Question about eternal damnation

[Der Alte]

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<fl>The punishment of the Father of all fathers is not merely correction: it is correction that improves, changes, transforms for the better.
Our God punishes with an objective in view, not as an end in itself!
There are dual aspects to our Father’s Realm as shown in the following…
Tamiym/ 'ymt means to be consumed, destroyed, exhausted and spent, but also to be finished and made sound.
Kalal has the same meaning, linking destruction, being spent, exhausted, as well as to be finished and made sound.
Tamam, the root word of Tamiym means to be finished, complete, summed up, made whole: linked with to be consumed, exhausted, spent and destroyed.
Shalam/ ~IX, another expression of destruction, has the scope of being finished and ended, made good or whole, & being made sound, coupled with to be restored.
Shebar, rooted in Shabar, means breakout, and being brought to birth; and underlying new birth and breakout? To be crushed and broken. Again there is dual meaning in our Lord’s words of destruction and re-creation.
Chalowph
The destructive Hebrew word Chalowph is rooted in being altered, renewed, changed, and to sprout again. It should also be noted that this is not just change, but change for the better.
In the Christian story God descends to reascend. He comes down;… down to the very roots and sea-bed of the Nature He has created. But He goes down to come up again and bring the whole ruined world up with Him. -C.S. Lewis<fl>

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All somewhat interesting. A lot of assertions but no, zero, none supporting evidence except for 2 sentences from C.S. Lewis.

 

[Ronald]

As “love thinketh no evil,” can God design the ultimate evil of a single soul? (1 Cor. 13:5)

As “love worketh no ill,” can God inflict, or cause, or allow to be inflicted, an endless ill? (Rom. 13:10)

As we are forbidden to be overcome by evil, can we safely suppose that God will be overcome by evil? (Rom. 12:21)

If man does wrong in returning evil for evil, would not God do wrong if He was to do the same?

KJV
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
CEB
I form light and create darkness, make prosperity and create doom; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
ASV
I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things.
ESV
I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
NIV
I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things.
RSV
I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe, I am the Lord, who do all these things.
YLT
Forming light, and preparing darkness, Making peace, and preparing evil, I [am] Jehovah, doing all these things.'
WEB
I form the light, and create darkness. I make peace, and create calamity. I am Yahweh, who does all these things.
NASB
The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating calamity; I am the Lord who does all these.

Would not the infliction of endless punishment prove that God HAD been overcome by evil?

Again, I don't believe in eternal punishment. Destruction means to put an end to. As paper burns in a fire, show shall all be destroyed in the Lake of Fire and be no more.

If God loves His enemies now, will he not always love them?

The rain falls on the wicked, they eat from the food God provides, they breathe the air, God even heals them when they are sick, He gives them ample opportunities, they hear the gospel, but remain rebellious and choose to go their own ways.
Don't think God loves everyone in the end, sure temporarily they benefit from His love while they live, but life on earth is temporal. And according to Romans 1, He also lets them go to their own demise. When God let's you go, that's it, there is no more drawing, no more attempts made, you are already judged, reprobate.

Remember God loved Jacob and hated Esau!
YLT "Is not Esau Jacob's brother? -- an affirmation of Jehovah, And I love Jacob, and Esau I have hated, And I make his mountains a desolation, And his inheritance for dragons of a wilderness." Mal. 1:2, 3

>Do you think God loved all the tribes that He told the Israelites to kill: men, women and children????
>Do you think the Flood was an example of God's love for the world???
And I suppose you think God is not vengeful either????
YLT "For the day of vengeance [is] in my heart, And the year of my redeemed hath come." Is. 63:4
"Never take your own revenge, beloved, but leave room for the wrath of God, for it is written, 'Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,' says the Lord." Romans 12:19
That doesn't sound like He is going to forgive them.

God is Love, but He is also a God of justice, which is a pillar by which love stands. Righteousness is an attribute of God and so this is also a factor in His judgment. Jesus imputes His Righteousness to us. However, the unrighteous are judged. The wages of sin is death. You seem to not understand DEATH or JUDGMENT
I'm not young btw, 63. I have written a book about Christianity, "Hell ... If I Know" and specifically devoted two chapters to the topic of Hell and its nature. So spare me your air of condescension. Evidently you are too old that you are set in your ways and therefore not teachable. You lack discernment which the Holy Spirit gives. You would rather lean on your own understanding, support it by outside references and then use the Greek words as if that is a shoe-in for understanding. If that were so, all Greek speaking people would understand God better than anyone - LOL. Hopefully you haven't been a pastor or teacher yourself because you will be responsible for those whom you mislead into thinking that everyone goes to heaven - which in turn might lead them into thinking, why not live the way they want?

 

[FineLinen]

Again, I don't believe in eternal punishment. Destruction means to put an end to. As paper burns in a fire, show shall all be destroyed in the Lake of Fire and be no more.

Dear Ronald: The fact is destruction is closely linked with change and transformation in both the Old and New Covenant. The Limne of Theos radiates with theion rooted firmly in Theos.

Fire, Ronald, Is the essence of God, in it and thru it our God the consuming fire brings the all (the ta panta), and rather than "no more", in fact saves!

John R Gavazzoni

Editors Note:

(The following was written by John R Gavazzoni as one of several explanations by members of a Christian internet forum sent to a brother in Christ who had asked if anyone could help him understand the meaning of the lake of fire and brimstone.)

Hi Doug, Please consider the following very general attempt to answer your question. I believe the association of fire with purification in both old and new testaments is easily traceable. I won't list proof texts, but they do abound, and probably others will take the time to present those in detail. In the old testament the prophetic analogy of silver being purified by fire is classically representative of the purification theme of the Bible.

I would say that, typically true of him, Paul, gets to the heart of the matter when he writes about every man's work being tried by fire, yet the man, himself, being saved. John, whose theology parallels Paul's more explicit style, with a more implicit style of his own, makes it a point to call the lake in question not only the lake of fire, but also of brimstone, which is an old word for sulfur. With sulfur being a common agent of ceremonial purification in temples of worship in ancient times, I think the association is obvious in the Book of Revelation.

Now, to specifically address the possibility that John means to convey destruction rather than purification, let me say that neither scripture nor science recognizes the destruction of anything in the sense of annihilation, that is, of anything being reduced to a state of absolute nothingness. Destruction does not render anything nonexistent, but rather incapable of carrying out its function, as in the destruction of a tank in warfare. The mass of metal is still there, but it can't function as a tank any longer.

Even if you were to vaporize the tank completely, yet, it's intrinsic elements would still exist in other forms. Contrary to conventional theology, all things were not created from nothing, and none of the things that have been created will ever face nonexistence, and by that I mean nonexistence in any form. All created things are subject to change, change in form, but not subject to losing their intrinsic existence.

So, what we have in the process of purification by fire is, first, a separation of the object of purification from all that defiles it, all that is foreign to it's intrinsic constitution, and then the removal of the corrupting element(s). But, as all analogies and parables fall short, in some way, of fully representing the truth they are meant to convey, so is the case here. (I think Bible teachers speak of parables not walking on all fours).

In the case of death and Hades being cast into the lake of fire and a separating of these foreign elements of corruption from the persons who are subjected to the divine flame, it is clear that the persons are saved; they are delivered from the corruption to which they were subjected, but other scripture indicates that death, that last (ultimate) enemy is not merely discarded, but is swallowed up in victory.

I think the Holy Spirit very specifically inspired Paul to write of swallowing up and not mere discarding and certainly not annihilation. When something is swallowed it undergoes a quite remarkable process whereby it becomes, physically speaking, part and parcel of the swallower himself. It is transformed into blood, bone and tissue and has become integral to the person's body. The Book of Hebrews uses the analogy of shaking. Everything that can be shaken will be removed by that shaking, but what then?

This brings us to the depth and extent of reconciliation in the economy of God. Certainly, God has reconciled the alienated person to Himself in Christ, that is undeniable in the scripture, but beyond that, God does not defeat death and the place/Hades [the capacity and potential] of death, by merely removing them. He takes alienation, enmity and hostility themselves and reconstitutes them back into the grace out of which they first proceeded. In a word, God defeats his enemies by transforming them into friends.

At the heart of the message of the Book of Revelation is majestic statement of Him who sits upon the throne, "Behold, I make ALL THINGS new." God loses nothing. The loss of anything does not compute when it comes to God. He created good and evil, the prophet said, and in the end, all things return to God that "He might be all in all."

What a God,

John R. Gavazzoni

 

[FineLinen]

God is Love, but He is also a God of justice, which is a pillar by which love stands.

Dear Ronald: The pillar of our God is His essence upon which all attributes of His mighty Being stands. Justice flows from His LOVE/FIRE/SPIRIT/LIGHT/RECONCILIATION and upon that foundation alone!

From Him the all, through Him the all, in Him the all

 

[FineLinen]

Don't think God loves everyone in the end, sure temporarily they benefit from His love while they live, but life on earth is temporal. And according to Romans 1, He also lets them go to their own demise. When God let's you go, that's it, there is no more drawing, no more attempts made, you are already judged, reprobate.

Dear Ronald: God loves because He is love. God loves us not "temporarily", God loves us PERIOD! Love never fails, we fail miserably: God never fails! He draws to the very end, and at the very end is LOVE!

Writings Of John Gavazzoni - Help Of The Helpless

"The whole of created life shall be delivered/ set free from the bondage of corruption.."

 

[FineLinen]

Dear Ronald: Two rules=

1. Love never fails.

2. When in doubt, see rule number 1.

“Love knows no limit to its endurance, no end to its trust, no fading of its hope; it can outlast anything. It is, in fact, the one thing that still stands when all else has fallen.”

Love never fails, never ever!

 

[FineLinen]

Again, I don't believe in eternal punishment. Destruction means to put an end to. As paper burns in a fire, show shall all be destroyed in the Lake of Fire and be no more.

Dear Ronald: My friend the scope of the fire of His essence is far more complex!

Our God is a consuming Fire

Fire Is A Beneficent Agent

How shallow is the common view of "fire" as only or chiefly a penal agent. Fire, in Scripture, is the element of....

"Life"....Isa. 4:5

"Purification"....Matt. 3:3

"Atonement"....Lev. 16:27

"Transformation".....2 Pet. 3:10

And never ever of preservation alive for purposes of anguish.

And the popular view selects precisely this latter use, never found in Scripture, and represents it as the sole end of God's fiery judgments! If we take either the teaching of Scripture or of nature, we see that the dominant conception of fire is of a beneficent agent. Nature tells us that fire is a necessary condition of life; its mission is to sustain life; and to purify, even when it dissolves.

Extinguish the stores of fire in the universe, and you extinguish all being; universal death reigns. Most strikingly is this connection of fire and life shown in the facts of nutrition. For we actually burn in order to live; our food is the fuel; our bodies are furnaces; our nutrition is a process of combustion; we are, in fact, "aflame to the very tips of our fingers." And so it is that round the fireside of life and work gather: when we think of home we speak of the family hearth.

Fire Is The Sign Of God's Being

And what Nature teaches, Scripture enforces in no doubtful tone. It is significant to find the Great Source of life constantly associated with fire in the Bible.

Fire is the sign, not of God's wrath, but of His being.

When God comes to Ezekiel there is a "fire unfolding itself" (Ezek. 1:4, 27) and "the appearance of fire." (Ezek. 8:2)

Christ's eyes are a flame of "fire" (Rev. 1:14).

The seven lamps of "fire" are the seven Spirits of God (Rev. 4:5). So a fiery stream is said "to go before God," His throne is fiery flame, its wheels are burning fire (Daniel 7:9,10). His eyes are lamps of fire (Dan. 10:6); He is a wall of fire (Zeph. 2:5). At His touch the mountains smoke (Psl. 104:32). And God's ministers are a flame of fire (Psl. 104:4...Heb. 1:7). It is not meant to deny that the Divine Fire chastises and destroys.

Purification, Not Ruin Is The Final Outcome

It is meant that purification, not ruin, is the final outcome of that fire from above, which consumes--call it, if you please, a paradox--in order that it may save. For if God is Love, then by what but by love can His fires be kindled? They are, in fact, the very flame of love; and so we have the key to the words, "Thy God is a consuming Fire," and "Thy God is a merciful God" (Deut. 4:24-31). So God devours the earth with fire, in order that finally all may call upon the name of the Lord (Zeph. 3:8,9)--words full of significance.

So Isaiah tells us of God's cleansing the daughters of Zion by the spirit of burning (Isa. 4:4)--suggestive words. And, so again, "By fire will the Lord plead with all flesh." (Isa. 66:16) And Christ coming to save, comes to purify by "fire." (Mal. 3:2).

Fire A Sign Of Favourable Response?

Let us note, also, how often "fire" is the sign of a favourable answer from God; when God appears to Moses at the Bush it is in "fire:" God answers Gideon by "fire;" and David by "fire." (1 Chron. 21:26) Again, when He answers Elijah on Carmel, it is by "fire;" and in "fire" Elijah himself ascends to God. So God sends to Elisha, for aid, chariots and horses of "fire." So when the Psalmist calls, God answers by "fire." (Psl. 18:6-8)

And by the pillar of "fire" God gave His law. And in "fire" the great gift of the Holy Ghost descends at Pentecost."

Fire Is The Portion Of All

These words bring us to the New Testament. There we find that "fire," like judgment, so far from being the sinner's portion ONLY, is the portion of all. Like God's judgment again, it is not future merely, but present; it is "already kindled," always kindled: its object is not torment, but cleansing. The proof comes from the lips of our Lord Himself. "I am come to send fire on the earth," for it is certain that He came as a Saviour. Thus, coming to save, Christ comes with fire, nay, with fire already kindled. He comes to baptize with the Holy Ghost, and with fire.

Therefore, it is that Christ teaches in solemn passage (usually misunderstood, Mark 9:43) that everyone shall be salted with fire. And so the "fire is to try every man's work." He whose work fails is saved (mark the word saved), not damned "so as by fire," by consuming what is evil, saves and refines.

The antient tradition that represents Christ as saying, "He that is near Me is near fire," expresses a vital truth. So Malachi, describes Christ as being in His saving work "like a refiner's fire." And so, echoing Deut 4:24-31, we are told that "our God is a consuming Fire," i.e., God in His closest relation to us; God is Love; God is Spirit: but "Our God is a consuming Fire"--a consuming Fire, "by which the whole material substance of sin is destroyed."

When, then, we read (Psl. 18:12) that "coals of fire" go before God, we think of the deeds of love which are "coals of fire" to our enemies. (Rom. 12:20) Thus, we who teach hope for all men, do not shrink from but accept, in their fullest meaning, these mysterious "fires" of gehenna, of which Christ speaks (kindled for purification), as in a special sense the sinner's doom in the coming ages. But taught by the clearest statements of Scripture (confirmed as they are by many analogies of Nature), we see in these "fires" not a denial of, but a mode of fulfilling, the promise--

"Behold, I make all things new."

-Christ Triumphant-

 

[Butch5]

[Previous post continued]

[11]John 10:28
(28) I give them eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life, and they shall never [αἰών/aion] perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. ​

Here “aionios” and “aion” are paired with “[not] snatch them out of my hand.” If “aion/aionios” means “age(s), a finite period,” that is not the opposite of “[not] snatch them out of my hand’” “Aionios life” by definition here means “eternal life.”

[12]1 John 2:17
(17) The world and its desires pass away, but whoever does the will of God lives forever. [αἰών/aion] ​

In this verse “aionios” is contrasted with “pass away,” “lives aionios” cannot mean a finite period, A “finite period” is not opposite of “pass away.” Thus “lives aionios” by definition here means “lives eternally.”

[13]1 Peter 5:10
(10) And the God of all grace, who called you to his eternal [αιωνιον/aionion] glory in Christ, after you have suffered a little while, [ολιγον/oligon] will himself restore you and make you strong, firm and steadfast. ​

In this verse “aionios” is contrasted with “little while” Does Jesus give His followers a finite period of glory then they eventually die? Thus “aionios” here means “eternal.”

[14]Romans 2:7
(7) To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, [ἀφθαρσία/apftharsia] he will give eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life. ​

In this verse “aionios” is paired with “immortality.” If “aionios” is only a finite period, believers cannot seek for “a finite period,” and “immortality” at the same time. But they can seek for “eternal life” and “immortality” at the same time. Thus by definition “aionios life” here means “eternal life.”

[15]1 Timothy 1:17.
(17) Now unto the King eternal, [αἰών/aion] immortal, [ ̓́αφθαρτος/aphthartos] invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever [αἰών/aion] and ever [αἰώνιος/aionios]. Amen. ​

In this verse “aion” is paired with “immortal.” “Aion” cannot mean “age(s),” a finite period and be immortal at the same time. Thus “aion” by definition here means “eternal.”

[16]Revelation 14:11
(11) And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever:[ εις αιωνας αιωνων/eis aionas aionon] and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name. ​

In this verse “aionas aionon torment” is paired with “no rest day or night.” If “aionas, aionon” means “a finite period” at some time they would rest, “Aionas, aionon” by definition here means “forever and forever.”

[17]John 3:15
(15) That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal [αιωνιον] life.​

In this verse “aionion” is paired with “shall not perish.” Believers could perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal life.

[18]John 3:16
(16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting [αιωνιον] life. ​

In this verse “aionion” is paired with “should not perish.” Believers could eventually perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal or everlasting life.

[19]John 5:24
(24) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting [αἰώνιος] life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. ​

In this verse “aionios” is paired with “shall not come into condemnation” and “passed from life unto death.” “Aionios” does not mean “a finite period,” by definition here it means “eternal,” unless Jesus lets His followers come into condemnation and pass into death.

[20]Romans 5:21
(21) That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal [αἰώνιος] life by Jesus Christ our Lord. ​

In this verse “aionios life” is contrasted with death. “A finite period life” is not opposite death, “eternal life” is. “Aionios life” by definition here means ‘eternal life.”

[21]Ephesians 3:21
(21) to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, for ever [του αιωνος/tou aionios] and ever! [των αιωνων/ton aionion] Amen. ​

In this verse “tou aionios ton aionion” is paired with “throughout all generations.” "Age(s)" a finite period cannot refer to "all generations." By definition “tou aionios ton aionion” means forever and ever.

[22]John 8:51
(51) Very truly [αμην αμην/amen amen] I tell you, whoever obeys my word will never [ου μη εις τον αιωνα/ou mé eis ton aiona] see death." ​

According to noted Greek scholar Marvin Vincent "The double negative “ou mé” signifies in nowise, by no means." Unless Jesus is saying they will die, i.e. see death, unto the age. By definition aion means eternity.

I've already addressed this cut and paste in the past.

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. (Matt. 28:19-20 KJV)

32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come. (Matt. 12:32 KJV)

The words in red are aion. Jesus spoke of the end of the aion. He spoke of an aion to come. Eternity by definition does not end. You can't have an eternity after eternity. Since aion ends it cannot mean eternity. That's real simple and the words are from Jesus. The decision is your's as to whether you're going to believe Jesus or the logical fallacies that you've presented. Since I've already shown you this I already know the decision you made. The choice is clear to me. If Jesus said it, that ends it.

 

[Butch5]

I gave reasons in point form, you reject them, that does not mean I did not address them.

You've just made statements without evidence. Your interpretation isn't evidence.

What you want is for me to give you a definition so you can argue about the definition I give. Do you have no concept of spiritual? If so give it and I will work with your definition.

What I want is a definition so I know what you're talking about. The definition of Pneuma is wind or breath, that can be found in any lexicon. However, English word spirit is also used as a figurative definition of pneuma. However, since it's figurative it's a figure of speech. You're using it in combination with death. Wind death or breath death make no sense, so you're using a figure of speech. I'm just trying to get you define what it is you're talking about. What is the figure of speech?

So when we receive a spiritual body according to you that is just a figure of speech and we do not really get a spiritual body.

You didn't answer the question. " I've pointed out that the word spirit is a figurative use of the word pneuma. That should indicate that when you say the law is spiritual it's a figure of speech. So, what is the figurative meaning?"


Yes, the spiritual body is a figure of speech. Yes we get one.

I have not based it on just that, I have also pointed you to the second law of thermodynamics which you say you understand, but obviously do not. Thus not only does scripture back up what I am saying so to does science.

You on the other hand have given me nothing except you believe the death Adam brought in was a physical death and we are all to accept your understanding without any proof.

The second law of thermodynamics has no bearing on the subject as I said. Adam had access to the Tree of Life. With access to the Tree of Life he would not die. Whether the second law of thermodynamics was in place or not he wouldn't die.


I've giving you evidence. Adam was created of physical dust and God told him if he ate of the Tree of Knowledge he would return to dust. That's physical.

Did the dinosaur and man inhabit the earth at the same time? How long to you believe man has been on this planet?

You didn't give me evidence, you asked me questions. Yes, the dinosaur and man inhabited the earth at the same time. Man's been on the planet for about 6000 years. I've answered your questions, why won't you answer mine?

For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.

Did Paul die physically here?

Spiritual death is recorded throughout scripture.

Are those without Christ spiritually alive? if not what would you call them for they are not physically dead.

If ones spirit must be saved what is it saved from?

So lets go back to what Paul said.

Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

It was not just death that Adam brought into the world it was also sin and sin is mentioned first as the cause of death.

Now

The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

Now as sin is the cause of the death brought in how did Adam gain the knowledge (key word) that he had sinned?

Paul tells us that it is because of the law we gain the knowledge (key word again) of sin.

What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

And what does Paul say the commandment did?

For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.

Sin revived and he died.

Now Paul is obviously not speaking of a physical death here is he? so what does it mean mean when Paul said "I died" if he is not speaking of a physical death?

It's a metaphor. Paul used death often as a metaphor. Paul also said, 'I die daily'. Do you think he died spiritually every single day? It's a metaphor for his giving up his own desires to follow Christ. He also said that he was alive once and then the law came and he died. Do you think he was spiritually alive and then spiritually dead and then spiritually alive again? It's a metaphor. Did you notice that of all of the places where Paul used the word death he NEVER used the word spiritual with it. The problem is that people come to the Scriptures with dualistic presuppositions. The old man is not a living thing that can be put to death, it's a way of living that has to be stopped, thus to put it to death is a metaphor.

Also, again here you're conflating two different things. The Law that is spiritual is the Law of Moses. The Law the revealed sin is the Law of Moses. There is nothing in Genesis 1 or 2 about a law. You're trying to connect God's statement to Adam and the Mosaic Law, they're different.

 

[Der Alte]

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<B5>I've already addressed this cut and paste in the past.
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. (Matt. 28:19-20 KJV)
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come. (Matt. 12:32 KJV)
The words in red are aion. Jesus spoke of the end of the aion. He spoke of an aion to come. Eternity by definition does not end. You can't have an eternity after eternity. Since aion ends it cannot mean eternity. That's real simple and the words are from Jesus. The decision is your's as to whether you're going to believe Jesus or the logical fallacies that you've presented. Since I've already shown you this I already know the decision you made. The choice is clear to me. If Jesus said it, that ends it.<B5>

end

Trying to insult me by calling my own work "cut and paste." I looked up every occurrence of aion/aionios in the NT and I found 22 verses where aion/aionios are defined by other adjectives or adjectival phrases. Nothing you have posted proves anything about my post.
.....Here are five verses where Jesus, Himself, defines aion/aionios with other adjectives or adjectival phrases. Are you implying that Jesus did not know what He was talking about in these verses?

John 6:58
(58) This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your ancestors ate manna and died, but whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.[αἰώνιος/aionios]​

In this verse Jesus contrasts “aionios life” with “ate manna and died." If “live aionios” is only a finite period, a finite period is not opposite “death.” Thus “aionios” by definition here means “eternal.”

John 10:28
(28) I give them eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life, and they shall never [αἰών/aion] perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.​

In this verse Jesus pairs “aionios” and “aion” with “[not] snatch them out of my hand.” If “aion/aionios” means “age(s), a finite period,” that is not the opposite of “[not] snatch them out of my hand.’” Thus “aionios life” by definition here means “eternal life.”

John 3:15
(15) That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal [αιωνιον] life.​

In this verse Jesus pairs “aionion” with “shall not perish.” Believers could perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal life.

John 3:16
(16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting [αιωνιον] life.​

In this verse “aionion” is paired with “should not perish.” Believers could eventually perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal or everlasting life.

John 5:24
(24) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting [αἰώνιος] life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.​

In this verse Jesus pairs “aionios” with “shall not come into condemnation” and “passed from life unto death.” “Aionios” does not mean “a finite period,” by definition here it means “eternal,” unless Jesus lets His followers come into condemnation and pass into death.
.....Does "the whole world" or "all the world" always mean the entire planet earth?

Matthew 16:26
(26) For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, [κόσμος/kosmos] and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?
John 12:19
(19) The Pharisees therefore said among themselves, Perceive ye how ye prevail nothing? behold, the world [κόσμος/kosmos] is gone after him.
John 14:17
(17) Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world [κόσμος/kosmos] cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
Romans 1:8
(8) First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.[κόσμος/kosmos]
1 John 5:19
(19) And we know that we are of God, and the whole world [κόσμος/kosmos] lieth in wickedness.
Luke 2:1
(1) And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all the world [ οἰκουμένη/oikoumené] should be taxed​

Can a person literally gain the "whole world?"
Did the "whole world" literally go after Jesus?
Can “the world” literally not receive the Spirit of truth.
Was the faith of the Roman Christians literally spoken of throughout the "whole world?"
Did “the whole world” literally lie in wickedness.
Did Caesar literally tax “all the world”?

 

[FineLinen]

Dear qaz: all believers & all non believers are heading Home to our God who IS consuming fire! The word “physically” I fear falls a mite short!

First birth= physical

Second birth= spiritual

First death= physical

Second death= spiritual

There is a First Birth (physical) and a Second Birth (spiritual) - being BORN AGAIN!).

There is a First Death (physical) and a Second Death (spiritual) - which results in a “New creature in Christ.”

The “flesh” cannot be “converted;” it must be “destroyed,” disassembled, made new. The “Old man of Sin” must be buried. The carnal (fleshly) mind “is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are flesh can not please God.”

The “flesh” is “destroyed,” but the person is not. After all, Jesus said He came “to DESTROY the WORKS of the DEVIL.” (1 John 3:8)

We are the Works of Christ. He created us. We are NOT the works of the devil. Only the SIN in our lives is the work of the devil. It is the SIN ONLY that is permanently destroyed. Then we become “A NEW creature in Christ.”

Jesus said:

“Behold, I make ALL THINGS NEW!!”

Word for today= kainos

Kainos= Unprecedented

Questions

1. If the Scriptures should testify, that God "will have all men to be damned," could we safely infer that a part might be saved?
2. If the Scriptures testify, that God "will have all men to be saved," can we safely infer that a part may be damned?
3. If God made an endless hell before He created man, did He know there would be any use for it?
4. If God knew there would be use for an endless hell, must He not have created some men for endless misery?
5. If God made an endless hell, was it included in the works which He pronounced "very good?" -- (Gen. 1:31)
6. If there be an endless hell, and it was not made before the creation of men, when was it made?

 

[Butch5]

<B5>I've already addressed this cut and paste in the past.
19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. (Matt. 28:19-20 KJV)
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come. (Matt. 12:32 KJV)
The words in red are aion. Jesus spoke of the end of the aion. He spoke of an aion to come. Eternity by definition does not end. You can't have an eternity after eternity. Since aion ends it cannot mean eternity. That's real simple and the words are from Jesus. The decision is your's as to whether you're going to believe Jesus or the logical fallacies that you've presented. Since I've already shown you this I already know the decision you made. The choice is clear to me. If Jesus said it, that ends it.<B5>
Trying to insult me by calling my own work "cut and paste." I looked up every occurrence of aion/aionios in the NT and I found 22 verses where aion/aionios are defined by other adjectives or adjectival phrases. Nothing you have posted proves anything about my post.
.....Here are five verses where Jesus, Himself, defines aion/aionios with other adjectives or adjectival phrases. Are you implying that Jesus did not know what He was talking about in these verses?

John 6:58
(58) This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your ancestors ate manna and died, but whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.[αἰώνιος/aionios]​

In this verse Jesus contrasts “aionios life” with “ate manna and died." If “live aionios” is only a finite period, a finite period is not opposite “death.” Thus “aionios” by definition here means “eternal.”

John 10:28
(28) I give them eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life, and they shall never [αἰών/aion] perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.​

In this verse Jesus pairs “aionios” and “aion” with “[not] snatch them out of my hand.” If “aion/aionios” means “age(s), a finite period,” that is not the opposite of “[not] snatch them out of my hand.’” Thus “aionios life” by definition here means “eternal life.”

John 3:15
(15) That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal [αιωνιον] life.​

In this verse Jesus pairs “aionion” with “shall not perish.” Believers could perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal life.

John 3:16
(16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting [αιωνιον] life.​

In this verse “aionion” is paired with “should not perish.” Believers could eventually perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal or everlasting life.

John 5:24
(24) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting [αἰώνιος] life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.​

In this verse Jesus pairs “aionios” with “shall not come into condemnation” and “passed from life unto death.” “Aionios” does not mean “a finite period,” by definition here it means “eternal,” unless Jesus lets His followers come into condemnation and pass into death.
.....Does "the whole world" or "all the world" always mean the entire planet earth?

Matthew 16:26
(26) For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, [κόσμος/kosmos] and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?
John 12:19
(19) The Pharisees therefore said among themselves, Perceive ye how ye prevail nothing? behold, the world [κόσμος/kosmos] is gone after him.
John 14:17
(17) Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world [κόσμος/kosmos] cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
Romans 1:8
(8) First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.[κόσμος/kosmos]
1 John 5:19
(19) And we know that we are of God, and the whole world [κόσμος/kosmos] lieth in wickedness.
Luke 2:1
(1) And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all the world [ οἰκουμένη/oikoumené] should be taxed​

Can a person literally gain the "whole world?"
Did the "whole world" literally go after Jesus?
Can “the world” literally not receive the Spirit of truth.
Was the faith of the Roman Christians literally spoken of throughout the "whole world?"
Did “the whole world” literally lie in wickedness.
Did Caesar literally tax “all the world”?

Like I said, you simply reject the evidence you disagree with. You didn't address what I posted. You just posted more passages in an attempt to prove your point. Jesus spoke of the end of the aion. Eternity doesn't end. The aion does. It's really simple.

 

[FineLinen]

Again, I don't believe in eternal punishment. Destruction means to put an end to. As paper burns in a fire, show shall all be destroyed in the Lake of Fire and be no more.

Dear Ronald:

The way for all is through the fires, for fire is the great uniter and reconciler of all things; and things which without fire can never be united, in and through the fire are changed and become one.

Therefore every coming of Christ, even in grace, is a day of judgment. Therefore there are fires even for the elect both now, (1 Pet. 1:7, and 4: 12) and in the coming day; (1 Cor. 3:. 13, 15.) for “our God is a consuming fire;” (Heb. 12: 29.) and to dwell in Him we must have a life, which, because it is of the fire, for fire burns not fire, can stand unhurt in it.

Therefore our Lord “came to cast fire into the earth,” and desired nothing more than “that it should be already kindled;” (S. Luke 12: 49) therefore He says,

Mark 9: 49-

For this is the very “baptism of the Holy Ghost and fire,” (Matt. 3: 11) that “spirit of judgment and burning,” promised by the prophet, "with which the Lord shall purge away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and cleanse the blood of Jerusalem; after which He will create on every dwelling place of Mount Zion, and on all her assemblies, a cloud of smoke by day, and the brightness of flame of fire by night; and upon all, the glory shall be a defence; (Isa. 4: 4, 5) for “He is like a refiner’s fire, and like a fuller’s soap; and He shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver, and He shall purify the sons of Levi as gold and silver are purged, that they may offer to the Lord an offering of righteousness.” (Mal. 3: 3). And as by the hidden fire of this present life, shut up in these bodies of corruption, we are able by the wondrous chemistry of nature through corruption to change the fruits and flesh of the earth into our blood, and from blood again into our flesh and bone and sinew; so by the fire of God can we be changed, and made partakers of Christ’s flesh and blood. In and through Christ we have received this transmutation; (Rom. 5: 11) and through His Spirit, which is fire, is this same change accomplished in us.

NOTE:

Numbers 28: 6. By this double sense a veil covers the letter, veiling yet revealing God’s purpose; for His purpose to the creature is through destruction to perfect it, and by fire to make it a bride unto the Lord. For a kindred reason some of the angels are called Seraphim, that is burning ones; for like the Lord, whose throne is flames of fire, (Dan. 7: 9,10.) they also are as fire; as it is written, “He makes His angels spirits, His messengers a flame of fire.” (Heb. 1: 7, and Psalm 104:4)

And as with the first-fruits, so with the harvest. The world to be saved must some day know the same baptism. For “the Lord will come with fire,” and “by fire and by His sword will He plead with all flesh, and the slain of the Lord shall be many.” (Isa. 66: 15, 16.) The promised baptism or outpouring of the Spirit must be judgment, for the Spirit cannot be poured on man without consuming this flesh to quicken a better life;

NOTE:

James 1: 20) works both righteousness and life, and is set forth in that “warfare of the service of the tabernacle” (See Numbers 4: 23, 30, and 8: 24, 25; margin: and compare 1 Tim. 1: eighteen) by which that which was of the earth was made to ascend to God through fire a sweet sacrifice.

HERE

 

[Der Alte]

Like I said, you simply reject the evidence you disagree with. You didn't address what I posted. You just posted more passages in an attempt to prove your point. Jesus spoke of the end of the aion. Eternity doesn't end. the aion does. It's really simple.

Like I said wrong again. It is you who simply reject anything you disagree with and you have not addressed the 22 verses I posted, which you quoted. And the verses you posted prove absolutely nothing about the verses I posted. I did not post more verses I posted 5 verses from the 22 I posted before and which you did not even read either time.
....And you ignored where I quoted verses in which even Jesus used a different word, kosmos/world, figuratively.

 

[Butch5]

Like I said wrong again. It is you who simply reject anything you disagree with and you have not addressed the 22 verses I posted, which you quoted. And the verses you posted prove absolutely nothing about the verses I posted. I did not post more verses I posted 5 verses from the 22 I posted before and which you did not even read either time.
....And you ignored where I quoted verses in which even Jesus used a different word, kosmos/world, figuratively.

I've addressed them several times in the past. Your reasoning is flawed However, as I've shown your assumption is wrong because Jesus spoke of the end of the aion, thus it cannot be eternal. People use speech figuratively sometimes. If someone said, God is eternal, therefore He's going to be around for a while, would you then argue that a while now means eternity? Would you argue that since it's connected with God and He's eternal that a while now means eternity?

As I said, I've addressed you passages. Your reasoning is flawed as I've shown above. However, I'll use one of your passages to show that it's flawed. You posted Luke 1:33 as part of you 22 passages that are supposed to prove that aion means eternal. However, this passage shows that it doesn't.

And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end. (Lk. 1:33 KJV)

Here's your argument.

[3]Luke 1:33
(33) And he shall reign [βασιλευσει][Vb] over the house of Jacob for ever; [αιωνας/aionas] and of his kingdom [βασιλειας][Nn] there shall be no end.[τελος/τελος]
In this verse the reign βασιλευσει/basileusei, which is the verb form of the word, is "aionas" and of the kingdom βασιλειας/basileias, the noun form of the same word, "there shall be no end.” “Aionas” by definition here means eternal.

You claim that because aion is paired with 'shall be no end' it must mean eternal. However, this is a misunderstanding of the passage. The translation of aion in this passage cannot mean eternal because Christ doesn't reign for eternity. He reigns a thousand years and then turns the kingdom over to the Father. So, what we see is that Christ's reign is for an age, but the kingdom which is turned over to the Father has no end.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
(1 Cor. 15:24-25 KJV)

So, you see, aion is mistranslated in that passage and doesn't mean eternity.

 

[Der Alte]

begin

<B5>I've addressed them several times in the past. Your reasoning is flawed However, as I've shown your assumption is wrong because Jesus spoke of the end of the aion, thus it cannot be eternal. People use speech figuratively sometimes. If someone said, God is eternal, therefore He's going to be around for a while, would you then argue that a while now means eternity? Would you argue that since it's connected with God and He's eternal that a while now means eternity?
As I said, I've addressed you passages. Your reasoning is flawed as I've shown above. However, I'll use one of your passages to show that it's flawed. You posted Luke 1:33 as part of you 22 passages that are supposed to prove that aion means eternal. However, this passage shows that it doesn't.
And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end. (Lk. 1:33 KJV)
Here's your argument.

[3]Luke 1:33
(33) And he shall reign [βασιλευσει][Vb] over the house of Jacob for ever; [αιωνας/aionas] and of his kingdom [βασιλειας][Nn] there shall be no end.[τελος/τελος]
In this verse the reign βασιλευσει/basileusei, which is the verb form of the word, is "aionas" and of the kingdom βασιλειας/basileias, the noun form of the same word, "there shall be no end.” “Aionas” by definition here means eternal.​

You claim that because aion is paired with 'shall be no end' it must mean eternal. However, this is a misunderstanding of the passage. The translation of aion in this passage cannot mean eternal because Christ doesn't reign for eternity. He reigns a thousand years and then turns the kingdom over to the Father. So, what we see is that Christ's reign is for an age, but the kingdom which is turned over to the Father has no end.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
(1 Cor. 15:24-25 KJV)
So, you see, aion is mistranslated in that passage and doesn't mean eternity.<B5>

end

Actually your reasoning is flawed. Because like all heterodox adherents you know virtually nothing about Greek and all you have is a handful of out-of-context proof texts which you evidently think supersedes every other verse in the Bible.
How can aionas be mistranslated in Luk 1:33 when it reads, "of his kingdom there shall be no end." If the vs. read “of the kingdom there shall be no end,” you might have an argument, but it does not say that.
…..Now let us look at your out-of-context proof text.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
(1 Cor. 15:24-25 KJV)​

First I do not see the word ‘end” or anything like it in these vss. Does the reign of Jesus end at some time?

Revelation 22:3-5
(3) No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him.
(4) They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads.
(5) There will be no more night. They will not need the light of a lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light. And they will reign for ever and ever.​

Who is “they” who will reign for ever and ever, vs. 5? Who is on the throne, vs. 4? “God and the lamb” is the they who will reign for ever and ever. Just as the angel said in Luk 1:33 "of the kingdom of the Son of the most high,” vs. 32, “there shall be no end.” Therefore aion in Luk 1:33 means “eternity” not a finite age.

 

[Butch5]

<B5>I've addressed them several times in the past. Your reasoning is flawed However, as I've shown your assumption is wrong because Jesus spoke of the end of the aion, thus it cannot be eternal. People use speech figuratively sometimes. If someone said, God is eternal, therefore He's going to be around for a while, would you then argue that a while now means eternity? Would you argue that since it's connected with God and He's eternal that a while now means eternity?
As I said, I've addressed you passages. Your reasoning is flawed as I've shown above. However, I'll use one of your passages to show that it's flawed. You posted Luke 1:33 as part of you 22 passages that are supposed to prove that aion means eternal. However, this passage shows that it doesn't.
And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end. (Lk. 1:33 KJV)
Here's your argument.

[3]Luke 1:33
(33) And he shall reign [βασιλευσει][Vb] over the house of Jacob for ever; [αιωνας/aionas] and of his kingdom [βασιλειας][Nn] there shall be no end.[τελος/τελος]
In this verse the reign βασιλευσει/basileusei, which is the verb form of the word, is "aionas" and of the kingdom βασιλειας/basileias, the noun form of the same word, "there shall be no end.” “Aionas” by definition here means eternal.​

You claim that because aion is paired with 'shall be no end' it must mean eternal. However, this is a misunderstanding of the passage. The translation of aion in this passage cannot mean eternal because Christ doesn't reign for eternity. He reigns a thousand years and then turns the kingdom over to the Father. So, what we see is that Christ's reign is for an age, but the kingdom which is turned over to the Father has no end.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
(1 Cor. 15:24-25 KJV)
So, you see, aion is mistranslated in that passage and doesn't mean eternity.<B5>
Actually your reasoning is flawed. Because like all heterodox adherents you know virtually nothing about Greek and all you have is a handful of out-of-context proof texts which you evidently think supersedes every other verse in the Bible.
How can aionas be mistranslated in Luk 1:33 when it reads, "of his kingdom there shall be no end." If the vs. read “of the kingdom there shall be no end,” you might have an argument, but it does not say that.
…..Now let us look at your out-of-context proof text.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
(1 Cor. 15:24-25 KJV)​

First I do not see the word ‘end” or anything like it in these vss. Does the reign of Jesus end at some time?

Revelation 22:3-5
(3) No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him.
(4) They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads.
(5) There will be no more night. They will not need the light of a lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light. And they will reign for ever and ever.​

Who is “they” who will reign for ever and ever, vs. 5? Who is on the throne, vs. 4? “God and the lamb” is the they who will reign for ever and ever. Just as the angel said in Luk 1:33 "of the kingdom of the Son of the most high,” vs. 32, “there shall be no end.” Therefore aion in Luk 1:33 means “eternity” not a finite age.

And again, you just disregard the evidence. Paul stated that Christ turns the kingdom over to God the Father, thus He doesn't reign forever. That's crystal clear. Your misunderstanding of additional passages doesn't disprove my argument. I presented your own claim and proved it wrong.

Also, it's the fallacy of Begging the question or Circular reasoning to use the word in dispute, aion, in your argument to prove that aion means eternal.

 

[FineLinen]

Questions

1. If endless punishment be the "wages of sin," could the sinner ever receive payment in full? (Rom. 6:23)
2. As man is a finite being, can he commit an infinite sin?
3. If man cannot commit an infinite sin, can he deserve endless punishment?
4. If one sin be infinite, can a million be any more?
5. If ONE sin be NOT infinite, can a million of sins amount to an infinite sin?
6. If sin be infinite, can one sin be greater than the other?
7. If sin be infinite, can it be true that, "where sin abounded grace did MUCH MORE abound?" --(Rom. 5:20)
8. If sin be infinite, can it ever be finished or brought to an end?
9. If ONE sin deserves an eternity of punishment, how much punishment will TEN sins deserve?

 

[Der Alte]

And again, you just disregard the evidence. Paul stated that Christ turns the kingdom over to God the Father, thus He doesn't reign forever. That's crystal clear. Your misunderstanding of additional passages doesn't disprove my argument. I presented your own claim and proved it wrong.
Also, it's the fallacy of Begging the question or Circular reasoning to use the word in dispute, aion, in your argument to prove that aion means eternal.

Unlike you I am not beating the air.

1 Corinthians 9:26 Therefore I do not run like someone running aimlessly; I do not fight like a boxer beating the air.​

I note that you did not address the scripture I quoted, I doubt if you even read it. You quite evidently do not know what you are talking about. I did not use a logical fallacy. I did not use "aion" to prove that "aion" means eternity and I did not use "aionios" to prove that "aionios" means eternal. I quoted 22 verses where aion/aionios is contrasted with or paired with other adjectives/adjectival phrases which show they mean eternity/eternal.
.....Here is a real world example of what I am talking about. I learned to speak German when I was 12. Several years later I was stationed in Germany. I was having a conversation with someone who did not speak English. She used a word I did not recognize, beinahe, pronounced by-nah-eh. So she tried to explain it "It is not yet 12 o'clcock but it is beinahe 12 o'clock." So I understood beinahe means "almost."
.....You have not and cannot provide one verse where aion/aionios is paired or contrasted with other adjectives/adjectival phrases which show that either one means a finite period.
Now let us look at your out-of-context proof text, again.

24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
(1 Cor. 15:24-25 KJV)​

First I do not see the word ‘end” or anything like it in associated with "reign." Does the reign of Jesus end at some time?

Revelation 22:3-5
(3) No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him.
(4) They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads.
(5) There will be no more night. They will not need the light of a lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light. And they will reign for ever and ever.​

Who is “they” who will reign for ever and ever, vs. 5? Who is on the throne, vs. 4? “God and the lamb” is the they who will reign for ever and ever. Just as the angel said in Luk 1:33 "of the kingdom of the Son of the most high,” vs. 32, “there shall be no end.” Therefore aion in Luk 1:33 means “eternity” not a finite age.
One last point look at the pronoun in your proof text 1 Cor. 15:24-2 and the pronoun in Rev 22:3-5. You do know what a pronoun is don't you?

 

[Der Alte]

begin

<FL>Questions
If endless punishment be the "wages of sin," could the sinner ever receive payment in full? (Rom. 6:23)
As man is a finite being, can he commit an infinite sin?
If man cannot commit an infinite sin, can he deserve endless punishment?
If one sin be infinite, can a million be any more?
If ONE sin be NOT infinite, can a million of sins amount to an infinite sin?
If sin be infinite, can one sin be greater than the other?
If sin be infinite, can it be true that, "where sin abounded grace did MUCH MORE abound?" --(Rom. 5:20)
If sin be infinite, can it ever be finished or brought to an end?
If ONE sin deserves an eternity of punishment, how much punishment will TEN sins deserve?<FL>

end

"If endless punishment be the "wages of sin," could the sinner ever receive payment in full? (Rom. 6:23)"
.....God, not imperfect, fallible man decides what punishment is appropriate.
"As man is a finite being, can he commit an infinite sin?"
.....Where did God tell us to determione what is appropriate punishment for sinful man?
"If man cannot commit an infinite sin, can he deserve endless punishment?"
.....God who is perfect and infallible not sinful, imperfect man decides what is appropriate punishment.
"If one sin be infinite, can a million be any more?"
.....I remember Jesus telling a parable about workers being paid the same whether they worked only one hour or all day long.
"If ONE sin be NOT infinite, can a million of sins amount to an infinite sin?"
.....James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
"If sin be infinite, can one sin be greater than the other?"
.....James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
"If sin be infinite, can it be true that, "where sin abounded grace did MUCH MORE abound?" --(Rom. 5:20)"
.....Who decides if a sin is infinite? God or man?
"If sin be infinite, can it ever be finished or brought to an end?"
.....God imposes the punishment, God decides if and when it is brought to an end.
"If ONE sin deserves an eternity of punishment, how much punishment will TEN sins deserve."
.....That is for God to decide not man. James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
.....You seem to spend an inordinate amount of time concerning yourself about things that are in God's domain, not man's.