Question about Mother Mary

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SumMer88

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I had a question about praying...

I have been in doctrined since i was very young, but my walk with God is fairly new

I am not a practicing Catholic, but i know Catholics have rosemary's and they do "Hail Mary's"

God speaks to me when I pray, and I remember that Mary ascended to heaven immediately, and was lifted by angels befre she died, so she is there in heaven with God.

If God speaks to people, do you think it's possible for Mary to speak to people as well since she is also in heaven?
 
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Sketcher

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I'm a Protestant so I have a problem with just about everything you've said.

In the New Testament, there's nothing concerning a relationship with the departed saints. There is quite a bit about a relationship with God Himself, though. Jesus is our only go-between for humans and the Father (1 Timothy 2:5) and there is no mention of having to go through any saints in order to get to Jesus. We can pray to God directly. When He answers us, He answers through the Holy Spirit. Not through another servant of His who has gone to be with Him.

Being as good a woman as she was, I do not believe for a minute that Mary is happy about the extra attention that Catholics and Orthodox give her. That worship, praise, and attention ought to go to God Himself, and God alone.
 
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snoochface

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I agree with everything twistedsketch said.

This question is likely to cause debate because no one but Catholics and perhaps Anglicans believe that Mary ascended into heaven and should be prayed to. You'd probably be better off posting your question in the Catholic forum, OBOB.
 
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IXOYE<><

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I had a question about praying...

I have been in doctrined since i was very young, but my walk with God is fairly new

I am not a practicing Catholic, but i know Catholics have rosemary's and they do "Hail Mary's"

God speaks to me when I pray, and I remember that Mary ascended to heaven immediately, and was lifted by angels befre she died, so she is there in heaven with God.

If God speaks to people, do you think it's possible for Mary to speak to people as well since she is also in heaven?

Actually, They're called Rosaries and yes Catholics do a kind of prayer they call a Hail Mary. As a non Catholic but not an anti Catholic, I can say I respect their reasons for giving respect and veneration to Mary. There are some though, who feel as though Mary should be treated on the same level as God.
 
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SumMer88

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sorry I guess I didn't specify but none of you really answered my question...

I respect your opinion that all praise should be to God alone, as that is my belief as well...
Maybe you misunderstood what I wrote or i miscommunicated...

God favored Mary as she was the bearer of His son... I am not saying she IS god ...

To all who posted, I guess in a round about way you answered my question because you said you do not think she ascended to heaven so therefore she cannot speak to those on earth.

I will ask on the catholic forum ... thanks for the input
 
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Sketcher

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To all who posted, I guess in a round about way you answered my question because you said you do not think she ascended to heaven so therefore she cannot speak to those on earth.
No, I believe she is in Heaven. I don't believe she was assumed, but I believe she is in Heaven. There are lots of folks up in Heaven, but they don't have any business speaking to us on earth. God does, and He might send an angel, but there is no New Testament evidence of Him sending departed saints to give messages to other saints. The departed saints are referred to as "fallen asleep," not as active messengers.
 
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ephraimanesti

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I had a question about praying...

I have been in doctrined since i was very young, but my walk with God is fairly new

I am not a practicing Catholic, but i know Catholics have rosemary's and they do "Hail Mary's"

God speaks to me when I pray, and I remember that Mary ascended to heaven immediately, and was lifted by angels befre she died, so she is there in heaven with God.

If God speaks to people, do you think it's possible for Mary to speak to people as well since she is also in heaven?

MY DEAR SISTER,

CONGRATULATIONS UPON BEGINNING YOUR WALK WITH THE LORD! May you experience all the wondrous blessings He has in store for you.

Mary is indeed alive and well in heaven--as are all the other Saints who have been faithful and done God's will while on earth. They are all seated before the Throne of God ready, willing, and able to intercede with our Lord on our behalf.

What must be realized--pictured, if you will--is that The Body of Christ--His Church--is a unified whole, with part of it on earth--us--and part of it in heaven--Jesus Christ the head with all the Saints (including Mary) who served the Lord faithfully while in the flesh on earth. (See our Lord's teaching contained in Luke 20:35-38) They exist in heaven solely to intercede on our behalf and obtain for us spiritual strength and guidance so that we may be enabled to overcome all obstacles which the Evil One places in our path and, through serving the Lord faithfully as they did, to eventually be honored with a place in Heaven among them.

It is important to remember that we pray THROUGH Mary and the other Saints, not TO them! As the prayer goes, "Holy Mary, Mother of God, PRAY FOR US SINNERS . . ." Saints are venerated, NOT worshipped! Mary and the other Saints are human beings just as we are and are in no way divine. The difference is that they, through their struggles on earth, have been spiritually perfected, and thus have a special power to interceed with God on our behalf.

i find it sad that so many refuse to ask for intercessions from Mary and the other Saints but think nothing of asking for the intercessions of their Pastor, friends, and even online prayer groups. Who do you think is more likely to have our Lord's "ear"--a fallible Pastor who is probably struggling with the same sins as you are, or God's mother Mary, who has transcended sin?

Yes, Mary and the other Saints will indeed speak to you in the quiet of your heart--LISTEN TO THEM! The majority of the world's Christians heed Mary and the other Saints' words--it is only an unfortunate minority who have thrown out the baby with the bathwater and refuse to do so.

A BOND-SLAVE OF CHRIST,
ephraim
 
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gloryseven

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:groupray: The reason they are called Rosary beads, is because the prayers offered in remembrance of Jesus, and to increase our faith and to remember what Christ has done for us during His life, death and Resurrection, is like a string of lovely fragrant roses, given to the Blessed Mother of our Savior, Jesus Christ.

God bless You and may Jesus send His Holy Spirit upon you to strengthen, bless, lead and guide you.

I believe that Mary is with Jesus in Heaven, I believe she loves us and He loves her and that Jewish moms are probably very very concerned not just about their sons, but about the humanity that their Son has come to Redeem and to sacrifice His life for. Mary loves us and she may pray for us according to Gods will. It is wonderful to know we have a Heavenly Mother, especially if our mother here on earth fell short of her role as a loving and nurturing soul.

I personally have felt very comforted and blessed by knowing my Heavenly Mother may be welcoming me into Heaven, even if my earthly mother is an unbeliever and perhaps even athiest. God is soo good.

Love Jesus, first and foremost, as all the Christians here advise, but dont forget the graces God gives us and the wisdom He provides. It will help you in your walk. Amen.
 
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SumMer88

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Yeah thanks for the last 2 posts! That clarified a lot!!!

I understand why people do not want to get caught up in prayer with Saints... I guess it confuses people and they think God will consider it "idol worship" .....

But I definitely agree with yall about it being almost the same thing as asking a good friend or priest to pray for you.

I am not saying Mary can be prayed TO.... rather talked to on behalf of us that are still on earth.
I don't understand why people do not want to give Mary attention. I know at my church women's names are hardly ever brought up. I just find it hard to believe that Mary is to be considered just like 'everyone else'
When who is the mother of the Son of God? She is...
And who is the Father? God is!
God is clearly her Heavenly Father as well... I am just saying God clearly chose her to be the mother of His only begotten Son for a reason...

Well this may cause disbelief for some of you, but a few nights ago I was praying and I felt God and mary both talking to me, I guess you could say like a conference call type thing...
Anyways thats why I was curious, because they were both still voices that I knew were not my own.

God bless and thanks for the replies!
 
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snoochface

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Is Mary omniscient? Does she know your thoughts and your mind? Is she omnipresent? Is she there in the room with you when you are praying? How does Mary "hear" your prayers in order to act as intercessor for you?
 
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ephraimanesti

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Is Mary omniscient? Does she know your thoughts and your mind? Is she omnipresent? Is she there in the room with you when you are praying? How does Mary "hear" your prayers in order to act as intercessor for you?

MY DEAR SISTER,

MARY IS NOT GOD--SHE IS HIS MOTHER!

Mary--and the rest of the Saints and our Guardian Angel--hear our prayers the same way Jesus does--by the fact that "In God we live and move and have our being." (Acts 17:28) Given that the Holy Spirit fills all things, prayers get to where they are directed through the medium of His Being.

ephraim
 
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ephraimanesti

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I agree with everything twistedsketch said.

This question is likely to cause debate because no one but Catholics and perhaps Anglicans believe that Mary ascended into heaven and should be prayed to. You'd probably be better off posting your question in the Catholic forum, OBOB.

MY DEAR SISTER,

The majority of the world's Christians--Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, and many Protestants--believe in the intercessory powers of Mary and the Saints. Disbelievers are a distinct minority in this regard. The OP's original question was valid and in a valid Forum--i fail to see the problem.

ephraim
 
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Sketcher

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MY DEAR SISTER,

MARY IS NOT GOD--SHE IS HIS MOTHER!

Mary--and the rest of the Saints and our Guardian Angel--hear our prayers the same way Jesus does--by the fact that "In God we live and move and have our being." (Acts 17:28) Given that the Holy Spirit fills all things, prayers get to where they are directed through the medium of His Being.

ephraim
Thus she is elevated to "goddess" level by believers that claim this. The writers of the New Testament were not half as Marian as the Catholic and Orthodox today.

Jesus is God, yes. That makes Him much, much greater than Mary. This "veneration" of saints ought to go to Him, rather than them. That's the way they would have insisted on in their lifetimes, Mary included.
 
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ephraimanesti

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Thus she is elevated to "goddess" level by believers that claim this. The writers of the New Testament were not half as Marian as the Catholic and Orthodox today.
"Elevated to 'goddess' level" is perhaps a poor description of the love, respect, and esteem Christians hold for God's mother. Judgment without knowledge could perhaps best be called prejudice.

Jesus is God, yes. That makes Him much, much greater than Mary. This "veneration" of saints ought to go to Him, rather than them. That's the way they would have insisted on in their lifetimes, Mary included.
No one would question that Jesus is "much, much greater than Mary." For this reason, WORSHIP goes to God and VENERATION goes to Mary and the other Saints. If we merely venerated God, we would not be Christians. WORSHIP GOES TO GOD--VENERATION GOES TO HIS SERVANTS. i honest don't see what is confusing about that.

WORSHIP--"Homage or reverence paid to a deity."

VENERATE--"Regard with deep respect; to revere on account of sanctity."


God's servants are venerated because they have provided extrene abd acceptable worshipful service to God, and for no other reason. Accolades to the servant redound to the Master!

Our Lord's first miracle--in Cana--was performed at the request of his mother. The pattern continues as we speak.

IN CHRIST,
ephraim
 
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Sketcher

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"Elevated to 'goddess' level" is perhaps a poor description of the love, respect, and esteem Christians hold for God's mother. Judgment without knowledge could perhaps best be called prejudice.


No one would question that Jesus is "much, much greater than Mary." For this reason, WORSHIP goes to God and VENERATION goes to Mary and the other Saints. If we merely venerated God, we would not be Christians. WORSHIP GOES TO GOD--VENERATION GOES TO HIS SERVANTS. i honest don't see what is confusing about that.

WORSHIP--"Homage or reverence paid to a deity."

VENERATE--"Regard with deep respect; to revere on account of sanctity."


God's servants are venerated because they have provided extrene abd acceptable worshipful service to God, and for no other reason.
Protestants think well of the saints too, but praying to them is taking it too far (even if it is asking them to pray for you, the method by which you contact them is prayer, unlike when someone walks up to a fellow believer and asks for prayer). The Hail Mary has been perverted from the message the angel gave her into praise and worship by men.

Accolades to the servant redound to the Master!
I don't believe this at all.

"At this I fell at his feet to worship him. But he said to me, 'Do not do it! I am a fellow servant with you and with your brothers who hold to the testimony of Jesus. Worship God! For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.'" - Rev 19:10

Our Lord's first miracle--in Cana--was performed at the request of his mother. The pattern continues as we speak.
So you're saying that all His miracles since, even to this day, are because Mary wanted them, rather than the Father?
 
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ephraimanesti

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Protestants think well of the saints too, but praying to them is taking it too far (even if it is asking them to pray for you, the method by which you contact them is prayer, unlike when someone walks up to a fellow believer and asks for prayer). The Hail Mary has been perverted from the message the angel gave her into praise and worship by men.

i see nothing "perverted" about giving due praise and veneration--NOT WORSHIP--to God's mother without whose "Let it be unto me according to your word" (Luke 1:38) the sin of Eve's disobedience could not have been undone--nor our Savior Jesus Christ take flesh.

I don't believe this at all.
Praise be to God that reality remains reality inspite of our prejudices and disbelief!

"At this I fell at his feet to worship him. But he said to me, 'Do not do it! I am a fellow servant with you and with your brothers who hold to the testimony of Jesus. Worship God! For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.'" - Rev 19:10
Why do you insist on continuing with this "worship" silliness. No Christian would ever "worship" Mary or any of the other Saints. These, our elder brothers and sisters, are VENERATED NOT WORSHIPPED.

So you're saying that all His miracles since, even to this day, are because Mary wanted them, rather than the Father?
Of course not! But there have been a bunch of miracles in my life due to the intercessions of Mary and other Saints.

The denial of the existence of something one does not understand and does not care to honestly investigate is kind of like a kid standing outside a Candy Store criticizing the taste of the sweets he glimpses from a distance through the window.

A BOND-SLAVE OF CHRIST,
ephraim
 
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Sketcher

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i see nothing "perverted" about giving due praise and veneration--NOT WORSHIP--to God's mother without whose "Let it be unto me according to your word" (Luke 1:38) the sin of Eve's disobedience could not have been undone--nor our Savior Jesus Christ take flesh.
Actually, God could have just found someone else who was a virgin, faithful, and from the line of David. The very thing that makes Mary worth remembering is that she chose obedience.

And allow me to clarify. I have actually talked with a Catholic who believes that the Holy Spirit comes through Mary, rather than being sent by the Father and Son according to John 14:16-17. This is a serious aberration. And how did she come to this conclusion? Through the abuse of the Hail Mary.

Why do you insist on continuing with this "worship" silliness. No Christian would ever "worship" Mary or any of the other Saints. These, our elder brothers and sisters, are VENERATED NOT WORSHIPPED.
Yet, you pray those prayers, and sing those songs. No one is worthy of that level of praise except God.

Of course not! But there have been a bunch of miracles in my life due to the intercessions of Mary and other Saints.
But according to the Bible, miracles are God's idea. Anything they would have prayed for is something that He would have already begun to do, since He knows every thought before it happens.
 
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ephraimanesti

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Actually, God could have just found someone else who was a virgin, faithful, and from the line of David. The very thing that makes Mary worth remembering is that she chose obedience.

God also could have created Eve without freewill so that she would not have listened to the serpent and sinned. Given that God will not violate our freewill, i don't think i can be as certain as you seem to be that God would have continued to "shop around" for an eartly mother for His Son had Mary chosen to refuse obedience to His will.

Anyway, the point is--she willingly DID what she did in humble submission to God's will, and thus has earned both a place of honor before the Father's Throne and veneration in the hearts of all Christians.

And allow me to clarify. I have actually talked with a Catholic who believes that the Holy Spirit comes through Mary, rather than being sent by the Father and Son according to John 14:16-17. This is a serious aberration. And how did she come to this conclusion? Through the abuse of the Hail Mary.
All what you state "clarifies" is that the person you talked to is way off the track--not understanding the teachings of the Catholic Church on the subject at hand. There are those unfortunates who get off track, but this has nothing to do with Catholic or Orthodox Church teachings or practices which are as i have already outlined them.

On the other hand, i have heard of Christians who honestly believe that "THE DA VINCI CODE" is a "ground-breaking work of scholarly non-fiction" and even have study groups going in their homes to study this new "spiritual" guidebook and avail themselves of the "truths" it contains. In both your example and mine, exceptions prove the rule in that they are aberations. If you want to know and understand Church teachings on Mary and the Saints, go to the authoritive sources, not to the extremists who have gone off on their own tangents and are outside the pale of true Christian worship.

Yet, you pray those prayers, and sing those songs. No one is worthy of that level of praise except God.
To the contrary, the level of veneration accorded to Mary and the other Saints is far below the level of worship and praise given to the Blessed Trinity--both in quantity and in quality--but still well within the bounds of what they deserve for the service they have provided--and continue to provide--to God on our behalf.

But according to the Bible, miracles are God's idea. Anything they would have prayed for is something that He would have already begun to do, since He knows every thought before it happens.
If what you are saying is literally true as you state it, what is the point of intercessory prayer between us here below? The Bible enjoins us in many places to pray for one another--what is the point of that if what you say is true and God is going to provide what we are asking for whether or not we ask for it or request our brothers and sisters to pray on our behalf? Personally, i would question whether our Lord would have acted to turn the water into wine at Cana if His mother hadn't asked Him to.

Scripture states, "THE PRAYER OF A RIGHTEOUS MAN AVAILS MUCH." (James 5:16) The benefit of asking for intercessory prayer from Mary or another of the Saints is that they have a proven exemplary record of righteousness, holiness, and pleasing God and thus we can be well assured that their prayers on our behalf will be heard. As for the prayers of Pastors, Televangelists, and our next-door neighbor--who knows? Things are often not what they seem to be (to say the least!)--Spiritually speaking

i think the OP's original question has probably been answered by now, so perhaps we shouldn't continue hijacking her thread. If you have a serious need to debate this question, perhaps you might try the General Theology Forum.

A BOND-SLAVE OF CHRIST,
ephraim
 
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snoochface

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i think the OP's original question has probably been answered by now, so perhaps we shouldn't continue hijacking her thread. If you have a serious need to debate this question, perhaps you might try the General Theology Forum.

Heh, that was my point a long time ago...

This question is likely to cause debate because no one but Catholics and perhaps Anglicans believe that Mary ascended into heaven and should be prayed to. You'd probably be better off posting your question in the Catholic forum, OBOB.
 
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