Racial Bias in Florida Sentencing

iluvatar5150

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Some good research here from the Sarasota Herald Tribune regarding persistent disparities in criminal sentencing in Florida, despite the legislature's attempts to implement systems that would counter judicial and prosecutorial bias.

TL;DR:
Some justices imposes sentences on black defendants upwards of 2x as long as those they impose on whites, when controlling for other factors.

Black justices tend to be more fair than whites.
Female justices tend to be more fair than men.
Black male justices tend to be the most lenient.
Black female justices tend to be the harshest, but easily the most even/fair.


Bias on the Bench | Sarasota Herald-Tribune Media Group | Sentencing

Justice has never been blind when it comes to race in Florida.

Blacks were first at the mercy of slave masters. Then came Jim Crow segregation and the Ku Klux Klan.

Now, prejudice wears a black robe.

Half a century after the civil rights movement, trial judges throughout Florida sentence blacks to harsher punishment than whites, a Herald-Tribune investigation found.

They offer blacks fewer chances to avoid jail or scrub away felonies.

They give blacks more time behind bars — sometimes double the sentences of whites accused of the same crimes under identical circumstances.

Florida lawmakers have struggled for 30 years to create a more equitable system.

Points are now used to calculate sentences based on the severity of the crime, the defendant’s prior record and a host of other factors. The idea is to punish criminals in Pensacola the same as those in Key West — no matter their race, gender or wealth.

But the point system has not stopped discrimination.
 

Ana the Ist

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Some good research here from the Sarasota Herald Tribune regarding persistent disparities in criminal sentencing in Florida, despite the legislature's attempts to implement systems that would counter judicial and prosecutorial bias.

I couldn't find a link to the research...just an article.

TL;DR:
Some justices imposes sentences on black defendants upwards of 2x as long as those they impose on whites, when controlling for other factors.

You can't control for every factor.

Black justices tend to be more fair than whites.
Female justices tend to be more fair than men.
Black male justices tend to be the most lenient.
Black female justices tend to be the harshest, but easily the most even/fair.


Bias on the Bench | Sarasota Herald-Tribune Media Group | Sentencing

So...is there a link to the research somewhere? I don't want to come off as skeptical, but it's hard to imagine a media outlet performing completely unbiased research on this.
 
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Ana the Ist

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If the research and findings are credible, there needs to be a big change.

I'm so tried of people living outside the law. Our recidivism rates are embarrassing.

That's a pretty big "if"...

I'm wary of any study that claims "we've controlled for every factor"...because it's simply not possible. Two men can have exactly the same record, be convicted of the same charges, and one can still justifiably deserve a longer sentence than the other.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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I'm so tried of people living outside the law. Our recidivism rates are embarrassing.

The recidivism rates we have are largely due to the fact that our incarceration system really only focuses on one of the two aspects that need to be present. Punishment and rehabilitation...our criminal justice system tends to go heavy on the former, and all but non-existent on the latter.

People in the US have been conditioned to think that unless a prisoner is spending 22 hours per day in an 8x10 grey block of misery and solitude, then they're "not being punished enough".

...the reality is, countries with a more rehabilitation-focused criminal justice system tend to product lower recidivism rates and better rates of job placement after time served.

If all biases are put aside and you just think about it from a logistics standpoint.
If you have a person who's already engaging in criminal behavior and you want that behavior to stop, how does locking a person up and subjecting them to fear, malnutrition, and isolation correct that behavior? After 5 years of that, you essentially have the exact same criminal, just even less mentally stable than they were before.

That's why the Scandinavian countries have some of the lowest recidivism rates in the world.
The US 5-year recidivism rate is 76% (not good)
Finland: 35%
Sweden: 41%
Switzerland: 29%
Iceland: 35%


People in the US accuse them of being "too soft on criminals", yet their systems produce better results than ours, our recidivism rate is basically double what theirs is.

I think we, in the US, are conditioned to seek vengeance. IE: "You wronged me, and I want you to have the harshest punishment possible!". As to where their line of thinking is "You wronged me, what can we do to make sure this person doesn't repeat that behavior again after their serve their time?"

Basically, it boils down to the difference between a gut reaction vs. critical thinking.
 
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381465

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The recidivism rates we have are largely due to the fact that our incarceration system really only focuses on one of the two aspects that need to be present. Punishment and rehabilitation...our criminal justice system tends to go heavy on the former, and all but non-existent on the latter.

People in the US have been conditioned to think that unless a prisoner is spending 22 hours per day in an 8x10 grey block of misery and solitude, then they're "not being punished enough".

...the reality is, countries with a more rehabilitation-focused criminal justice system tend to product lower recidivism rates and better rates of job placement after time served.

If all biases are put aside and you just think about it from a logistics standpoint.
If you have a person who's already engaging in criminal behavior and you want that behavior to stop, how does locking a person up and subjecting them to fear, malnutrition, and isolation correct that behavior? After 5 years of that, you essentially have the exact same criminal, just even less mentally stable than they were before.

That's why the Scandinavian countries have some of the lowest recidivism rates in the world.
The US 5-year recidivism rate is 76% (not good)
Finland: 35%
Sweden: 41%
Switzerland: 29%
Iceland: 35%


People in the US accuse them of being "too soft on criminals", yet their systems produce better results than ours, our recidivism rate is basically double what theirs is.

I think we, in the US, are conditioned to seek vengeance. IE: "You wronged me, and I want you to have the harshest punishment possible!". As to where their line of thinking is "You wronged me, what can we do to make sure this person doesn't repeat that behavior again after their serve their time?"

Basically, it boils down to the difference between a gut reaction vs. critical thinking.
I guess your experiences are different than mine or things have changed a lot in the last 15 to 2 years.
I would have to go to mostly medium and a few maximum security prisons to interview convicts regarding criminal activity, suspects, witnesses and general evidence gathering.
Medium security prisons operate mostly on an open cell policy except evenings and lock downs. There is freedom to go to other cells, cantines, library. Etc. They have many personal effects including radio, TV, books...no Internet access.
Maximum is tougher. Less open cell, still some regulated privileges
I never knew a convict that was in his cell 22 hours per day.
I didn't have contact with serial killers, but a few murderers and none were under that kind of restriction unless they had been naughty.
Rehabilitation is offered to varying degrees. I think they were called classification councillors that would assist in finding educational and occupational outlets.
Rehabilitation has to be the desire of those to be rehabilitated.
I did not experience much of that attitude.

In short...most convicts I interacted with didn't hate prison any more or less than most everything else they hated.

I don't know if that's gut reaction or critical thinking.
 
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Occams Barber

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I couldn't find a link to the research...just an article.



You can't control for every factor.



So...is there a link to the research somewhere? I don't want to come off as skeptical, but it's hard to imagine a media outlet performing completely unbiased research on this.

I fished around the article and found the links to the research. It appears that the work was done by the newspaper as part of a continuing series on the Florida judicial system.

To find the research method/data source:

Click on READ THE FULL PROJECT at the top right of the article

Clicking on this will take you to EXTRAS on the right side of the screen.

EXTRAS include:
How we did it
Read the methodology behind the analysis


And

Data
Explore the data

OB
 
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Ana the Ist

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The recidivism rates we have are largely due to the fact that our incarceration system really only focuses on one of the two aspects that need to be present. Punishment and rehabilitation...our criminal justice system tends to go heavy on the former, and all but non-existent on the latter.

People in the US have been conditioned to think that unless a prisoner is spending 22 hours per day in an 8x10 grey block of misery and solitude, then they're "not being punished enough".

...the reality is, countries with a more rehabilitation-focused criminal justice system tend to product lower recidivism rates and better rates of job placement after time served.

If all biases are put aside and you just think about it from a logistics standpoint.
If you have a person who's already engaging in criminal behavior and you want that behavior to stop, how does locking a person up and subjecting them to fear, malnutrition, and isolation correct that behavior? After 5 years of that, you essentially have the exact same criminal, just even less mentally stable than they were before.

That's why the Scandinavian countries have some of the lowest recidivism rates in the world.
The US 5-year recidivism rate is 76% (not good)
Finland: 35%
Sweden: 41%
Switzerland: 29%
Iceland: 35%


People in the US accuse them of being "too soft on criminals", yet their systems produce better results than ours, our recidivism rate is basically double what theirs is.

I think we, in the US, are conditioned to seek vengeance. IE: "You wronged me, and I want you to have the harshest punishment possible!". As to where their line of thinking is "You wronged me, what can we do to make sure this person doesn't repeat that behavior again after their serve their time?"

Basically, it boils down to the difference between a gut reaction vs. critical thinking.

I think it's cultural...but I mainly agree. A large number of us simply label criminals as "bad" or "evil" without any examination of what drove them to commit a crime, and therefore they deserve to suffer a punishment.

The idea of what is good for our society regarding crime and punishment is really a secondary thought to the "justice" aspect of it.

I can't remember if it's Norway or another nation in Scandinavia...but I think they even have a limit of 30 years or so to which a person can be incarcerated.
 
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Ana the Ist

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After getting to read the methodology of the study...I'll say that it's a stronger effort to compile such data than I've seen in a lot of other research. It is probably as sound of an effort as one can make...but it still falls short of being able to account for every factor.

For example, a defendant's attitude is often considered during sentencing. Two men could both have no prior record, both be charged with domestic battery, and both be convicted of it. If one defendant is tearful and shows what appears to be genuine remorse for what he's done...and the second defendant is defiant and insists he was right to do what he did, we can reasonably expect the second defendant's sentence to be longer than the first. That's just one example of the limitations of these kinds of studies and why the conclusions they draw aren't necessarily reasonable.

I did find it interesting that in the category of "driving without a license"...a crime that appears virtually identical in every case regardless of the race of the offender...there's absolutely no difference in sentencing between blacks and whites.

I would be curious to hear how those doing the research would explain that phenomena. Are they under the impression that judges exhibit racial bias all the time...yet when it comes to that particular crime they suddenly become fair and objective? As far as conclusions go, I don't think that would hold up.
 
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iluvatar5150

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After getting to read the methodology of the study...I'll say that it's a stronger effort to compile such data than I've seen in a lot of other research. It is probably as sound of an effort as one can make...but it still falls short of being able to account for every factor.

For example, a defendant's attitude is often considered during sentencing. Two men could both have no prior record, both be charged with domestic battery, and both be convicted of it. If one defendant is tearful and shows what appears to be genuine remorse for what he's done...and the second defendant is defiant and insists he was right to do what he did, we can reasonably expect the second defendant's sentence to be longer than the first. That's just one example of the limitations of these kinds of studies and why the conclusions they draw aren't necessarily reasonable.

If you're comparing one single case to another single case, sure. But we're talking about millions of records. Are blacks just disproportionately less remorseful as a race? Or is it more likely that judges tend to be more skeptical of people of a different race?

I did find it interesting that in the category of "driving without a license"...a crime that appears virtually identical in every case regardless of the race of the offender...there's absolutely no difference in sentencing between blacks and whites.

I think you're misreading that page. The way they've got it set up is a little annoying, but as far as I can tell, the Circuit drop-down doesn't affect the data on the page. Rather, the Circuit drop-down filters the list of judges available in the Judge drop-down, and the data on the page applies to whatever judge is selected. So, when you select "(All)", you'll probably get the default judge, Michael Allen, who does treat driving w/o a license even-handedly. But the same can't be said for other judges.
 
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Ana the Ist

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If you're comparing one single case to another single case, sure. But we're talking about millions of records. Are blacks just disproportionately less remorseful as a race? Or is it more likely that judges tend to be more skeptical of people of a different race?

I don't see why you think having millions of records changes my point...being remorseful, respectful, general demeanor are things likely to factor into sentencing in every case where plea bargains aren't already agreed upon. I also said it's just one factor. Another factor would be the nature of the plea bargains themselves (which I don't remember the study saying was accounted for)...a man pleading guilty to simple battery is going to likely get a better deal than a guy who has charges of resisting arrest or fleeing dropped so that he'll plea guilty to simple battery.

As for your question, I'm sure you've seen statistics indicating that blacks and whites view the justice system quite differently...why wouldn't that affect their behavior/demeanor in court?



I think you're misreading that page. The way they've got it set up is a little annoying, but as far as I can tell, the Circuit drop-down doesn't affect the data on the page. Rather, the Circuit drop-down filters the list of judges available in the Judge drop-down, and the data on the page applies to whatever judge is selected. So, when you select "(All)", you'll probably get the default judge, Michael Allen, who does treat driving w/o a license even-handedly. But the same can't be said for other judges.

My mistake, I followed the links Occam provided.
 
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iluvatar5150

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I don't see why you think having millions of records changes my point...being remorseful, respectful, general demeanor are things likely to factor into sentencing in every case where plea bargains aren't already agreed upon.

Because to get the kinds of disparities we see after millions of records, those factors would have to be dominant throughout the entire population.

I also said it's just one factor. Another factor would be the nature of the plea bargains themselves (which I don't remember the study saying was accounted for)...a man pleading guilty to simple battery is going to likely get a better deal than a guy who has charges of resisting arrest or fleeing dropped so that he'll plea guilty to simple battery.

Those additional charges of resisting would show up in the point tallies, wouldn't they?

As for your question, I'm sure you've seen statistics indicating that blacks and whites view the justice system quite differently...why wouldn't that affect their behavior/demeanor in court?

Maybe. And if we were talking about a couple percentage points, then maybe that's all it was. But we're talking about double and triple-digit discrepancies in most categories in most counties.

And if it's the attitude of the defendant that's a big factor, why does the balance flip with black judges?
 
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I don't see why you think having millions of records changes my point...being remorseful, respectful, general demeanor are things likely to factor into sentencing in every case where plea bargains aren't already agreed upon. I also said it's just one factor. Another factor would be the nature of the plea bargains themselves (which I don't remember the study saying was accounted for)...a man pleading guilty to simple battery is going to likely get a better deal than a guy who has charges of resisting arrest or fleeing dropped so that he'll plea guilty to simple battery.

As for your question, I'm sure you've seen statistics indicating that blacks and whites view the justice system quite differently...why wouldn't that affect their behavior/demeanor i


My mistake, I followed the links Occam provided.

Iluvatar's data comes from the same Data link I provided in post #11.

You'll find searchable data bases related to Judges, Appeals and Politics below the interactiveFlorida county map.
OB
 
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Ana the Ist

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Because to get the kinds of disparities we see after millions of records, those factors would have to be dominant throughout the entire population.

I wouldn't say "dominant"...you could have only 30% difference between the two groups, it all depends on how much it affects a particular judge's sentencing.



Those additional charges of resisting would show up in the point tallies, wouldn't they?

I don't fully understand the "point tallies" aspect of the Florida system. I was under the impression it was used to rate the severity of a crime. For example, showing the difference between a guy who assaults another man so badly he spends a week in the hospital recovering and several months in physical therapy...and a man who simply punched another man several times and left him bruised and bloodied, but no long lasting injuries.

I didn't think it had anything to do with plea agreements.



Maybe. And if we were talking about a couple percentage points, then maybe that's all it was. But we're talking about double and triple-digit discrepancies in most categories in most counties.

Surely there's a pdf of the actual research paper somewhere? Navigating multiple drop down menus over and over on my phone doesn't exactly allow for easy comparison.

And if it's the attitude of the defendant that's a big factor, why does the balance flip with black judges?

Perhaps they're more willing to dismiss such things...perhaps the defendants become more optimistic about their chances when they see their own race in the judge. I can only speculate...much like the researchers themselves.
 
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TheNorwegian

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I can't remember if it's Norway or another nation in Scandinavia...but I think they even have a limit of 30 years or so to which a person can be incarcerated.

You are right. Norway has a maximum sentence of 30 years in prison. However, there are certain exceptions where a person is deemed so dangerous that he can be kept in confinement for life. This is very rare, but people like mass murderers or serial rapists will not be released back into society
 
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Another sound, rigorous study that uncovers significant bias in our justice system. Not only that, but it mirrors the "lesser" studies that have similar conclusions and the methodology is being attacked? I think multiple independent studies with similar conclusions are more correct than the people that refuse to accept the accounting of racial bias.

And no, one does not need to account for every possible factor because one does not need to know every possible weight in a model.
 
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