Scriptural Verification of the Pre-trib Rapture of the Church

Douggg

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It is too bad all posts are not numbered, which would make reference to them quite easy.
Q, in the upper right hand corner of each post is a number. Each thread begins with post #1 and progresses by post numbers in the upper right hand corner.
 
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Davy

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The Biblical support for the coming pre-trib rapture of the Church contradict your views in the OP. Here is more Scriptural support for it:

he Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church

Mt.24:31:

And He will send His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His ELECT from the four winds [Israel - on earth], from one end of the heavens to the other [The Church Jesus will rapture before the seven year tribulation begins]. How did those ELECT get into heaven? Read on to find out. [OT saints of Israel never went to heaven until after Jesus shed His blood and died on the cross, which is another subject entirely. See Lk.16:19-31].

Lk.21:36:
"Watch ye, therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of Man."

Jn.14:2-4 and 28:
"In my Father's house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you [See Jn.20:17]. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. You know the way to the place where I am going." [Jn.14:2-4].

"You heard me say, 'I am going away and I am coming back to you.' If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I." [Jn.14:28].

The Scriptures tell us where we all go, who belong to Christ, after the death of our bodies:
"We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord." As recorded in 2 Cor.5:8, confirming Ecc.12:7. Which is, in and of itself, conclusive to the fact that Jesus is not going to let the rest of His Church remain on earth to go through the seven year tribulation, when He returns for those of us who are still alive, waiting for His appearing, in 1 Thes.4:17. Since He raises all those who have died, to be with Him, immediately after their physical death, for more than 2,000 years.

1 Thes.4:13-18:
The Thessalonians were very concerned about those among them who had died, that they would not be gathered together with the rest of them when Jesus returned. Paul assures them in vs 13-14 that they will all be returning with Christ from heaven, where they have been since He raised them up to be with Him, the day they died physically, according to 2 Cor.5:6-8.

"We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him [Died physically]. Vs 14.

"According to the Lord's own word [Scriptural truth as to the fact that Jesus taught there was to be a pre-trib rapture of the Church, as recorded in Jn.14:2-4 and 28], we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left to the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep." Vs 15. An assurance by Paul to the Thessalonians that the dead in Christ had already been raised from the dead before, and were already with Christ when He returns for all those left on earth alive at His coming.

Because they have already been raised, each in his/her own turn, according to 1 Cor.15:23. That is the very reason it is not documented as a resurrection in the Scriptures.

"For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven [With all His saints [Church], according to vs 14], with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first" [Paul again assures them, as seen in verses 13-14, they were already previously raised once before, each in his/her own turn, as they died, for more than 2,000 years]. Vs 16.

"After that, we who are still alive and are left will be CAUGHT UP [raptured] together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the sky. And so we will be with the Lord forever." Vs 17. Where we proceed with Jesus to our Father in heaven as He promised us in Jn.14:2-4 and 28.

"Therefore encourage each other with these words." Vs 18.

2 Thess.2:1-8:
The precise timing of the rapture of the Church:
"Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to Him, we ask you, brothers, not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy, report or letter supposed to have come from us, saying that the Day of the Lord [The 70th and final Week/seven year tribulation of Dan.9:27] has already come." 2 Thes.2:1-2. Which is a direct reference to 1 Thes.4:17 and the theme of Paul's entire pre-trib rapture message in 2 Thes.2:1-8. When we will be CAUGHT UP TOGETHER WITH THEM IN THE CLOUDS TO MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR. [Parenthetics mine].

The "Day of the Lord" Paul refers to in vs 2, alludes to Dan.9:27, when God will intervene into the affairs of man for the last time, culminating in the second coming of Jesus to the earth. In that passage of Scripture, the Day of the Lord is triggered by the "he" who "confirms a covenant [An agreement] for one Week" [The Day of the Lord/ 70th and final Week/seven year tribulation], who is the antichrist. The second, and same "he," who stops Israel from the offerings and sacrificing in the temple of God, and the third, and same "he," who breaks his covenant in the middle of the Week [After 3.5 of the 7 year total], and sets up the abomination of desolation Jesus referred to in Mt.24:15, in His Olivet Discourse, about the sign of His second coming, and of the end of the age.

In 2 Thess.2:3:
"Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that Day [The Day of the Lord, the 70th and final Week, the seven year tribulation] will not come, until the "apostasia" [Greek term in which the original translation was "to depart," or "departure," meaning, the rapture of the Church] occurs and the man of lawlessness [The antichrist, and all three of the "he's" in Dan.9:27] is revealed [Who triggers the Day of the Lord/ the 70th and final Week/ the seven year tribulation], the man doomed to destruction." Which reveals the "apostasia" [Departure] will take place before the antichrist is revealed, who triggers the 70th Week/seven year tribulation. Confirmed in verses 7 and 8 below.

Translation History of apostasia and discessio: By Thomas Ice, PhD.
The first seven English translations of apostasia all rendered the noun as either " departure" or " departing." They are as follows: Wycliffe Bible (1384); Tyndale Bible (1526); Coverdale Bible (1535); Cranmer Bible (1539); Breeches Bible (1576); Beza Bible (1583); Geneva Bible (1608) . This supports the notion that the word truly means " departure." In fact, Jerome' s Latin translation known as the Vulgate from around the time of 325 A.D. renders apostasia with the " word discessio, meaning ' departure.' Why was the King James Version the first to depart from the established translation of "departure" in 1611 A.D.? [It is more than likely due to overzealous RCC scribes who altered the original wording of vs 3. to accommodate their teachings of Amillenialism, which rejects both the pre-trib rapture of the Church as well as Jesus Millennial reign her on earth].

Theodore Beza, the Swiss reformer was the first to transliterate apostasia and create a new word, rather than translate it as others had done. The translators of the King James Version were the first to introduce the new rendering of apostasia as " falling away." Most English translators have followed the KJV and Beza in departing from translating apostasia as " departure." No reason was ever given.

"He [The antichrist] will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God." Vs 4. [The abomination of desolation, confirming Dan.9:27 and Mt.24:15]. See also 2 Thes.2:4.

The rapture of the Church and verse 3 confirmed in verse 7:
"For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so until he [The saints - Church] is taken out of the way."

The "he" who will be taken out of the way, is the one body of Christ, who bear the Holy Spirit within each of us [Eph.1:13-14], the Church of Jesus Christ. The very same as those who will participate in the "apostasia," the "departure," [the rapture] of the Church, in vs 3. Immediately following that:

In verse 8:
"And then the lawless one [The antichrist] will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of His mouth and destroy by the splendor of His coming." Vs 8. [See Rev.19:17-21].

The antichrist is found in all three of the "he's" in Dan. 9:27, confirmed by Jesus in Mt.24:15; Mk.13:14 and by Paul, in 2 Thes.2:3, 4 and 8.

From the above Scriptural facts, there can be only one proper interpretation for the timing of the rapture of the Church, which will be immediately preceding the 70th and final/7 year tribulation, triggered by the antichrist, all three of the "he's" in Dan.9:27. Seen also as the first of the four horsemen of the apocalypse, riding the white horse, in the first of the seven seals, in Rev.6:2. There is no "pre-wrath" or post-trib rapture taught in the Scriptures.


Other verses pertaining to the rapture of the Church: 1 Thes.1:10; 1 Thes.5:9; Rev.3:10 and Rev.4:1-2. Of the saints [Church] returning with Christ from their marriage in heaven, in Rev.19:7, 8 and 14; Jude 14 and Zech.14:4-5!


The difference between the Second Coming of Christ and the pre-trib rapture of the Church:

http://www.pre-trib.org/data/pdf/Ice...eenTheRapt.pdf


Quasar92

Not one single verse that you quoted shows a Pre-tribulational rapture of the Church.

The 2 Thess.2:1-8 Scripture part you posted you even CHOPPED UP and instead ADDED the pre-trib rapture idea to it when the actual Scripture as written is AGAINST a pre-trib rapture idea:

2 Thess 2:1-4
2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,


2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

KJV
 
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Quasar92

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No scripture presents that. As shown, the only time the rapture happens is after the second coming has begun, and after the resurrection is completed.






Those verses do not show anything like that.




The Church is only following because the dead in Christ were resurrected, and the living were raptured to Christ. Those things happen once the second coming begins.



1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Of course this refers to the resurrection.



According to the Scriptures: Jn.14:2-3, 28; 1 Thess.4:16-17 and 2 Thess.2:1-3 and 7-8 fully support the coming pre-trib rapture of the Church, as documented in the following four post link. In which the 4th post listings of men from many aspects of Christian teachings who fully endorse it.


Quasar92
 
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Douggg

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The "Day of the Lord" Paul refers to in vs 2, alludes to Dan.9:27, when God will intervene into the affairs of man for the last time, culminating in the second coming of Jesus to the earth. In that passage of Scripture, the Day of the Lord is triggered by the "he" who "confirms a covenant [An agreement] for one Week"
Q, read the text of 2thessalonians2. There is nothing in there about the confirmation of the covenant.

The Day of the Lord begins when the man of sin goes into the temple sits and claims to be God. That does not happen until the middle part of the 70th week, Q.

The Day of the Lord does not begin with the confirming of the covenant.

The whole issue of the rapture - is that the church is not here during the Day of the Lord.
 
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Quasar92

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Not one single verse that you quoted shows a Pre-tribulational rapture of the Church.

The 2 Thess.2:1-8 Scripture part you posted you even CHOPPED UP and instead ADDED the pre-trib rapture idea to it when the actual Scripture as written is AGAINST a pre-trib rapture idea:

2 Thess 2:1-4
2:1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,


2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

KJV


The following is a four post link that fully refutes the meaningless opinion from the above. Be sure you observe the translation history of 2 Thess.2:3 in the first of the four posts, for starters.

The Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church - a deeper walk...


Quasar92
 
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Quasar92

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Q, read the text of 2thessalonians2. There is nothing in there about the confirmation of the covenant.

The Day of the Lord begins when the man of sin goes into the temple sits and claims to be God. That does not happen until the middle part of the 70th week, Q.

The Day of the Lord does not begin with the confirming of the covenant.

The whole issue of the rapture - is that the church is not here during the Day of the Lord.


According to your opinion. The three "he's" of Dan.9:27, is the beast out of the sea, whom Satan will give his throne, power an great authority to, recorded in Rev.13:1-2, which is the beginning of the Day of the Lord. according to the Scriptures.

Quasar92
 
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Douggg

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Not one single verse that you quoted shows a Pre-tribulational rapture of the Church.
At the core, the only real problem is Q's conclusion - that the rapture MUST happen pre-trib (pre-70th week). The problem is with the "MUST". And being adamant about it.

To say that the rapture CAN'T happen pre-trib (pre-70th week) is just as bad as saying it MUST happen pre-trib (pre-70th week).

The main idea is to be anticipating the rapture - because it may happen at anytime between now - and when it actually takes place.
 
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Douggg

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According to your opinion. The three "he's" of Dan.9:27, is the beast out of the sea, whom Satan will give his throne, power an great authority to, recorded in Rev.13:1-2, which is the beginning of the Day of the Lord. according to the Scriptures.

Quasar92
I am not sure if you are asking me a question, Q ?

The prince who shall come, spoke of in Daniel 9:26 who confirms the covenant in Daniel 9:27 is the arch-villain of the end times.

At the particular time of confirming the covenant, in Daniel 9:27 he will be in the role of the perceived messiah by the Jews, and will have just been anointed the King of Israel.

And the world will think it has entered the messianic age of peace and safety.
____________________________________________________

Coming out of the sea in Revelation 13, identifies the beast - his background, of originating from the nations.

In Revelation 13, after the person has become the beast - then the image of him made, and placed in the temple - as the abomination of desolation. That triggers the great tribulation.

The great tribulation is contained within the Day of the Lord. The Day of the Lord actually begins slightly earlier (than the great tribulation). And continues all the way to the great white throne judgement, including the millennium rule of Jesus on this earth, from Jerusalem.

Here is how it breaks down Q. This is what you need to REFINE in your thinking. Don't throw everything out - just refine.

1. the Antichrist goes into the temple sits - an act. That act is called the transgression of desolation (Daniel 8:13 if you want to look it up). That triggers the Day of the Lord.

The person's "act" and claim draws an angry response from God, Who has the person killed, and shortly thereafter, after a short stint in hell, God in disdain for the person brings him back alive.

2. That's when the person becomes the "beast". And the image made of him in Revelation 13.

When the image is placed in the temple - as the abomination of desolation. That triggers the great tribulation.
 
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Quasar92

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At the core, the only real problem is Q's conclusion - that the rapture MUST happen pre-trib (pre-70th week). The problem is with the "MUST". And being adamant about it.

To say that the rapture CAN'T happen pre-trib (pre-70th week) is just as bad as saying it MUST happen pre-trib (pre-70th week).

The main idea is to be anticipating the rapture - because it may happen at anytime between now - and when it actually takes place.


The articles I post about the coming pre-trib rapture of the Church, are the teachings of Jesus, Matthew, Luke, John and Paul. They are Scriptural teachings I bring forth for all who seek to learn and to know the true teachings of the Bible. My "conclusions" do not enter into the issue in any way, shape of form!

Quasar92
 
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Douggg

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The articles I post about the coming pre-trib rapture of the Church, are the teachings of Jesus, Matthew, Luke, John and Paul. They are Scriptural teachings I bring forth for all who seek to learn and to know the true teachings of the Bible. My "conclusions" do not enter into the issue in any way, shape of form!

Quasar92
"My "conclusions" do not enter into the issue in any way, shape of form!"

:)

But your stubborn-ness does, Q, :angel: to someone who is trying to constructively point a few things out for you to digest.
 
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Quasar92

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"My "conclusions" do not enter into the issue in any way, shape of form!"

:)

But your stubborn-ness does, Q, :angel: to someone who is trying to constructively point a few things out for you to digest.


I beg your pardon! Where did you obtain qualifications to teach eschatology? Your opinions without a shred of Scripturalm support is completely meaningless.

Quasar92
 
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Quasar92

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I am not sure if you are asking me a question, Q ?

The prince who shall come, spoke of in Daniel 9:26 who confirms the covenant in Daniel 9:27 is the arch-villain of the end times.

At the particular time of confirming the covenant, in Daniel 9:27 he will be in the role of the perceived messiah by the Jews, and will have just been anointed the King of Israel.

And the world will think it has entered the messianic age of peace and safety.
____________________________________________________

Coming out of the sea in Revelation 13, identifies the beast - his background, of originating from the nations.

In Revelation 13, after the person has become the beast - then the image of him made, and placed in the temple - as the abomination of desolation. That triggers the great tribulation.

The great tribulation is contained within the Day of the Lord. The Day of the Lord actually begins slightly earlier (than the great tribulation). And continues all the way to the great white throne judgement, including the millennium rule of Jesus on this earth, from Jerusalem.

Here is how it breaks down Q. This is what you need to REFINE in your thinking. Don't throw everything out - just refine.

1. the Antichrist goes into the temple sits - an act. That act is called the transgression of desolation (Daniel 8:13 if you want to look it up). That triggers the Day of the Lord.

The person's "act" and claim draws an angry response from God, Who has the person killed, and shortly thereafter, after a short stint in hell, God in disdain for the person brings him back alive.

2. That's when the person becomes the "beast". And the image made of him in Revelation 13.

When the image is placed in the temple - as the abomination of desolation. That triggers the great tribulation.


What I posted are not questions, but rather the Scriptural facts that fully support the issues involved. In Dan.9:26:

American Standard Version
"And after the threescore and two weeks shall the anointed one be cut off, and shall have nothing: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and even unto the end shall be war; desolations are determined."

Douay-Rheims Bible
"And after sixty-two weeks Christ shall be slain: and the people that shall deny him shall not be his. And a people with their leader that shall come, shall destroy the city and the sanctuary: and the end thereof shall be waste, and after the end of the war the appointed desolation."

The people of the prince who is to come, who destroy the city and the sanctuary - is a clear case of secular history - as well as fulfilled Biblical prophecy. The people referred to was the Roman army and their prince who led them was general Titus. Not the "he" of Dan.9:27, who will confirm a binding agreement/covenant - yet to be fulfilled - who is the Antichrist, that many well known expositors believe. Titus later became the Roman Emperor who built the Roman Colloseum, around 90 A.D.

There is nothing in verse 27 that has a thing to do with verse 26, except for it being an integral part of the overall prophecy.


Quasar92
 
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Davy

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The following is a four post link that fully refutes the meaningless opinion from the above. Be sure you observe the translation history of 2 Thess.2:3 in the first of the four posts, for starters.

The Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church - a deeper walk...


Quasar92

I have no need to read some treatise by man on a false doctrine. God's Word as written is good enough.

2 Thess.2 is not difficult at all, because Paul was exact with the timing he was speaking about, i.e., the coming Antichrist ("man of sin") MUST come FIRST... prior to our Lord Jesus' coming to gather His Church. That means the tribulation must occur FIRST before our gathering by Jesus.

Now you can either listen to Apostle Paul's warning there, or you can listen to men's doctrines. But you might want to think hard about heeding men's traditions, because our Lord Jesus warned us about that.
 
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Davy

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At the core, the only real problem is Q's conclusion - that the rapture MUST happen pre-trib (pre-70th week). The problem is with the "MUST". And being adamant about it.

To say that the rapture CAN'T happen pre-trib (pre-70th week) is just as bad as saying it MUST happen pre-trib (pre-70th week).

The main idea is to be anticipating the rapture - because it may happen at anytime between now - and when it actually takes place.

That kind of logic does not work. The idea is to KEEP to God's Word as written. And God's Holy Writ is not that difficult.

When Jesus said, "Immediately after the tribulation of those days..." when speaking of His coming to gather His saints (His Church), "Immediately after" just doesn't get any easier to understand.

Furthermore, "the day of the Lord" is about a culmination of events that actually END this present world all on the LAST DAY. It is NOT about the latter half of Daniel's symbolic "one week" (i.e., tribulation time).
 
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The Biblical support for the coming pre-trib rapture of the Church contradict your views in the OP. Here is more Scriptural support for it:

he Biblical teaching of the pre-trib rapture of the Church

Mt.24:31:

And He will send His angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather His ELECT from the four winds [Israel - on earth], from one end of the heavens to the other [The Church Jesus will rapture before the seven year tribulation begins]. How did those ELECT get into heaven? Read on to find out. [OT saints of Israel never went to heaven until after Jesus shed His blood and died on the cross, which is another subject entirely. See Lk.16:19-31].

Lk.21:36:
"Watch ye, therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of Man."

Jn.14:2-4 and 28:
"In my Father's house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I am going there to prepare a place for you [See Jn.20:17]. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. You know the way to the place where I am going." [Jn.14:2-4].

"You heard me say, 'I am going away and I am coming back to you.' If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I." [Jn.14:28].

The Scriptures tell us where we all go, who belong to Christ, after the death of our bodies:
"We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord." As recorded in 2 Cor.5:8, confirming Ecc.12:7. Which is, in and of itself, conclusive to the fact that Jesus is not going to let the rest of His Church remain on earth to go through the seven year tribulation, when He returns for those of us who are still alive, waiting for His appearing, in 1 Thes.4:17. Since He raises all those who have died, to be with Him, immediately after their physical death, for more than 2,000 years.

1 Thes.4:13-18:
The Thessalonians were very concerned about those among them who had died, that they would not be gathered together with the rest of them when Jesus returned. Paul assures them in vs 13-14 that they will all be returning with Christ from heaven, where they have been since He raised them up to be with Him, the day they died physically, according to 2 Cor.5:6-8.

"We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him [Died physically]. Vs 14.

"According to the Lord's own word [Scriptural truth as to the fact that Jesus taught there was to be a pre-trib rapture of the Church, as recorded in Jn.14:2-4 and 28], we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left to the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep." Vs 15. An assurance by Paul to the Thessalonians that the dead in Christ had already been raised from the dead before, and were already with Christ when He returns for all those left on earth alive at His coming.

Because they have already been raised, each in his/her own turn, according to 1 Cor.15:23. That is the very reason it is not documented as a resurrection in the Scriptures.

"For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven [With all His saints [Church], according to vs 14], with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first" [Paul again assures them, as seen in verses 13-14, they were already previously raised once before, each in his/her own turn, as they died, for more than 2,000 years]. Vs 16.

"After that, we who are still alive and are left will be CAUGHT UP [raptured] together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the sky. And so we will be with the Lord forever." Vs 17. Where we proceed with Jesus to our Father in heaven as He promised us in Jn.14:2-4 and 28.

"Therefore encourage each other with these words." Vs 18.

2 Thess.2:1-8:
The precise timing of the rapture of the Church:
"Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to Him, we ask you, brothers, not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by some prophecy, report or letter supposed to have come from us, saying that the Day of the Lord [The 70th and final Week/seven year tribulation of Dan.9:27] has already come." 2 Thes.2:1-2. Which is a direct reference to 1 Thes.4:17 and the theme of Paul's entire pre-trib rapture message in 2 Thes.2:1-8. When we will be CAUGHT UP TOGETHER WITH THEM IN THE CLOUDS TO MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR. [Parenthetics mine].

The "Day of the Lord" Paul refers to in vs 2, alludes to Dan.9:27, when God will intervene into the affairs of man for the last time, culminating in the second coming of Jesus to the earth. In that passage of Scripture, the Day of the Lord is triggered by the "he" who "confirms a covenant [An agreement] for one Week" [The Day of the Lord/ 70th and final Week/seven year tribulation], who is the antichrist. The second, and same "he," who stops Israel from the offerings and sacrificing in the temple of God, and the third, and same "he," who breaks his covenant in the middle of the Week [After 3.5 of the 7 year total], and sets up the abomination of desolation Jesus referred to in Mt.24:15, in His Olivet Discourse, about the sign of His second coming, and of the end of the age.

In 2 Thess.2:3:
"Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that Day [The Day of the Lord, the 70th and final Week, the seven year tribulation] will not come, until the "apostasia" [Greek term in which the original translation was "to depart," or "departure," meaning, the rapture of the Church] occurs and the man of lawlessness [The antichrist, and all three of the "he's" in Dan.9:27] is revealed [Who triggers the Day of the Lord/ the 70th and final Week/ the seven year tribulation], the man doomed to destruction." Which reveals the "apostasia" [Departure] will take place before the antichrist is revealed, who triggers the 70th Week/seven year tribulation. Confirmed in verses 7 and 8 below.

Translation History of apostasia and discessio: By Thomas Ice, PhD.
The first seven English translations of apostasia all rendered the noun as either " departure" or " departing." They are as follows: Wycliffe Bible (1384); Tyndale Bible (1526); Coverdale Bible (1535); Cranmer Bible (1539); Breeches Bible (1576); Beza Bible (1583); Geneva Bible (1608) . This supports the notion that the word truly means " departure." In fact, Jerome' s Latin translation known as the Vulgate from around the time of 325 A.D. renders apostasia with the " word discessio, meaning ' departure.' Why was the King James Version the first to depart from the established translation of "departure" in 1611 A.D.? [It is more than likely due to overzealous RCC scribes who altered the original wording of vs 3. to accommodate their teachings of Amillenialism, which rejects both the pre-trib rapture of the Church as well as Jesus Millennial reign her on earth].

Theodore Beza, the Swiss reformer was the first to transliterate apostasia and create a new word, rather than translate it as others had done. The translators of the King James Version were the first to introduce the new rendering of apostasia as " falling away." Most English translators have followed the KJV and Beza in departing from translating apostasia as " departure." No reason was ever given.

"He [The antichrist] will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God." Vs 4. [The abomination of desolation, confirming Dan.9:27 and Mt.24:15]. See also 2 Thes.2:4.

The rapture of the Church and verse 3 confirmed in verse 7:
"For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so until he [The saints - Church] is taken out of the way."

The "he" who will be taken out of the way, is the one body of Christ, who bear the Holy Spirit within each of us [Eph.1:13-14], the Church of Jesus Christ. The very same as those who will participate in the "apostasia," the "departure," [the rapture] of the Church, in vs 3. Immediately following that:

In verse 8:
"And then the lawless one [The antichrist] will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of His mouth and destroy by the splendor of His coming." Vs 8. [See Rev.19:17-21].

The antichrist is found in all three of the "he's" in Dan. 9:27, confirmed by Jesus in Mt.24:15; Mk.13:14 and by Paul, in 2 Thes.2:3, 4 and 8.

From the above Scriptural facts, there can be only one proper interpretation for the timing of the rapture of the Church, which will be immediately preceding the 70th and final/7 year tribulation, triggered by the antichrist, all three of the "he's" in Dan.9:27. Seen also as the first of the four horsemen of the apocalypse, riding the white horse, in the first of the seven seals, in Rev.6:2. There is no "pre-wrath" or post-trib rapture taught in the Scriptures.


Other verses pertaining to the rapture of the Church: 1 Thes.1:10; 1 Thes.5:9; Rev.3:10 and Rev.4:1-2. Of the saints [Church] returning with Christ from their marriage in heaven, in Rev.19:7, 8 and 14; Jude 14 and Zech.14:4-5!


The difference between the Second Coming of Christ and the pre-trib rapture of the Church:

http://www.pre-trib.org/data/pdf/Ice...eenTheRapt.pdf


Quasar92

I believe in the Pre-Trib Rapture but I do not believe Matthew 24:31 speaks about the Pre-Trib Rapture.
I believe it is talking about a 2nd Rapture that takes place shortly before Christ's 2nd Coming.

The Lord Gathers His Elect For the Upcoming Battle:
(The Call to the Marriage Supper of the Lamb):
(The 2nd Rapture or Translation of the Saints):
(And The End of the Surviving Tribulation Saint's 1,335 Day of Testing):

Luke 12:36

And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately.​

Daniel 12:12 ISV and Daniel 12:12 NIV

Blessed is the one who perseveres...and reaches the end of the 1,335 days.​

Revelation 14:16

And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.​

Matthew 24:31

And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.​

Mark 13:27

And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.​

Luke 17:34-37

"I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left."

And they answered and said unto him,

"Where, Lord?"

And he said unto them,

"Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together."​

Matthew 24:28

For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.​

Revelation 19:17-18 and Revelation 19:14

And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying

"To all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great."

And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.​

Jude 1:14

Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,​

Isaiah 31:4 NLT

The LORD of Heaven’s Armies will come down​

Isaiah 26:21b NLT

The earth will no longer hide those who have been killed. They will be brought out for all to see.

 
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The Marriage Supper of the Lamb is not a feast in heaven. It is the battle of Armageddon where Christ destroys those nations that come up against Him; And the Eagles are believers. Granted, we will not literally eat flesh of kings, captains, etc. It is metaphorical.
 
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Douggg

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I beg your pardon! Where did you obtain qualifications to teach eschatology? Your opinions without a shred of Scripturalm support is completely meaningless.

Quasar92
Q, you will have inquiry about my appointment to teach eschatology with Jesus.

Ephesians4:
10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
 
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Douggg

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Titus later became the Roman Emperor who built the Roman Colloseum, around 90 A.D.

There is nothing in verse 27 that has a thing to do with verse 26, except for it being an integral part of the overall prophecy.
Building the Roman Coliseum - that is why Titus (according to your understanding) was ranked in importance to be in the same verse with Jesus? Really Q? .....it's not referring to Titus, Q.

That the person, who confirms the covenant with many in verse 27, will be from the people who destroyed the temple and city in verse 26 - corresponds to that person emerging from the Kingdom of the ten kings, in Daniel 7 and Daniel 2 - i.e. the fourth kingdom, the Roman Empire.

The construct of that kingdom in the end times is the EU - the elephant in the room, Q. In the latter time of the EU, the kingdom of the transgressors in Daniel 8:23, the stern faced king will "stand up".
 
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Douggg

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That kind of logic does not work. The idea is to KEEP to God's Word as written.
Anticipating the rapture is part of God's Word, Davy.

Luke 21:
34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.

36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Matthew 24:
42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.
 
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