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pretty much no hope

Discussion in 'Obsessive Compulsive Disorder' started by raven1, Dec 6, 2011.

  1. Anonymous User

    Anonymous User Newbie

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    Freaking out is a FEELING. Has your decision overall about Christ changed when you freak out?

    Tons of people are afraid of cats because they don't want to get scratched or bitten. Few people without OCD, however, sit in immense terror of being attacked by a twenty-year old obese cat that's locked in its carrier on the other side of the house. Yes, Hell is something to be aware of, and people who DON'T trust Jesus would certainly have good reason to be afraid, but I don't think anyone without OCD who desires Christ as their Savior and has asked him to be so worry as much as you do! Your fears are not unique, but they are still, I PROMISE, irrational!
     
  2. raven1

    raven1 Well-Known Member

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    I just get fearful all these people know if something aligns with whatever in space it will the end so of I sit
    In my fear of 2012 and afterlife I go to hell if I try to come to terms with what ifs I go to hell. If I am just ocd y do I search facebook for athiests and agnostics and get fuzzy feelings when I see they are
    I also feel no breaks in doubts everyone on here goes back and forth from belief to doubt. I always doubt.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2011
  3. Anonymous User

    Anonymous User Newbie

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    Raven,

    If you truly wanted to believe in 2012, you would be doubting these people's "prophecies". There is nothing supernatural about the 2012 thing. The astronomical alignment of the stars is a mathematical calculation, and math is the same in every country because it is a natural law. It's just a traditional thing of the ages to believe that significance lies in these astronomical figures, but these people's beliefs of the alignment of the star's implications on the world have no more proof or gravity than if someone said, "There are three oranges in the bowl in front of me. That means the world will end in three days." There is immense PROOF of Christianity's truth. Because you are an OCD sufferer and WANT to believe that Christianity is true, no matter how little proof there is in the opposite, you feel obliged to listen to what you fear most.

    I don't know how much more I can reinforce that doubts do not prevent you from believing. That you have to ignore these fears, no matter how relentless they are, and trust that if you trust Christ, you are saved. Being saved does not make, at least for the OCD plagued, the doubts go away, or the feelings of fear go away. You are searching for that magic 'aha' moment of certainty that DOES NOT EXIST. You will actually have to practice putting faith not only in Christ, but in the words so many of us have been telling you. You cannot fully understand the security in which you stand, because you have OCD. Hopefully with cognitive therapy and medication you will one day feel little to no fear or doubt. But until then you have to act courageous. Not FEEL courageous; ACT courageous. Take those steps of faith. Trust in Christ even when He feels like a fairy tale. When the fears of Hell and the afterlife come into your head, tell yourself, 'Jesus has saved me,' and try to distract yourself, no matter how hard it may be or how often you may fail. Go to work even when you are afraid you could die and go to Hell. Be courageous, Raven. I know it's hard. Trust me. I know that when I give you all this advice it can sound like I never have troubles and never doubt and am so sure of everything, but I struggle daily with new challenges, and it's often hard to follow my own advice, simply because I second-guess everything. But I am passing on to you not only what I believe to be true, but what others outside of myself, such as Christian psychiatrists, Christian therapists, and just general Christians have passed on to me. You've got to lean on the advice that is outside of you, because neither you nor I are capable at this point in our disorder to make sense of things by ourselves. Please trust me, Raven. Be courageous. Don't 'feel' courageous, because that's nearly impossibly. BE courageous.
     
  4. raven1

    raven1 Well-Known Member

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    Huh I am confused. I am just afraid they may be right are you saying I can't come to terms with maybe there right or no afterlife or I am going to hell.
     
  5. hollyda

    hollyda To read makes our speaking English good

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    Raven,

    In order to get better, you have to be willing to do the work. This means confronting your fears. Getting into therapy is a must. You have to help yourself. If you don't take these steps, chances are you'll remain in this fear cycle, and that's just no way to live.
     
  6. kerrysue

    kerrysue Newbie

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    Hi, I just wrote a long reply to sdb39 that I would also like to send to you, but not sure how to make it appear for you all to see! Hope you have a wonderful Christmas and thank you for posting on here and being honest. It helps the rest of us too. Hope my experiences can somehow be of help to others and lead them to Christ who loves and wants to help each one of us.
     
  7. raven1

    raven1 Well-Known Member

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    How do I confront my fears if analyzing the what if and trying to cope with them means I am not showing trust in God go to hell. Why is everyone assuming my dount God exists and 2012 might and no afterlife and getting exciting see people are athiest is OCD. Can't it just be doubt cause I can't prove these things exists or not. A agnostic person holding onto faith to avoid hell

    Kerrysue we are saved by grace and God gives faith if he exists so I fear some people are not choosen
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2011
  8. hollyda

    hollyda To read makes our speaking English good

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    Is what you're doing right now, this moment, working for you?

    If the answer is no, go to therapy. Even if it's not OCD, it's something. Or do you want to spend tomorrow, the next day, the day after that, and every day for the foreseeable future feeling the way you do right now?
     
  9. Anonymous User

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    Raven,

    I know what you're AFRAID of. You have to try and act DESPITE those fears. You are caught in an endless loop because you just can't accept that it's okay for you to be afraid!

    Never, ever, EVER analyze the 'what if'. 'What if' is the definition of OCD and has no value and is only going to make things worse for you. IGNORE the 'what if'.

    Everything you are describing is still a FEELING. Feelings are irrelevant in regards to your salvation. It's what you CHOOSE to DECIDE is true!

    An agnostic person holding on to faith in Christ in order not to go to Hell is not an agnostic. They are a Christian. A true agnostic has not put any kind of trust in Jesus, but only regards Him as a possibility and does not act on that.

    You are experiencing doubt. There's no question of that. And you CANNOT EVER be 100 percent sure of Christ this side of Heaven. That's why you have to TRUST that He's real.

    You have to TRY to believe what we are telling you. You have to trust in our words despite your doubts of them. You are always going to second-guess everything anyone tells you. You have to make the decision to trust despite your fears. You will never feel sure of anything while you have OCD.
     
  10. raven1

    raven1 Well-Known Member

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    Doubting God exists and 2012 can not be OCD. What is a therapist going to do help me stifle my fear of hell when I should be afraid of going there. Ifeel lke I have to analyze the what if there is no 2012 or afterlif in case theyr true so I can be ok with those outcomes if that is what the outcome will be.
    .
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2011
  11. Anonymous User

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    They don't have to be OCD. But a non-OCD sufferer with these doubts, if they chose to, would be easily able to conquer and dismiss them. You have IRRATIONAL fears, and therapy definitely can help those! Please do see a good therapist.
     
  12. hollyda

    hollyda To read makes our speaking English good

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    Yes. It can. As I said: OCD IS THE DOUBTING DISEASE. And FEAR plays into OCD. Fear is OCD's food. Without fear, the obsessive thought would not exist.

    You're not just afraid of going to Hell -- you're obsessed with it. And fearing it won't change anything.

    I know what I'm talking about. I've dealt with OCD for 20 years.

    This would be the compulsion. -- ruminating, bargaining, mental rituals, etc. If you don't want to get better, this is what you should do. If you DO want to get better, you need to get into therapy. And that's a guarantee.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2011
  13. kerrysue

    kerrysue Newbie

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    Raven,
    I had those exact worries before going to therapy and on meds--afraid they would make me "stifle" the worries I should be having to truly believe and prevent going to hell. I know exactly what you are feeling. You are caught in a cycle...doomed if you do, doomed if you don't. There is no way to get off that cycle on your own--I was on it for over 30 years. Get therapy and medication because this is not really "you", it is your mind and serotonin not working properly. One thing that helped me even then and now that I have had therapy and meds still (I still have passing temptations to obssess on those same lines) is getting to know the Lord better through Scripture. I read and re-read Psalm 139 when I was having a major crisis (before therapy and meds kicked in) and just realizing that God created me and loves me and my doubts or thots don't affect HIM at all. My spiritual status is not dependent on me (thank goodness!) ; it is dependent on HIM--His gift of Jesus and just the fact that you want to believe and are worrying about this shows that you truly do believe! But just hearing all of us saying this to you won't help completely because your brain is not healthy and doing what it is supposed to do right now. You will need the physical part to work (through meds and counseling) before the spiritual part can work with it. You really should get that booklet I mentioned--it really helps with the underlying spiritual part.

    Ok, praying for you as I really can empathize and God knows and understands you and loves you far more than you can imagine. Cling to HIM! He wants you to have healing and does not want you living in fear and would not play games like this--that is not in His character. Praying for you especially this Christmas season.

    KerrySue
     
  14. raven1

    raven1 Well-Known Member

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    I don't have any test I can take to determine exactly what is OCD and not. Last night I debated in my head for an hour why I didn't want to wear a cross necklace and decided it was because I didn't want to show everyone like a beacon I believed in him because I didn't feel him or know if I believed in him. It can very well be I doubt him and am denying him no OCD involved only OCD in ruminating. The therapist can't tell me I am saved so how is she going to help me believe I am if that is not what I can gain from therapy y go?

    Ok let me get this straight if I fear 2012 and no afterlife I will go to hell? See the main reason I don't wan therapy other than not getting the point is if 2012 exists therap will take time I have with my daughter if 2012 is real.

    My stepdad is sick I didn't want to touch the trashcan after him scared I wo.uld get the flu I am supposeed to touch it anyway and trust there is a afterlife if I don't take these steps of trust I am hellbound? I also. Whave no way of knowing if God is kind. Ihave no way to know we aren't chosen for salvation. People tell all kinds of things. I am saved they say and they say I am not. I am also not a nice person in ways and the only reason I want to change is to avoid hell

    I heard someone say once I would rather there no heaven because then I would know there was no hell because how will I know I am good enough for heaven and I will be told I am but how can I really know
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2011
  15. kodadog1024

    kodadog1024 Well-Known Member

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    I heard someone say once I would rather there no heaven because then I would know there was no hell because how will I know I am good enough for heaven and I will be told I am but how can I really know.

    Because Christ came down from Heaven to "die" a criminals death, to PAY your ransom, my ransom, BECAUSE He loves you, me and the world. Your no different than me, or anyone else on this forum. There is no "good deed that will EVER, EVER get you into Heaven. None. Zip. Nodda. The only thing that will get you a life in eternity with an ever-lasting God, where there will be no more sorrow, no more pain, no more tears, is if YOU accept the gift that God has given to each and every one of us. And that is His son. Doesn't matter how much you believe, or how little. What matters is if you accept and open the gift. PERIOD. He is more than your doubt, our fears, our anxiety. That, you have to accept, not matter how hard it is. Start reading the Bible which is 2000 years old. That is truth, the word of God. That will set you free. God bless and Merry Christmas. :) You know I'm praying for you! Stay strong!
     
  16. kerrysue

    kerrysue Newbie

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    Excellent--right on Kodadog, right on!! Praying for all my new friends on here. KerrySue
     
  17. raven1

    raven1 Well-Known Member

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    I want to believe God is merciful. I can't. I cannot know what is going to happen to me because I doubt. Now I am freaking out I haven't trustd enough like Anonymous said. If you can't know your saved what do you do. If it is ok to continuously doubt God exists no OCD involved why is so much emphasis put on the fact u must believe. I can't help that I think I don't need that if I buy that and 2012 comes that was a waste if we will be dead how do I just trust
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2011
  18. kerrysue

    kerrysue Newbie

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    Raven, have you seen a doctor, psychatrist, or taken meds at all yet concerning this? To me (and I struggled with many similar things for 25 + years before discovering what was wrong) you sound so classic ocd. And taking what Anonymous said and now worrying about that aspect is a huge symptom too....there will always be something else to worry on even if something someone here says makes you feel better for an instant. Oh how I know about that. Salvation is totally GRACE--like somebody just commented earlier and God certainly is not the author of fear...He doesn't want you to live like this. To believe for salvation is a choice, a one time thing, and does not depend on whether you think God exists or feel like you believe, odd as that sounds. It is just simply a decision to accept something. Our physical (mental), spiritual, and emotional all work together and when one is out of line or not working, the other parts don't either. Before you can get your spiritual part to function correctly and have peace and understanding you need you are going to have to deal with the mental/physical part, it sounds like to me. Please talk to God and ask Him to lead you to a good doctor who can help you. That is what I am praying for you.

    KerrySue
     
  19. raven1

    raven1 Well-Known Member

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    Oh I know that his grace is the only thing that saves us
    That is y I am afraid fundamentalist may be right. What can a therapist do about that.
     
  20. kodadog1024

    kodadog1024 Well-Known Member

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    If you could see Jesus Christ, right now, tonight, what would you say to Him? "Am I saved Jesus? Am I good enough for you and Heaven? What if I have all this doubt?" What do you think He would say to you Raven? How do you think Peter reacted the first time He saw Christ walking on water and thought He was a ghost, BECAUSE He had doubt. Peter even started to sink because he didn't believe.

    After feeding 500, Jesus sends his disciples ahead of him in a boat to cross the Sea of Galilee. Several hours later in the night, the disciples encounter a storm. Jesus comes to them, walking on the water. This terrifies the disciples who think they are seeing a ghost. Jesus tells them in verse 27, "Take courage! It is I. Don't be afraid."

    Peter replies, "Lord, if it's you, tell me to come to you on the water." So Jesus invites Peter to come. Peter gets out of the boat and begins walking on the water toward Jesus. But when Peter takes his eyes off Jesus and sees the wind and waves, he begins to sink. Peter cries out to the Lord and Jesus immediately reaches out his hand and catches Peter. As they climb into the boat together, the storm ceases. Then the disciples worship Jesus, saying, "Truly you are the Son of God.

    •"Jesus sends the disciples away so he can get alone on the mountainside and pray. Even in his busy schedule,spending time with God is a priority for Jesus.


    • The disciples, even though they have spent much time with Jesus, don't recognize him in the storm. Sometimes we don't recognize the Lord when he comes to us in the middle of our "storms.


    "Peter doesn't begin to sink until he starts looking around at the wind and the waves. Taking our eyes off Jesus, and focusing on the difficult circumstances will cause us to get under our problems. But when we cry out to Jesus, he catches us by the hand and raises us above the seemingly impossible surroundings.



    The point is, you already WANT to believe. It doesn't matter if it amounts to fill the vasts depths of the ocean OR to fill the void of a mustard seed Raven. It doesn't matter how right or how wrong YOU think you are doing it. The matter is you WANT to believe. Let Christ now build your faith. Here is a question for you. Do you want to really believe. Do you really want to know Christ? If yes, then Raven, you ARE saved. I won't reassure you anymore from here on out, now you have to open your heart to Him. Let the doubt be there, the questions, the "I don't know if I can's"... Now, if you want to live a Christ-like life, you have to do some work on your end. And that is love. Love God with all your heart, all your mind and all your soul. And then love everyone else the same as yourself. Let God take care of the rest. Do you really want Christ the center of your life Raven?
     
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