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Rev. Moon discovered the true nature of the fall

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by Rev Moon jr, Jan 29, 2001.

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  1. Rev Moon jr

    Rev Moon jr Guest

    +0
    Rev. Moon discovered the true nature of the human "fall"

    How did the human “fall” develop and multiple?

    What is the process and motivation of the human “fall”?

    The Sin of the Angel and the Sin of the First Man and Woman
    What was the sin of the angel? Jude 6-7 says,

    "And the angels that did not keep their own position but left their proper dwelling have been kept by him in eternal chains in the nether gloom until the judgment of the great day; just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise [like the angels] acted immorally and indulged in unnatural lust, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire."
    [KJV- fornication]

    The sin of the angel (in the Garden) was the sin of fornication. Since fornication cannot be committed alone, there must have been a partner. But who could it have been? The Bible tells us of only three beings that sinned in the Garden of Eden; the serpent and Adam and Eve. Let us consider what the sin of the first man and woman could have been.

    In Genesis 3:7 we read that after being tempted by the serpent and committing sin, the first ancestors became ashamed of their nakedness and covered the lower parts of their bodies. However, before their fall Adam and Eve were naked but unashamed (Gen 2:25). Then when we read that they covered the lower, or sexual, parts of their bodies with fig leaves after they sinned, we must ask ourselves whether man also committed the sin of fornication.
    It is in fallen man's nature to try to conceal his faults and wrongs; so if the fruit of good and evil were a fruit in the literal sense, Adam and Eve should have covered their hands or mouths if they had taken the fruit with their hands or had eaten it with their mouths. Yet we find that they covered their sexual parts, not their hands and mouths. This is an indication that Adam and Eve's transgression involved their sexual parts. Job 31:33 says, "...I have concealed my transgression...like Adam by hiding my iniquity in my bosom" (emphasis added). Job's words indicate that Adam concealed his transgression, and since we know that Adam and Eve concealed their sexual parts, we can conclude that their sin involved their sexual parts.
    In the Garden of Eden, the only sin that man would possible commit at the risk of his life was a sin involving love. Adam and Eve were to grow as brother and sister, and, after perfecting themselves, were to establish the Kingdom of Heaven by becoming the first husband and wife and creating God's family, fulfilling the Purpose of the Creation. However, when Jesus says in John 8:44, "'You are of your father the devil...,'" he clearly shows that fallen people are descendants of the Devil. Adam and Eve forsook God, their true father, and became one with a false father, Satan, which is the reason that Romans 8:23 says, "...we ourselves, who have the first fruits of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait for adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies" (emphasis added). The fact that we are waiting for adoption into God's lineage tells us that we are not of God's lineage. In Matthew 3:7 and Matthew 23:33, respectively, John the Baptist and Jesus called the people a "brood of vipers"--in other words, the offspring of serpents-clearly indicating that fallen man is the offspring of Satan. Thus we can clearly understand that fallen man belongs to Satan's lineage, not God's. This is the result of Eve's committing the sin of fornication with the angel. As a result of this crime, all human beings have been born as the "children" of Satan.
     
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  2. carma

    carma Guest

    +0
    There was one sin in the Fall of man and that was disobedience of God.

    It was eating the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge. It is not a metaphor for "sex", it is not a metaphor for "fornication", it means simply, they ate the fruit of a Tree that was forbidden them.

    And again.....

    This is not the teaching of Jesus Christ, this is a different gospel. If anyone has any questions concerning what has been presented here, please start a thread and ask those questions and we will all look to scripture and find the truth.
     
  3. Rev Moon jr

    Rev Moon jr Guest

    +0
    Thank God that people have their own responsibility to decide what is true. Let each person ask God and look into their own heart for answers. I believe people will know the truth when they hear it, if they are not blocked by
    self-centered, narrow-minded beliefs that exclude God's viewpoint, God's Spirit, new prophesy, new visions, new dreams and all other sources for truth necessary for good judgement.
    " And in the Last Days it shall be, God declairs, that I will pour out my Spirit upon all flesh, and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams...I will pour out my Spirit; and they shall prophesy"
    This is the year 2001, God will not repeat what He said 2,000 years ago.

    The Fruit of Good and Evil and the Root of Sin

    Since a tree reproduces itself by its fruit (which bears the seeds) and man reproduces by a sexual relationship, then the Fruit of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil symbolizes the sexual love of Eve. The fact that Eve ate the fruit which Satan persuaded her to eat means that she committed fornication with Satan. Since eating something means to make it a part of our flesh and blood, Eve's giving Adam the fruit of good and evil and his eating it means that Eve caused Adam to fall through this same act of illicit love.

    Therefore, the root of sin is not the first human ancestors' eating a literal fruit, but their establishing a blood relationship through fornication with the archangel, who was symbolized by the serpent, This blood relationship is the cause for the Original Sin's being passed on from generation to generation. All religions which try to remove sin have branded and treated adultery as one of the greatest sins. Based on this view of Original Sin, we can understand why the Israelites had to be circumcised to be considered God's chosen people. It was required in order to make restitution for the misuse of the sexual parts, by which man had become Satan's descendants. We may be able to put a stop to all other sins through social, educational, or economic improvements, but even though civilization develops and social and economic conditions improve to the point where we can enjoy a more stable life, the increase of sexual promiscuity and of man's inclination toward moral degradation cannot be stopped by anyone.

    The reason that Satan is able to break down the proper order of man's love as the Last Days approach is because the first ancestors became husband and wife without the permission or blessing of God and united with Satan an their false father. Their children where thus born as children of sin, and not of God, and they established a world of faithlessness, evil, and war. Consequently, Satan has dominated man as he has seen fit (Jn 8:44).

    Despite the fact that God created man and the cosmos, He has never been able to have the central role in any of the world's affairs--to rule according to his Will alone. Man cast Satan in the starring role, and Satan has been falsely playing the part of the lord. It is for this reason that Satan is referred to as "the ruler of this world" (Jn 12:31) and "the god of this world" (2 Cor 4:4).
     
  4. carma

    carma Guest

    +0
    You aren't the first one that has taught the HERESY and you won't be the last.

    Why don't you answer the questions about who Jesus Christ is, who Moon is, what Moon thinks he is supposed to do?

    Are you afraid to give those answers because you know what people will say?



    Yes, thank God most people here know Blasphemous Heresy when they see it, they know the scriptures speak truth when they say, "I am the way, the life and truth and NO ONE comes to the Father but through ME.

    Notice something? Rev Moons name is not there, there is only one way to the Father and it is through Jesus Christ, He paid it all and Rev Moon has nothing to do with that whatsoever.
     
  5. Rev Moon jr

    Rev Moon jr Guest

    +0
    The thread is: Rev. Moon discovered the true nature of the fall.

    If you would like to talk about Rev. Moon, start a new thread. Try www.unification.net or www.tparents.org
    to get more information. There is no perfection in ignorance.
     
  6. onesheep

    onesheep Sheep that looks like Bob

    987
    +14
    Catholic
    You can't discuss this without discussing Reverend Moon himself since you are stating that he found the truth. The statement itself is an untruth and Reverend Moon is a false prophet. That is something is something you cannot get around. So if you want to discuss that, you're going to have to get into the unreliability and falseness of the person you believe to have found the truth.
     
  7. carma

    carma Guest

    +0
    Since you brought up starting a thread, I did and since it was your idea, I assume you will participate.

    The thread is located here, in the Round Tables Forum:

    pub16.ezboard.com/fleftbe...=378.topic
     
  8. Rev Moon jr

    Rev Moon jr Guest

    +0
    Discussing Rev. Moon in the context of this thread is fine. I can only hope that good people will try to make effort to understand the truth being revealed.
     
  9. carma

    carma Guest

    +0
    Wait a second.....you said this:



    So I started another thread, just like you said. I started it with the expectations that you would participate in it, that is what you made it sound like.

    I do not understand since you are the only Moonie on the board, that you will not participate in it.

    What are you afraid of? I have never been afraid to state my beliefs, to anyone. If someone knows they are right, they do not refuse to discuss their beliefs. The only reason they generally refuse to discuss their beliefs is if they know there is a problem with them.

    When you come to a board that discusses religion, Christianity in particular, you can't expect not to have your beliefs discussed or questioned. That is part of this board for EVERYONE.

    Now you have been given an opportunity to explain your beliefs to us and if your beliefs are different than what we think they are, then I am sure that you want to make sure that we know what they are and they we don't believe something about your beliefs that is incorrect.

    Anybody else would do that.

    So, are you going to discuss Rev Moon or not?
     
  10. Rev Moon jr

    Rev Moon jr Guest

    +0
    I have no problem discussing anything about Rev. Moon.
    His life on earth will benefit every man, woman and child.

    When people who know so little start saying his teachings are false because some are different from theirs, well, I'm not so moved to share.

    When such people point to sites other than official Unification Church sites and say this is where the truth about the UC can be found, that is just not right.

    Rev. Moon describes what it means to fulfill the purpose of creation, in thousands of speeches. The time is soon coming when his experience with God will be desired by everyone. It is truly inspirational! [personal experience] God has provided mass communication to make sure this is possible.
    Rev. Moon is creating a world-wide culture of true marriage and true family. Through ideal families, God's love will be manifested in all our lives. It will happen! [Christians don't even seem to have a clue what God is doing. God blessed Christians for the sake of the rest of the world and they gave the world a few crumbs and kept the rest for themselves.]
    Rev. Moon teaches that God's way is to give and give and forget what you have given and give more. If you want to know Rev. Moon, just follow this way. This is how Rev. Moon met God. This is the way of God and Jesus and anyone who will be called the true Son and Daughters of God. Living for the sake of others will naturally separate anyone from satan, who is selfish and self-centered. It's the narrow road and the true road. It works!

     
  11. carma

    carma Guest

    +0
    We don't need any sites, for or against to look at.

    If you want to explain the beliefs as if talking to people that have never heard them, all we need for verification of your beliefs or mine, is scripture, that's it.
     
  12. Rev Moon jr

    Rev Moon jr Guest

    +0
    One of the more ludicrous beliefs of some Christians is to limit Almighty God to the Christian scriptures, at the exclusion of all else. Who would make God so small.
     
  13. carma

    carma Guest

    +0


    One of the biggest errors is to believe that God has private relevations and interpretations that conflict with scripture.

    One is not a serious error if it is true, the other is fatal.
     
  14. Rev Moon jr

    Rev Moon jr Guest

    +0
    The Creation of the Angels
    With what motive and by what process did Adam and Eve and the angel fall in the Garden of Eden?
    God first created the angels as servants to help with his creation and administration of the world (Heb 1:14). However, since man was created as the child of God and was to have dominion over the Creation, man was also to have dominion over the angles. The reason that today angels are usually considered higher than man is that because of the Fall, man became so corrupt (Jer 17:9) that he stood in a position lower than the things of the Creation, including the angels.
    The Spiritual Fall
    Lucifer (Is 14:12) was in the position of archangel and was thus the channel for God's love to the angelic world. It seemed as if only he were in a position to receive God's love. However, since Adam and Eve were created as God's children, God loved them much more than he did Lucifer, who was created as a servant. Yet, in no way did Lucifer actually receive any less love from God after Adam and Eve's creation than he did before their creation. However, by God's giving so much more love to Adam and Eve, Lucifer felt as though there had been a reduction in the amount of love he was receiving. Because of this feeling, Lucifer then tried to supplement the love he received by coming closer to Adam and Eve.
    Because God's love is the source of life and beauty, Eve, who received much love from God, was very beautiful in Lucifer's eyes. Lucifer was often very close to Eve and was strongly stimulated by an impulse of love toward her. Eve, still being in a state of imperfection, was susceptible to Lucifer's temptation, and they committed the sin of fornication. This was the spiritual fall.
    One might ask how it is possible for a sexual relationship to take place between an angel and a human being. This question arises only because man's spiritual perception fell to such a low state due to the Fall. However, in Genesis 32:25, the Bible shows that direct contact between man and angel is possible when it records that an angel wrestled with Jacob and dislocated his hip.
    The Physical Fall
    When Eve united with the archangel (through their spirit selves), she felt a sense of fear, which came from a guilty conscience, and she gained the knowledge that her intended spouse was Adam, not the angel.
    Eve wanted to restore her relationship with God and she also wanted to rid herself of the fear derived from the Fall. Adam was her only hope for returning to God, and Eve thought she could accomplish this by even then becoming one with Adam, who was meant to be her spouse, and so she seduced Adam. This was the motive of the physical fall.
    As explained in "The Principles of the Creation," Adam and Eve were to realize the Three Blessings. In order to do this they ultimately had to become husband and wife. In other words, the Ideal for the Creation was for Adam and Eve to perfect themselves individually and then become husband and wife of eternal love, centered on God. But because they acted as husband and wife prematurely and centered on Satan, their relationship resulted in the Fall and not in the realization of God's ideal. By uniting with Eve, Adam inherited the evil elements which Eve had received from Lucifer. These evil elements were then transmitted to their descendants from generation to generation.
    If the first ancestors had not "eaten of the fruit of good and evil," they would have perfected themselves as the son and the daughter of God, and then, blessed by God, they would have become husband and wife centered on God's love and produced children with natures of goodness, fulfilling the Ideal for the Creation. Then, after Eve fulfilled the Ideal for the Creation, her love would have been a fruit of goodness, and she would have been likened to a tree of goodness.
    However, before she could become perfect, Eve committed the sin of fornication with the archangel and became a fallen person. She furthermore caused Adam to fall, thus creating the first of the fallen families, none of which God can work through. Therefore, fallen Eve was likened to a tree of the knowledge of evil and her love to a fruit of that tree.
    In retrospect, we can see that since just prior to the Fall, Eve was in a position to become either a tree of goodness, by accomplishing the Purpose of the Creation, or a tree of evil, by falling, she was symbolized by the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil. Since prior to the Fall, Eve's love was capable of bearing either a fruit of goodness, fulfilling the Purpose of the Creation, or a fruit of evil causing the Fall, her love was symbolized by a fruit of good and evil.
    According to "The Principles of the Creation," God was to accomplish the purpose of man's creation through love. Thus love is the source of man's joy, life, and happiness. However, because the first ancestors disobeyed the rules of heaven, and fell, love itself was corrupted, and Satan has dominated man and has made him suffer. Thus Satan, who corrupted man's love, is the ringleader behind the destruction of the ideal family. DP
     
  15. carma

    carma Guest

    +0
    I pray that God has mercy on your soul at your judgment, you are going to need it.
     
  16. mikitta

    mikitta Guest

    +0
    Sung Myung Moon is sorely decieved. All who follow him blindly are also decieved and have no part in Christ. RMJr, that means you. You have been decieved and led astray. You have blasphemed the Name of Christ. You have followed after false doctrine, putting your trust in the blind to lead you.

    Here is the point. Call out to Christ Jesus. Admit that you are a sinner and that His is the ONLY name given under heaven to save you. Accept that salvation and run very far from the dangerous and destructive cult that holds you in bondage.

    I will be praying that the Lord in His infinite wisdom and mercy will prompt your heart and lead you out of slavery to Sung Myung Moon.

    God Bless,
    mik
     
  17. Rev Moon jr

    Rev Moon jr Guest

    +0
    I have confidence that the humble and pure will understand. I see it all the time.
    What is interesting is that we are living at a time when Adam and Eve are telling their own story as to what really happened in the garden. Most people have never thought that there would come a time when God would allow all the Biblical personages to convey to people on earth their personal testimonies. This is the time of HIGH NOON when all truth will be revealed. No more shadows and church mysteries. I feel sorry for those who are locked into their small minded beliefs and cannot receive the outpouring of God’s Spirit. These are truly the Last Days.
     
  18. Rev Moon jr

    Rev Moon jr Guest

    +0
    How It Was Possible For Man To Fall
    The Force of Love and the Force of The Principle
    Man was created to grow to perfection, moved from within during the growth period, or period of indirect dominion, by the force of The Principle to live in accordance with The Principle. Therefore, the force of The Principle cannot itself derail man from the track of The Principle and make him fall. But prior to perfection man is liable to be derailed from the track if hit by a force stronger than that of The Principle, which directs man's growth. The only force stronger than that of The Principle is the force of love, Then while man is still imperfect, prior to experiencing the perfect love of God's direct dominion, it is possible for him to fall because of non-Principle "love," love directed toward a purpose different from God's.
    Then why did God make the force of love stronger than the force of The Principle? Love is the motive and purpose for God's creating the Creation, and therefore, love is the most precious aspect of all things, To the Creation it is the source of life, happiness, and joy. Although God created all things in accordance with The Principle, or laws, since he ultimately desired a dominion of love, he made love the strongest force.
    The Purpose of the Commandment and the Period Necessary for It
    Because the force of love is stronger than the force of The Principle, there is always the possibility that during his growth period a person may fall due to non-Principle "love." What can prevent this? Once the force of non-Principle "love" comes into play during their period when a person is still imperfect and not directly in the dominion of God's love, he may fall. In order to prevent this, God game man the commandment 'not to eat of the fruit of good and evil'. As long as the human ancestors had faithfully kept the commandment, they would not have established a reciprocal base with the archangel. Accordingly, the force of non-Principle "love" would not have come into existence. However, since they did not maintain their faith and observe the commandment, but instead established a reciprocal base and a give and take relationship with the archangel, the force of immoral "love" caused them to deviate from the track of The Principle.
    Then how long would God have required the first ancestors to keep the commandment "not to eat," which is the condition of faith that God gave them? Once Adam and Eve had perfected themselves and established horizontal love as husband and wife centered on God, there would have been no force that could break that love, because the love created between them would have been absolute love. Then, after having perfected themselves, they could never have fallen. The force of the lower-level love of the archangel cannot violate the love between a perfected husband and a perfected wife. Accordingly, God's commandment 'not to eat' was required only as long as Adam and Eve were still in the period prior to their perfection.
     
  19. carma

    carma Guest

    +0


    Rev Moon, jr, let me put it to you this way.

    What you are trying to sell here is nothing but a cheap imitation, it is fool's gold.

    You are passing off lies of hell as truths of God. What you have posted can't be found in scripture at all. Genesis is very clear in the story of Adam and Eve and nothing you have posted is there.

    You are following a false prophet, a man who claims to be a messiah, which is a false messiah. Scripture is clear what will happen to this man if he does not repent, false prophets will go to hell and you are following right on his heels as long as you believe every lie that comes from his lips.

    Your only hope is Jesus Christ and you will not find Jesus Christ associated with Rev Moon in any way, shape or form. If he does not repent and turn to Christ, he will be in the Lake of Fire right along with all the other false prophets and false messiahs that Jesus Christ warned us about.
     
  20. ChosenbyHim

    ChosenbyHim Guest

    +0

    Yep. On this ONE point, we agree. However, it was the true Messiah, Jesus, who said that many false prophets would arise in the last days claiming to be the true one or Messiah. Rev. Moon is a fine example of this.

    Chosen
     
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