Probably been asked before but - Do Christians believe that every non-Christian ever born will not g

[Hank77]

So Adam is left out? And all his off-spring?
I was thinking God was more inclusive.

This is what Job said...
Job 19:25 For I know that my Redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth:

Job believe that his Redeemer, the Messiah, was alive and would stand on the earth.
He also believed..
Job 19:26 And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:
Job 19:27 Whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another; though my reins be consumed within me.

So here Job speaks of the resurrection of his own body and he will see and be in the presence of God.
The Old Testament Saints knew more than most people believe they did.

 

[Catherineanne]

Doesn't the scripture say that Jesus descended to preach to spirits in prison?

I Peter 3:18-20
“For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit; in which also He went and made proclamation to the spirits in prison, who once were disobedient, when the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight souls, were saved through water.”

Jude 1: 16
And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their proper dwelling--these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day.


Genesis 6:1-5?
“When man began to multiply on the face of the land and daughters were born to them, the sons of God saw that the daughters of man were attractive. And they took as their wives any they chose. Then the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not abide in man forever, for he is flesh: his days shall be 120 years.” The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men who were of old, the men of renown. The Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intention of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.” — Genesis 6:1-5

With the intention of leaving them there?

That makes no sense.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

With the intention of leaving them there?

That makes no sense.

E.W.Bullinger's 'Lazarus and the Rich Man' might (and might not) help .

He cuts through thousands of years of tradition that contradicts Scripture directly,
and shows from All Scripture , I think Genesis through Revelation, (it is 20 page pdf file),
much insight into how ALL the BIBLE fits jointly together without the common contradictions of men.

This might not directly affect, change, or discuss at all anyone's views specifically what Yhwh's Word says about preaching to the spirits in prison(if they were spirits); but it is encouraging, refreshing and enlightening in Yhwh's Plan of Salvation and His Word and it is closely related....

free and otherwise online: (I don't know which links work today, if any)
Philologos | The Rich Man and Lazarus: An Intermediate State?
philologos.org/__eb-rml/
E.W. BULLINGER, D.D. ... we can reach the Scripture concerning the rich man and Lazarus; or arrive at a satisfactory conclusion as to the State after death.

The Rich Man and Lazarus by E.W. BULLINGER - levendwater . org
https://levendwater.org/books/the_rich_man_and_lazarus/index.htm
The Rich Man and Lazarus: An. "His breath goeth forth,. He returneth to his earth;. Intermediate State? In that very day his thoughts perish". Luke 16:19-31.

The Rich Man And Lazarus - Kindle edition by E.W. Bullinger. Religion ...
https://www.amazon.com/Rich-Man-Lazarus...Bulling...
Amazon.com, Inc.
The Rich Man And Lazarus - Kindle edition by E.W. Bullinger. Download it once and read it on your Kindle device, PC, phones or tablets. Use features like ...

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

... it's about gravity and magnetism being applied to spiritual attributes.

If it is subject to gravity and electromagnetism, this must mean that the spirit is a physical thing (which is unexpected), which means we should, in principle, be able to detect it. It certainly solves the interaction problem, although it does present some thermodynamic conundrums...

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

If it is subject to gravity and electromagnetism, this must mean that the spirit is a physical thing (which is unexpected), which means we should, in principle, be able to detect it. It certainly solves the interaction problem, although it does present some thermodynamic conundrums...

? was there ever any question ?

Have you ever seen a house (a lot of houses) knocked down by a strong wind ?

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

? was there ever any question ?

Yes indeed there was - since the origins of dualism.

Have you ever seen a house (a lot of houses) knocked down by a strong wind ?

Not personally, I acknowledge that it happens - why, are you suggesting spirit is like wind?

What do you suggest are the physical attributes of spirit? what's it made of?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Yes indeed there was - since the origins of dualism.

Not personally, I acknowledge that it happens - why, are you suggesting spirit is like wind?

What do you suggest are the physical attributes of spirit? what's it made of?

No, just wondering. If you never personally saw it, that's really all to say then.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

No, just wondering. If you never personally saw it, that's really all to say then.

I have seen a tree blown down if that helps ?? Or were you just making random interjections?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I have seen a tree blown down if that helps ?? Or were you just making random interjections?

Yes, that helps.
What country was the tree in ? (not joking nor random)

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

What country was the tree in ? (not joking nor random)

England, UK.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

England, UK.

Okay,
now this will seem like dr seuss or sesame street, but it is not - no joking nor random -

I have never been in England, UK, or even close to it.

I have seen movies and tv shows from 'there' I guess (one show called 'old wine' or something like that, - hilarious comedy ! )

When you saw the tree blown down, did you notice or even think about looking for

something like a hand or entity or figure or weapon ? Anything at all out of the ordinary ?

Did you see with your eyes anything actually push the tree over ?

I have seen a tree blown down if that helps ??

p.s. you will like where this ends up. I think.

 

[bhsmte]

Okay,
now this will seem like dr seuss or sesame street, but it is not - no joking nor random -

I have never been in England, UK, or even close to it.

I have seen movies and tv shows from 'there' I guess (one show called 'old wine' or something like that, - hilarious comedy ! )

When you saw the tree blown down, did you notice or even think about looking for

something like a hand or entity or figure or weapon ? Anything at all out of the ordinary ?

Did you see with your eyes anything actually push the tree over ?


p.s. you will like where this ends up. I think.

I can't wait to see where this ends up.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I can't wait to see where this ends up.

HOLD UR BREATH!

 

[Gregory Thompson]

If it is subject to gravity and electromagnetism, this must mean that the spirit is a physical thing (which is unexpected), which means we should, in principle, be able to detect it. It certainly solves the interaction problem, although it does present some thermodynamic conundrums...

@FrumiousBandersnatch - Alternate dimension, different laws of physics, once we can interact then it will be observable to science.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

...I have seen movies and tv shows from 'there' I guess (one show called 'old wine' or something like that, - hilarious comedy ! )

It was probably, "Last of the summer Wine".

When you saw the tree blown down, did you notice or even think about looking for

something like a hand or entity or figure or weapon ? Anything at all out of the ordinary ?

Did you see with your eyes anything actually push the tree over ?

What was out of the ordinary was an extraordinarily strong wind. But no, when a flag flaps on a flagpole in the breeze, when a plastic bag blows along the street, and when a tree blows over in a gale, the windy context tells me it's the movement of air that causes it, not hands or entities or figures or weapons. Also, the noticeable absence of hands or entities or figures or weapons acting on those items lends support to the conclusion.

p.s. you will like where this ends up. I think.

Surprise me.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

@FrumiousBandersnatch - Alternate dimension, different laws of physics, once we can interact then it will be observable to science.

But you said it already does interact with gravity & electromagnetism. But please tell me about this 'alternate dimension' and its different laws of physics anyway.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

It was probably, "Last of the summer Wine".

What was out of the ordinary was an extraordinarily strong wind. But no, when a flag flaps on a flagpole in the breeze, when a plastic bag blows along the street, and when a tree blows over in a gale, the windy context tells me it's the movement of air that causes it, not hands or entities or figures or weapons. Also, the noticeable absence of hands or entities or figures or weapons acting on those items lends support to the conclusion.

Surprise me.

Yes, "Last of the Summer Wine" is the show....... we were rolling on the floor laughing , or at least a good honest belly laugh, about 12 years ago watching it at a friends house....

I lost my train of thought since posting, so I'll get back to this later, tonight or next day or so... I had clear thoughts and was all set for half hour or so then got totally into other things needed (like cooking, eating(changing blood sugar levels/ sleepy, taking a nap ... ) , and a few other threads... )

The surprise might be somewhat anticlimactic (it seems so far off right now as my head is nodding off to sleep), or maybe like taking a big bite of food and suddenly finding out it has A LOT of those really really hot peppers in it... .... (you know, "LIGHT BULB" goes on all of a sudden....)

E=MC**2 ..... That is the equation famous. WHO KNOWS the rest of the equation ? (added later to increase its accuracy since this original equation is very minutely off) .....

nite!

 

[bhsmte]

Yes, "Last of the Summer Wine" is the show....... we were rolling on the floor laughing , or at least a good honest belly laugh, about 12 years ago watching it at a friends house....

I lost my train of thought since posting, so I'll get back to this later, tonight or next day or so... I had clear thoughts and was all set for half hour or so then got totally into other things needed (like cooking, eating(changing blood sugar levels/ sleepy, taking a nap ... ) , and a few other threads... )

The surprise might be somewhat anticlimactic (it seems so far off right now as my head is nodding off to sleep), or maybe like taking a big bite of food and suddenly finding out it has A LOT of those really really hot peppers in it... .... (you know, "LIGHT BULB" goes on all of a sudden....)

E=MC**2 ..... That is the equation famous. WHO KNOWS the rest of the equation ? (added later to increase its accuracy since this original equation is very minutely off) .....

nite!

I am still holding my breath.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

But you said it already does interact with gravity & electromagnetism. But please tell me about this 'alternate dimension' and its different laws of physics anyway.

@FrumiousBandersnatch - Human observational instruments are unreliable for scientific observation, there is interaction, it's just machines haven't been designed to observe the subtle interaction. For example: When people talk about what happens after you die, there's a big question mark because there is no way of proving anything using scientific instruments. So in the sense of being blatantly observable, it does not interact. The current interaction is subtle.
.
The whole idea of "the soul" going somewhere after you die, implies one believes that they have a soul that continues on after the body stops functioning.
.
The alternate or parallel dimension is a reality where intent manifests for each person. The reality of God also called the kingdom of God is another such parallel dimension by using "faith" a person can synchronize with the other dimension's laws of physics and all of a sudden anything becomes possible ... however, it can be reasoned that this faith is lacking in the western world due to the lack of re-producible evidence ... though one might hear a story of such evidence of faith becoming substance as it was said of old or experience it on a personal level and then it doesn't happen again:
Making it problematic for scientific observation.
.
So I experience this grand hope, and I pray, because it seems that people can only trust in its existence once they become aware of it. But I continue to consider the words "may your will be done on earth as it is in heaven" and what kind of faith would make that happen if even for a day.
.
Thanks for the opportunity to reflect. Respect.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Human observational instruments are unreliable for scientific observation...

They can reliably detect influences several orders of magnitude too small to affect, for example, the functioning of the brain, so quite reliable enough, I would suggest.

...there is interaction, it's just machines haven't been designed to observe the subtle interaction.

If the influence is too subtle to be detectable by measuring instruments, it's too subtle to have a biological influence. For example, in terms of electromagnetism, instruments can reliably detect individual photons even in the far infra-red (i.e. lowest energy); for a quantized field, there is no subtler influence. Do you see the implication?

For example: When people talk about what happens after you die, there's a big question mark because there is no way of proving anything using scientific instruments. So in the sense of being blatantly observable, it does not interact. The current interaction is subtle.

If you think that either gravitational or electromagnetic interactions (or both) can be recruited in support of soul or spirit, you've been sadly misinformed. Gravity is incredibly weak relative to other forces, and is simply not a significant force at human-mass scales (and, in any case, is proportional to mass, so it's effectively constant), and electromagnetism below the threshold of detection is simply waste heat.

By all means propose supernatural realms and miraculous events, etc., but if you're going to invoke real-world physics in support of your ideas, you need to have some knowledge of real-world physics. What you're suggesting just isn't viable - it doesn't make sense from any physical viewpoint.

The whole idea of "the soul" going somewhere after you die, implies one believes that they have a soul that continues on after the body stops functioning.

For which there is no plausible evidence whatsoever, and contrary to which is the whole of physics as currently understood - which at human-relative scales and energies is well-enough. If you'd like to hear an expert in physics explain precisely why your suggestion is not sustainable, check out Sean Carroll's entertaining talk here (skip to minute 33 for specifically relevant details - although I highly recommend the whole talk):

The alternate or parallel dimension is a reality where intent manifests for each person.

[are you sure you meant 'manifest', i.e. shown or demonstrated?] Intent or purpose is an abstraction of the motivations for goal-driven behaviour; it is not a physical thing. We also know that it's a function of brain processes because we can change it by interfering with brain processes. If it was independently resident in an alternate or parallel dimension, that would not be the case.