasn't even met the guy I was seeing before.

Moral of the story. Ultimately it was my decision.I don't like people influencing my decisions and life. Marriage is a lifelong commitment. Yes God does send people through people, and God's ways are vast and unfathomable, and I do not condemn anyone or any servant of God for trying to help or do what they believe God is asking of them.

But it has to be YOUR decision, not what the pastor says, not what anyone else says. You are the one who will live with your 'husband' for life and it should not be a decision that will be influenced by others. It has to be God's influence ALONE and you being sure that it is God who has signed and sealed it, and your heart is also in it as well. GOD is the only one who never makes mistakes. So seek Him with all your heart. If you have to fast for days, pray and really get into it, keep going. The Lord will answer you and you will have PEACE of mind.

He isn't my pastor. He's a pastor of outreach. I didn't know him and hadn't been around him until he approached me while I was getting ready to sleep on the couch at church.

I'm not judging the church leaders but I'm afraid of what I think they will do if I don't do what they want in this situation.

 

[truelove1]

..............

 

[Ark100]

My goodness how many churches does this sort of controlling behaviour occur in? I have never heard of this in a church before this thread.

My pastor is a nice man of God. Quite humble actually. But he probably thought he was helping me and 'match-making'.
The other guy I was seeing was not a member of the church and actually did not go to church regularly. So the pastor said he would prefer the 'member' of the church for me rather than the other guy.

When he said it, I was actually gobsmacked. I was just thinking "shouldnt this be about what I want?"

He said he would text the guy's number to me so that we could chat, and maybe go for coffee

I didn't call the guy, to be honest I didnt save his number. Then I think the pastor gave him my number and he called me. The first thing he said was "Hi...(my name) Did the pastor speak to you?"

I was like "what pastor?"

Seriously it was funny and a bit sad to think about. He had his own mouth and ability to come speak to me face to face. And also the fact that I already told the pastor that I was SEEING someone should have been enough to at least give me time and respect my space and my decisions.

As I said I don't condemn the pastor, he thought he was helping. Him and his wife have been nice to me, and they always look for my good. But the way he approached that matter was a no no

 

[Ark100]

He isn't my pastor. He's a pastor of outreach. I didn't know him and hadn't been around him until he approached me while I was getting ready to sleep on the couch at church.

I'm not judging the church leaders but I'm afraid of what I think they will do if I don't do what they want in this situation.

I didn't say you were judging them. We are to test all things. I shared the experience I had in the past so that you know you are not alone. There are many people that face similar situations.

What I was getting at and the only thing that matters here is just to seek God anyway. IT doesnt matter what anyone says or saw in their dream. The only thing that matters is You have to be sure about what God says and approves.

Goodluck

 

[seashale76]

He isn't my pastor. He's a pastor of outreach. I didn't know him and hadn't been around him until he approached me while I was getting ready to sleep on the couch at church.

I'm not judging the church leaders but I'm afraid of what I think they will do if I don't do what they want in this situation.

Worst case scenario (because I hope murder isn't what you're worried about): They act nasty to you, disfellowship you, and perhaps demand that you repay the tuition money they gave you. In which case, you've lost nothing, and they would actually be doing you a favor. If you're afraid at church, then you need to leave that church, as it is obviously not a healthy place for you.

 

[truelove1]

someone asked what kind of church i attend. it's a non denominational church with pentecostal doctrine.

 

[truelove1]

Originally Posted by aiki
God has given you a Bible full of wisdom which He expects you to employ in making life decisions. As Seashale has said, "God isn't your magic 8-ball." Any fool can take and follow orders; God wants you to be a woman who is wise and able to effectively apply His principles and truths to daily living - including who to marry.

The idea that God has one specific person ready for you to marry is silly. What happens if Joe marries Sally, but she is the wrong one for him? What if Sally was supposed to marry Bill, but now that she has married Joe, Bill ends up marrying Betty? And what happens to Gary who was supposed to marry Betty but who, because she has married Bill, ends up marrying Jill who was supposed to marry Harry...and on and on. If just one guy marries "In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established." You have more than two or three people all saying the same thing about your situation. A wise person would take this as an indicator of truth.
the wrong gal a myriad of wrong marriages result. Do you really think this is the way God operates? I don't think so.


"In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established." You have more than two or three people all saying the same thing about your situation. A wise person would take this as an indicator of truth.

Selah.

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should i consider their input on my situation biased and unreliable since there's no question about whether or not they want this 2nd guy and i to end up together and have gone to extremes to make it happen? i admit their input has gone far beyond just giving advice, what they're doing is trying to control the situation/me.

 

[joey_downunder]

Churches can be mainstream in beliefs but cultish in behaviour/practice. Several things stand out in your entries: Cults 101: Checklist of Cult Characteristics:

The leadership dictates, sometimes in great detail, how members should think, act, and feel (for example, members must get permission to date, change jobs, marry—or leaders prescribe what types of clothes to wear, where to live, whether or not to have children, how to discipline children, and so forth).

The leadership induces feelings of shame and/or guilt iin order to influence and/or control members. Often, this is done through peer pressure and subtle forms of persuasion.

Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members.

Please remember I am NOT saying your church is a cult. Your willingness to consider their opinions above your own wellbeing/potential husband's happiness concerns me though. Is free thought discouraged or punished in your church?

 

[parsley]

It sounds like you have good instincts, but others are pressuring you. As others said, this is your life.

Pretend the guy wasn't a church member, and think -- a guy who never approached you before decides to hit on you while you're lying down. To me, that's a sign of objectifying you -- him being tempted by any woman lying down. You are not any woman, and should not be.

If he makes decisions like this now, he will probably continue. He really showed no effort to find out what you wanted in life, or in a relationship -- but was only focused on himself. Narcissistic behavior is not going to benefit you in the long run.

I am not saying that he should ignore what he felt was God's direction, but I seriously doubt it was. As you and others said, it is important to value your established relationship -- and it is important for others to encourage you to be faithful to your old beau. The pastors probably don't know enough about either of you to give fitting advice, so don't take their words more powerfully than they need to be.

Does your church screen leaders? Many churches do that now, especially when they work with children. There are many people with criminal histories who have conversion experiences, and even more who have never been confronted for their creepiness.

 

[truelove1]

Churches can be mainstream in beliefs but cultish in behaviour/practice. Several things stand out in your entries: infoserv_cult101/checklis.htm]Cults 101: Checklist of Cult Characteristics:

The leadership dictates, sometimes in great detail, how members should think, act, and feel (for example, members must get permission to date, change jobs, marry—or leaders prescribe what types of clothes to wear, where to live, whether or not to have children, how to discipline children, and so forth).

The leadership induces feelings of shame and/or guilt iin order to influence and/or control members. Often, this is done through peer pressure and subtle forms of persuasion.

Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members.

Please remember I am NOT saying your church is a cult. Your willingness to consider their opinions above your own wellbeing/potential husband's happiness concerns me though. Is free thought discouraged or punished in your church?

I'll have to think about that question. I've taken note of your post. I'm not sure how many of the characteristics from your link on cults my church practices or how many it would need to practice in order to be considered a cult group. Thanks.

 

[Avniel]

I'll have to think about that question. I've taken note of your post. I'm not sure how many of the characteristics from your link on cults my church practices or how many it would need to practice in order to be considered a cult group. Thanks.

I was raised COGIC I understand how the Pentecostal church can be.

 

[aiki]

should i consider their input on my situation biased and unreliable since there's no question about whether or not they want this 2nd guy and i to end up together and have gone to extremes to make it happen?

I think you ought to give serious weight to the chorus of voices on this thread that are warning you away from the pastor (who shouldn't, by the way, be a pastor if he is young, unmarried and has no children - 1Ti. 3:1-7). They have no vested interest in your church or the people there and are able, therefore, to give a more objective response to your situation.

It is also, I think, alarming that your church feels it has the right to insinuate itself into your personal affairs in the manner that it has. Community is one thing; a cult is another. It can be a fine line between them sometimes. You decide where your boundaries are, not the church. If your church will not respect those boundaries, then find a community of believers that will.

i admit their input has gone far beyond just giving advice, what they're doing is trying to control the situation/me.

And this, as you seem to understand, is very wrong. Since it is, what does wisdom indicate you should do?

Selah.

 

[parsley]

Cults...

It is also, I think, alarming that your church feels it has the right to insinuate itself into your personal affairs in the manner that it has. Community is one thing; a cult is another. It can be a fine line between them sometimes. You decide where your boundaries are, not the church. If your church will not respect those boundaries, then find a community of believers that will.

It will be hard to trust other ones once allowing too much. You might think yourself strong, but we're all more vulnerable than we want to be.

I'll have to think about that question. I've taken note of your post. I'm not sure how many of the characteristics from your link on cults my church practices or how many it would need to practice in order to be considered a cult group. Thanks.

There are so many organizations that stay on a semi-safe border, so they are never named cults. But the results can still have powerful negative impact in many, many people's lives. Since you attend there, you probably wouldn't consider it a cult; so look at the list of points, rights that a person should be able to reasonbly expect from an organization. Make sure you stand firmly in what you believe scriptures say about different topics.

1Ti. 3:1-7

Interesting connection -- that would prevent single women from ogling over a new pastor, and give the pastor some accountability and resistance.

You (OP) had said he was outreach coordinator. In churches I've been in, that's the volunteer who writes to missionaries, arranges visitations to new members, plans inspiring mission-related events. They are not usually considered part of the staff, unless it's a large church. So a pastor saying, "sure go ahead and date" might be his way of saying it's none of his business.

If he says it to a co-pastor or paid staff member, and includes you in the directive OR GIVES OUT YOUR PERSONAL INFORMATION, then there's a problem. If you have not offered your address for the church directory, then you have not given permission.

 

[truelove1]

people i know have been talking to me almost every day about my situation at church. i'm stressed about it, so i think i'll just not think about it much and try living my life as normal. hopefully God will make a way in the future. anyone who wants is free to add anymore advice.

 

[born2serveGod]

Let God, don't let other people decide your future. If God wants you to marry 2015..okay just follow it..

 

[ananda]

Hypothetical: What would you do if the second guy wasn't a 'pastor', and he was just a random believer from your church? and if you weren't faced with the additional situation of pressure from others (elders, etc.)?

 

[truelove1]

Hypothetical: What would you do if the second guy wasn't a 'pastor', and he was just a random believer from your church? and if you weren't faced with the additional situation of pressure from others (elders, etc.)?

If my answer to your question would be reject him, what would your point be?

 

[seashale76]

If my answer to your question would be reject him, what would your point be?

That you should employ the same logic regardless of whether or not the man is a pastor. Of course, I'm speculating, but it is rather obvious.

 

[ananda]

That you should employ the same logic regardless of whether or not the man is a pastor. Of course, I'm speculating, but it is rather obvious.

Exactly.

To the OP: Remember, our One and Only Teacher, Master, Pastor/Shepherd, and Rabbi is Messiah Himself, and we are all simply brethren (Mt 23:8, etc.).

 

[mandelduke]

Let me break this down. You have been going with someone for almost two years, and yall are making marriage plains. Now some so-called minister of your church is telling you that he wants you, saw you in his dreams. And the Main Church Pastors and leaders gave permission to the pastor who wants to court you. What are you thinking? Do you really need advice? Well my advice would be get out of that church!