Sacred formality vs. Casual atmosphere? Effects on worshipfulness?

[nephilimiyr]

I'm right there with ya!

This:

I'll Dance like David Danced.. '' Awesome Live Dance worship song" by SALVADOR! - YouTube

Doesn't do it for me like this:

Traditional Catholic Latin Mass of the Angels - YouTube

But, that's me.

And this is what does it for me. To each his own is what I say, and I think the three of us have just proved that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tx-4X_icZv0

 

[MoreCoffee]

I'd put this in another thread except for it being about the core of Catholic "Sacred formality". Others may have similar testimonies on related roles in their tradition. If you have about twenty minutes then watch and listen. God be with you all as you hear the call.

To Be A Priest - YouTube

 

[nephilimiyr]

I'd put this in another thread except for it being about the core of Catholic "Sacred formality". Others may have similar testimonies on related roles in their tradition. If you have about twenty minutes then watch and listen. God be with you all as you hear the call.

To Be A Priest - YouTube

I viewed about 15 minutes worth of this video and simply saw it as an infomercial on selling the Roman Catholic Priesthood. As for "sacred formality" I know of too many scandals, I just don't see it as being very sacred. And don't get me wrong, I've seen just as many scandals among the Protestant clergy as well. Whenever I see any church or denomination come out with videos such as this I think the samething about that. They're all about selling, and sweeping the dirt under the rug. Not getting rid of it, just hidding it.

 

[MoreCoffee]

For those with greater fortitude and an interest in liturgy this mass on the feast day of saints Peter and Paul is quite moving - knowing a little Latin and Italian will help but it is not necessary.

Liturgy of Eucharist on the Feastday of the Apostle Saints Peter and Paul - YouTube

 

[nephilimiyr]

For those who have an interest in how a non-denominational church holds service on any given Sunday there's this video. Unlike the stories you have heard, even in this thread, about how 80% of the service is about raising money, or how 100% of the service is about calling damnation upon everyone, the fire and brimstone type sermons, this is what you'll find to be true about most of them.

Non-Denominational Church - YouTube

 

[Mama Kidogo]

And this is what does it for me. To each his own is what I say, and I think the three of us have just proved that.

So a worship service is all about what we want and what is most comfortable? Seems I'm doing it all wrong as they don't serve bon bons or paint my toenails where I worship. Perhaps I should go church shopping to find one with a real handsome preacher with really good abs. Sorry. I took that to the absurd.

My point is simple. Worship should be what the Lord enjoys and we should learn to enjoy pleasing him. I am not saying this can't be done informally. I'm saying it isn't about us being entertained or pleased.

 

[nephilimiyr]

So a worship service is all about what we want and what is most comfortable? Seems I'm doing it all wrong as they don't serve bon bons or paint my toenails where I worship. Perhaps I should go church shopping to find one with a real handsome preacher with really good abs. Sorry. I took that to the absurd.

My point is simple. Worship should be what the Lord enjoys and we should learn to enjoy pleasing him. I am not saying this can't be done informally. I'm saying it isn't about us being entertained or pleased.

I have no idea what made you go off on me like this but that post I made, quoteing both Sunlover and Cogent, had nothing to do with you or what you had ever said. They both showed by video what they are into music wise, and then I posted my video. It shows three different music styles. What the heck does that have to do with me disagreeing with you about what you had said about what you think a worship service should be all about? I don't even know what you had said about it or what point you were trying to make. And why should I , I wasn't quoteing you or responding to you in any way shape or form.

If you feel the need to vent, I understand that need, as I'm tired of people talking do-do about what I believe and how I worship, usually from people who complain the loudest about how it's done to them.

Your post was flat out insulting. I never suggested anything like what you are saying.

 

[nephilimiyr]

So a worship service is all about what we want and what is most comfortable? Seems I'm doing it all wrong as they don't serve bon bons or paint my toenails where I worship. Perhaps I should go church shopping to find one with a real handsome preacher with really good abs. Sorry. I took that to the absurd.

My point is simple. Worship should be what the Lord enjoys and we should learn to enjoy pleasing him. I am not saying this can't be done informally. I'm saying it isn't about us being entertained or pleased.

Why did you pick me to throw your little fit? Sunlover posted a music video saying this is what does it for her. Cogent posted a video saying this is what does it for him. I did no different than them. Do I have a sign on my back saying "kick me, I'm the devil"?

 

[Mama Kidogo]

I have no idea what made you go off on me like this but that post I made, quoteing both Sunlover and Cogent, had nothing to do with you or what you had ever said. They both showed by video what they are into music wise, and then I posted my video. It shows three different music styles. What the heck does that have to do with me disagreeing with you about what you had said about what you think a worship service should be all about? I don't even know what you had said about it or what point you were trying to make. And why should I , I wasn't quoteing you or responding to you in any way shape or form.

If you feel the need to vent, I understand that need, as I'm tired of people talking do-do about what I believe and how I worship, usually from people who complain the loudest about how it's done to them.

Your post was flat out insulting. I never suggested anything like what you are saying.

Forgive me. It wasn't you but that saying. I have no idea what you believe so it wasn't meant personally.
That saying reminded me of so many leaving a church over music, comfort or convenience and that just hits me like fingernails on the chalkboard.

Again I ask forgiveness I wasn't going off on you personally (although I did quote you), I was going off on a phrase. And yes you hit upon it. it was , "what does it for me".
If we are simple speaking of music, I have no issue. If we are speaking of worship, it just hits me wrong. And worship is the topic.

 

[sunlover1]

Forgive me. It wasn't you but that saying. I have no idea what you believe so it wasn't meant personally.
That saying reminded me of so many leaving a church over music, comfort or convenience and that just hits me like fingernails on the chalkboard.

Again I ask forgiveness I wasn't going off on you personally (although I did quote you), I was going off on a phrase. And yes you hit upon it. it was , "what does it for me".
If we are simple speaking of music, I have no issue. If we are speaking of worship, it just hits me wrong. And worship is the topic.

The song I posted... and I have actually sang and danced TO/WITH
that song in the past..., is my worship before God and HE is pleased
with my worship and so that's really all I need to know.
I am a friend of God's
HE calls me His friend.
#bewilderedandundeserving.

It may seem foreign to you because it's not what's offered in your tribe,
but that doesn't make it irreverent or bad, just not what you're used to.

My theory is that GOD loves all of our worship (that's given in spirit and
truth) because it was HE who created us with different personalities, etc.
I simply cannot contain myself when I worship. I want to fall to my
knees weeping for joy and repentance, and/or shout HALLELUIA! etc.
So I'm more of a "david" type of worshiper.
IOW, no I don't think it's about US, it's ALL about Him, but it's US who
are worshiping from who we are,... who HE created us to BE.

IMO

 

[Mama Kidogo]

The song I posted... and I have actually sang and danced TO/WITH
that song in the past..., is my worship before God and HE is pleased
with my worship and so that's really all I need to know.
I am a friend of God's
HE calls me His friend.
#bewilderedandundeserving.

It may seem foreign to you because it's not what's offered in your tribe,
but that doesn't make it irreverent or bad, just not what you're used to.

My theory is that GOD loves all of our worship (that's given in spirit and
truth) because it was HE who created us with different personalities, etc.
I simply cannot contain myself when I worship. I want to fall to my
knees weeping for joy and repentance, and/or shout HALLELUIA! etc.
So I'm more of a "david" type of worshiper.
IOW, no I don't think it's about US, it's ALL about Him, but it's US who
are worshiping from who we are,... who HE created us to BE.

IMO

I have no issue with the music. I have no issue with someone enjoying being in worship. i was harping on a phrase used by many when speaking of worship.
For sure, it is of us. But it's not about us. What Christ did was about us. But worship is another matter. It's not just due to my tribe. i felt this way before becoming a part of my community. We had songs, old songs called worship songs. The theme? How wonderful it will be for me. There was a Red hymnal 410 pages long. I found three songs praising God in it. The rest...about us singing how I like this or how this helps me.
Yes it's my hair trigger. I should keep the safety on Sis.
I find many of the newer songs much better. They focus on praising God and saying how wonderful he is. Or the very old hymns that actually praise Him.

I really wasn't intending to go off on the fellow. It was just the third time i'd read "this is what does it for me" and being a thread about "worshipfulness", I thought it needed to be said. I should have said it without being so crude and abrupt. But I assure you that wasn't even close to me going off. I wrote it calmly. Poorly but calmly.
Am I forgiven or should I set in the corner longer?

 

[sunlover1]

I have no issue with the music. I have no issue with someone enjoying being in worship. i was harping on a phrase used by many when speaking of worship.
For sure, it is of us. But it's not about us. What Christ did was about us. But worship is another matter. It's not just due to my tribe. i felt this way before becoming a part of my community. We had songs, old songs called worship songs. The theme? How wonderful it will be for me. There was a Red hymnal 410 pages long. I found three songs praising God in it. The rest...about us singing how I like this or how this helps me.
Yes it's my hair trigger. I should keep the safety on Sis.

It's alright, we all have different understandings and different things
that get under our skin.
I find that the older I get, the less some things set me off.

I even felt as you do at one time as well.
Now, for me, even the songs that "seem to be" about me,
I have realized are really about my relationship to Him.
I use that word loosely and incorrectly but you get the gist.
"It's me, it's me oh Lord, Standing in the need of prayer"
for example.
It's not about "me" it's about Him and my need FOR HIM.

But like I said, we all have our things.
Don't start talking about closed communion if
you don't want to see my "thing" lol.

I find many of the newer songs much better. They focus on praising God and saying how wonderful he is. Or the very old hymns that actually praise Him.

I really wasn't intending to go off on the fellow. It was just the third time i'd read "this is what does it for me" and being a thread about "worshipfulness", I thought it needed to be said. I should have said it without being so crude and abrupt. But I assure you that wasn't even close to me going off. I wrote it calmly. Poorly but calmly.
Am I forgiven or should I set in the corner longer?

I know nephy and I doubt you'll be doing any corner sitting.
He's a gem.

Gnight, be blessed, be safe, be warm

 

[Mama Kidogo]

It's alright, we all have different understandings and different things
that get under our skin.
I find that the older I get, the less some things set me off.

I even felt as you do at one time as well.
Now, for me, even the songs that "seem to be" about me,
I have realized are really about my relationship to Him.
I use that word loosely and incorrectly but you get the gist.
"It's me, it's me oh Lord, Standing in the need of prayer"
for example.
It's not about "me" it's about Him and my need FOR HIM.

But like I said, we all have our things.
Don't start talking about closed communion if
you don't want to see my "thing" lol.


I know nephy and I doubt you'll be doing any corner sitting.
He's a gem.

Gnight, be blessed, be safe, be warm

Thank you Sis.The song you mentioned I'd call a prayer but I know what you mean.
So you have a closed Communion button. I do as well but I imagine from a complete different angle. But let's leave that alone.
It's warm here and all the windows are open.
Time for prayer then bed. Gotta take the girl to school in the morning and it's her last day before Spring Break. I have a feeling she has a long list of plans.
The Lord be with you.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The psalms are not like those hymns are they, Mama Kidogo?

I like singing psalms. We do it a lot.

 

[Mama Kidogo]

The psalms are not like those hymns are they, Mama Kidogo?

I like singing psalms. We do it a lot.

At first, it was novel and interesting. later it hit me like a ton of bricks. I was just singing. Later I began making this a part of my prayers only done in song. The best way I can explain it is; You first have to bring it into your heart and then present it before the Lord. It took a good deal of soul searching making the psalms my prayers. questions like, "Do I really feel that way about God? Am I truly one after his own heart?" When I could answer those questions yes, the Psalms became my prayer. Until that they were just worship or praise songs written by some other guy that I liked and found inspirational.
Being Baptist raised and trained I saw doing such as a plagiarism of sorts. I had a mindset saying personal meant all alone and by my self worshipping God. A just me and Jesus thing.
I'm pretty hardheaded so changing my mind on something doesn't come easy for me. I was helping with the children at a Church Feast when a child (one helping with the smaller ones) was explaining prayer and worship to a child about his age who's family was converting from the Muslim faith to Christ. He explained it this way; You are invited to a party honoring someone wonderful and great and waiting for the special one to arrive. The special one watches the preparation from the hilltop waiting for the guests to arrive. Only after the guest are arrived and ready will he make his entrance.

A passage and promise came to my mind. Matthew 18:19-20. They seemed conditional. The conditions were agreeing and gathering. I'd read them countless times before but had never really considered both verses together. christ was teaching the concept of the Church. The concept of prayer and worship together as one Body looking upward to the Head.
Odd how you can age to over fifty hearing countless sermons and hours of teaching and then a wee one explains what you've failed to grasp the whole time. I had a concept of church and took a different promise as meaning just me and Jesus." teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age.” Trouble was I didn't read the whole passage. It was not made to an individual. It was made to a group of 11. The Church.

 

[~Anastasia~]

We had songs, old songs called worship songs. The theme? How wonderful it will be for me. There was a Red hymnal 410 pages long. I found three songs praising God in it. The rest...about us singing how I like this or how this helps me.
<snip>
I find many of the newer songs much better. They focus on praising God and saying how wonderful he is. Or the very old hymns that actually praise Him.

In reading through the recent talk (still not caught up) on this thread, something hit me.

I think it has to do with both the lyrics of the music AND the style of worship.

You really hit the nail on the head, MamaK - it's about worshipping God. That's the point, right?

I felt the same way when I look through certain hymn books. The last church I was in that had them, I looked through. Yes, almost all were about how we benefited from God, or what He was going to do for us, or how great it made us feel. I thought that odd of hymns, because I was used to thinking of hymns as being songs that actually praised God.

I find the same difference between contemporary (I mean newer in the last few decades, not any particular style) songs. There are many good ones that really focus on God. There are many others that focus on how good He makes us feel. I don't mind listening to a mix of those as I go through my day, because I think we should be sure to remember and appreciate what He does for us. But when I am worshiping, I want to focus on God and giving praise, honor, and glory to Him. Some of the newer songs are wonderful for this as well. Because I know them, I have had some of the purest worship while singing these songs, and they will always be dear to my heart (as well as some of the wonderful hymns that praise God).

As far as the style of worship, I think I learned something else last night. I was able to attend what was probably a shortened form of a Divine Liturgy. It seemed to be - if I get this right - very much focused on God in a different way. All I can think is OT comes to mind. There was of course and altar, and most of the time the (priest and deacons?) were ministering at the altar, while the choir sang mostly psalms. There were some points of interaction from the congregation. (I think I still need to understand more what the congregation is actually supposed to be doing.) But at least I could follow this one. There were many prayers as well. There was something of an "observer" rather than a "participant" feel to it, and I don't actually "like" that, but I understand that it is a different style. I did find it very focused on God and ministering to Him, while there were supplications as well. And of course the congregation received the Eucharist, of which I could not take part, and I realize that is a focus as well.

Contrasted with the services I am familiar with - we usually take far less time worshiping. That's a necessity, I'm afraid. I've been in churches - my favorites - where worship would last about an hour, and then would often resume after the preaching, so worship could in some cases go on for several hours a night. And with the right heart, it IS true worship, but not the formal altar ministry type of course. The focus of most churches though is really the sermon. At an extreme end, some will sing perhaps 3 short songs for about 9 minutes of worship, and then go on to have an hour or so sermon. I enjoy a good sermon, when there is real teaching going on (which I am also finding limited in some churches, strong in others). But I am guessing in the liturgical churches there is no long sermon, which makes me wonder where the teaching happens? Though at least one is hearing the Scriptures, since there is much reading.

I don't want to focus too much on teaching though, unless we've finished the topic of worship.

I just noted that with different styles of worship, teaching has a different focus as well.

I am seeing, really, the liturgical churches and the others are actually very different.

(I was VERY glad it was of a different sound than the one I had attended before - I don't wish to criticize but the other was difficult. This one had a beautiful sound, though there were only voices, and no music. But it was mostly choir and not congregation, the other had no choir and was all congregation, so that might make a difference.)

 

[~Anastasia~]

At first, it was novel and interesting. later it hit me like a ton of bricks. I was just singing. Later I began making this a part of my prayers only done in song. The best way I can explain it is; You first have to bring it into your heart and then present it before the Lord. It took a good deal of soul searching making the psalms my prayers. questions like, "Do I really feel that way about God? Am I truly one after his own heart?" When I could answer those questions yes, the Psalms became my prayer. Until that they were just worship or praise songs written by some other guy that I liked and found inspirational.
Being Baptist raised and trained I saw doing such as a plagiarism of sorts. I had a mindset saying personal meant all alone and by my self worshipping God. A just me and Jesus thing.
I'm pretty hardheaded so changing my mind on something doesn't come easy for me. I was helping with the children at a Church Feast when a child (one helping with the smaller ones) was explaining prayer and worship to a child about his age who's family was converting from the Muslim faith to Christ. He explained it this way; You are invited to a party honoring someone wonderful and great and waiting for the special one to arrive. The special one watches the preparation from the hilltop waiting for the guests to arrive. Only after the guest are arrived and ready will he make his entrance.

A passage and promise came to my mind. Matthew 18:19-20. They seemed conditional. The conditions were agreeing and gathering. I'd read them countless times before but had never really considered both verses together. christ was teaching the concept of the Church. The concept of prayer and worship together as one Body looking upward to the Head.
Odd how you can age to over fifty hearing countless sermons and hours of teaching and then a wee one explains what you've failed to grasp the whole time. I had a concept of church and took a different promise as meaning just me and Jesus." teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age.&#8221; Trouble was I didn't read the whole passage. It was not made to an individual. It was made to a group of 11. The Church.

Hmmmm .... thank you so much. There is a lot to consider here.

First, yes, I love it when a little child says something so profound and teaches you a truth! A little humbling, but such a blessing to see how He enlightens even children. I love it.

And I want to think more on what you said about praying Psalms. Someone suggested it to me when I was going through a very difficult time and being persecuted on a personal level. You know what I found? There are places where the Psalms talk about being delivered, and about the intention of the enemy turning back on him. I prayed that - it almost felt wrong - but I did anyway. And in every instance where I did, I was vindicated in the end, and the one who tried to damage me ended up having it turn back on them. (I also learned what NOT to pray about one's enemy - Lord forgive me - but apparently Psalms are ok )

But there is much more there to praying the Psalms, I am sure. I have prayed some, but I appreciate what you say here. I think I wish to make this a focus, so thank you so much for that.

Be blessed, dear Mama Kidogo!

 

[Mama Kidogo]

In reading through the recent talk (still not caught up) on this thread, something hit me.

I think it has to do with both the lyrics of the music AND the style of worship.

You really hit the nail on the head, MamaK - it's about worshipping God. That's the point, right?

I felt the same way when I look through certain hymn books. The last church I was in that had them, I looked through. Yes, almost all were about how we benefited from God, or what He was going to do for us, or how great it made us feel. I thought that odd of hymns, because I was used to thinking of hymns as being songs that actually praised God.

I find the same difference between contemporary (I mean newer in the last few decades, not any particular style) songs. There are many good ones that really focus on God. There are many others that focus on how good He makes us feel. I don't mind listening to a mix of those as I go through my day, because I think we should be sure to remember and appreciate what He does for us. But when I am worshiping, I want to focus on God and giving praise, honor, and glory to Him. Some of the newer songs are wonderful for this as well. Because I know them, I have had some of the purest worship while singing these songs, and they will always be dear to my heart (as well as some of the wonderful hymns that praise God).

As far as the style of worship, I think I learned something else last night. I was able to attend what was probably a shortened form of a Divine Liturgy. It seemed to be - if I get this right - very much focused on God in a different way. All I can think is OT comes to mind. There was of course and altar, and most of the time the (priest and deacons?) were ministering at the altar, while the choir sang mostly psalms. There were some points of interaction from the congregation. (I think I still need to understand more what the congregation is actually supposed to be doing.) But at least I could follow this one. There were many prayers as well. There was something of an "observer" rather than a "participant" feel to it, and I don't actually "like" that, but I understand that it is a different style. I did find it very focused on God and ministering to Him, while there were supplications as well. And of course the congregation received the Eucharist, of which I could not take part, and I realize that is a focus as well.

Contrasted with the services I am familiar with - we usually take far less time worshiping. That's a necessity, I'm afraid. I've been in churches - my favorites - where worship would last about an hour, and then would often resume after the preaching, so worship could in some cases go on for several hours a night. And with the right heart, it IS true worship, but not the formal altar ministry type of course. The focus of most churches though is really the sermon. At an extreme end, some will sing perhaps 3 short songs for about 9 minutes of worship, and then go on to have an hour or so sermon. I enjoy a good sermon, when there is real teaching going on (which I am also finding limited in some churches, strong in others). But I am guessing in the liturgical churches there is no long sermon, which makes me wonder where the teaching happens? Though at least one is hearing the Scriptures, since there is much reading.

I don't want to focus too much on teaching though, unless we've finished the topic of worship.

I just noted that with different styles of worship, teaching has a different focus as well.

I am seeing, really, the liturgical churches and the others are actually very different.

(I was VERY glad it was of a different sound than the one I had attended before - I don't wish to criticize but the other was difficult. This one had a beautiful sound, though there were only voices, and no music. But it was mostly choir and not congregation, the other had no choir and was all congregation, so that might make a difference.)

I'm not convinced that a less formal style equals less worship. It may equal less worship as one Body but not less worship.
The history of this is interesting. The first protestants did not have an issue with the form of worship. They had issues with things outside of worship. Then it progressed to seeing these things were wrong maybe there was more wrong. things were scrutinized with a spirit of bias and supposed faults were found. And here we are. In a place where a person not speaking our tongue could observe us and conclude we were of two completely different beliefs. It's like we only let our light shine out of opposite sides of the basket.
Fixing things unbroken is something we all do. Not just the casual crowd.
That we are not single minded is not a good thing. I think we misread live and let live as meaning the church rather than how the church treats the world.
I often have an uneasy feeling come upon me that I do not like. It comes when I call someone a brother or sister. Our differences (not personal but cooperate) come to the forefront of my mind, I have to struggle to call some a brother or sister as i don't use those titles in a cavalier manner.But I struggle through it and really mean it when I say it. I'd much rather call someone sister and be found wrong than to not call someone sister and be found wrong.
I think when we say it and don't mean it we are worse than wrong. We are liars. Better or worse aside, I'm just thrilled people have a heart to worship our Lord. that is what makes one my brother and sister. I just wish we on both sides would remove our desires and preferences away from our worship and just worship. the real question is not is my style best or even best for me. It's: Is it really worship or self entertainment. That can apply to either form when we forget who worship is for.
I hear a question asked by believers and unbelievers often. Why do you go to Church? the amount of completely different answers I hear is frightening.
I have come to the conclusion that many go for the by-products and not for the true purpose. I do wish I could tell you I hear bad answer only in the less formal style. But that would be a big lie.

 

[~Anastasia~]

I'm not convinced that a less formal style equals less worship. It may equal less worship as one Body but not less worship.
The history of this is interesting. The first protestants did not have an issue with the form of worship. They had issues with things outside of worship. Then it progressed to seeing these things were wrong maybe there was more wrong. things were scrutinized with a spirit of bias and supposed faults were found. And here we are. In a place where a person not speaking our tongue could observe us and conclude we were of two completely different beliefs. It's like we only let our light shine out of opposite sides of the basket.
Fixing things unbroken is something we all do. Not just the casual crowd.
That we are not single minded is not a good thing. I think we misread live and let live as meaning the church rather than how the church treats the world.
I often have an uneasy feeling come upon me that I do not like. It comes when I call someone a brother or sister. Our differences (not personal but cooperate) come to the forefront of my mind, I have to struggle to call some a brother or sister as i don't use those titles in a cavalier manner.But I struggle through it and really mean it when I say it. I'd much rather call someone sister and be found wrong than to not call someone sister and be found wrong.
I think when we say it and don't mean it we are worse than wrong. We are liars. Better or worse aside, I'm just thrilled people have a heart to worship our Lord. that is what makes one my brother and sister. I just wish we on both sides would remove our desires and preferences away from our worship and just worship. the real question is not is my style best or even best for me. It's: Is it really worship or self entertainment. That can apply to either form when we forget who worship is for.
I hear a question asked by believers and unbelievers often. Why do you go to Church? the amount of completely different answers I hear is frightening.
I have come to the conclusion that many go for the by-products and not for the true purpose. I do wish I could tell you I hear bad answer only in the less formal style. But that would be a big lie.

I don't think less formal = less worship - not by any means. I hope I didn't say anything to imply that. If anything, I am not familiar with the formal worship, and I don't exactly experience the worship there, but I am unwilling to say it is not worship. On the contrary, I see it as a different KIND of worship perhaps, but certainly worship. I do have to wonder if what I equate with "worship" can be incorporated into that. Very likely so, but my unfamiliarity at this point makes that not quite possible.

I'm actually very interested in how the theology evolved (I just started a thread on that and hope to get responses). Surely the worship evolves with the theology. I'm not very knowledgeable about such things though. I found the Lutheran church I visited to be quite similar in some ways to the Orthodox. I would say much more like Orthodox than like Baptist, Pentecostal, or non-denominational, for example.

Why one goes to church - is a question I thought of when writing the post inspired by my visit to an Antiochian church last night.

My best guess there is that the focus is on participating in ministering-to-the-Lord (as in more priestly) worship (forgive me if I said that badly, the congregational responses I see as participating though?), and receiving the Eucharist.

My best guess for less formal church is - well, it varies. In some the worship is (ime) kind of a "me connecting to God" thing, but a bunch of "mes" side by side. I know that sounds strange, but there's a power in that. It's about coming together as a body, but I experience it as each person individually connecting with God (or not, as the case may be). And a sermon, for teaching. That is my USUAL method, and reason for coming to church. I'm not saying it's better or worse. It's rather a Pentecostal-type thing, as far as I can tell. (But not restricted to churches of a Pentecostal type, and not present in all Pentecostal churches - but - well, not Baptist.)

Some "less formal" if you will, really meaning non-traditonal, are more about the body worshipping God together in the singing of a few songs or hymns. To me, those connect me less well. Strange, I think the "body together" is actually more the way it should be, and I am wrong in my thinking, but those particular churches don't seem to draw me into worship (usually). These have been the more Baptist-type churches. And their main reason, I would guess, is to receive a sermon.

It's a very good question: Why do you go to church?

I think between the different churches, yes, the answer will vary. What's given/received in church is probably what people go there to give and receive, so that's usually why they choose that church.

And what we can "relate to" obviously varies a lot between us. TBH, I can well relate to many of my brothers and sisters who speak of the "less traditional" forms, and that's where I've always felt connected to God. But at the same time, most of the songs they specifically post would prove to be a bit of an obstacle for me, on the basis of style. I'm starting to think I'm a very odd duck, LOL. God made me "different" I think. Maybe it's no wonder I have trouble finding a church.

Thanks for your post.

 

[Gxg (G²)]

Thanks for the research Gxg (G²)
As a person who also loves to research.
A wealth of information.

Glad to know that it was of benefit.

It is difficult at times realizing that in CF I'm one of the few Black posters on board with experience in African-American background (and other cultures connected to the Black experience...from Afro-Hispanic to Afro-Asian to Caribbean, etc.). And sometimes, when seeing some of the comments make (or the ways others don't speak on the issue), it's a burden since there's such an evident gap present