Prosperity question.

[RaymondG]

Do you think that they make Elohim sound like a slot machine when they preach

I hear those terms a lot (on forums, not in life): slot machine, genies, vending machine, Santa clause etc.. I find that these are term used by the world to try and stop us from asking Other heavenly father for things and receiving from Him.

I would be disappointed if one were to go to my children and tell them what they can and cannot ask me for.....what I will and wont give them......or give them a list of things they can and cannot ask for.

What if God feels the same for His children.

Ask therefore and receive, that your joy may be full...

I believe there is a progression.......now you may ask for things......later you will realize that you already have everything and need not ask, anymore for anything....

Then one will realize they only must enter into His gates with thanksgiving and into his courts with Praise.....

 

[messianist]

I hear those terms a lot (on forums, not in life): slot machine, genies, vending machine, Santa clause etc.. I find that these are term used by the world to try and stop us from asking Other heavenly father for things and receiving from Him.

I would be disappointed if one were to go to my children and tell them what they can and cannot ask me for.....what I will and wont give them......or give them a list of things they can and cannot ask for.

What if God feels the same for His children.

Ask therefore and receive, that your joy may be full...

I believe there is a progression.......now you may ask for things......later you will realize that you already have everything and need not ask, anymore for anything....

Then one will realize they only must enter into His gates with thanksgiving and into his courts with Praise.....

But they don't tell people to ask for things they tell them to keep giving them money so that they can get more money.

 

[RaymondG]

If they preached that Jesus said not to store wealth on earth this would wreck their theology.

Only if you link storing wealth on earth with storing money in the bank...... If our analogy turn out to be incorrect, we might be the ones, at the gate., saying "didnt I sell this and give up that?" Only to hear "i never knew you"

It is a very dangerous thing to link money with heaven.......and if the amount of money you possess has no bearing on our entrance.....why is this, so often a topic of conversation?

 

[messianist]

God said to Solomon, “Since this is your heart’s desire and you have not asked for wealth, possessions or honor, nor for the death of your enemies,

 

[W2L]

But they don't tell people to ask for things they tell them to keep giving them money so that they can get more money.

Exactly. The only ones getting rich are the preachers.

 

[W2L]

Only if you link storing wealth on earth with storing money in the bank...... If our analogy turn out to be incorrect, we might be the ones who, at the gate gate, saying "didnt I sell this and give up that?" Only to hear "i never knew you"

It is a very dangerous thing to link money with heaven.......and if the amount of money you possess has no bearing on our entrance.....why is this, so often a topic of conversation?

Oh, i suppose you are going to redefine what the Lord meant when he said not to store money on earth? This inst about storing money in the bank? Bro, you sound like a lawyer trying to define the law to suit him.

 

[RaymondG]

But they don't tell people to ask for things they tell them to keep giving them money so that they can get more money.

I've found it to be true, that the more you give.....the more you will have to give...... although they may say :"the more you give the more you receive"..... semantics. I find it to be a law unbroken.....

The only slight issue I see is, like you pointed out, they dont teach how to Ask God for things (Pray)..... And it doesnt really matter where or who you give to......Also the desire to give is more important than what you actually give....

I can see the prompt to give only to the preachers establishment to be self-serving......but these matters will be taken care of by God, so I need not worry myself about them.....

 

[RaymondG]

Oh, i suppose you are going to redefine what the Lord meant when he said not to store money on earth? This inst about storing money in the bank? Bro, you sound like a lawyer trying to define the law to suit him.

I use to let my mind tell me the meaning of scripture.....I've discovered that the carnal mind cannot do so. So I ask God now for wisdom.....Knowing that he will give freely, that which I am able to bear. Yet beforehand, I was told I had to give up everything I had and store my riches no more.........

I find no fault in anything you believe.

 

[W2L]

I use to let my mind tell me the meaning of scripture.....I've discovered that the carnal mind cannot do so. So I ask God now for wisdom.....Knowing that he will give freely, that which I am able to bear. Yet beforehand, I was told I had to give up everything I had and store my riches no more.........

I find no fault in anything you believe.

Im blind and cant see the truth you see? I lack wisdom too? And have a carnal mind? Its better to give than receive. Is that saying about wealth too or am i just thinking carnally?

 

[Archivist]

Don't listen to the prosperity preachers. They are looking out for their own prosperity.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Usually, they tell that to everyone who will listen to them, and then all those people send money to them and they become rich, and those people can't understand why they are not getting rich, when they ask questions they get told its because they aren't doing this that and the other and that they must keep giving.

Actually, we are not to even have lunch with those who are extortioners!

It is not a sin to be rich. It is a sin to be selfish.

However, 3 John 1:2 says, "2 Beloved, I pray that you may prosper in all things and be in health, just as your soul prospers." So there is precedent but you must take all scripture into account for the truth and balance.

Matthew 6:
25 “Therefore I say to you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or what you will drink; nor about your body, what you will put on. Is not life more than food and the body more than clothing? 26 Look at the birds of the air, for they neither sow nor reap nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not of more value than they? 27 Which of you by worrying can add one cubit to his stature?

28 “So why do you worry about clothing? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow: they neither toil nor spin; 29 and yet I say to you that even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 30 Now if God so clothes the grass of the field, which today is, and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will He not much more clothe you, O you of little faith?

But then He goes on to say,

31 “Therefore do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ 32 For after all these things the Gentiles seek. For your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. 33 But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you. 34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble.

James 4:2b-3 "Yet you do not have because you do not ask. 3 You ask and do not receive, because you ask amiss, that you may spend it on your pleasures."

 

[GingerBeer]

Prosperity preachers say God wants us to be rich, having an abundance of wealth. However Jesus said not to store money on earth but in heaven. How do prosperity proponents explain this? How can i have wealth if im not storing it on earth? If i build a luxurious mansion, am i following Jesus command that says not to store wealth on earth?

Prosperity preachers are charlatans who are out to make themselves prosper.

 

[W2L]

Forgive my bluntness but im not always very articulate. To think God wants me to have a luxurious mansion while people actually die in this world not having food, clothing and shelter. Thats carnally minded. In my opinion,

 

[messianist]

Actually, we are not to even have lunch with those who are extortioners!

It is not a sin to be rich. It is a sin to be selfish.

However, 3 John 1:2 says, "2 Beloved, I pray that you may prosper in all things and be in health, just as your soul prospers." So there is precedent but you must take all scripture into account for the truth and balance.

Matthew 6:
25 “Therefore I say to you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or what you will drink; nor about your body, what you will put on. Is not life more than food and the body more than clothing? 26 Look at the birds of the air, for they neither sow nor reap nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not of more value than they? 27 Which of you by worrying can add one cubit to his stature?

28 “So why do you worry about clothing? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow: they neither toil nor spin; 29 and yet I say to you that even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 30 Now if God so clothes the grass of the field, which today is, and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will He not much more clothe you, O you of little faith?

But then He goes on to say,

31 “Therefore do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ 32 For after all these things the Gentiles seek. For your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. 33 But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you. 34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble.



James 4:2b-3 "Yet you do not have because you do not ask. 3 You ask and do not receive, because you ask amiss, that you may spend it on your pleasures."

Im not sure where i implied it was a sin to be rich?
god said to Solomon, “Since this is your heart’s desire and you have not asked for wealth, possessions or honor, nor for the death of your enemies,

 

[W2L]

I've found it to be true, that the more you give.....the more you will have to give...... although they may say :"the more you give the more you receive"..... semantics. I find it to be a law unbroken.....

The only slight issue I see is, like you pointed out, they dont teach how to Ask God for things (Pray)..... And it doesnt really matter where or who you give to......Also the desire to give is more important than what you actually give....

I can see the prompt to give only to the preachers establishment to be self-serving......but these matters will be taken care of by God, so I need not worry myself about them.....

If prosperity preaching were truth, then the church could easily wipe out poverty by giving. This however hasnt happened. All i see is wealthy preachers getting rich selling prosperity doctrine and using that money to buy mansions while some poor are neglected. Im not judging, just observing and discussing the issue.

 

[W2L]

Don't listen to the prosperity preachers. There are looking out for their own prosperity.

I must agree. They dont get rich by giving but instead by selling books and DVD's

 

[W2L]

Prosperity preachers are charlatans who are out to make themselves prosper.

I agree. They might be deceived i think.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Im not sure where i implied it was a sin to be rich?
god said to Solomon, “Since this is your heart’s desire and you have not asked for wealth, possessions or honor, nor for the death of your enemies,

I merely made a statement, nothing against you, but what I believe.

 

[RaymondG]

Im blind and cant see the truth you see? I lack wisdom too? And have a carnal mind?

am i just thinking carnally?

You are a in good favor.....for it is better to discover these things before the grave, as there is no repentance after it......where most discover the err in their ways.

Note I cannot judge the heart, nor wish to......I can only believe what you say is true of yourself...

Its better to give than receive.

I agree.....and the more you give, the more you will have to give...... so it you desire to have little or nothing....you must stop giving......

 

[messianist]

I merely made a statement, nothing against you, but what I believe.

no problem thanks for addressing the question.