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Preterism-phony as a Ford Corvette

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by robycop3, Aug 22, 2021.

  1. robycop3

    robycop3 Newbie

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    God wasn't. He prophesied thru Daniel, Paul, & John, a MAN of sin. While I don't hold the RCC in much esteem, one must look elsewhere from the papacy to find THE man of sin He prophesied about.

    Sure, there have been many men of sin, including some popes, & the "Boyzz R Us" club among the RCC clergy. But THE man of sin will make even Hitler look as a naughty toddler in comparison when he comes to power.
     
  2. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    Ummm, no, it isn't. The temple mount platform is the floor of the former Roman Antonia Fortress, where Christ was flogged, with His blood spattering the stones. I find it rather amusing that the Muslims demand that shoes be taken off before anyone enters this site, as a sign of respect. Whether they realize it or not, they are giving unknowing honor to the blood of the Son of God spilled on that site.

    The True Temple location - on Mount Zion - was just further south from that Antonia Fortress location, with the waters of the Gihon Spring channeled to flow there to serve in the Temple's ritualistic washings for purification. The current Temple Mount location has no such source of "living water" that could have serviced the former Temple's needs.

    So it seems that Jews and Muslims have been competing to the death over a former Roman military barracks. That seems apropos.
     
  3. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Who is that one "MAN of God"?

    If you think that the Reformers whom God raised up were wrong, then the God who raised them up was also wrong.

    Without the Reformers' faith, vision, and sacrifice, the Christian Church of today would not exist.

    Nor would those who denigrate their spiritual insights and accomplishments, by God's grace and mercy.
     
  4. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    Of course there is. There is the hubris of Preterism, Amillennialism, and post Millennialism. All theology is human hubris.
     
  5. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    If "all" theology is human hubris, then you forgot to include premil and dispen.

    Who call God "simply wrong".
     
  6. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    When is the person who is the beast mortally wounded and comes back to life - before or after going into the temple, sitting claiming to be God ?
     
  7. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    I'll stick my nose in here again. Very simple answer. We are told in Revelation 20:5 that the millennium ended with the "First Resurrection" - of Christ and the Matthew 27 saints raised in AD 33. A literal thousand years prior, the physical Temple system was inaugurated with Solomon laying the foundation stone for the Temple in 968/967 BC. The fame of Solomon's kingdom went abroad through many nations, further spreading the knowledge of the God of Israel, and "chaining" Satan's deceptions of those nations. Even with this knowledge, the nations may have still acted sinfully, but at least they could no longer claim the excuse of deceived ignorance about the God of Israel.

    The beginning of the millennium was what the aging King David was talking about when he said about Zion that "The time to favor her, yeah the SET TIME IS COME" when the Lord would "build up Zion" (Ps. 102:13-16). This "set time" is a significant phrase in the original languages. It implies a specific, foreordained time set up by God for a very particular purpose. David as a prophet was anticipating the special time of God's favor for Mount Zion when his son Solomon would build a house for the Lord, as God had promised to David.

    The conditions for the beginning of the millennium are spoken of in Psalms 72:3, especially in the LXX. This last Psalm of King David speaks of his son Solomon "bringing low the FALSE ACCUSER." Not killing this false accuser, but bringing him down into a humiliated state. Just where do we hear again about this "false accuser" identity? In Revelation 12:10, when the "ACCUSER of the brethren" was cast out of heaven down to the earth for a "short time" in John's days. Solomon as a "peaceable" king over Israel was used by God to start Satan's 1,000 years of chained deception. Even when Solomon himself personally apostatized, the continued surge in the ministry of the prophets, both spoken and written, kept the nations aware of the God of Israel's existence through the centuries. This even included King Nebuchadnezzar's humbled declaration of submission to God, sent to every nation under his control. Likewise, King Darius' decree that all in his kingdom should worship the God of Daniel.

    In Solomon's days of establishing the Temple God planned for him to build, the very fame of Solomon's wisdom and the fabulous Temple he constructed was the beginning of God's binding chain put upon Satan's deception of the nations. The Queen of Sheba visiting Solomon is part evidence of this fame of the God of Israel over Solomon's kingdom. In other words, Solomon's Temple foundation stone was the beginning of the literal 1,000-year millennium of a physical temple worship system, a type which God intended to last until His Son Jesus Christ became the anti-type fulfillment as the "chief cornerstone" foundation of a Spiritual Temple made of "living stones", instead of chiseled limestone blocks.
     
  8. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    The temple mount not being the temple mount, but fort Antonia, has been discussed in other threads extensively. I do not wish to revisit those discussions in this thread.

    I will note the Jews - who would be rebuilding the next temple - hold to the temple mount location as being where the temple stood.
     
  9. sovereigngrace

    sovereigngrace Well-Known Member

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    · Is the second coming of Christ a past event, an ongoing process or a literal physical future climactic event?
    · Is the resurrection of the dead a past event, an ongoing process or a literal physical future climactic event?
    · Is the judgment of all a past event, an ongoing process or a literal physical future climactic event?
     
  10. sovereigngrace

    sovereigngrace Well-Known Member

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  11. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    I believe you are right in this statement above. Which only proves you are wrong about Christ not having returned once already. Because He said to the disciples that He would "receive you unto myself, that where I am, there ye may be also". This is echoed in the rapture text of I Thess. 4. The resurrected saints would "meet the Lord in the air", and return to heaven with Him. On that occasion, Christ WOULD NOT REMAIN ON EARTH - HE WOULD LEAVE WITH THE RESURRECTED SAINTS AND RETURN TO HEAVEN.

    This necessitates yet ANOTHER RETURN OF CHRIST in our future if He is to remain on earth, since none of the bodies of the saints are to be left behind in the dust of the grave.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2021
  12. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Jesus's future return to this earth is in Ezekiel 39:21.

    21 And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see my judgment that I have executed, and my hand that I have laid upon them.
     
  13. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    That was the PAST judgment upon Israel in the "days of vengeance" from AD 66 - 70. It can't be the particular occasion of the future return of Christ for us being discussed there, because all the HEATHEN at that point would see the hand of God's judgment on Israel. When God wraps things up for humanity at the close of history, there won't be any "heathen" left. Even ethnic Israel going into captivity at that point "from that day forward" (meaning time would keep marching forward) would be forced to acknowledge that it was by God's hand that they "all fell by the sword" (Ezekiel 39:23).
     
  14. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Jesus's glory was not set amongst the heathen in 70 AD or to present, it is still future.

    21 And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see my judgment that I have executed, and my hand that I have laid upon them.

    Ezekiel 39:17-20 corresponds to Revelation 19:17-18.
    Ezekiel 39:28 corresponds to Matthew 24:31.

    No, verse 23 is that the Jews will know that Jesus is the Lord their God from that day and forward. Right know they don't believe that Jesus is the Lord their God, who entered into the world in the form of a man.
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2021
  15. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    No offense at all taken at your long list of "machine gun" questions given earlier. If I didn't have work orders with deadlines sitting on my table, I would like nothing better than to post all day long with you guys. Much more fun than work orders. For your abbreviated list here...

    #1) Is the second coming of Christ a past event, an ongoing process or a literal physical future climactic event? Answer: Christ's second coming was a past event that fell on AD 70's Pentecost Day (Daniel's prophesied 1,335th day), with numerous references and warnings in the NT as to its imminent arrival in their generation.

    #2) Is the resurrection of the dead a past event, an ongoing process or a literal physical future climactic event? Answer: Yes to all these. There have been two past physical resurrection events back in Passover AD 33 with Christ and the Mathew 27 saints, and also that second resurrection on AD 70's Pentecost Day (the 1,335th day). There has also been an ongoing spiritual resurrection to life for all the children of faith ever since creation, and there will also be a literal, physical future climactic conclusion to fallen man's history in a final third resurrection.

    #3) Is the judgment of all a past event, an ongoing process or a literal physical future climactic event? Answer: If you are speaking of a "great white throne" type of judgment, ALL must eventually give an account before God. Just not all in one, solitary event. God has staged this judgment in phases - one at the close of the OC age, and one that will occur at the close of the New Covenant age.

    Preterists are correct that a judgment took place back in AD 70, as scripture clearly teaches if one is honest with all the time-relevant phrases, terms, and the parables given by Christ. But since "we must ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ, to receive the things done in our body, whether they be good or evil", that necessitates yet ANOTHER JUDGMENT in the future for the rest of us to participate in. A judgment of rewards for the saints, or a lack thereof, depending on our level of faithfulness.

    "The ungodly shall not stand in the judgment." (Ps. 1:5). Without Christ's righteous covering, they end up being destroyed by God's judgment, with their body, soul, and spirit all perishing. This has happened once already back in AD 70, and will happen again at Christ's next return. Like a computer trash bin that was already emptied once, and has been gradually filling up again since AD 70.
     
  16. Spiritual Jew

    Spiritual Jew Well-Known Member Supporter

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    If it's not then why didn't you answer my questions? The fact that you didn't shows to me that it is such a dilemma for you that you can't even answer the questions I asked.
     
  17. Spiritual Jew

    Spiritual Jew Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Do you believe the entire book of Revelation is already fulfilled?
     
  18. sovereigngrace

    sovereigngrace Well-Known Member

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    Totally agree!
     
  19. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    Ezekiel 39:17-20 and Revelation 19:17-18 certainly do correspond as being the same event, but they are definitely past events, since the Gog / Magog conflict of Revelation is included in the revealed "AT HAND" prophecies of Revelation. We have to use GOD'S definition of when an "AT HAND" prophecy was to be fulfilled - which was NOT to be "prolonged" into "times that are far off", such as our future.

    These two do NOT correspond. Ezekiel 39:28 was God promising through the prophet Ezekiel about the post-exilic return period. That is why God said "NOW will I bring again the captivity of Jacob, and have mercy upon the whole house of Israel, and will be jealous for my holy name; AFTER they have borne their shame, and all their trespasses whereby they have trespassed against me, when they dwelt safely in their land, and none made them afraid."

    Ezekiel was at that time along with the captivity which was then "bearing their shame" for their wickedness as a nation. When their 70 years of prophesied exile had expired, God would then "bring again the captivity of Jacob" in the post-exilic return period. There is a distinct break in Ezekiel's prophetic content between Ezekiel 39:24's end of the Gog prophecy, and Ezekiel 39:25 which reverted back to Ezekiel's present circumstances.

    As for Matthew 24:31, the angels gathering the elect took place at Christ's AD 70 return, which was "IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION OF THOSE DAYS".

    PLEASE TAKE NOTE: there is a looong record of history following the Great Tribulation, in which no tribulation period would be of the same type compared to that Great Tribulation from earlier time - "No, nor ever SHALL BE" (Matthew 24:21). Now, if Christ returned "IMMEDIATELY AFTER" that Great Tribulation, and history would keep marching forward for a looong time AFTER that Great Tribulation, then we have the proof of a third coming for Christ with a third resurrection event in our future.
     
  20. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    Yes.
    Which isn't at all "IN LIKE MANNER" as He left.
    :scratch:

    Weird.
     
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