Rev 11- 1st 3.5 years of Final 7 not a time of peace, after all?

[Douggg]

How do you reconcile NO man knows the day nor the hour - with your theory that His coming will be on day 2520?

I have already told you it has to do with the rapture. You left out four verses in your "proof text", which Jesus was talking about the parable of the fig tree.

In Mark 13, he also gives the parable of the fig tree. Which the bottom line was to "watch".

If you go to Luke 21:34-36, the same message is to watch and pray to be found worthy to stand before the son of man to avoid that day, which will come up on the world unexpected.

32 But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father.

33 Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is.

34 For the Son of man is as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch.

35 Watch ye therefore: for ye know not when the master of the house cometh, at even, or at midnight, or at the cockcrowing, or in the morning:

36 Lest coming suddenly he find you sleeping.

37 And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.
_____________________________________________________________________
Luke 21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.

33 Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.

34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.

35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.

36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

 

[Douggg]

The entire context is the 70th week of Daniel from verse 15 on. The rapture of the church will take place before the week begins. Therefore IN CONTEXT verse 36 is referring to His coming to the Battle.

You left out four verses before verse 36 and the verses after verse 36. So you did not give the true context. Not knowing the day, nor hour, is talking about the rapture, when read in context.


32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

 

[Douggg]

We both know the 6th seal begins the DAY and that has NOT happened. Therefore that seal has NOT been opened. Therefore the BOOK has not yet been opened. When the BOOK gets opened, then the trumpet judgments will come - and we both know they are future.

The book was already opened or else John could not have recorded what was inside. It is the events revealed that haven't taken place yet.

 

[iamlamad]

You did not answer the question, and evaded what it says in Revelation 10:7.

It is not the opening of the seals, but the events that John was shown, that are future. The seals were opened back in the first century as John was given Revelation, and so that everyone will know what is in the book, Jesus unsealed.

The seals were opened by Jesus and John recorded what he saw and heard.

The sounding of the trumpets are future, not the opening of the seals.

Revelation 8:7 The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.

Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

OF COURSE the trumpets are future, because the 7th seal is not yet opened so the 7 angels have not yet received their trumpets to sound.

The 7th seal cannot be opened until the 6th is opened, and when the 6th is opened, all will know: there will be a world wide earthquake, the sun will turn dark and the moon will appear as blood red. It will be the start of the Day of the Lord, and many will KNOW this. It is FUTURE.

The 6th seal cannot be opened until the rapture takes place. The rapture will trigger the 6th seal. The 6th seal events are FUTURE.

You seem to want to change John's order, but it is unchangable! We are waiting on the rapture that will end the church age. the moment after the rapture, it is DAY OF THE LORD - brought on by Jesus opening the 6th seal.

You imagine Jesus opened all of them and then just waited to bring on the effects of each seal at the right time. That is simply not the way John wrote it.

Seal 1 was the church taking the gospel to the world. Did the church WAIT until some unknown time to start? NO! Philip went right down to Samaria. The Gospel went out immediately after Pentecost: from Jerusalem to Samaria and then to the surrounding nations.

Seals 2-4 were Satan's attempts to stop the gospel. Did Satan wait to start? No, Stephen was killed soon after the gospel began to spread. And Satan was after Paul his entire life trying to stop him.

The moment these seals were opened, the events happened. Perhaps there was some slight delay with the 5th seal, but Jesus could have waiting until just before Stephen was killed to open that seal.

Seal 6 is future. When Jesus opens that seal, THE DAY will begin

If you wish to imagine seal 6 and 7 are already opened, I guess you can be wrong. But make no mistake, the DAY will start right after Paul's rapture, and the 7th seal events will start soon after that - I would guess 10 days after.

The seals were opened by Jesus and John recorded...
The sounding of the trumpets are future...

Why do you say this? What is different about the trumpets? John saw and He recorded - so what is different?

Do you imagine that the 6th seal events are in our history?
Do you imagine that the 7 angels already have their trumpets?

 

[Douggg]

OF COURSE the trumpets are future, because the 7th seal is not yet opened so the 7 angels have not yet received their trumpets to sound.

It doesn't say in the text in the days of the 7th seal because the seals were locks on the book from seeing what was inside.

Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

 

[iamlamad]

The book was already opened or else John could not have recorded what was inside. It is the events revealed that haven't taken place yet.

Do you have ANY concept of a vision versus reality? John was seeing a VISION. It was not real. For example, John saw the throne room where Jesus was NOT THERE, and a search for one worthy that ended in failure. But this was 95 AD and Jesus WAS THERE in the throne room showing John the vision. So the REALITY of 95 AD was that Jesus had been back in the throne room, at the right hand of the Father, for around 60 years! Jesus had already been found worthy and had taken the book 60 years previous to John seeing this vision. John was seeing a vision of the PAST.

However, in the vision, John saw the past first - a throne room without Jesus - a search that ended in failure - then the moment (around 32 AD) when Jesus ascended, and got the book into His hands. Then in the vision John saw HISTORIC events: Jesus breaking seals 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5. We KNOW these are historic because we know they are in our history.

The truth is, the VISION passes from history to future between the 5th and 6th seal. We know that because we know the EVENTS of the 6th seal has not happened yet. From that point on in the vision, all the events are future: they have not happened yet.

Has the gospel been sent out from Jerusalem? CHECK!
Has the devil made attempts to stop the gospel? CHECK!
Has there been martyrs of the church? CHECK!
Has the Day of the Lord started? NO WAY!

See how easy it is to know where we are now, know what is history and what is future? Got it?

Rev 6:
9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed

THIS IS HISTORY: and martyrs are still be added.

Rev 6:
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

This is FUTURE: it has not happened yet.

See how simple God made it? Everything (except perhaps a parenthesis) is FUTURE from this point on in Revelation.

 

[iamlamad]

It doesn't say in the text in the days of the 7th seal because the seals were locks on the book from seeing what was inside.

Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

Rev 8:
8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.
2 And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets.

This is what WILL happen when the 7th seal is opened: 7 angels will receive 7 trumpets. Now, do you see any TIME between verse 1 and 2? I see only 30 minutes.

Just so you understand, this is in a VISION. It is not reality YET. The 7th seal is not opened yet and the 7 angels do not yet have their trumpets. Why?

Because the 6th seal is not yet opened!

Why do you jump all the way to the 7th trumpet? That will be 3 1/2 years after the 7th seal is opened.

 

[iamlamad]

The book was already opened or else John could not have recorded what was inside. It is the events revealed that haven't taken place yet.

I can see you have no concept at all of a vision versus reality.

 

[iamlamad]

You left out four verses before verse 36 and the verses after verse 36. So you did not give the true context. Not knowing the day, nor hour, is talking about the rapture, when read in context.


32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

Some people imagine the one taken and one left is referring to the rapture, but Luke sets us straight, those taken end up being dead bodies where birds gather to eat their flesh.

Jesus referring to Noah was ONLY to make a point of the SUDDENNESS of their destruction: they woke up one morning thinking it would be a day just like all their yesterdays - but the flood swept them away. There was no next morning for them. Jesus is making the point that His coming will be just as sudden.

Remember the parable of the tares? Is

You left out four verses before verse 36 and the verses after verse 36. So you did not give the true context. Not knowing the day, nor hour, is talking about the rapture, when read in context.


32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.

37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

Some people imagine the one taken and one left is referring to the rapture, but Luke sets us straight, those taken end up being dead bodies where birds gather to eat their flesh.

Jesus referring to Noah was ONLY to make a point of the SUDDENNESS of their destruction: they woke up one morning thinking it would be a day just like all their yesterdays - but the flood swept them away. There was no next morning for them. Jesus is making the point that His coming will be just as sudden.

Remember the parable of the tares? Is one taken and one left? It would seem so, because the wicked are taken first, as Luke shows us.

I think Jesus was talking to Jewish men about the end of THEIR age. Will one be taken and one left when Jesus comes? I think that is when He sends out His angels to gather with wicked.

 

[Douggg]

Rev 8:
8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.
2 And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets.

This is what WILL happen when the 7th seal is opened: 7 angels will receive 7 trumpets. Now, do you see any TIME between verse 1 and 2? I see only 30 minutes.

If you had in your hands right now a book, not knowing what is inside. Then you opened the book and saw what would take place in the future.

Does that mean you open the book in the future? No, of course not. Opening the seals just allowed to see what would happen in the future.

There was silence in heaven for 30 minutes because they were shocked by what they saw.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

I have already told you it has to do with the rapture. You left out four verses in your "proof text", which Jesus was talking about the parable of the fig tree.

Matt, Mark and Luke's 70ad Jerusalem/Temple discourse mentions "the fig tree" simile.

I have all 3 harmonized at this link for those interested:

Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized

Matthew 24
1 And Jesus coming out, departed from the Temple..............

32 ‘And from the fig-tree learn ye the simile:
When already its branch may have become tender, and the leaves it may put forth,
ye know that summer [is] nigh,

Mark 13:
1 And He going forth out of the Temple,...................

28 ‘And from the fig-tree learn ye the simile: when the branch may already become tender, and may put forth the leaves,
ye know that nigh is the summer;

Luke 21:
5 and of some saying concerning the Temple, .................

29 And he spake a simile to them:
‘See the fig-tree, and all the trees,
30 when they may now cast forth, having seen of yourselves
ye know that now is the summer nigh

Joel 1:12
The vine has dried up,
And the fig tree has withered;
The pomegranate tree,
The palm tree also,
And the apple tree—
All the trees of the field are withered;
Surely joy has withered away from the sons of men.

Revelation 6:13
and the stars of the heaven fell to the earth --
as a fig-tree doth cast her winter-figs<3653>, by a great wind being shaken -

Jer 8:13
“I will surely consume them,” says the LORD.
“No grapes shall be on the vine,
Nor figs on the fig tree,
And the leaf shall fade;
And the things I have given them shall pass away from them.” ' ”




.

 

[Douggg]

However, in the vision, John saw the past first - a throne room without Jesus - a search that ended in failure - then the moment (around 32 AD) when Jesus ascended, and got the book into His hands. Then in the vision John saw HISTORIC events: Jesus breaking seals 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5. We KNOW these are historic because we know they are in our history.

You are going off on some speculative tangent. The fact is Jesus opened the seals already and by the seals having been opened, John recorded in the first centrury everything he saw and was told of what would happen in the future.

 

[Douggg]

Matt, Mark and Luke's 70ad Jerusalem/Temple discourse mentions "the fig tree" simile.

I have all 3 harmonized at this link for those interested:

Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized

Matthew 24
1 And Jesus coming out, departed from the Temple..............

32 ‘And from the fig-tree learn ye the simile:
When already its branch may have become tender, and the leaves it may put forth,
ye know that summer [is] nigh,

Mark 13:
1 And He going forth out of the Temple,...................

28 ‘And from the fig-tree learn ye the simile: when the branch may already become tender, and may put forth the leaves,
ye know that nigh is the summer;

Luke 21:
5 and of some saying concerning the Temple, .................

29 And he spake a simile to them:
‘See the fig-tree, and all the trees,
30 when they may now cast forth, having seen of yourselves
ye know that now is the summer nigh

Joel 1:12
The vine has dried up,
And the fig tree has withered;
The pomegranate tree,
The palm tree also,
And the apple tree—
All the trees of the field are withered;
Surely joy has withered away from the sons of men.

Revelation 6:13
and the stars of the heaven fell to the earth --
as a fig-tree doth cast her winter-figs<3653>, by a great wind being shaken -

Jer 8:13
“I will surely consume them,” says the LORD.
“No grapes shall be on the vine,
Nor figs on the fig tree,
And the leaf shall fade;
And the things I have given them shall pass away from them.” ' ”




.

Fig tree - Jerusalem. Back in the hands of the Jews in 1967. Russians, Turkey, Syria, Iran positioned for Gog/Magog. Yellow vest protests in Europe, stock markets declines, financial issues, pointing toward ten king form of government in the EU, imo.

When you see these things begin to happen, look up your redemption draws near. The rapture.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Some people imagine the one taken and one left is referring to the rapture, but Luke sets us straight, those taken end up being dead bodies where birds gather to eat their flesh.

I think Jesus was talking to Jewish men about the end of THEIR age. Will one be taken and one left when Jesus comes? I think that is when He sends out His angels to gather with wicked.

Yeah those 2 passages of Matthew 24 and Luke 17 has stumped quiet a few theologians.
Have you seen this thread I created on it?

"Where the body/carcass is, there the eagles be gathered" Matt 24 Luke 17 70ad and Revelation

[If you post, please take time to vote in the POLL. Thanks.]

I noticed 2 different Greek words for "bodies" and "carcasses/corpse" in the NT.

Verses with "bodies" and "carcasses" in them..........

Matthew uses G4430

4430. ptoma pto'-mah from the alternate of 4098; a ruin, i.e. (specially), lifeless body (corpse, carrion):--dead body, carcase, corpse.

Matthew 24:28
for wherever the corpse<4430> may be, there shall the eagles/vultures<105> be gathered together.

It is used in 3 other verses......
The body of John the Baptist in Mark 6, and bodies of 2 witnesses in Revelation 11.

Mark 6:
24 And she went forth, and said unto her mother, What shall I ask? And she said, The head of John the Baptist.
27 And immediately the king sent an executioner, and commanded his head to be brought: and he went and beheaded him in the prison,
29 And when is disciples heard of it, they came
and took up His corpse, G4430 and laid it in a tomb.

Why Jerusalem is Mystically Called Sodom and Egypt

Revelation 11:
8 And their dead corpses G4430 shall lie in the street<4113> of the great City, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their corpses G4430 three days and an half, and shall not suffer their corpses G4430 to be put in a tomb<3418>

Luke uses G4983

4983. soma so'-mah from 4982; the body (as a sound whole), used in a very wide application, literally or figuratively:--bodily, body, slave

Luke 17:37
And they answering say to him, 'Where, sir?'
and He saith to them, 'Where the body<4983> is, there will the eagles/vultures<105> be gathered together.'

Which is used in 1 verse of Revelation concerning the destruction of the "Great City/Harlot/Queen"

Revelation 18:13
and cinnamon, and odours, and ointment, and frankincense,
and wine, and oil,
and fine flour, and wheat,
and cattle, and sheep,
and of horses, and of chariots,
and of bodies<4983> and souls<5590> of men.
.

.

 

[iamlamad]

You are going off on some speculative tangent. The fact is Jesus opened the seals already and by the seals having been opened, John recorded in the first centrury everything he saw and was told of what would happen in the future.

He not only saw the seals opened, He saw the trumpets sounded, and the vials poured out; he saw the new heaven and new earth, and the Holy City descending. Are you saying that because John saw the trumpets sounded, they they must have already sounded? The vials are poured out because John SAW them poured out.

Are you for real? I keep telling you there is a DIFFERENCE between a vision and reality. If you have not figured that out by now, there is little hope for you. In a VISION John saw ALL of the future up to the Holy city coming down. But that is VISION, not reality. In reality we are waiting for the rapture and then the 6th seal.

So HOW do we know where we are now in Revelation? There is only one way: follow John's narrative past the things we know are history, and find the first event that has not yet happened. It is simple. I am amazed you struggle with this. The 6th seal events have not happened, so we know the 6th seal has not been opened. It is FUTURE.

 

[iamlamad]

If you had in your hands right now a book, not knowing what is inside. Then you opened the book and saw what would take place in the future.

Does that mean you open the book in the future? No, of course not. Opening the seals just allowed to see what would happen in the future.

There was silence in heaven for 30 minutes because they were shocked by what they saw.

Would you wake up? That was in a VISION! It was not reality: it was a vision of what WILL happen, not what has happened. The 7th seal is NOT YET OPENED! It will not be opened until we see a world wide earthquake. And that earthquake will not come until the rapture comes first.

It is very clear you simply don't understand the difference between reality and a vision. There is little hope you will ever see the truth. It is no wonder we disagree so much.

If God showed me a vision of what was inside a book, then I would know BEFORE I got the book into my hands and opened it. We know what is inside because John saw it in a vision, NOT BECAUSE THE BOOK IS OPENED!

Trust me, when that book gets opened in our future, soon after all will know, because there will be nuclear war. All the green grass will be burned, and 1/3 of the trees, and water will become poison to drink. When people see that, they will know that the book is opened.

We are not seeing nuclear war so we can know the book has not yet been opened. Since we have not seen a world wide earthquake, we can know the 6th seal has not been opened. Since we are still here on earth, we can know the rapture is still future.

Perhaps you should look up "future" in the dictionary.

 

[Douggg]

Are you saying that because John saw the trumpets sounded, they they must have already sounded?

I already told you the trumpets have not sounded because in Revelation 10:7, it says

Revelation 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

It doesn't say in the days of the seventh seal. The sounding of the trumpets is future. The seventh seal opened that part of the book to see what was in it.

 

[Douggg]

If God showed me a vision of what was inside a book, then I would know BEFORE I got the book into my hands and opened it. We know what is inside because John saw it in a vision, NOT BECAUSE THE BOOK IS OPENED!

But that is not the way it happened. John was taken to heaven in chapter 4 to be shown what was in the book. And Jesus opened the seals of the book, and the future was revealed.

God did not reveal to John what was in the book before then.

 

[Julian King]

Julian, first let me say you did a good job on putting your thoughts on the 7 year presentation by Day, citing the beginning of the time period and the end with explanations concerning your rationale.

It makes it lot easier for others to fathom and discuss your ideas, and for you yourself to reason things out (imo).

_________________________________________________________________________________

You have the sacrifices stopped on Day 220 and resumed 1260 days later on Day 1480.

However, I am not seeing the 1260 days being used that way. The 1260 days would be the exact middle of the 7 years. And in Revelation, the 1260 days passages do not mention any restarting of sacrifices, but to the end of the two witnesses' testimony time (Revelation 11:3) and the Jews being fed the word of God and fleeing to the wilderness in Revelation 12:6.

________________________________________________________________________________

"Day 1510- Desolating abomination set up, marking end of the 1290 Days- those in Judea flee to mountains at this time as advised by Jesus in Matt 24:15-16;"

Julian, the abomination of desolation setup is what cause the Jews to flee, agreed. But if we look at Revelation 12:6, they have already fled into the wilderness by the 1260 day point. So the Day 1510 would not be a fit of when the abomination of desolation is setup.

The aod will have to be setup before day 1260. I think on day 1185, 1335 days before Jesus returns.
_______________________________________________________________________________

"Day 1555- 1335 Days ends when those that persevere are made happy/blessed- this could represent when those Judeans that fled to the mountains 45 days earlier reach Rev 12's place of nourishment, which I think will be available for the whole of the Final 3.5 Years of the 7. And the reason that they may feel so happy/blessed could be that this could be the time of the 'Mark of the Beast' period"

Julian, if you were in that situation, would you be happy that you could not dare leave the mountains and go back to your home. Or would you be happy if the 1335 day landed on the day Jesus returns, and He destroys the beast, false prophet, and the armies in you country, - seeking to enslave or kill you ?

I think the blessing is to them who remain faithful to the day Jesus returns. So I put the 1335th day as being the day Jesus returns.

Hi Doug

I have two points concerning your 7 years model.

Firstly, you have sacrifices ceasing on Day 1260, and the 1290 Days of Daniel 12:11 starting on Day 1185. But doesn't it look from Daniel 12:11 that sacrifices ceasing is the event that marks the start of the 1290 Days, which would mean that the either one, sacrifices cease on Day 1185, which, since that is more than 1260 days before Day 2520, would mean that they would have to resume 75 days before Day 2520, or two, it would mean that the 1290 Days would have to start on Day 1260, which would mean that they cease 30 days after Day 2520- in which case, what event do you think would mark the end of the 1290 Days?

So, the basic question is- do you think Daniel 12:11 is telling us that sacrifices ceasing will mark the start of the 1290 Days?

And secondly, you have the AoD set up before Day 1260, the day that the 42 months of Revelation 13 begin. But I think the AoD is the Image of the Beast from Revelation 13, and I think Rev 13 reads as though the Image is made and hence set up during those 42 months, which would mean that the AoD will not be set up before Day 1260.

What do you think?

 

[Douggg]

So, the basic question is- do you think Daniel 12:11 is telling us that sacrifices ceasing will mark the start of the 1290 Days?

The answer is no. Because the sacrifices are stopped maybe a month or so before the abomination of desolation (a statue image of the beast) is placed in temple.

The 1290 days are marked from when the abomination of desolation is placed in the temple. It does not say what takes place 1290 days from that point in the text.

I believe what takes place is the events of the 6th seal, the cosmos parting and the world seeing Jesus before the throne of God.
____________________________________________________________________

You misunderstood me in regards to the stopping of the sacrifices. I did not say on day 1260. There is no way to tell what day on the timeline, the sacrifices are stopped.

Why?

Because they are stopped without warning by the person who will have been anointed the King of Israel - the Antichrist (Anti- legitimate King of Israel, Jesus) - about three years earlier.

In Daniel 8:25, the person magnifies himself in his heart - i.e. gets the big head. Thinks he has achieved God-hood. That's when he decides to make the claim, by stopping the daily sacrifice and going into the temple, sitting claiming to be God.

That action by the person will be totally unexpected, and there is no way of knowing exactly what day. What we can know is that it has to happen before when the abomination of desolation is placed in the temple - which we can determine a firm day for that of 2520-1335 = day 1185 on the timeline.

Here is a general narrative. The Antichrist after ruling as the King of Israel for about three years, without warning stops the daily sacrifice. Goes into the temple, sits, claims to the God. That act is call the transgression of desolation - not to be confused with the abomination of desolation that comes later.

The Jews will be mortified by his act and will impeach him from continuing as their King. That ends the person's time in the role of being the Antichrist. He is now the revealed man of sin.

The person is going to be killed for the act. How can we know?

Because in Ezekiel 28:1-10, under the code name of the prince of tyre, God spells it all out. About the person magnifying himself in heart, sitting in the seat of God, showing everyone his claim.

God is not pleased, and says he is no God and is just a man. So God brings strangers against him, to kill him.

Ezekiel 28:
7 Behold, therefore I will bring strangers upon thee, the terrible of the nations: and they shall draw their swords against the beauty of thy wisdom, and they shall defile thy brightness.

8 They shall bring thee down to the pit, and thou shalt die the deaths of them that are slain in the midst of the seas.

Okay, so he is killed. Symbolically, in Revelation 13, he is the mortally wounded head on the beast. But comes back to life.

So how does the guy come back to life? It is in Isaiah 14, that he finds his soul in hell, taunted, before God decides not to let him rest there. And brings him back to life.

Isaiah 14:
19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.

20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.

Verse 20 indicates his body is never buried. Which indicates that he will be dead maybe a week or so, and his body in the viewing period. That's when he sits up in the open casket - and shocks the world.

At that point he has become the beast. And the false prophet has the image made of him and placed in the temple. As the abomination of desolation. Now we have finally got to day 1185.

That's where the 1290 days start counting from. So a lot of things will transpire between the stopping of the sacrifices to the day the abomination of desolation is placed in the temple

I highlighted in blue the stopping of the daily sacrifice, if you want to go back over the narrative.

So the daily sacrifice will be stopped, and a bunch of time passes, maybe a month or so, and then it finally gets around to image made of the person. I probably did a pretty good job of confusing you, but that was not my intention if I did.

I am intimately familiar with all the passages and have pursued the subject for 47 years, I am 70 years old.