Rich Warren & Joel Osteen preach the Daniel Diet!

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Hentenza

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I think a better way to put it would be to say, "Is it necessary to obey the voice of God in order to be saved?" One only needs to read Hebrews 4 to know the answer to that.

Christ IS my sabbath rest. He IS Lord of the Sabbath. Again, is following the Jewish laws including the Jewish Sabbath and the dietary laws necessary for salvation?
 
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Hentenza

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I have, which is why I agree with most of what he says.

If you believe what he writes about the dietary laws then you really do need to compare them with scripture. There is absolutely no teaching requiring the Christian to follow the Jewish laws. None. I challenge you to post a single verse that teaches that the Christian is required to follow the dietary laws. Remember that context is important.
 
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Lysimachus

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Amazing Discoveries ministry merely panhandles for the SDA and is in no way or form representative of mainstream Christianity. They are welcome to their opinions, which is what they are, but most of us here do not buy into such a gross misinterpretation of scripture.

There you go again, getting "hung up" on denominations, rather than dealing with the arguments on their own merits.

These Old Testament laws are regarded by NUMEROUS non-Adventist Churches throughout the world. NUMEROUS.

Joel Osteen should have prevented you from making this comment.

I just want to go on record, I am not a member of any Church, nor have I ever been. But I wholly subscribe to Adventist ideology based on my study of God's Word.
 
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James 75

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Christ IS my sabbath rest. He IS Lord of the Sabbath. Again, is following the Jewish laws including the Jewish Sabbath and the dietary laws necessary for salvation?

What are Jewish laws?

Are they laws of God that you don't want obey?

The Bible doesn't teach about a Jewish sabbath, but it does teach about God's sabbath.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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What are Jewish laws?

Are they laws of God that you don't want obey?

The Bible doesn't teach about a Jewish sabbath, but it does teach about God's sabbath.
What's the difference?
 
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Hentenza

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There you go again, getting "hung up" on denominations, rather than dealing with the arguments on their own merits.

These Old Testament laws are regarded by NUMEROUS non-Adventist Churches throughout the world. NUMEROUS.

Joel Osteen should have prevented you from making this comment.

I just want to go on record, I am not a member of any Church, nor have I ever been. But I wholly subscribe to Adventist ideology based on my study of God's Word.

Joel Osteen is a false teacher that couldn't find a bible verse even if the bible only had one. He can not "pevent" no one. In fact, his sermons are non confrontational and full of happiness and prosperity. He never addresses the meat of scripture consequently he grows nominal Christians with his "feely good" discourses.

I do not hold to Adventist theology based on my study of God's word. Very few, if any, of the mainstream churches hold to the unbiblical teaching that the Christian is required to follow the Mosaic law.
 
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Frogster

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There you go again, getting "hung up" on denominations, rather than dealing with the arguments on their own merits.

These Old Testament laws are regarded by NUMEROUS non-Adventist Churches throughout the world. NUMEROUS.

Joel Osteen should have prevented you from making this comment.

I just want to go on record, I am not a member of any Church, nor have I ever been. But I wholly subscribe to Adventist ideology based on my study of God's Word.

Hi bro...how ya been? Speaking of the Word, last time you told me Galatians was just about ceremonies, yet when I said the curse of the law redmption inof 3;10 and 3;13, was not just about ceremonies, and how they were all bound in sin, in 3:22, could not just be ceremonies, you never replied. I was just curious as to your reply, to my facts.:)

Good to see ya..frog.:)

This thread is about ceremonies, but we have to tie in the sin issue also, because Peter was rebuked for declaring them sinners.
 
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Lysimachus

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Joel Osteen is a false teacher that couldn't find a bible verse even if the bible only had one. He can not "pevent" no one. In fact, his sermons are non confrontational and full of happiness and prosperity. He never addresses the meat of scripture consequently he grows nominal Christians with his "feely good" discourses.

I do not hold to Adventist theology based on my study of God's word. Very few, if any, of the mainstream churches hold to the unbiblical teaching that the Christian is required to follow the Mosaic law.

Joel Osteen may be a false teacher, but he has some good things to say just like every false teacher. I even think you and those Churches you fellowship at are false in their beliefs, yet I don't doubt you have many good things to say.

I believe these are one of the instances an evangelical Sunday keeping preacher is finally spot on about. Despite his numerous errors.
 
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Frogster

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What are Jewish laws?

Are they laws of God that you don't want obey?

The Bible doesn't teach about a Jewish sabbath, but it does teach about God's sabbath.

jewish laws, would be laws given to the jews. italian laws are for those in Italy, german laws are for those in germany, japan.....
 
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Lysimachus

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Hi bro...how ya been? Speaking of the Word, last time you told me Galatians was just about ceremonies, yet when I said the curse of the law redmption inof 3;10 and 3;13, was not just about ceremonies, and how they were all bound in sin, in 3:22, could not just be ceremonies, you never replied. I was just curious as to your reply, to my facts.:)

Good to see ya..frog.:)

This thread is about ceremonies, but we have to tie in the sin issue also, because Peter was rebuked for declaring them sinners.

I do remember responding to you on this in some other thread a while back, but unfortunately I cannot prove it as who knows how many threads I'd have to sift through.

I will consider dealing with this issue in another thread at another time, but for now I'd prefer to just stick with the dietary laws alone.

Thanks for reminding me though.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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God's laws are what Jesus taught

Jewish laws are what Jesus taught against.

Thank you for asking.
You mentioned the Jewish Sabbath and that is what I was asking about.
Originally Posted by James 75
What are Jewish laws?

Are they laws of God that you don't want obey?

The Bible doesn't teach about a Jewish sabbath, but it does teach about God's sabbath.
 
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Frogster

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I think a better way to put it would be to say, "Is it necessary to obey the voice of God in order to be saved?" One only needs to read Hebrews 4 to know the answer to that.

Why do you think Paul said he wasted his time on the galatians, for getting under the jewish calendar, that had sabbath in 4;10-11?
 
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Hentenza

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What are Jewish laws?

Those given to Moses which were then given to the Jewish people.

Are they laws of God that you don't want obey?

That "I" don't want to obey? Huh?:doh:

Is it God's law for "me" that I can not eat a ham sandwich or that I have to worship on Saturday instead of Sunday or any other day?

The Bible doesn't teach about a Jewish sabbath, but it does teach about God's sabbath.

No, the bible does not teach about a Saturday sabbath for the Christian. The scriptures teach that we are to worship God everyday not just on one day of the week. In fact, the early church worshiped on Sunday in remembrance of our Lord's resurrection. Are you saying that the early church did not "keep" God's sabbath?
 
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Frogster

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I do remember responding to you on this in some other thread a while back, but unfortunately I cannot prove it as who knows how many threads I'd have to sift through.

I will consider dealing with this issue in another thread at another time, but for now I'd prefer to just stick with the dietary laws alone.

Thanks for reminding me though.

you didn't but that's ok..:)

Ok, so why did paul rebuke peter, for regressing to antiquated silly food laws in antioch?
 
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Hentenza

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Joel Osteen may be a false teacher, but he has some good things to say just like every false teacher. I even think you and those Churches you fellowship at are false in their beliefs, yet I don't doubt you have many good things to say.

I believe these are one of the instances an evangelical Sunday keeping preacher is finally spot on about. Despite his numerous errors.

I disagree. Joel Osteen has gone beyond false and is responsible for many immature Christians. He can't even profess that Jesus is the only way to salvation. Everything he says is suspect to me, even what turns out to be right which is not much.

You can believe as you wish but don't come here expecting us to agree with your legalistic theology. Faith does not include a checklist that tells us how good a "Christian" we are.
 
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Frogster

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No, German laws are laws made by Germans.

God says that the laws He gives are His.

then why did the church council of 15, say no moses to the gentiles?

he just said a few rules, to keep peace with the few churches that were intermixeed, then paul said eat all in the corinth meat mkt, idol, blood, pork, unclean, you name it, he said eat it:D, (other than for unbelievers if they were weak etc) but in no way, were they commanded to be cut in, which would bind them to moses in all its fullness,gal 5;3 unless u can prove me wrong, using acts 15.
 
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Frogster

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I disagree. Joel Osteen has gone beyond false and is responsible for many immature Christians. He can't even profess that Jesus is the only way to salvation. Everything he says is suspect to me, even what turns out to be right which is not much.

You can believe as you wish but don't come here expecting us to agree with your legalistic theology. Faith does not include a checklist that tells us how good a "Christian" we are.

:thumbsup:
 
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Lysimachus

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you didn't but that's ok..:)

Ok, so why did paul rebuke peter, for regressing to antiquated silly food laws in antioch?


Galatians
2:7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as [the gospel] of the circumcision [was] unto Peter;
2:8 (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles:)
2:9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we [should go] unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
2:10 Only [they would] that we should remember the poor; the same which I also was forward to do.
2:11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
2:12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
2:13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
2:14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before [them] all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
2:15 We [who are] Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.​

I don't see anything being discussed here about "silly" food laws. Paul rebuked Peter for separating himself from sitting down to eat with the Jews. Remember, Peter thought the Gentiles were unclean. This is how the Jews thought of the Gentiles. They would not even eat with them.

The issue here is clear:

1. Circumcision as to whether it is applicable or not.

2. Whether gentiles who were not circumcised were to be considered unclean.

Paul rightly rebuked Peter for departing from the Gentiles to eat somewhere else.
 
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