Question about John 6:37-40

[Neostarwcc]

Is there a limit as to who is covered by John 6:37-40? Like for example lets say a person comes to Jesus for salvation and accepts Jesus but later renounces the faith? Jesus says that he will lose none of those the father gives him. But a person who later renounces the faith is that person not given to Jesus by God the father? So they're not covered by John 6:37-40? But Jesus says in John 6:37 that those who the Father gives to Jesus will come to him for salvation. So I'm confused. Because people say that those who renounce the faith lose their salvation or that they never had salvation to begin with. Yet Jesus says in John 6:39 that he won't lose one single believer so am I missing something?

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

Just my opinion but your approach sounds too legal to me. I don't look to the Gospels for technical answers. I look to it for inspiration.

 

[Jonaitis]

Is there a limit as to who is covered by John 6:37-40? Like for example lets say a person comes to Jesus for salvation and accepts Jesus but later renounces the faith? Jesus says that he will lose none of those the father gives him. But a person who later renounces the faith is that person not given to Jesus by God the father? So they're not covered by John 6:37-40? But Jesus says in John 6:37 that those who the Father gives to Jesus will come to him for salvation. So I'm confused. Because people say that those who renounce the faith lose their salvation or that they never had salvation to begin with. Yet Jesus says in John 6:39 that he won't lose one single believer so am I missing something?

I think the parable of the sower explains this. The one who bears fruit believes savingly, as opposed to those who may have been intellectually or emotionally converted (or whatever the case may have been). The general call is the outward preaching of the gospel, and people may agree with it to a point. Such people have a temporal faith, as the Lord Jesus spoke about, until something shakes it (like the parable of the house with a foundation built on sand). They were never regenerated, they were never changed by it. However, the irresistible call spoken of in John 6:44, Romans 8:40, and 1 Corinthians 1:24 is the inward drawing of the Holy Spirit that cannot be resisted. Those individuals are immediately regenerated, comprehending all that the gospel presents, and as a consequential response they take hold of Christ by real faith in all that he is and all that he offers. These are then covered with the blood of Christ, and are washed from all of their sins. These Christ will never forsake, he brought them to himself by hiding them in the shelter of his wings.

There are many unregenerate professors of Christianity. They may say the right things, they may agree to the right things, they may even appear moral, but they are dead in sin and dead to the things of God. There is a difference imo with believing Christ and believing in him.

 

[redleghunter]

Is there a limit as to who is covered by John 6:37-40? Like for example lets say a person comes to Jesus for salvation and accepts Jesus but later renounces the faith? Jesus says that he will lose none of those the father gives him. But a person who later renounces the faith is that person not given to Jesus by God the father? So they're not covered by John 6:37-40? But Jesus says in John 6:37 that those who the Father gives to Jesus will come to him for salvation. So I'm confused. Because people say that those who renounce the faith lose their salvation or that they never had salvation to begin with. Yet Jesus says in John 6:39 that he won't lose one single believer so am I missing something?

I would say Jesus meant every word He said and every promise He made.

If the Father gives sheep to Jesus and Jesus is not to lose them, then believe that is true.

 

[d taylor]

Is there a limit as to who is covered by John 6:37-40? Like for example lets say a person comes to Jesus for salvation and accepts Jesus but later renounces the faith? Jesus says that he will lose none of those the father gives him. But a person who later renounces the faith is that person not given to Jesus by God the father? So they're not covered by John 6:37-40? But Jesus says in John 6:37 that those who the Father gives to Jesus will come to him for salvation. So I'm confused. Because people say that those who renounce the faith lose their salvation or that they never had salvation to begin with. Yet Jesus says in John 6:39 that he won't lose one single believer so am I missing something?

If a person believes, Jesus in the promised Messiah from The Old Testament prophecies and trust in Jesus for His gift of eternal life. Then they have eternal life and have crossed over from death to life.
I see no verse from the Bible saying that a person can lose their eternal life.

 

[Radagast]

I would say Jesus meant every word He said and every promise He made.

If the Father gives sheep to Jesus and Jesus is not to lose them, then believe that is true.

But remember that Jesus said this knowing that Judas was lost. Judas was never truly one of the sheep.

 

[redleghunter]

But remember that Jesus said this knowing that Judas was lost. Judas was never truly one of the sheep.

That’s true. Which brings up stuff most don’t want to discuss. Judas was chosen to fulfill the Scriptures.

I had a thread on “Did Judas get a raw deal.” Some interesting responses.

 

[Kenny'sID]

40 For this is the will of my Father, that every one that beholdeth the Son, and believeth on him, should have eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

That last verse of what you posted sums it up nicely. And to your question, I can only see "every one" as meaning anyone that believes on him, regardless of if they stay or fall away and return.

Be in the state of believing on him (as in accepting, then showing we believe by our obedience) when we die or at his return, and we are in.

Ain't it grand.

 

[bèlla]

So I'm confused. Because people say that those who renounce the faith lose their salvation or that they never had salvation to begin with. Yet Jesus says in John 6:39 that he won't lose one single believer so am I missing something?

No, He won't lose you. I have shared my testimony here. I was raised in the church and believed in God and Christ. I didn't agree with confession and never went. I spent time reading my bible and having theological conversations with the priests. A negative experience at church brought questions about its leadership and I could no longer attend. I was related to the pastor.

I visited several churches and read about Wesley and the Methodists. I researched numerous denominations for clarification on their doctrine. But something was missing. I don't know what. But it felt like religion not relationship.

I began looking elsewhere. I have practiced or studied most main religions. However, when I reached the end of myself and was spiritual weary He led me to a synagogue. Then the magic happened. I saw the Word come to life. I had renounced Christ and was no longer certain about God's existence. This was the end of the road. But God...

I found God and Christ in the synagogue. He turned me into a warrior and a holy snatcher for His glory. And because of my experiences I'm able to engage with others who believe differently without discomfort. I understand where they're coming from.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

he won't lose one single believer

No He will not because they stayed the course. Jesus explicitly said only those who endure till the end will be saved. Those are the ones who are not LOST.
Blessings

 

[redleghunter]

40 For this is the will of my Father, that every one that beholdeth the Son, and believeth on him, should have eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

That last verse of what you posted sums it up nicely. And to your question, I can only see "every one" as meaning anyone that believes on him, regardless of if they stay or fall away and return.

Be in the state of believing on him (as in accepting, then showing we believe by our obedience) when we die or at his return, and we are in.

Ain't it grand.

Jesus didn’t deal with straw men. He burned them down.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Jesus didn’t deal with straw men. He burned them down.

If you disagreed with part of my post, you'll need to be direct and clear, please.

 

[redleghunter]

If you disagreed with part of my post, you'll need to be direct and clear, please.

Sure. You quoted Jesus and then made a snide remark on how He saves us and secures us.

I’m not going to address “what if” scenarios.

What if Superman was German during the Nazi regime?

What if Aquaman could not swim?

What if Spider-Man was actually bitten by a roach?

What if’s are straw men.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Sure. You quoted Jesus and then made a snide remark on how He saves us and secures us.

I asked you to be clear, and since no remark was meant as snide, I haven't the slightest what you refer to..so you will need to point that out.

 

[redleghunter]

I asked you to be clear, and since no remark was meant as snide, I haven't the slightest what you refer to..so you will need to point that out.

To be clear you were mocking the words and promise of Christ.

 

[Kenny'sID]

To be clear you were mocking the words and promise of Christ.

You are wasting my time and yours now, as well as, by your refusal to be clear, you are showing others there is something amiss with your argument.

I'll leave it with you if this is all you are going to do.

 

[redleghunter]

You are wasting my time and yours now, as well as, by your refusal to be clear, you are showing others there is something amiss with your argument.

I'll leave it with you if this is all you are going to do.

Your post came across as adding to the words of Jesus. I went back and see it could mean an affirmation.

The fault is with me as I read it wrong.

My apologies brother.

 

[kkamagwi]

Is there a limit as to who is covered by John 6:37-40? Like for example lets say a person comes to Jesus for salvation and accepts Jesus but later renounces the faith? Jesus says that he will lose none of those the father gives him. But a person who later renounces the faith is that person not given to Jesus by God the father? So they're not covered by John 6:37-40? But Jesus says in John 6:37 that those who the Father gives to Jesus will come to him for salvation. So I'm confused. Because people say that those who renounce the faith lose their salvation or that they never had salvation to begin with. Yet Jesus says in John 6:39 that he won't lose one single believer so am I missing something?

They that eat of Jesus will never again hunger, just as they that drink of Jesus will never again thirst. To eat of Jesus is to be given faith by God that Jesus is the Savior. The soul's desires find their gratification in Jesus.

People who God joins to Jesus are given to him as his own. God gives faith to God's elect. It's grace's call, and so none of those that God gives faith in Jesus to will he cast out.

God's thoughts are peace and mercy; God has no desire for shameful people's deaths.

To fulfill God's purpose, Jesus came into the world. It's God's will that Jesus lose none of those whom God has given him. They're in God's sight. So those whom God has given to Jesus as his own, Jesus should raise from the dead on the last day to give them glory. It's God's will that all that look upon Jesus in faith will have eternal life and partake of the New Earth.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Your post came across as adding to the words of Jesus. I went back and see it could mean an affirmation.

The fault is with me as I read it wrong.

My apologies brother.

Not a big deal, happens to all of us.

 

[redleghunter]

They that eat of Jesus will never again hunger, just as they that drink of Jesus will never again thirst. To eat of Jesus is to be given faith by God that Jesus is the Savior. The soul's desires find their gratification in Jesus.

People who God joins to Jesus are given to him as his own. God gives faith to God's elect. It's grace's call, and so none of those that God gives faith in Jesus to will he cast out.

God's thoughts are peace and mercy; God has no desire for shameful people's deaths.

To fulfill God's purpose, Jesus came into the world. It's God's will that Jesus lose none of those whom God has given him. They're in God's sight. So those whom God has given to Jesus as his own, Jesus should raise from the dead on the last day to give them glory. It's God's will that all that look upon Jesus in faith will have eternal life and partake of the New Earth.

Cut to the quick with this post. Beautiful and Spirit filled. Thank you.