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Question re: Democratic Perspective - Trump free thread

Discussion in 'American Politics' started by hislegacy, May 23, 2020.

  1. hislegacy

    hislegacy This is me.

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    ****Not about Trump - ****

    In 2016 the Democratic Party presented "the best qualified" Candidate for the Presidency. She was very well qualified, backed by more than 1 Billion dollars in campaign funds, had the blessing of the DNC high command and the full endorsement of the former President. Yet she lost.

    Many commentators (opposition), said that she would be a continuation of the Obama policies, some calling it his third term. That combined with an uprising in the general populace wanting a change from the same style politics as the former eight years rose steadily.

    Some have ventured to say that the election was more a vote against Hillary and per politics, than it was for her opponent.

    Here is the question I'd like to get some feedback from:

    IF, please note 'if' - the election results were influenced by a large number of voters who were voting against the candidate and the administration policies, what do they think will happen when they run the former vice president, who was an architect to some of those very same policies? Would that not be a detriment? Isn't that a reason why the people supporting Bernie felt so strongly?

    Are they making a mistake?

    ****Not about Trump - **** Can I please ask the mods to help keep this thread on subject.
     
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  2. GreatLakes4Ever

    GreatLakes4Ever Well-Known Member

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    I think there was a non insignificant segment who voted against Clinton because they really didn’t like her. My dad was one of those people who voted for Trump in 2016 because of this and thinks his chances for 2020 are dead in the water at the moment partly because it isn’t Clinton going against him.
     
  3. grasping the after wind

    grasping the after wind That's grasping after the wind

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    I don't know how you expect to keep Trump out of the thread when the subject is what people think will happen in an election Biden is running in where Trump will be his opponent? The voters will not be faced with an uncontested election where they are being asked to either approve or disapprove of Biden. Asking people to ignore Trump is like asking them to ignore Hillary in the last election. There will be many people voting against Trump just as there were many people voting against Hillary. There will also be many people voting against Biden. I suspect that an embarrassingly large percentage of voters base their votes upon surface traits like looks, sex, race, and personality rather than by examining what the candidate is likely to do once in office.
     
  4. Arcangl86

    Arcangl86 Newbie

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    I really think the 2016 election was more about personality then it was about policy. It's also worth pointing out, the election was lost by a small margin in a part of the country that Hillary didn't bother campaigning in. I do think that Biden is making mistakes by trying to appeal to conservatives, but I while i don't think he has as good a chance to win as a more progressive candidate would, I still think he has a really good chance.
     
  5. grasping the after wind

    grasping the after wind That's grasping after the wind

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    When did Biden try to appeal to conservatives? I must have missed it.
     
  6. Arcangl86

    Arcangl86 Newbie

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    Sorry, I should have said "Republicans." He's been courting moderate Republicans.
     
  7. grasping the after wind

    grasping the after wind That's grasping after the wind

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    What has he been promising them ?
     
  8. variant

    variant Happy Cat

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    I think the 2016 election was the epitome of a "who do you like less" election for most people.
     
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  9. jacks

    jacks Er Victus Supporter

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    In addition to what Arcangl86 said about personality being more important than policies during the 2016 election; I think many Democrats resented having Hilary in essence forced upon them by the DNC. I know I did and that is why I turned to to Bernie. (Though I must say in retrospect I'm glad he wasn't elected.)
     
  10. Arcangl86

    Arcangl86 Newbie

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    He's been trying to portray himself as a unifier. His proposed policies are also more moderate then the party as a whole.
     
  11. ThatRobGuy

    ThatRobGuy Programmer Extraordinaire Supporter

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    I posted this in another thread, but I'll re-post it here (complying with the declared intent of the OP to not reference a certain person...so that part will be redacted.)


    13% of 2016 voters who voted against their own party (7 million) were former Obama voters (interestingly enough, 80% of which said they'd be happy to vote for Obama again if he were allowed to run again, and nearly 70% of which saying that they're happy content with their choice not to back Hillary), and 1/10 Bernie primary supporters (another million) ended up doing the same, and nearly 6 million voters ended up going for a 3rd party. (Giving "the other guys" some of the highest numbers they've seen since Ross Perot).

    ...that happened with someone with no former political experience as the opponent, and the DNC throwing hundreds of million's at the campaign to get their person elected.

    2016 should've been a good learning experience that you can't just throw any old establishment politician in the mix, and assume that name recognition & number of years of service (or even being part of a popular former president's administration) combined with "throwing money at the problem" will equate to a "slam dunk" strategically speaking.

    So yes, I think they're making a mistake by (by all appearances), repeating their 2016 strategy which failed them, instead of repeating their 2008 strategy which worked quite well for them.

    Simply being Obama's former VP doesn't equate to having the same drawing power.

    As many recall, Obama and Biden were actually both part of the 2008 democratic primary race. Clearly they don't have the same appeal when it comes to presidency (in the eyes of many voters), as Obama obviously was in first place for that one, while Biden finished 5th, with 0 delegates, 0 super-delegates...right behind John Edwards (3rd) and Bill Richardson (4th).

    Obviously Obama picked him for VP, but in terms of standing on his own two feet as a voter draw, Biden's no Obama.

    Public Opinion Polling
    upload_2020-5-23_16-31-27.png

    ...and based on the graph, he's not even a John Edwards either.
     
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  12. Runner12

    Runner12 New Member Supporter

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    I definitely voted against Hillary. I support many of Trump's policies, but I would have voted for literally anyone who ran against Hillary. I believe the Clintons are simply evil.

    Biden has an excellent chance of winning for precisely the same reason. Vast hordes of people would vote for literally anyone who ran against Trump; I think the visceral, utter hatred of Trump runs deeper and wider than the visceral, utter hatred of Hillary. The question will be whether enough of the others - such as Bernie's supporters and those who have no enthusiasm about Biden - turn out to vote or stay home.

    Biden may be gaffe-prone and borderline senile, but I don't think he carries the same baggage that Hillary does. Even though he was Obama's VP, it doesn't seem to me that too many people view him as another Obama in terms of policy or fundamental hatred of America.
     
  13. Speedwell

    Speedwell Well-Known Member

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    Hatred of America?
     
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  14. tulc

    tulc loves "SO'S YER MOM!! posts!

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    ...didn't Clinton get many millions more votes then the other candidate? Because the OP seems to be saying she was less popular then the other candidate and that's why she lost, which isn't the reality. She lost because some States votes count more then other states. :wave:
    tulc(just in case people have forgotten)
     
  15. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    As it stands right now I'll be voting for Biden but I wouldn't have voted for Bernie.
    In 2016, I didn't vote for Clinton or Trump.
    But we shouldn't forget the Clinton did win the popular vote and because we are talking about how individual people voted and will vote this next election that should be taken into consideration.
     
  16. variant

    variant Happy Cat

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    My vote for Biden will be mainly because his opponent is currently attempting to tear down every last bit of legitimacy in the way we have our government set up.

    I think something needs to be salvaged there.
     
  17. Arcangl86

    Arcangl86 Newbie

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    I never understood this. It's one thing to fundamentally disagree with President Obama's policies. But I really don't get why people think he was Anti-America. Most of his adult life was in public service.
     
  18. SimplyMe

    SimplyMe Senior Veteran

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    Yes, the people who hated Hillary hate America.

    You have to admit, you walked right into that one. :wave:
     
  19. essentialsaltes

    essentialsaltes Stranger in a Strange Land

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    Hypothesis denied.
     
  20. DaisyDay

    DaisyDay blind squirrel

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    It wasn't only Clinton that lost to Donald, but all of the Republican contenders as well and there were a lot of well-qualified candidates.

    Biden stands a good chance simply because we've seen what incompetence, ignorance of laws and general contempt for our government has wrought - death and destruction.
     
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