Sad News To Report

[Mountainmanbob]

Dear Josh: We love our enemy 70 X 7. Total forgiveness credits = 490.

Our forgiveness of our enemy has nothing to do with coming to a knowledge of the truth. It flows from the standard of God who has made it so.

However>>>>

The Creator of the standard runs out of forgiveness credits.

Reach 490 = too bad so sad: You have run out of credits.

Never heard of the credit system?

Our good works are as filthy rags.

M-Bob

 

[FineLinen]

Never heard of the credit system?

Our good works are as filthy rags.

M-Bob

You have now, my friend. There of course are zero credits of forgiveness. The steadfast love of the Lord never ceases, His mercies NEVER end. EVER.

"We’ve sinned and kept at it so long!
Is there any hope for us? Can we be saved?
We’re all sin-infected, sin-contaminated.
Our best efforts are grease-stained rags.
We dry up like autumn leaves—
sin-dried, we’re blown off by the wind.
No one prays to you
or makes the effort to reach out to you
Because you’ve turned away from us,
left us to stew in our sins." -The Message-

 

[rnmomof7]

I am talking about the doctrinal opposites of predestination and free will.

What is your response to post #463?

They are not "doctrinal opposites" Man always chooses according to his will ...the question is why does he will that choice..

 

[rnmomof7]

@rnmomof7 i will not be responding further to any of your posts. i would appreciate it if you did not communicate nor respond to any of my posts further as well.

Thank you kindly.

"But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness." ~II Tim 2:16

I guess I don't know why quoting scripture is offensive

 

[Saint Steven]

They are not "doctrinal opposites" Man always chooses according to his will ...the question is why does he will that choice..

But as a Calvinist, don't you believe that would be salvation by works. Did the "work" of a free will choice lead to salvation? Perhaps you are claiming a predestination of choice?

And yes, I see predestination and free will as doctrinal opposites.
Isn't that the biggest debate between Calvinism and Armininism?
That predestination means God chose us and free will means we chose him.
Opposites.

It actually occurred to me yesterday that predestination probably has more to do with the journey than with the destination.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

But as a Calvinist, don't you believe that would be salvation by works.




Did the "work" of a free will choice lead to salvation? Perhaps you are claiming a predestination of choice?

And yes, I see predestination and free will as doctrinal opposites.
Isn't that the biggest debate between Calvinism and Armininism?
That predestination means God chose us and free will means we chose him.
Opposites.

It actually occurred to me yesterday that predestination probably has more to do with the journey than with the destination.

Yes, at the Reformed Church we attend we do believe that Salvation is by Works.

The Works Of Christ Alone.

Leaving wretched me out of the picture.


M-Bob

 

[Saint Steven]

Yes, at the Reformed Church we attend we do believe that Salvation is by Works.

The Works Of Christ Alone.

Leaving wretched me out of the picture.


M-Bob

That's good. I like the way you said that. - lol

How is salvation applied to the individual then?
1) God chooses who to save and elects them.
2) We choose Jesus/God and are therefore saved.
3) Other: explain.

 

[RaymondG]

I guess I don't know why quoting scripture is offensive

Some are not able to bear it......and it, therefore, should not be forced on them.

 

[FineLinen]

Yes, at the Reformed Church we attend we do believe that Salvation is by Works.

The Works Of Christ Alone.

Leaving wretched me out of the picture.


M-Bob

Dear Bob. The man of God A.W Tozer summed the situation up thus>>>

"The purpose of the cross is to do away with you, blessed riddance."

 

[rnmomof7]

But as a Calvinist, don't you believe that would be salvation by works. Did the "work" of a free will choice lead to salvation? Perhaps you are claiming a predestination of choice?

And yes, I see predestination and free will as doctrinal opposites.
Isn't that the biggest debate between Calvinism and Armininism?
That predestination means God chose us and free will means we chose him.
Opposites.

It actually occurred to me yesterday that predestination probably has more to do with the journey than with the destination.

Who was it that chose your sex? Your parents? The place of your birth?Your IQ? Your educational opportunities ? Who put in place your preferences?

Exactly who's will were you formed by ?

 

[FineLinen]

Dear Mom: Before I was formed in my mother's womb His Sovereign will, the Will of all wills determined >>>>>

You are Mine

 

[FineLinen]

Sad news to report

1. To receive Him it must be granted to you. It does not come by the will of the flesh, nor the will of man.
   
   
2. The Lord must open your heart (like Lydia).
   
   
3. No man can come to Jesus Christ “it is granted of My Father.”
   
   
4. The foundation for being a disciple of Jesus Christ,

You did not choose Me, I chose you.

 

[FineLinen]

It gets worse though brother!

He chooses the common, the blind, the prisoner, the lame, the leprous, beggars, thieves, taxmen, harlots, conmen, fools, chiefs of sinners, the unworthy, the unloving, unrighteous, the faithless, even you and me.

Terrible news for some.

But when he is raised up, he will draw all men to him.

So let's continue to raise aloft the light in the darkness.

Dear Shrewd: Once the Glorious Father touches your wee life, the sky takes on a different hue. It is interesting the word used in the Revelation," He was like". There
are simply no words that come close to adequately express the experience of Him.

God visits the chief of sinners in His sovereign timing. In His same wonderful timing every last broken wreck of sin will know Him who draws, drags off in power the all, not a few, not many, the radical all!

Blessed be the God & Father of our Lord Jesus Christ!

 

[Saint Steven]

"To a collective death in ADAM is here opposed a collective life in Christ; to a fall, a rising again; to a loss, a gain; and that universal and absolute, one dealing with the race. I say, a gain, necessarily; and as involved in the very idea of the Resurrection. For what is the Resurrection? It comes only through Christ, Who not merely gives, but Who IS the Resurrection and the Life. … the Resurrection death is swept away, is, indeed, "swallowed up," and Life in all its fulness of meaning, Life in Christ, Life which is Christ, is communicated."

Christ Triumphant by Thomas Allin chapter six

 

[FineLinen]

"To a collective death in ADAM is here opposed a collective life in Christ; to a fall, a rising again; to a loss, a gain; and that universal and absolute, one dealing with the race. I say, a gain, necessarily; and as involved in the very idea of the Resurrection. For what is the Resurrection? It comes only through Christ, Who not merely gives, but Who IS the Resurrection and the Life. … the Resurrection death is swept away, is, indeed, "swallowed up," and Life in all its fulness of meaning, Life in Christ, Life which is Christ, is communicated."

Christ Triumphant by Thomas Allin chapter six

Dear Steve: I like Thomas Allin very much. Your diligence in posting these wonderful expressions of him are much appreciated.

Jesus Christ IS the resurrection & the life; He swallows up all death in Life.

 

[A_Thinker]

No man can come to Jesus Christ “it is granted of My Father.”

"Come unto Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Take my yoke upon you and learn of Me, for I am meek and lowly in heart ... and you shall find rest unto your souls.

for My yoke is easy ... and My burden is light."

Matthew 11:28-30

 

[Shrewd Manager]

"Come unto Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Take my yoke upon you and learn of Me, for I am meek and lowly in heart ... and you shall find rest unto your souls.

for My yoke is easy ... and My burden is light."

Matthew 11:28-30

Yes, that's a good scripture to consider on the free will/ God's will question imho.

The 'road to Calvary' is along the lines: God gives Israel choice, Israel chooses to reject/ disobey, the burdens and natural consequences of sin pile up, Israel cries out to God for salvation (feeling oppressed, trapped, enslaved, dead inside etc). God then saves, changes hearts and minds, and restores in grace.

And to the new man is revealed that's it's been God's plan all along, he was in 'wrath' 'hardening hearts', letting man blindly dig himself into a hole and be excoriated by the devil, but always present and ready to save. So God draws man back to him thus. It's not manipulation, just the logical course of things under God's Logos.

Clear as mud?

 

[Saint Steven]

"This principle, by which the elect become a means of blessing to all the rest, is strikingly affirmed in the Jewish law. A sheaf of the "firstfruits" was to be presented to the Lord as pledging and consecrating the whole harvest. (Lev. xxiii. 10 and 11.) All the "firstborn" of the herds and flocks were the Lord's (Deut. xv. 19), as a pledge that all were His. So were the "firstborn" of their sons. (Ex. xxii. 29.) If now we turn to the New Testament, we learn the essential bearing of all this on Christ's kingdom. First the Apostle assures us that if the "firstfruits" be holy, the lump is also holy. (Rom. xi. i6.) Next he asserts that not Israel only, but in a higher sense Christ is the "firstfruits." (x Cor. xv. 23.) And the context implies that Christ conveys, actually imparts, life to all as did ADAM death to all. And as Israel was the "firstborn" son (Ex. iv. 22), so in a sense far higher is Christ the "firstborn" of every creature (Col. 1. 15-20), (the head of every man, 1 Cor. xi. 3.) Here, too, the context involves the reconciliation through the "first born," Christ, of every creature to God."

Christ Triumphant by Thomas Allin chapter seven --- bold emphasis mine

 

[Saint Steven]

"The Bible plainly teaches that fallen man is blinded to the truth; the soulish man receives not the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness unto him, neither can he know them because they are spiritually discerned, and the soulish man has not the Spirit. Thus the sinner does not realize and appreciate the value of the salvation that is offered to him. In the first place, he does not know that he is lost, and hence feels no need of salvation. Secondly, this sinner does not know that the salvation offered him in Christ is worth anything. All he has to go by in determining its worth is the lives of those who profess to possess it, and they for the most part, are very deficient illustrations of its merit. Furthermore the sinner is surrounded by circumstances entirely adverse to his acceptance of Christ. And finally, worse than all, 'the mind of the flesh,' a corrupt nature, an 'evil heart of unbelief,' a 'body of death,' that leans toward the bad and opposes the good continually; and mark you, all these things are circumstances over which the individual has no control and for which he is not to blame.

"Again, mark you, that if he overcomes these unfavorable circumstances and in spite of them does accept Christ, it must be by some power OUTSIDE OF HIMSELF, for in himself he would never have any power for his own deliverance. This is the teaching of the seventh chapter of Romans. God must deliver him if he is delivered at all! He must bring him to a knowledge of his lost condition, so that he will feel his need of a Saviour, and He must give him repentance and faith. God must open his eyes so that he shall not only see the need, but also the priceless value of salvation, that like the apostle Paul, he will be willing to count all thing but dross for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus his Lord.

Source: The Savior of the World, by J. Preston Eby
Kindgdom Bible Studies Savior of the World Series Part 1

 

[BNR32FAN]

Never heard of the credit system?

Our good works are as filthy rags.

M-Bob

Our good works are only filthy rags before we are justified by Christ’s atonement because they are still stained with our sin. After we have been cleansed by Christ our good works are pleasing to God.