Sabbath should not be discussed in SDA specific forums

Gerhard Ebersoehn

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The Sabbath should not be discussed in obscure, specific SDA or Hebraic-Christian, or Judaist / Jewish forum-corners.

The Sabbath of the LORD GOD is Christian and Scriptural, and should be respected and appreciated, and classified and treated as such, while it is independent from and irreconcilable with exclusivity or cultish-ness of any kind.
 
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ViaCrucis

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The Sabbath of the LORD GOD is Christian and Scriptural, and should be respected and appreciated, and classified and treated as such, while it is independent from and irreconcilable with exclusivity or cultish-ness of any kind.

Sabbatarianism is restricted to certain boards because at one point half the threads in General Theology were little more than Sabbatarians vs non-Sabbatarians.

Just because you believe Christians are supposed to observe the Sabbath doesn't change this.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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Sabbatarianism is restricted to certain boards because at one point half the threads in General Theology were little more than Sabbatarians vs non-Sabbatarians.

Just because you believe Christians are supposed to observe the Sabbath doesn't change this.

-CryptoLutheran

You don't know anything about 'my' supposed 'observing' of the Sabbath.

Well there is nothing to know about it, but not because I believe or do not believe the Sabbath, but because of the Reason-for-being ---the Scriptural Reason-for-being--- of "the day The Seventh Day Sabbath OF THE LORD GOD".

It is easy to and you are most welcome to belittle 'my' supposed 'observing' of the Sabbath. But until you aim your belittling against the Scriptures in which "God ... by the Son ... thus, concerning the Seventh Day spake: And God the day The Seventh Day from ALL, HIS, WORKS, RESTED" ... until then, whatever they may be, your arguments and objections are aimed at a mere straw-man ---me--- and therefore are worth less than the straw of both your straw-man and your straw-speaking.
 
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ViaCrucis

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You don't know anything about 'my' supposed 'observing' of the Sabbath.

Well there is nothing to know about it, but not because I believe or do not believe the Sabbath, but because of the Reason-for-being ---the Scriptural Reason-for-being--- of "the day The Seventh Day Sabbath OF THE LORD GOD".

It is easy to and you are most welcome to belittle 'my' supposed 'observing' of the Sabbath. But until you aim your belittling against the Scriptures in which "God ... by the Son ... thus, concerning the Seventh Day spake: And God the day The Seventh Day from ALL, HIS, WORKS, RESTED" ... until then, whatever they may be, your arguments and objections are aimed at a mere straw-man ---me--- and therefore are worth less than the straw of both your straw-man and your straw-speaking.

If you believe Christians are obligated to observe the Sabbath by resting on the seventh day of the week, then you are free to your opinion--but your opinion on that matter doesn't change the fact that Sabbatarianism is restricted to certain areas in order to avoid clogging the system with Sabbath threads.

Suffice to say, the Christian Church, since the days of the Apostles, has confessed that Christians are under no compulsion to observe the Torah which had been given exclusively to the Jews as part of the covenant God made with them at Sinai. Which is why St. Paul says not to let anyone judge us concerning sabbaths, new moons, feasts, foods, and drink. Christians are not under the covenant which God made with the nation of Israel through Moses; we are under the covenant which is in Christ which is in His shed blood on the cross.

If I want to observe the Jewish Sabbath I'll convert to Judaism. But I have no intention on doing so, since I am a Christian.

-CryptoLutheran
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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If you believe Christians are obligated to observe the Sabbath by resting on the seventh day of the week, then you are free to your opinion--but your opinion on that matter doesn't change the fact that Sabbatarianism is restricted to certain areas in order to avoid clogging the system with Sabbath threads.

Suffice to say, the Christian Church, since the days of the Apostles, has confessed that Christians are under no compulsion to observe the Torah which had been given exclusively to the Jews as part of the covenant God made with them at Sinai. Which is why St. Paul says not to let anyone judge us concerning sabbaths, new moons, feasts, foods, and drink. Christians are not under the covenant which God made with the nation of Israel through Moses; we are under the covenant which is in Christ which is in His shed blood on the cross.

If I want to observe the Jewish Sabbath I'll convert to Judaism. But I have no intention on doing so, since I am a Christian.

-CryptoLutheran

<<If you believe…>>; <<you are free to your opinion…>>; <<your opinion on that matter…>>; <<If I want to observe…>>; <<I'll convert…>>; <<But I have no intention…>>; <<I am a Christian>>.


What <I> or <you> believe, intend, want, are or am and what my or your <opinion> or <intention> is or may be, is of NO concern here.


However, you, must please not on behalf of myself, decide for and tell me what I believe or do not believe, or what my opinion and or intention are or ought not be.


Granted though <<the fact that Sabbatarianism is restricted to certain areas in order to avoid clogging the system with Sabbath threads.>> If that fact does not tell its own story!


Internet is supposed to be free and unbiased, and although academic institutions have lost much of their mind control, and big churches of their authoritarianism, to freedom of thought and will through internet, they no longer instil the same fear as in the not so far past. Nevertheless these very church and state powers—powers of majorities, money and esteem—despite, have taken internet under siege again, already. As is seen in <<the fact that Sabbatarianism is restricted to certain areas in order to avoid clogging the system with Sabbath threads.>>

The <<fact that Sabbatarianism is restricted to certain areas in order to avoid clogging the system with Sabbath threads>> tells its own story, that the Sabbath without a doubt everywhere where there is independence in Biblical research, is number one topic of interest! People are no longer fooled one-sidedly at least. They are still fooled, yes, but at least by new religious bigotry—because they have come to notice the old wives’ fables and hypocritical myths of the established church—the Sunday-church!
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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If you believe Christians are obligated to observe the Sabbath by resting on the seventh day of the week, then you are free to your opinion--but your opinion on that matter doesn't change the fact that Sabbatarianism is restricted to certain areas in order to avoid clogging the system with Sabbath threads.

Suffice to say, the Christian Church, since the days of the Apostles, has confessed that Christians are under no compulsion to observe the Torah which had been given exclusively to the Jews as part of the covenant God made with them at Sinai. Which is why St. Paul says not to let anyone judge us concerning sabbaths, new moons, feasts, foods, and drink. Christians are not under the covenant which God made with the nation of Israel through Moses; we are under the covenant which is in Christ which is in His shed blood on the cross.

If I want to observe the Jewish Sabbath I'll convert to Judaism. But I have no intention on doing so, since I am a Christian.

-CryptoLutheran

I believe Christians are free to observe “Sabbaths’ Feast of Christ the Substance, eating and drinking of Him, the Nourishment (of Sabbaths) ministered”, “For if JESUS gave them Rest”—gave them Himself, Himself being “the Rest-of-God”, “God thus concerning the Seventh Day having spoken … by the Son … And God on the day The Seventh Day from ALL, HIS, WORKS, rested.” … “There THEREFORE, for the People of God remains (obligatory) Sabbath-Day-of-Rest.”


I am not free to an opinion of mine own. The Scriptures are binding on and over, my opinion or intention, as well as conscience.


Suffice to say, that Christians are under no compulsion to observe the Torah. Who said they are? Some deluded Sabbatharians maybe; no Christian believing Christ’s Resurrection “on the Sabbath”!


And who disclaimed the Torah had been given exclusively to the Jews as part of the covenant God made with them at Sinai? No Christian in his right senses!



Now Paul does not say not to <<let anyone judge us concerning sabbaths, new moons, feasts, foods, and drink.>> Every word is incorrect against what Paul actually wrote.

Nevertheless, even had Paul written what you are saying, so what?! <<Let not anyone judge us concerning sabbaths, new moons, feasts, foods, and drink>>! He or they judging you have no authority over you, Christians, “with regard to your eating or drinking of Sabbaths’ Feast”! Let them go jump in the lake; they have no say over you!


But sorry to differ with you, CryptoLutheran, but Christians are in truth under the same Covenant which God made with the nation of Israel through Moses. Christians are under the Only Covenant of Grace, <<which is in Christ which is in His shed blood on the cross>> and under which God saved the children of Israel. No one ever saved has ever been saved under or in or by or through another Covenant—another Gospel—another Saviour.


[I don’t know about Lutherans nowadays that they are returned to mamma Rome’s universal warm embrace.]


So you’re quite right, If you want to observe the Jewish Sabbath you'll have to convert to Judaism, because you won’t find it in the whole of the Bible. But I’m happy to hear you have no intention on doing so, since you are a Christian. Thank God.
 
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Major1

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You don't know anything about 'my' supposed 'observing' of the Sabbath.

Well there is nothing to know about it, but not because I believe or do not believe the Sabbath, but because of the Reason-for-being ---the Scriptural Reason-for-being--- of "the day The Seventh Day Sabbath OF THE LORD GOD".

It is easy to and you are most welcome to belittle 'my' supposed 'observing' of the Sabbath. But until you aim your belittling against the Scriptures in which "God ... by the Son ... thus, concerning the Seventh Day spake: And God the day The Seventh Day from ALL, HIS, WORKS, RESTED" ... until then, whatever they may be, your arguments and objections are aimed at a mere straw-man ---me--- and therefore are worth less than the straw of both your straw-man and your straw-speaking.
The bottom line my friend is simply that the New Test. church does not keep the Sabbath but instead chooses Sunday the day of the Resurrection.

In fact, to make the keeping of the Sabbath a rule, you are adding works to salvation which is exactly what Ephesians 2:8-9 tells us NOT TO DO.
 
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Major1

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I believe Christians are free to observe “Sabbaths’ Feast of Christ the Substance, eating and drinking of Him, the Nourishment (of Sabbaths) ministered”, “For if JESUS gave them Rest”—gave them Himself, Himself being “the Rest-of-God”, “God thus concerning the Seventh Day having spoken … by the Son … And God on the day The Seventh Day from ALL, HIS, WORKS, rested.” … “There THEREFORE, for the People of God remains (obligatory) Sabbath-Day-of-Rest.”


I am not free to an opinion of mine own. The Scriptures are binding on and over, my opinion or intention, as well as conscience.


Suffice to say, that Christians are under no compulsion to observe the Torah. Who said they are? Some deluded Sabbatharians maybe; no Christian believing Christ’s Resurrection “on the Sabbath”!


And who disclaimed the Torah had been given exclusively to the Jews as part of the covenant God made with them at Sinai? No Christian in his right senses!



Now Paul does not say not to <<let anyone judge us concerning sabbaths, new moons, feasts, foods, and drink.>> Every word is incorrect against what Paul actually wrote.

Nevertheless, even had Paul written what you are saying, so what?! <<Let not anyone judge us concerning sabbaths, new moons, feasts, foods, and drink>>! He or they judging you have no authority over you, Christians, “with regard to your eating or drinking of Sabbaths’ Feast”! Let them go jump in the lake; they have no say over you!


But sorry to differ with you, CryptoLutheran, but Christians are in truth under the same Covenant which God made with the nation of Israel through Moses. Christians are under the Only Covenant of Grace, <<which is in Christ which is in His shed blood on the cross>> and under which God saved the children of Israel. No one ever saved has ever been saved under or in or by or through another Covenant—another Gospel—another Saviour.


[I don’t know about Lutherans nowadays that they are returned to mamma Rome’s universal warm embrace.]


So you’re quite right, If you want to observe the Jewish Sabbath you'll have to convert to Judaism, because you won’t find it in the whole of the Bible. But I’m happy to hear you have no intention on doing so, since you are a Christian. Thank God.

I would remind you that The Old Covenant that God had established with His people required strict obedience to the Mosaic Law. Isn't that what the bottom line for you is by keeping the Sabbath????

You see, because the wages of sin is death as seen in Rom. 6:23, the Law required that Israel perform daily sacrifices in order to atone for sin. But Moses, through whom God established the Old Covenant, also anticipated the New Covenant. In one of his final addresses to the nation of Israel, Moses looks forward to a time when Israel would be given “a heart to understand” (Deuteronomy 29:4, ESV).

Moses predicts that Israel would fail in keeping the Old Covenant (verses 22–28), but he then sees a time of restoration (30:1–5). At that time, Moses says, “The Lord your God will circumcise your hearts and the hearts of your descendants, so that you may love him with all your heart and with all your soul, and live” (verse 6). The New Covenant involves a total change of heart so that God’s people are naturally pleasing to Him.
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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The bottom line my friend is simply that the New Test. church does not keep the Sabbath but instead chooses Sunday the day of the Resurrection.

In fact, to make the keeping of the Sabbath a rule, you are adding works to salvation which is exactly what Ephesians 2:8-9 tells us NOT TO DO.

"What you accuse another of doing, you are guilty of yourself." The words of Paul.

And a lot more and worse. For example, the arbitrariness of "the New Test. church (that) does not keep the Sabbath but instead chooses Sunday the day of the Resurrection."

And in the arbitrariness (self-will religion / <<adding works to salvation>>), carefully hidden, is the lie / "sin which never is absent when many words are said", <<Sunday the day of the Resurrection>>. The greatest delusion -- it had to be Christian!? God have mercy on us

Of course the hypocrisy shall also be glaring, <<The bottom line my friend is simply...>>

And the twisting of the <friend's> words and ideas, <<to make the keeping of the Sabbath a rule...>>, when his true words were, "eating and drinking of Christ The Substance / Essence / <rule> of Sabbaths' Feast" -- only Paul's precise words, by the way; none of the <friend's>.
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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I would remind you that The Old Covenant that God had established with His people required strict obedience to the Mosaic Law. Isn't that what the bottom line for you is by keeping the Sabbath????

I would help you find the truth, that God never had an <<Old Covenant established with His people>>. And that God never <<required strict obedience (of his People) to the Mosaic Law>>, but to Himself; and above all FAITH in Himself -- faith exactly NOT in <<strict obedience to the Mosaic Law>>.

The <<bottom line>> / <<the rule>> / "the essence / substance" for Israel of old AS MUCH AS for all, true, Israel -- Israel after the spirit, EVER has been ONE: Christ Jesus, Messiah Saviour of God's People. "Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven (ever) given among (any) men whereby we (all) must be saved (than Jesus Christ)."

Again, Please don't tell me what I believe or do or why???? In other words, Do not act God and Judge others.
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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The New Covenant involves a total change of heart so that God’s people are naturally pleasing to Him.

The New Covenant involves a total change of heart so that God’s people are pleasing to Him, "in Christ" -- "your life hid with Christ in God" which is everything against, <<naturally pleasing>> to God ... next to Sunday the greatest delusion called Christian ... God have mercy on us
 
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Major1

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The New Covenant involves a total change of heart so that God’s people are pleasing to Him, "in Christ" -- "your life hid with Christ in God" which is everything against, <<naturally pleasing>> to God ... next to Sunday the greatest delusion called Christian ... God have mercy on us

But isn't it biblically true that EVERYDAY is God's day because He created all the days.
 
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tatteredsoul

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The Sabbath should not be discussed in obscure, specific SDA or Hebraic-Christian, or Judaist / Jewish forum-corners.

The Sabbath of the LORD GOD is Christian and Scriptural, and should be respected and appreciated, and classified and treated as such, while it is independent from and irreconcilable with exclusivity or cultish-ness of any kind.
Good luck with that idealism...

The content of the Sabbath, and the people who support it, are SAFEST in its own sub.
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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Good luck with that idealism...

The content of the Sabbath, and the people who support it, are SAFEST in its own sub.

There are other people who believe the Sabbath; who do not claim to <support> it or 'keep' it, but leave that to "the Son of Man" the Son of God, according to Isaiah 56. "For mine House shall be called an House of Prayer for ALL people."

Further, you hope your idealism is safest for Christianity, which is Sunday-supporters, to put the Sabbath and its Content <<in its own sub>> where no one may find it and turn over the Sunday applecart in public view.

There is no place to hide for the wicked; and Christians aren't saints. There is no lie stuck away that shall not be exposed; and Sunday is no truth. Nor is the Sabbath in the care of the Adventists and COGotters. (Notice there's no Adventists 'and / or' COGotters because they in essence and <content> are all the same.) Their 'Sabbath' is as false as Sunday; it is not the "Sabbaths' Feast OF CHRIST THE SUBSTANCE".
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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But isn't it biblically true that EVERYDAY is God's day because He created all the days.

If it were <<biblically true>> it at least would have been Biblically written. Therefore, yes, it is written God <<created all the days>>; but it isn't written all days are God's Sabbath, but, "God thus concerning The Seventh Day spake (and let write), And God the day The Seventh Day from all his works rested."
 
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tatteredsoul

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There are other people who believe the Sabbath; who do not claim to <support> it or 'keep' it, but leave that to "the Son of Man" the Son of God, according to Isaiah 56. "For mine House shall be called an House of Prayer for ALL people."

Further, you hope your idealism is safest for Christianity, which is Sunday-supporters, to put the Sabbath and its Content <<in its own sub>> where no one may find it and turn over the Sunday applecart in public view.

There is no place to hide for the wicked; and Christians aren't saints. There is no lie stuck away that shall not be exposed; and Sunday is no truth. Nor is the Sabbath in the care of the Adventists and COGotters. (Notice there's no Adventists 'and / or' COGotters because they in essence and <content> are all the same.) Their 'Sabbath' is as false as Sunday; it is not the "Sabbaths' Feast OF CHRIST THE SUBSTANCE".

Talking about the Sabbath in a general forums creates nothing but stumbling blocks. It is as denominational as any other sect of Christianity represented on this forum, and should have its "security" in its own space.

Christians are not united; forcing unification and agreement on doctrine that is well-established to be disagreeable within the sphere of the namesake belief is as counter-productive as opening up post-tribulation eschatology to a general forum.

It is also a beacon for distraction, and derailing from persons who would otherwise care nothing about the topic.

When the Sabbath is determined to be Truth in the Christian community, then maybe it should be open to everyone. But, why create a stumbling block when we *know* most Christians do not believe the Sabbath is the seventh day, or that it is a commandment for all of mankind.

You will just get Christian vs. Christian, which is a hackneyed common occurrence on these forums.
 
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Major1

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If it were <<biblically true>> it at least would have been Biblically written. Therefore, yes, it is written God <<created all the days>>; but it isn't written all days are God's Sabbath, but, "God thus concerning The Seventh Day spake (and let write), And God the day The Seventh Day from all his works rested."

Genesis 1:1
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth".

Psalms 50:12
"The world is mine, and all that is in it".
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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Talking about the Sabbath in a general forums creates nothing but stumbling blocks. It is as denominational as any other sect of Christianity represented on this forum, and should have its "security" in its own space.

Christians are not united; forcing unification and agreement on doctrine that is well-established to be disagreeable within the sphere of the namesake belief is as counter-productive as opening up post-tribulation eschatology to a general forum.

It is also a beacon for distraction, and derailing from persons who would otherwise care nothing about the topic.

When the Sabbath is determined to be Truth in the Christian community, then maybe it should be open to everyone. But, why create a stumbling block when we *know* most Christians do not believe the Sabbath is the seventh day, or that it is a commandment for all of mankind.

You will just get Christian vs. Christian, which is a hackneyed common occurrence on these forums.


Yea, <<Christian vs. Christian>>; that's what the Sabbath and Sabbath Scripture are become; because there is no Sabbath Scripture vs. Sunday Scripture because there is no Sunday Scripture vs. Sabbath Scripture. Now because Sunday -- not the Sabbath -- has no Scripture <support>, of course the issue must become <<Christian vs. Christian>>. And it must be blamed on the Sabbath because its discussion has become <<a hackneyed common occurrence on these forums>>.

Let's face the facts, Sunday is Roman idolatry rampant throughout Christianity. The Church is too afraid and too hypocritical to admit it and the best way for it to defend itself against Scripture Truth, is, to lay all the blame on the Sabbath. Make the Sabbath look like it is not Christian or Christ-like but the wicked old Jew; and make Sunday look like the born-again Christian's spirit-filled obedience.
 
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Gerhard Ebersoehn

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Genesis 1:1

"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth".


Psalms 50:12

"The world is mine, and all that is in it".


Yes;

"In the beginning God ... the Fifth Day said... it was good";

"In the beginning God ... the Sixth Day said ... it was very good”;

"In the beginning ... thus the heavens and the earth were finished";

"In the beginning God ... ended ALL HIS WORKS the Seventh Day";

"In the beginning God ... blessed the Seventh Day";

"In the beginning God ... hallowed the Seventh Day";

"In the beginning God ... the Seventh Day from ALL HIS WORKS, rested":


ALL BY CHRIST, THUS:


"In the evening cool of the (selfsame) day they heard the VOICE of the LORD GOD”;

"In the evening cool of the (selfsame) day … the LORD GOD CALLED”;

"In the evening cool of the (selfsame) day … the LORD GOD made coats of skin and clothed them”;

"… In the (selfsame) day … the LORD GOD drove out the man.”


Don’t pretend your pet verses nullify others and tell everything God “THUS CONCERNING the Seventh Day spoke … in times past through the prophets and in these last days BY THE SON”.
 
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