Put your crash helmet on the chauvin verdict is almost in....and it's guilty.

[atpollard]

... to be overturned on appeal.

 

[Pommer]

... to be overturned on appeal.

On what grounds?

 

[KarateCowboy]

Not according to the MMA fighter who testified for the prosecution during the Chauvin trial.

UFC, Jon James also spoke about that hold.
MMA Fighter Testifies Derek Chauvin Used 'Blood Choke' On George Floyd

Seen it. Guy is lying, flat out. You can tell for several reasons. 1) "Kill choke" -- not a thing. In the submission martial arts it doesn't exist. It's just not a thing. "Kill choke" is Hollywood style dramatizing. We don't distinguish between chokes and "kill chokes". 2) Knee on the shoulder and trapz is not a choke. It's a temporary pin while you transition. 3) "Shimmy hold". Again, not a thing. In 31 years of training I've never heard of it. Granted, that doesn't mean it's not out there -- some styles, and even schools within the same style, sometimes use different terminology to refer to the same thing. However, I searched shimmy hold, shimmy hold wrestling, shimmy jujitsu, shimmy mma, etc. The only thing I found relating to shimmies and chokes was articles about him using the term.

Yeah I see his racial tirade. It's a disgrace to the sport. The bodycam footage also shows he was shooting off his mouth without the whole picture. Literally. But then, racial hatred leads to that type of prejudice. You're talking about a guy who threw a tantrum and threatened to quit because they wouldn't pay him $30_000_000 for one fight. More recently he's askng $50_000_000 for a fight. Guy thinks he's God's gift to the world.

"Anyone who has practiced the very basics of jujitsu recognizes a bloodchoke when they see this. "

What a joke. Anyone who knows the basics of jujitsu knows you need to get both arteries on each side of the neck to get a decent choke. Not your knee mostly on his shoulder and a little on his trapz.

But anyway, the science is against him New Study: More Evidence Against the Myth of “Restraint Asphyxia” | Force Science Institute

Also, I've been in that position. It sucks, but it's not going to put a sustained choke on you, much less kill you.

 

[KarateCowboy]

... to be overturned on appeal.

In prior scientific studies, weights of up to 225 lbs. have been placed on a prone subject’s back without causing any clinically significant respiratory impairment, Kroll points out. For fatal consequences to be likely “would take two or more LEOs, weighing 287 lbs., each standing on the back of a prone subject,” he writes.

New Study: More Evidence Against the Myth of “Restraint Asphyxia” | Force Science Institute

Hatred didn't take Floyd's life, but it sure seems intent on ruining Chauvin's life

 

[atpollard]

On what grounds?

You cannot be serious.
Irrespective of what you think about the verdict or his guilt, the irregularities in this trial GUARANTEE grounds for appeal.

• Judge refused request for change of venue opening the door to the possibility that the jury was not impartial.
• The Prosecution repeatedly dumped new evidence on the defense at the 11th hour contrary to the rules of discovery (which even the Judge warned had created grounds for an appeal and twice threatened to declare a mistrial over).
• Maxine Waters arrived just prior to the jury being sequestered to advocate violence and death threats against the jurists if a guilty verdict was not returned (which the Judge again condemned as unhealthy for the Judicial process).
• On the facts of the case itself, the victim allegedly died because he “could not breathe”, however the last witness called by the prosecution with evidence “suddenly discovered” indicated an O2 level of 90% in mr Floyd at the time of death ... which is proof that he WAS breathing and getting oxygen into his system when his heart failed from a lethal drug overdose. (However the defense expert was already on a plane when the Prosecution found this O2 data that everyone had been requesting from the beginning and might have proven the officer innocent of Floyd’s death)

An appeal is a certainty.
A retrial or overturning the verdict is a significant possibility.
The officer was an insensitive jerk, but the drugs killed Mr Floyd.

 

[Aldebaran]

On what grounds?

So many possibilities:
Comments made by people like Joe Biden who said he was praying for a conviction, or Maxine Waters telling people to become more confrontational if there wasn't a guilty verdict, or the Minneapolis settlement with the Loyd family of 27 million dollars just before the trial started, or the BLM "protesters" who were getting ready to do violence as the jury deliberated, the knowledge the jurors had about past riots after trials didn't go according to the wishes of the mob, and even the fact that Jurors' names and addresses may become known after this trial is over.
Any or all of these things could be shown to have influenced the jury's decision, and should have resulted in a mistrial.

 

[SummerMadness]

Derek Chauvin is a murderer, he was found guilty by a jury of his peers. All the armchair experts should have joined his defense team if they felt they had a slam-dunk defense.

 

[Sketcher]

Notice that none of them can acknowledge the verdict of the trial. It's all deflection to BLM, Portland, or something other than acknowledging that Derek Chauvin murdered George Floyd.

Who are you referring to as "them?"

 

[KarateCowboy]

Skepticism of this sort can be met with experimentation - get a friend to kneel on you the same way, on pavement. My guess is he'll probably stop when you really want him to stop, and that he will stop well short of nine minutes since if he's doing it right, it will not be comfortable.

Done that. Though on the mat, not pavement. Def. not comfortable. Sore the next day. Couldn't get a choke from it, though. This was at the MMA academy.

 

[Whyayeman]

I don't believe I edited anything on this thread. But you do agree with Maxine Waters right? That there needs to be confrontation if justice is not met?

I believe that if justice cannot be met any other way then confrontation is not only justified, it becomes the only recourse. Most Americans believe that too. It was the just cause of the American Revolution - to put right the injustices of British colonial rule.

'No taxation without representation!'

Remember?

 

[Nithavela]

I believe that if justice cannot be met any other way then confrontation is not only justified, it becomes the only recourse. Most Americans believe that too. It was the just cause of the American Revolution - to put right the injustices of British colonial rule.

'No taxation without representation!'

Remember?

It was a bit more complicated than that.

 

[Yttrium]

Done that. Though on the mat, not pavement. Def. not comfortable. Sore the next day. Couldn't get a choke from it, though. This was at the MMA academy.

One thing to keep in mind is that martial artists are generally in great physical condition. Floyd was a slob with multiple problems that reduced the flow of oxygen to his heart. Being a big guy didn't help in this case, since it just gave his heart more work. There were definitely contributing factors to his death from his own lifestyle. So imagine you've got maybe half the normal oxygen intake, a weak musculature, and you're mashed into concrete instead of a mat, how's that going to work out for you?

 

[essentialsaltes]

Anyone with eyes in their head could see that what happened in the video was wrong.

Now, this wrongness has been addressed with justice.

It's astonishing to see some of the gross reactions here. It's a good thing frankspeech doesn't work, or I might go there to find better company.

 

[KarateCowboy]

Gone from kneeling on his neck to kneeling on his shoulder.

Yah. I thought it was mainly the neck. Then the body cam footage was released

 

[KarateCowboy]

Anyone with eyes in their head could see that what happened in the video was wrong.

Now, this wrongness has been addressed with justice.

It's astonishing to see some of the gross reactions here. It's a good thing frankspeech doesn't work, or I might go there to find better company.

I saw what happened, in the video, with my eyes.

I experienced it, myself, when we tried it at the gym.

A miscarriage of justice has been done. You don't need to be an expert to know you can't kill a man by kneeling on his shoulder.

 

[SummerMadness]

I saw what happened, in the video, with my eyes.

I experienced it, myself, when we tried it at the gym.

A miscarriage of justice has been done. You don't need to be an expert to know you can't kill a man by kneeling on his shoulder. It's racist hatred says his conviction is justice

If you did this at the gym, you did not experience the same thing. You lack any authority on the subject. The prosecution laid out and proved their case, that is why Chauvin was convicted.

 

[essentialsaltes]

. You don't need to be an expert to know you can't kill a man by kneeling on his shoulder.

I don't think even the defense experts asserted that's what happened.

 

[KarateCowboy]

If you did this at the gym, you did not experience the same thing.

You lack the expertise to make that call. I'll use my 31 years of relevant experience to say I did.

The prosecutions case falls apart under empirical testing. An innocent man was convicted because of ignorance and conjecture

 

[KarateCowboy]

I don't think even the defense experts asserted that's what happened.

The defense cross examined the chief of the department and they noted he was mainly kneeling on his shoulder.

Maybe they should have pushed the point harder? I don't know

 

[essentialsaltes]

The defense cross examined the chief of the department and they noted he was mainly kneeling on his shoulder.

#1 That's not a medical expert.
#2 Not really.

Nelson then highlighted that while it appeared Chauvin had his knee on Floyd’s neck in the video recorded by Frazier, the knee appeared to be on Floyd’s shoulder blade during the same period in the bodycam footage, asking Arradondo: “Would you agree that from the perspective of Officer Kueng’s body camera it appeared Officer Chauvin’s knee was more on Mr. Floyd’s shoulder blade?”

“Yes,” Arradondo responded, though the prosecution, which took the stand immediately after, was quick to highlight that this was one specific moment “at a time when the ambulance had already arrived [and] very shortly before they loaded Mr. Floyd onto the gurney.”

Arradondo then further stamped down the defense’s point, saying that he had not seen Chauvin’s knee anywhere but on Floyd’s neck during his review of all the footage made available to him.