Saying "All Iives Matter" can get you killed

[Sparagmos]

A woman said "all lives matter" and was killed for it. Does it really matter if the murder was or wasn't with BLM? The point of the OP was that merely saying "all lives matter" can get you killed.

Women are most likely to be killed by a man whom they know and are or have been in a relationship with. A person who has claimed to love them. So you could also say that just being in a relationship with a man can get you killed. You could also say that just getting into a car can get you killed. We also don’t know why she was killed, since the killer has not been apprehended.

 

[Oompa Loompa]

She could have chosen to remain silent instead of provoking a group that contained someone who was imbalanced enough to kill her, so it's her own action that set things in motion.

But black people get killed just for existing with the wrong skin color - there's no action they can take to keep from being discriminated against and killed.

No. In a free country with a constitutional right to free speech, nobody should live in fear of exercising their free speech. Would you have the same response if a group of white supremacists shot and killed a black woman for saying "Black lives matter"? Absolutely not. You would be right there screaming racial injustice.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I read the news articles in question - they describe "all lives matter" triggering an argument, which then cooled but apparently flared back up. We don't know what happened in the rest of that argument, yet the commentator in the OP was pretty confident in claiming that the woman was shot for saying "all lives matter".

From the article....

During a brief argument, Ramirez claims the suspect’s group shouted Black Lives Matter and either Whitaker or someone in her group replied that All Lives Matter.

A few moments later a member of the same group ambushed them and shot her.

This is far more evidence of racial motives than about 90% of the crimes people claim are racially motivated on here and I don't recall you questioning whether or not it was a hate crime in those.

What's the difference here?

 

[Oompa Loompa]

Women are most likely to be killed by a man whom they know and are or have been in a relationship with. A person who has claimed to love them. So you could also say that just being in a relationship with a man can get you killed. You could also say that just getting into a car can get you killed. We also don’t know why she was killed, since the killer has not been apprehended.

Then we can also say being black and uncooperative to law enforcement can get you killed.

 

[grasping the after wind]

...uhmmm...so?
tulc(honestly isn't sure why people think that matters)

GTAW wonders why anyone wouldn't. Never seen a Marxist that was not trying to advance a Marxist agenda wherever they got themselves involved.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I read the news articles in question - they describe "all lives matter" triggering an argument, which then cooled but apparently flared back up. We don't know what happened in the rest of that argument, yet the commentator in the OP was pretty confident in claiming that the woman was shot for saying "all lives matter".

I'm not sure which article you read....I read the local Fox news article about the incident.

That article didn't make it sound like the argument "flared back up". It sounded like the two groups split...then someone from the "black lives matter" group ambushed the "all lives matter group" with gunfire.

It sounded more like the shooter pretended to let things go so he could fire on the victim from a safer position or with the element of surprise since he knew the victim's group was armed.

If you have more details from a different article I'd like to see it.

 

[Ana the Ist]

We also don’t know why she was killed, since the killer has not been apprehended.

Do you always extend the benefit of the doubt like this when there's a claim of racism?

 

[Ana the Ist]

I have seen none of that on this thread.

I'd call this defending the shooter by way of blaming the victim....

She could have chosen to remain silent instead of provoking a group that contained someone who was imbalanced enough to kill her, so it's her own action that set things in motion.

It's basically the old "if she wasn't wearing those clothes she wouldn't have provoked that rapist" argument.

 

[Rachel20]

You see them in person or in the media? Because obviously, everyday technology makes it easier and easier for us to be aware of violence. That doesn’t mean violence is increasing.

A valid point

 

[Sparagmos]

Then we can also say being black and uncooperative to law enforcement can get you killed.

Yes

 

[renniks]

supporters are normal, opposed to racism, and generally unaware of some of the more radical stuff going on with the movement. A white supremacist supporter is much more likely to just be a white supremacist.

Why make assumptions? Are regular supporters unable to watch the news?

 

[renniks]

So when a friend speaks up in a time of obvious pain and hurt and says "Black lives matter." an answer of "All lives matter." would be truthful but hurtful and cruel in the moment.

False narrative, because blacks are no more in pain or hurt than any other race.

 

[renniks]

But black people get killed just for existing with the wrong skin color -

Really? By whom? Most blacks that are killed are killed by other blacks, so that doesn't make sense.

 

[Oompa Loompa]

Yes

So it would then be the fault of the black person killed by the police because the were uncooporative.

 

[renniks]

She certainly does! But in some circumstances it is better to be discrete.

Be discreet or die? Wow, nice choice!

 

[Oompa Loompa]

She could have chosen to remain silent instead of provoking a group that contained someone who was imbalanced enough to kill her, so it's her own action that set things in motion.

But black people get killed just for existing with the wrong skin color - there's no action they can take to keep from being discriminated against and killed.

Should George Floyed remained silent too or perhaps if he wasn't walking around with those fake bills he wouldn't have gotten himself killed? Do you not see how absurd your comments are?

 

[JackRT]

False narrative, because blacks are no more in pain or hurt than any other race.

I disagree completely! If we look at the historical narratives of black people and white people in the USA over the past 400 years who has carried more pain and hurt? The answer is self evident. Although many of the past injustices have been dealt with there still remain deep seated attitudes and prejudices that persist --- and that is true on both sides. We can extend this to the past and present treatment of Indigenous people, of Hispanic people ...

 

[JackRT]

Be discreet or die? Wow, nice choice!

No, it is not a nice choice but it is a realistic choice.

 

[Silmarien]

Why make assumptions? Are regular supporters unable to watch the news?

To the best of my knowledge, the riots and looting were not actually tied to BLM. I for one do not think they were responsible.

The radicalization I had in mind concerns BLM's ideological commitments. You need to be looking at conservative sources and/or really deep into social theory to pick up on that, though, and it's such theoretical stuff that it might not make much of a difference to someone anyway. (It does to me, but I've been going through a nasty breakup with the left and do not have much patience for identity politics and intersectionality right now.)

 

[iluvatar5150]

I'm not sure which article you read....I read the local Fox news article about the incident.

That article didn't make it sound like the argument "flared back up". It sounded like the two groups split...then someone from the "black lives matter" group ambushed the "all lives matter group" with gunfire.

It sounded more like the shooter pretended to let things go so he could fire on the victim from a safer position or with the element of surprise since he knew the victim's group was armed.

If you have more details from a different article I'd like to see it.

My point is that there are a lot of unknowns regarding what happened, yet the commentator seems to have a clear understanding of all of it.