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Saved by Grace or Law

Discussion in 'No Creed But Christ - Restoration Movement' started by Thedictator, Jun 27, 2010.

  1. Duckybill

    Duckybill Well-Known Member

    +61
    Christian
    Married
    So eating bacon is sin?
     
  2. NaLuvena

    NaLuvena Junior Member

    +183
    Christian
    Married

    You're the one who introduced the bacon...:)
     
  3. Duckybill

    Duckybill Well-Known Member

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    I thought God did? And so, is eating bacon sin?
     
  4. NaLuvena

    NaLuvena Junior Member

    +183
    Christian
    Married
    IMO Used to be, but not anymore.
     
  5. Duckybill

    Duckybill Well-Known Member

    +61
    Christian
    Married
    Ok, thanks for answering the question.
     
  6. NaLuvena

    NaLuvena Junior Member

    +183
    Christian
    Married
    You're welcome. God bless you my friend:)
     
  7. Alive_Again

    Alive_Again Resident Alien

    +201
    Word of Faith
    Which words are you referring to? It's not about us. We don't trust in men anyway.
     
  8. Alive_Again

    Alive_Again Resident Alien

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    Word of Faith
    There are some parables, but not all truths were given in parable form. We are to take the Word literally. If we don't you can argue any of it away. There are some cases where analogies are used, and it should be common sense when that is the case. Some stand on scriptures in a way to take away the liberty we have in the Spirit.

    I'm not concerned with those who hide behind the book. I want to stand with those who do. There isn't time to deal with those who willingly turn aside from the truth. Let the dead bury their dead.
    Flee where? Their will always be tares with the wheat. Let them flee.
     
  9. Alive_Again

    Alive_Again Resident Alien

    +201
    Word of Faith
    You're worrying me now. Who's hiding from the Gentile truth teller who knows all things?

    Who's the heir to Aaron? In what capacity? Who's "him and the temple"?
     
  10. Alive_Again

    Alive_Again Resident Alien

    +201
    Word of Faith
    If you do not speak clearly then no one knows what you're talking about. If you have a message, spell it out in plain terms.
     
  11. Alive_Again

    Alive_Again Resident Alien

    +201
    Word of Faith
    He sang many psalms. Which one is speaking to you right now?
     
  12. Stevemacchia

    Stevemacchia Newbie

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    Wow this is facinating. He explained to me that he has been in contact with the direct descendant of Aaron. Levi was his name. He told me that the Temple Institute in Jerusalem had found the heir and even had him give blood to prove he was a direct decendant. I found that amazing. I was able to verify that through the Rabbi. Also he told me that the spirit came upon him through a vision and that once it did he was greeted by Lucifer. He gave me some amazing details and even shared a video he shot himself. Says he needs to carry a camera because he said there was a spiritual consiracy angainst truth which he said is love. He said not in this world but in Christ's world. He said his whole family was turned over to Satan and in fact he had to run away the first time but kept returning for his nephews who were twin 9 year olds. He said they accepted truth but even his own family stoled that truth spreading lies to confuse them on things love and Christ. He said that all the churches are infiltrated with devils and even showed me the scripture where it says it would be. The man with the crooked hat was the pope and he is crooked because he does not walk as Jesus walked yet claims authority over 2 billion of his sheep. He said he was raising the Body of Christ and they killed his access. Man I don't think you should have condemed him so quickly. Did you report him? He said he read devil testimony on this web site about God hate and God sickesn and God suffers and that was allowed but perfect truth backed up by scripture was not allowed. I am going to try and contact him again. Maybe ask him to do a bible study so I can judge for myself. I know God in me I trust to be able to tell if it is the same with him.

    TTYL
     
  13. Alive_Again

    Alive_Again Resident Alien

    +201
    Word of Faith
    Even though Jesus is the King of Kings, incredibly, He is a "regular" person. Although He is every good and strong quality to the extreme, Jesus is the most approachable person you would ever want to know. He does not have "airs" and is open and honest about what He does. He is not a "mystic". It is His heart's desire for His people to know Him intimately. He does withhold some things for His own purposes, and we're to walk by faith. His Word eliminates confusion, not adds to it.

    Our friend left a trail of veiled references to vague "truths". God's servants are not to add to the mystery. They are to reveal truth as it is given and do not provide confusion nor trump an uncertain sound.

    While it is true that the enemy is everywhere and the church is no different. Since they oppose the move of God, they will not overlook any opportunity to minister confusion. The church at large is not apostate. The real church are those who follow the promptings of the Head. They are found within every church. There will always be tares in the churches.

    This is nothing new. Believe it or not, God is moving within the Catholic Church. No offense to Catholics, but dry form and tradition is not what God ordered for the church. He IS working within though to win the hearts of the people through love and every anointed truth, every chance He gets to minister it.

    The enemy cannot prevail against the Spirit led church. Without any condemnation to the man, I saw no spiritual fruit of the Spirit in any of his postings. Everything that I read preached veiled mysteries and fantastic claims. True servants of God will have an anointing and will lead people into a closer walk with God.

    I don't condemn him at all. My prayer is for him. I didn't report him, but people who preach like this are snapped up pretty quickly. For all of the forum's faults (especially the astrology ads and other demonic ads), they don't let something like this go unopposed for any length.

    As you wish, but don't be swayed by every wind of doctrine. When God speaks someone, it should draw people into a closer walk, not just criticize the church because the devil is attacking it.
     
  14. Stevemacchia

    Stevemacchia Newbie

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    Wow I can't believe what I am reading and hearing. I think you may want to reconsider especially when I read these things. Brother I am taking extra care with this believing the book only hearing for the living word truth.

    [5] And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
    [6] There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.
    [7] The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
    [8] He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
    [9] That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
    [10] He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
    [11] He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

    And then here where John confessed he was not Elias

    [21] And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No.

    And then here where Jesus said Elias would come first and set things in order.

    [10] And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come?
    [11] And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things.
    [12] But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them.

    I listened to how he said things would be ordered and it made perfect sense if he truely speaks for God.

    If so I understand why so many are confused. Brother you should read again and ask him questions. In my oppion he is worthy of questions. I know I don't understand everything in the book but your rejections sound very familiar. Perhaps he rebuked you and you were offended?

    [10] And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
    [11] He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
    [12] For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
    [13] Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
    [14] And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
    [15] For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
    [16] But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
    [17] For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.

    I still find no cause Brother. Just between you I and God the witness.
     
  15. Alive_Again

    Alive_Again Resident Alien

    +201
    Word of Faith
    No. From the beginning I read his claim to being Elijah and asked him if he were a prophet. (No answer). I told him that prophets lead people to repentance. I said that we would judge all of his words (according to the scripture) and he continued to only give veiled remarks.

    He also seemed to imply that someone was judged for not helping him in some thing. He got more way out as we went and I kept asking him point blank to take the veil off and not be a mysteriouso. Although he quoted a scripture, he preached no doctrine and implied that the whole church was found wanting.

    I've known many prophets (we still have them today) and they are all regular people. Prophets are not "weird". They speak a clear message and the fruit of that is a closer walk not adding to the "mystery".

    Jesus spoke in parables. He also explained them to His people. The parables were for those who had not heart for God and had no "ears".

    It's not for us to judge the person. We can judge the words and they point to a deceiving spirit. They make their way to these forums making delusional claims and show themselves to be clouds without water.

    Read again the words I quoted from some of his posts. We're supposed to be transparent with each other. The ministry of the Holy Spirit makes us closer and He gives understanding to the simple. He is not condescending. Any non Christian cult member could have said what he said. If there is anointing in his words, it should be readily discernible.
     
  16. Stevemacchia

    Stevemacchia Newbie

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    Well there in lies the problem. Jesus said there would be one Prophet and many false. And many evil which is why he spoke in parables. I don't think he would speak plainly unless amongst the believing. Maybe truth not in us. This world is sticky and a new reality maybe beyonf our understanding. As I read it anyway. Well best of luck. Let me know if you hear from him again. I was intersted but apparently he was booted. Brother the Bible is confusing why would we delete someone because we were confused? Makes no sense and worse sounds dangerous as if we are relying on someone here to manage truth. Let each deccide for themselves. I don't need to be protected by anyone. I can read and judge for myself. Amen
     
  17. Alive_Again

    Alive_Again Resident Alien

    +201
    Word of Faith
    And his disciples asked him, saying, Why then say the scribes that Elias must first come? And Jesus answered and said unto them, Elias truly shall first come, and restore all things. But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist.
    Matt 17:10-13
    And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
    Eph 4:11-14

    The church hasn't reached the full stature of Christ, so we definitely have prophets. We definitely need watchmen because plenty of people making false claims come to the church to deceive.

    Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge.
    1 Cor 14:29

    And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets. For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
    1 Cor 14:32-33

    Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. Are all apostles? are all prophets?
    1 Cor 12:27-29

    Here are 2 more in the end times:

    And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
    Rev 11:10

    Regarding false prophets

    Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
    1 John 4:1

    But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
    2 Peter 2:1

    For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect. But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.
    Mark 13:22-23

    Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit
    Matt 7:15-17
     
  18. donovan1979

    donovan1979 Newbie

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    Amen to this

    Because we are under GRACE does not mean we can sin. A Christian cannot walk according to the flesh and claim to be under Grace, if we love Jesus we keep His commandments. It is the law that shows us the sin. Without the law there can be no penalty of sin. You cannot get a speeding fine if there is no speed limits for the road you speeding on.

    We are saved by Faith in Jesus. Faith without works is dead. Remember that if you want Jesus to abide in you you have to obey His commandments. Breaking them is sin, sin = death, death that Jesus paid for us in full. this does not mean we can live wicked lives because we saved by grace.

    No
     
  19. benidict

    benidict benidict

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    Engaged
    US-Libertarian
    Yes. Because at that time, Christ had not risen from the dead, and we were still under the Mosaic law...We are no longer under the Mosaic law. We are under the law of Love found in the letter of James. Otherwise, the Judaizers would have been correct, and Paul would have been wrong, in respects to circumsion. And we know what Paul thought about those who required circumsion to follow Christ......Not to mention, the Apostles told us as Gentiles what we were to do. Abstain from meat sacrificed to Idols, refrain from sexual uncleaness, and do not eat meat with the lifeblood in the animal still in it. If we do these things we do well. However, The more important aspects of Christianity are summed up in James. Whoever practices the Law of Love, fullfills the Whole Law. If you are counting on the Mosaic law to save you, you are in serious error. It cannot. Only Christ and his sacrifice on calvary can do that. And daily picking up your Cross and following him. Yes, we are required to do works. Just not the works of the Mosaic Law. They were a forshadowing of things to come, that came to a fulfillment in his Death, Burial, and Ressurection, and Assension. And to cap it all off? The Holy Spirit coming to indwell the Apostles, and the formation of his Church. Peace. :liturgy:
     
  20. underheaven

    underheaven Well-Known Member

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    You are correct when you say that when we are 'saved' we are then in tune with God's laws,'without even thinking about it',it becomes natural
    not harsh,not brittle,but feels right,and is clear in the faces and
    actions of those who know Christ,are 'saved'.
    I am inclined to think that the cells in our bodies may even change,
    and maybe the reason for 'miracle' cures.:bow:
     
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