Prophetic promises to Israel

[BABerean2]

Matthew 3:9; John the Baptist is saying this and he didn't know what the NC church was for the mystery of the NC church was not given till years after the Day of Pentecost.

How can the New Covenant Church be a "mystery" if it was foretold in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and is found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:18-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8?

Paul says in the text below that it was revealed to Hosea that the Gentiles would be grafted in among the children of God.


Rom 9:24　 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?　
Rom 9:25　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.　
Rom 9:26　 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.　
Rom 9:27　 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:　

Your attempts to keep Israel and the Church separated fall apart on the Day of Pentecost when Peter addressed the crowd as "men of Judea", then as "men of Israel", and in Acts 2:36 as "all the house of Israel".

Peter made it clear that he was talking to Israelites.

Paul reveals below who is now the Israel of God.


Gal 6:14 But it's unthinkable that I could ever brag about anything except the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ. By his cross my relationship to the world and its relationship to me have been crucified.

Gal 6:15 Certainly, it doesn't matter whether a person is circumcised or not. Rather, what matters is being a new creation.

Gal 6:16 Peace and mercy will come to rest on all those who conform to this principle. They are the Israel of God.

GW

 

[jerry kelso]

How can the New Covenant Church be a "mystery" if it was foretold in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and is found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:18-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8?

Paul says in the text below that it was revealed to Hosea that the Gentiles would be grafted in among the children of God.


Rom 9:24　 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?　
Rom 9:25　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.　
Rom 9:26　 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.　
Rom 9:27　 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:　

Your attempts to keep Israel and the Church separated fall apart on the Day of Pentecost when Peter addressed the crowd as "men of Judea", then as "men of Israel", and in Acts 2:36 as "all the house of Israel".

Peter made it clear that he was talking to Israelites.

Paul reveals below who is now the Israel of God.


Gal 6:14 But it's unthinkable that I could ever brag about anything except the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ. By his cross my relationship to the world and its relationship to me have been crucified.

Gal 6:15 Certainly, it doesn't matter whether a person is circumcised or not. Rather, what matters is being a new creation.

Gal 6:16 Peace and mercy will come to rest on all those who conform to this principle. They are the Israel of God.

GW

baberean2,

1. How can the NC Church be a mystery if it was prophesied in Jeremiah and fulfilled in Hebrews?
Asking this question shows you want to add your opinion to the scripture and make it appear as scripture and it's context.
Jeremiah and Hebrews is about the NC not the mystery of the church.
Israel rejected the KoG message of the NC Acts 28.
The Old Testament prophesied Israel's rejection under the law Matthew 23:37:39.
Jesus prophesied the destruction of the temple and the city's destruction Matthew 24:1-2. This was before the NC was inaugurated at the Cross.
After the resurrection on the Day of Pentecost Peter knew repentance was the key to the kingdom reign with Israel propagating the gospel but had no idea of the body of Christ for he was addressing Israelites and trying to figure out why the KoH signs were happening when Jesus said the time of the kingdom was not for them to know.
Peter's vision was when everything changed with the Gentiles coming into the picture Acts 10.
Salvation for gentiles was no mystery John 3:16.
The Gentiles being on the same level with the Jew in the body of Christ Ephesians 2:14-15; 3:3-5.
If Peter would have understood what this on the Day of Pentecost he wouldn't have had so much trouble many years later with the vision of the clean and unclean Acts 10.
You know better, which means you are being willingly ignorant to try and keep your false belief going.

2. I already debunked all your scriptures time and time again because you don't understand context and have wrong hermeneutics.

3. I have explained in depth that the body of Christ being called the Israel of God doesn't negate the gifts and calling of National Israel in the KoH reign in the future Romans 9:25-29.

4. Ezekiel 37 proves your replacement theology wrong and you couldn't answer to it and that is why you replied with an old argument that has been debunked by the scriptures and their context I gave.

5. It is plain your posts are wrong and your motive is a perception of nothing less than not forthright and resulting in dishonesty and unfairness in exegesis and the real scriptural truth.

6. Why do you think Paul said the church of Jews was a mystery to the Old Testament saints and now revealed to his apostles and prophets in his day?

7. The mystery of the Church being ratified at the Cross is different than it coming to light at a time later after the fact of the Cross.
If the mystery of the Church was
revealed and understood in the early part of the Church there wouldn't have been so much confusion with the Jews and what the law meant in light of the NC coming in.
Quit spinning, dodging, and being one sided and having tunnel vision and being in opposition to the biblical truth. Jerry kelso

 

[Biblewriter]

How can the New Covenant Church be a "mystery" if it was foretold in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and is found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:18-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8?

Paul says in the text below that it was revealed to Hosea that the Gentiles would be grafted in among the children of God.


Rom 9:24　 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?　
Rom 9:25　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.　
Rom 9:26　 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.　
Rom 9:27　 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:　

Your attempts to keep Israel and the Church separated fall apart on the Day of Pentecost when Peter addressed the crowd as "men of Judea", then as "men of Israel", and in Acts 2:36 as "all the house of Israel".

Peter made it clear that he was talking to Israelites.

Paul reveals below who is now the Israel of God.


Gal 6:14 But it's unthinkable that I could ever brag about anything except the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ. By his cross my relationship to the world and its relationship to me have been crucified.

Gal 6:15 Certainly, it doesn't matter whether a person is circumcised or not. Rather, what matters is being a new creation.

Gal 6:16 Peace and mercy will come to rest on all those who conform to this principle. They are the Israel of God.

GW

Did you fail to notice, or are you just pretending that you did not notice, that the people he was addressing were not yet believers in Christ, and thus were not yet part of the church?

 

[BABerean2]

the body of Christ being called the Israel of God doesn't negate the gifts and calling of National Israel in the KoH reign in the future Romans 9:25-29.

Rom 9:24　 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?　
Rom 9:25　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.　
Rom 9:26　 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.　
Rom 9:27　 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

　
Rom 9:6　 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:　
Rom 9:7　 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.　
Rom 9:8　 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.　


Rom 11:1　 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.　
Rom 11:2　 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,　
Rom 11:3　 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.　
Rom 11:4　 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.　
Rom 11:5　 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

　

Rom 11:23　 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.　

Rom 11:26　 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:　
Rom 11:27　 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.　


Heb 10:16　 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;　
Heb 10:17　 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.　
Heb 10:18　 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.　

Paul provides no path to salvation for modern Jews, outside of being grafted back into the Olive Tree, which is a symbol of the New Covenant Church.

.

 

[BABerean2]

Did you fail to notice, or are you just pretending that you did not notice, that the people he was addressing were not yet believers in Christ, and thus were not yet part of the church?

Did they stop being Israelites when they accepted Christ?

Did you notice the word "church" in Hebrews 12:22-24?


Heb 12:22　 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,　
Heb 12:23　 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,　
Heb 12:24　 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
　

How do you separate Israel and the Church in Hebrews 8:6-13?

Heb 8:6　 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.　
Heb 8:7　 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.　
Heb 8:8　 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:　
(Part of this text comes directly from Jeremiah chapter 31.)
Heb 8:9　 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.　
Heb 8:10　 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:　
Heb 8:11　 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.　
Heb 8:12　 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.　
Heb 8:13　 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.　

...or Hebrews 10:16-18?

Heb 10:16　 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;　
Heb 10:17　 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.　
Heb 10:18　 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.　

.
.

 

[jerry kelso]

Rom 9:24　 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?　
Rom 9:25　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.　
Rom 9:26　 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.　
Rom 9:27　 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved:

　
Rom 9:6　 Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:　
Rom 9:7　 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.　
Rom 9:8　 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.　


Rom 11:1　 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.　
Rom 11:2　 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,　
Rom 11:3　 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.　
Rom 11:4　 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.　
Rom 11:5　 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

　

Rom 11:23　 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.　

Rom 11:26　 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:　
Rom 11:27　 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.　


Heb 10:16　 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;　
Heb 10:17　 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.　
Heb 10:18　 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.　

Paul provides no path to salvation for modern Jews, outside of being grafted back into the Olive Tree, which is a symbol of the New Covenant Church.

baberean2,

1. You never answered my question so answer it.
Why did Paul say the Church was a mystery that was not known in other ages as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit. That the Gentiles should be fellow heirs and of the same body and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel Ephesians 3:3-6. Paul hadn't started his Gentile ministry till after Peter had the vision of the clean and unclean.
Peter said in Acts 10:42-43 to preach the NC that would give the prophets witness that through his name whosoever believers in him shall receive remission of sins.
However, in verse 44-46 when the Gentiles were given the gift of the Holy Ghost the Jews were astonished for they heard them speak in tongues and magnify God.
So answer Paul's question and the vision of the clean and unclean and the astonishment of the believing Jews.
These accounts show that the mystery of Christ was not known on the Day of Pentecost. Jerry kelso

 

[BABerean2]

It is very simple Jerry.

What does the text say?


Eph 3:1　 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,　
Eph 3:2　 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:　
Eph 3:3　 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,　
Eph 3:4　 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)　
Eph 3:5　 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;　
Eph 3:6　 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:　
Eph 3:7　 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.　
Eph 3:8　 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;　
Eph 3:9　 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:　
Eph 3:10　 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,　
Eph 3:11　 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:　
Eph 3:12　 In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him.　
Eph 3:13　 Wherefore I desire that ye faint not at my tribulations for you, which is your glory.


It was not revealed to the average person in the Old Testament that Gentiles would be grafted in.

However, in Romans 9:25 Paul said that it was revealed to Hosea.

Rom 9:24　 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?　

Rom 9:25　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.　

Rom 9:26　 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.　



Since I am a retired Science teacher there be some things that I know about science that could be a mystery to you.

You may know some things about a particular subject that would be a mystery to me.

What was a mystery to most people, was revealed to Hosea.
And now the mystery of how both texts can be correct has been solved.

.

　

 

[jerry kelso]

It is very simple Jerry.

What does the text say?


Eph 3:1　 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,　
Eph 3:2　 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:　
Eph 3:3　 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,　
Eph 3:4　 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)　
Eph 3:5　 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;　
Eph 3:6　 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:　
Eph 3:7　 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.　
Eph 3:8　 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;　
Eph 3:9　 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:　
Eph 3:10　 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,　
Eph 3:11　 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:　
Eph 3:12　 In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him.　
Eph 3:13　 Wherefore I desire that ye faint not at my tribulations for you, which is your glory.


It was not revealed to the average person in the Old Testament that Gentiles would be grafted in.

However, in Romans 9:25 Paul said that it was revealed to Hosea.

Rom 9:24　 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?　

Rom 9:25　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.　

Rom 9:26　 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.　



Since I am a retired Science teacher there be some things that I know about science that could be a mystery to you.

You may know some things about a particular subject that would be a mystery to me.

What was a mystery to most people, was revealed to Hosea.
And now the mystery of how both texts can be correct has been solved.

　

baberean2,

1. I already explained that the biblical context in Hosea was only to Israel not the Gentiles.
God gave future revelations to many prophets and they didn't understand the full picture or any of it at all.

Romans 9:24-25; Even us, whom he hath called, not of of the Jews only but also of the Gentiles?
The wording Even us and but also of the Gentiles with a question mark shows that was not fully understood in the Old Testament in connection to verse 25.
As he saith also in Osse I will call them my people etc.
The wording is not about Hosea knowing the mystery of Christ in Hosea because he didn't.
In Romans 9 it was after the fact was revealed to Paul that he could say that what Hosea said included the Jews.

2. It's the same way that people who falsely say the Holy Spirit Coming was a fulfillment of Joel which is not really true for it was a prophecy of Jesus in John 16:13.
Joel was the same manifestation but in the context of the future tribulation and Israel coming back to God and the restoration of the land Joel 2:18-27; 28-32.

3. I don't disagree with your statement about knowing things I wouldn't know but that is not the case of that context.
In all due respect to you being a retired science teacher, English definitely wasn't your major! Lol though truthful! Jerry kelso

 

[BABerean2]

baberean2,

1. I already explained that the biblical context in Hosea was only to Israel not the Gentiles.
God gave future revelations to many prophets and they didn't understand the full picture or any of it at all.

Romans 9:24-25; Even us, whom he hath called, not of of the Jews only but also of the Gentiles?
The wording Even us and but also of the Gentiles with a question mark shows that was not fully understood in the Old Testament in connection to verse 25.
As he saith also in Osse I will call them my people etc.
The wording is not about Hosea knowing the mystery of Christ in Hosea because he didn't.
In Romans 9 it was after the fact was revealed to Paul that he could say that what Hosea said included the Jews.

2. It's the same way that people who falsely say the Holy Spirit Coming was a fulfillment of Joel which is not really true for it was a prophecy of Jesus in John 16:13.
Joel was the same manifestation but in the context of the future tribulation and Israel coming back to God and the restoration of the land Joel 2:18-27; 28-32.

3. I don't disagree with your statement about knowing things I wouldn't know but that is not the case of that context.
In all due respect to you being a retired science teacher, English definitely wasn't your major! Lol though truthful! Jerry kelso

Romans 9:25

(CJB)　 As indeed he says in Hoshea, "Those who were not my people I will call my people; her who was not loved I will call loved;

(ESV)　 As indeed he says in Hosea, "Those who were not my people I will call 'my people,' and her who was not beloved I will call 'beloved.'"

(Geneva)　 As he sayth also in Osee, I will call them, My people, which were not my people: and her, Beloued, which was not beloued.

(GW)　 As God says in Hosea: "Those who are not my people I will call my people. Those who are not loved I will call my loved ones.

(LITV-TSP)　 As also He says in Hosea, I will call those not My people, My people! And those not beloved, Beloved! Hosea 2:23

(KJV)　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

(KJV+)　 AsG5613 he saithG3004 alsoG2532 inG1722 Osee,G5617 I will callG2564 them myG3450 people,G2992 whichG3588 were notG3756 myG3450 people;G2992 andG2532 her beloved,G25 which was not beloved.G25 G3756


(NKJV)　 As He says also in Hosea: "I WILL CALL THEM MY PEOPLE, WHO WERE NOT MY PEOPLE, AND HER BELOVED, WHO WAS NOT BELOVED."

(YLT)　 as also in Hosea He saith, 'I will call what is not My people—My people; and her not beloved—Beloved,


Maybe you think the verse does not really say what is written in the text.

Hos 2:18　 In that day I will make a covenant for them With the beasts of the field, With the birds of the air, And with the creeping things of the ground. Bow and sword of battle I will shatter from the earth, To make them lie down safely.　


Hos 2:19　 "I will betroth you to Me forever; Yes, I will betroth you to Me In righteousness and justice, In lovingkindness and mercy;　

Hos 2:20　 I will betroth you to Me in faithfulness, And you shall know the LORD.　

Hos 2:21　 "It shall come to pass in that day That I will answer," says the LORD; "I will answer the heavens, And they shall answer the earth.　

Hos 2:22　 The earth shall answer With grain, With new wine, And with oil; They shall answer Jezreel.　

Hos 2:23　 Then I will sow her for Myself in the earth, And I will have mercy on her who had not obtained mercy; Then I will say to those who were not My people, 'You are My people!' And they shall say, 'You are my God!' "　

.

 

[Biblewriter]

Romans 9:25

(CJB)　 As indeed he says in Hoshea, "Those who were not my people I will call my people; her who was not loved I will call loved;

(ESV)　 As indeed he says in Hosea, "Those who were not my people I will call 'my people,' and her who was not beloved I will call 'beloved.'"

(Geneva)　 As he sayth also in Osee, I will call them, My people, which were not my people: and her, Beloued, which was not beloued.

(GW)　 As God says in Hosea: "Those who are not my people I will call my people. Those who are not loved I will call my loved ones.

(LITV-TSP)　 As also He says in Hosea, I will call those not My people, My people! And those not beloved, Beloved! Hosea 2:23

(KJV)　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

(KJV+)　 AsG5613 he saithG3004 alsoG2532 inG1722 Osee,G5617 I will callG2564 them myG3450 people,G2992 whichG3588 were notG3756 myG3450 people;G2992 andG2532 her beloved,G25 which was not beloved.G25 G3756


(NKJV)　 As He says also in Hosea: "I WILL CALL THEM MY PEOPLE, WHO WERE NOT MY PEOPLE, AND HER BELOVED, WHO WAS NOT BELOVED."

(YLT)　 as also in Hosea He saith, 'I will call what is not My people—My people; and her not beloved—Beloved,


Maybe you think the verse does not really say what is written in the text.

Hos 2:18　 In that day I will make a covenant for them With the beasts of the field, With the birds of the air, And with the creeping things of the ground. Bow and sword of battle I will shatter from the earth, To make them lie down safely.　


Hos 2:19　 "I will betroth you to Me forever; Yes, I will betroth you to Me In righteousness and justice, In lovingkindness and mercy;　

Hos 2:20　 I will betroth you to Me in faithfulness, And you shall know the LORD.　

Hos 2:21　 "It shall come to pass in that day That I will answer," says the LORD; "I will answer the heavens, And they shall answer the earth.　

Hos 2:22　 The earth shall answer With grain, With new wine, And with oil; They shall answer Jezreel.　

Hos 2:23　 Then I will sow her for Myself in the earth, And I will have mercy on her who had not obtained mercy; Then I will say to those who were not My people, 'You are My people!' And they shall say, 'You are my God!' "　

.

No amount of posting, or of insisting, can change the undeniable fact, that not even one of the many New Testament scriptures you keep posting, even hints at an idea that the ancient promises made to the physical nation of Israel, to the physical sub-nations of Judah and Ephraim, and to the piece of real estate that they occupied, will not be literally kept, exactly as God stated them.

 

[jerry kelso]

Romans 9:25

(CJB)　 As indeed he says in Hoshea, "Those who were not my people I will call my people; her who was not loved I will call loved;

(ESV)　 As indeed he says in Hosea, "Those who were not my people I will call 'my people,' and her who was not beloved I will call 'beloved.'"

(Geneva)　 As he sayth also in Osee, I will call them, My people, which were not my people: and her, Beloued, which was not beloued.

(GW)　 As God says in Hosea: "Those who are not my people I will call my people. Those who are not loved I will call my loved ones.

(LITV-TSP)　 As also He says in Hosea, I will call those not My people, My people! And those not beloved, Beloved! Hosea 2:23

(KJV)　 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

(KJV+)　 AsG5613 he saithG3004 alsoG2532 inG1722 Osee,G5617 I will callG2564 them myG3450 people,G2992 whichG3588 were notG3756 myG3450 people;G2992 andG2532 her beloved,G25 which was not beloved.G25 G3756


(NKJV)　 As He says also in Hosea: "I WILL CALL THEM MY PEOPLE, WHO WERE NOT MY PEOPLE, AND HER BELOVED, WHO WAS NOT BELOVED."

(YLT)　 as also in Hosea He saith, 'I will call what is not My people—My people; and her not beloved—Beloved,


Maybe you think the verse does not really say what is written in the text.

Hos 2:18　 In that day I will make a covenant for them With the beasts of the field, With the birds of the air, And with the creeping things of the ground. Bow and sword of battle I will shatter from the earth, To make them lie down safely.　


Hos 2:19　 "I will betroth you to Me forever; Yes, I will betroth you to Me In righteousness and justice, In lovingkindness and mercy;　

Hos 2:20　 I will betroth you to Me in faithfulness, And you shall know the LORD.　

Hos 2:21　 "It shall come to pass in that day That I will answer," says the LORD; "I will answer the heavens, And they shall answer the earth.　

Hos 2:22　 The earth shall answer With grain, With new wine, And with oil; They shall answer Jezreel.　

Hos 2:23　 Then I will sow her for Myself in the earth, And I will have mercy on her who had not obtained mercy; Then I will say to those who were not My people, 'You are My people!' And they shall say, 'You are my God!' "　

.

baberean2,

1. You show me in the immediate context of Hosea alone that Hosea had firsthand knowledge of the mystery of the church. Jerry kelso

 

[BABerean2]

No amount of posting, or of insisting, can change the undeniable fact, that not even one of the many New Testament scriptures you keep posting, even hints at an idea that the ancient promises made to the physical nation of Israel, to the physical sub-nations of Judah and Ephraim, ant to the piece of real estate that they occupied, will not be literally kept, exactly as God stated them.

Like the promise of the New Covenant made to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, which is found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:18-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8...

.................................................................

If you are claiming that promises are to be fulfilled outside of the New Covenant Church of Christ, you will be in opposition to Paul in Galatians 3:16,29 where Paul said the promises to Abraham were made to only One Seed, who is Christ.

You are ignoring John the Baptist's warning about genealogy in Matthew 3:9, and a similar warning in 1 Timothy 1:4.

If you are sure you are correct, you may want to buy up some DNA test kits and make them available through this forum, so that we can find out which of us can lay claim to the promises you are promoting.
Maybe I should buy a plane ticket to the modern State of Israel.
How many acres would I receive?
Will I have to become a Jew to gain Israeli citizenship?

How much of Abraham's DNA do I need to qualify, in your opinion?

.

 

[jerry kelso]

Like the promise of the New Covenant made to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, which is found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:18-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8...

.................................................................

If you are claiming that promises are to be fulfilled outside of the New Covenant Church of Christ, you will be in opposition to Paul in Galatians 3:16,29 where Paul said the promises to Abraham were made to only One Seed, who is Christ.

You are ignoring John the Baptist's warning about genealogy in Matthew 3:9, and a similar warning in 1 Timothy 1:4.

If you are sure you are correct, you may want to buy up some DNA test kits and make them available through this forum, so that we can find out which of us can lay claim to the promises you are promoting.
Maybe I should buy a plane ticket to the modern State of Israel.
How many acres would I receive?
Will I have to become a Jew to gain Israeli citizenship?

How much of Abraham's DNA do I need to qualify, in your opinion?

.

baberean2,

1. Why don't you explain Ezekiel 37:24-28;15-28.
Prove that you are going to live in the land of Israel with David as your King over that specific country.

2. Prove the immediate context of Matthew 3:9 and 1Timothy 1:4 have anything to do with the churches position of physical rulership in the KoH.

3. Prove Galatians 3:16,29 immediate context shows the Churches position of physical rulership in the KoH.

4. Prove that the immediate context Hebrews 12:18-24 has anything to do with the Church's position of authority in the physical KoH.

5. Prove that the immediate context Of Jeremiah 31:31-34 or Hebrews 8:6-13 has anything to do with the Churches position of physical rulership in the KoH.

6. The only way you can do it is only by spiritualizing the scripture with your false theory of the spiritual Jew to the extreme. The truth will show that it is a lie.

7. Salvation by the NC is the churches requirement for going to Heaven. Rulership positions depends on rewards of works and stewardship.
For Israel salvation was in Jesus day and will be in the future to gain entrance into the KoH reign forever.
Salvation for the Jews today is by the church making them jealous.
In the future it will be more about their national light snuffed out Revelation 1:7, 16:16and the purification process Daniel 9:24-27;12:1 they must go through in the context of Jacob's trouble Jeremiah 30:5-6, Daniel 12:1, Matthew 24:15-21. which has nothing to do with the Church.
It will result in recognizing the suffering Savior they crucified Revelation 1:7. Jerry kelso

 

[BABerean2]

baberean2,

1. Why don't you explain Ezekiel 37:24-28;15-28.
Prove that you are going to live in the land of Israel with David as your King over that specific country.

2. Prove the immediate context of Matthew 3:9 and 1Timothy 1:4 have anything to do with the churches position of physical rulership in the KoH.

3. Prove Galatians 3:16,29 immediate context shows the Churches position of physical rulership in the KoH.

4. Prove that the immediate context Hebrews 12:18-24 has anything to do with the Church's position of authority in the physical KoH.

5. Prove that the immediate context Of Jeremiah 31:31-34 or Hebrews 8:6-13 has anything to do with the Churches position of physical rulership in the KoH.

6. The only way you can do it is only by spiritualizing the scripture with your false theory of the spiritual Jew to the extreme. The truth will show that it is a lie.

7. Salvation by the NC is the churches requirement for going to Heaven. Rulership positions depends on rewards of works and stewardship.
For Israel salvation was in Jesus day and will be in the future to gain entrance into the KoH reign forever.
Salvation for the Jews today is by the church making them jealous.
In the future it will be more about their national light snuffed out Revelation 1:7, 16:16and the purification process Daniel 9:24-27;12:1 they must go through in the context of Jacob's trouble Jeremiah 30:5-6, Daniel 12:1, Matthew 24:15-21. which has nothing to do with the Church.
It will result in recognizing the suffering Savior they crucified Revelation 1:7. Jerry kelso

Many of the older classic Dispensationalists claim the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God are not the same. However, a parallel study of the Gospels reveals the error of this logic.


Mat 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the
kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Mar 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand:
repent ye, and believe the gospel.


Mat 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath
not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in
the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Mat 11:12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven
suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.


Luk 16:16 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the
kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.



Mat 10:7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Luk 9:2 And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.






Mat 19:23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples,
Verily I say unto you, That a rich
man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.



Mat 19:24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye
of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

All false doctrines are exposed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but by the scripture they must ignore to make the doctrine work.

.

 

[jerry kelso]

Many of the older classic Dispensationalists claim the kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God are not the same. However, a parallel study of the Gospels reveals the error of this logic.


Mat 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the
kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Mar 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand:
repent ye, and believe the gospel.


Mat 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath
not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in
the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Mat 11:12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven
suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.


Luk 16:16 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the
kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.



Mat 10:7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Luk 9:2 And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.






Mat 19:23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples,
Verily I say unto you, That a rich
man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.



Mat 19:24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye
of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

All false doctrines are exposed not by the scripture quoted by its proponents, but by the scripture they must ignore to make the doctrine work.

.

baberean2,

1. I have already proved you wrong on this more than once. Obviously you don't pay attention or can't comprehend English or you don't want accept the truth.

2. The KoH and KoG both are physical kingdoms and spiritual kingdoms.

3. The KoH is the earthly sphere of the KoG which is the whole universe.
The KoH Daniel 7:27 which is the kingdom under the Heaven where God dwells cannot be the entire universe. Why? Because it is only part of the whole. Quit being ignorant as in lacking understanding.
The KoG can be stated in parallel passages because it is the whole of everything.

4. The KoH spiritual aspect are things contained in the physical KoH. Matthew 13.... the KoH is like etc.
The KoG spiritual aspect is the rule of God in hearts of men.
Matthew 6:33; Luke 17:20.
Seek and comes without observation are the main points and the Jews were never told to seek the KoH for salvation and it was never said that it comes without observation.

5. Matthew 4:17; 11:11,12; Matthew 10:7; Matthew 19:23; Mark 1:15 are all the physical kingdom.
Luke 9:2; 16:16 are the Spiritual KoG.
You want to go by wording alone and not by context. Luke was talking with the understanding of Luke 17:20 KoG comes without observation.
Mark 1:15 is a parallel passage where the physical KoG is the whole of the part of the physical KoH earthly sphere.
Your problem is that you want to make two terms be the same, mean the same. In this case the physical earth would have to be the whole universe to be equated with the KoH that is the whole universe. This is how ignorant that logic is.
You also want to make the wording take precedent over the full context. This means the Jews would have had to seek the physical things for salvation instead of the Gospel of believing in Messiah.

6. You are the one quoting scripture without understanding of the context and trying to push it as the truth.
You are the one who ignores scriptures on the context. This can be clearly seen of your argument with the Jewish nation inheritance of the land to those of Jacob's descendants and not the Church's will be the land of Israel with David their King.
You couldn't rebut it so you stayed silent.
That is wrong and to do that and pass it off as truth is hypocritical. This is no secret for those who understand the real picture are privy to your repeated posted offenses of not rightly dividing the word. Jerry kelso