Premillennialism safe house

[ewq1938]

One resurrection of the dead or two?

Some of Amil believe the resurrection of the unrighteous immediately follow the resurrection of the righteous at a general resurrection but sometimes admits there could be a second or more inbetween the two resurrections. That promotes two different resurrections separated by a short time period, yet Amil also denies there are two resurrections.

Another variant of Amil believes that Revelation 20 does not show two resurrections despite the text declaring "the rest of the dead lived not" proving a group of the dead did live again, and that a second group of the dead would live again at a later time.

 

[BobRyan]

Members who chose to participate in this safe house should believe in premillennialism (see definition below). This thread is for discussing end time events and prophecy (Biblical) from an premillennial point of view. Fellowship posts from all members are welcome.

• This safe house thread is for those members who believe in premillennialism.

• The safe house is for discussion and not for debate. Debate is defined as: "Engaging in argument by discussing opposing points."

• Members who do not believe in premillennialism may post in fellowship only.

• No posts from this safe house may be quoted in other threads or used to start discussion threads in the main Eschatology forum.

• Premillennialism: is the belief that Jesus Christ will literally and physically be on the earth for his millennial reign at his second coming. The doctrine is called premillennialism because it holds that Jesus' physical return to earth will occur prior to the inauguration of the millennium.

Is this also the safe house for the pre-mill literal 2nd coming, post-trib view where the saints spend the literal millennium in heaven with Christ?

"The first resurrection" described by John in Rev 20:4-5 being the resurrection of the saints - that we find in 1Thess 4 rapture and resurrection- and Christ takes all the saints to heaven to be with him as He states in Matthew 24.

Does that also fit the category for this safe house?

 

[ewq1938]

How many armies are in Rev 19-20?

Rev 19-20 speaks of three armies. One of that belongs to the beast which is defeated by the return of Christ and his army, then after satan is released from the pit he raises a new army which does not face an army of God but is destroyed by fire from God the Father in heaven. Amil typically teaches there are only two armies which contradicts what we are given.

The beast's Rev 19 army defeated by God the Son and army, satan's Rev 20 army defeated by God the Father with no army. The first battle happens before the thousand years and the second happens after the thousand years has ended.

 

[ewq1938]

The Battle of Armageddon (in the valley of Megiddo) is the same battle found in Rev 20:8-9? (Gog Magog)

Amil typically teaches these are the same battle yet they clearly are not:

In Rev 19 a battle involving two armies is fought at Armageddon (in the valley of Megiddo).
One army is led by the Rev 13:1 beast and the false prophet, and the other is led by Christ at his second coming. He and his army destroy the enemy army and the beast and FP are cast into the lake of fire. All this before the Rev 20's "a thousand years" even begins.

After the end of the "a thousand years", Rev 20:8-9 shows an army led by satan (the beast and false prophet already having been defeated and are in the lake of fire) surrounding Jerusalem and facing no opposing army. Instead of Christ and his army defeating this army, God the Father rains fire from heaven and destroys them. This second battle happens just outside of Jerusalem and Jerusalem is 50 miles away from the valley of Megiddo.

Satan is then cast into the lake of fire where the beast and the false prophet already are proving they were cast into the lake of fire at an earlier time before satan was further proving the two battles are not the same battle repeated twice.

Clearly two different places and two different battles where an army of evil is destroyed.

 

[ewq1938]

Proving the thousand years of Revelation 20 is exactly 1000 years.

The Greek word chilias "thousand" G5505 is only used in scripture when there is multiples of thousands of something:


Luk_14:31 OrG2228 whatG5101 king,G935 goingG4198 to make warG4820 G1519 G4171 against anotherG2087 king,G935 sitteth not downG2523 G3780 first,G4412 andG2532 consultethG1011 whetherG1487 he beG2076 ableG1415 withG1722 tenG1176 thousandG5505 to meetG528 him that comethG2064 againstG1909 himG846 withG3326 twentyG1501 thousand?G5505

Act_4:4 HowbeitG1161 manyG4183 of them which heardG191 theG3588 wordG3056 believed;G4100 andG2532 theG3588 numberG706 of theG3588 menG435 wasG1096 aboutG5616 fiveG4002 thousand.G5505

1Co_10:8 NeitherG3366 let us commit fornication,G4203 asG2531 someG5100 of themG846 committed,G4203 andG2532 fellG4098 inG1722 oneG3391 dayG2250 three and twenty thousand.G5140 G1501 G5505

Rev_5:11 AndG2532 I beheld,G1492 andG2532 I heardG191 the voiceG5456 of manyG4183 angelsG32 round aboutG2943 theG3588 throneG2362 andG2532 theG3588 beastsG2226 andG2532 theG3588 elders:G4245 andG2532 theG3588 numberG706 of themG846 wasG2258 ten thousand times ten thousand,G3461 G3461 andG2532 thousands of thousands;G5505 G5505

Rev_7:4 AndG2532 I heardG191 theG3588 numberG706 of them which were sealed:G4972 and there were sealedG4972 an hundred and forty and four thousandG1540 G5062 G5064 G5505 ofG1537 allG3956 the tribesG5443 of the childrenG5207 of Israel.G2474
Rev_7:5 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of JudaG2455 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of ReubenG4502 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of GadG1045 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505
Rev_7:6 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of AserG768 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of NepthalimG3508 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of ManassesG3128 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505
Rev_7:7 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of SimeonG4826 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of LeviG3017 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of IssacharG2466 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505
Rev_7:8 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of ZabulonG2194 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of JosephG2501 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505 OfG1537 the tribeG5443 of BenjaminG958 were sealedG4972 twelveG1427 thousand.G5505

Rev_11:13 AndG2532 the sameG1565 hourG5610 wasG1096 there a greatG3173 earthquake,G4578 andG2532 theG3588 tenth partG1182 of theG3588 cityG4172 fell,G4098 andG2532 inG1722 theG3588 earthquakeG4578 were slainG615 of(G3686) menG444 sevenG2033 thousand:G5505 andG2532 theG3588 remnantG3062 wereG1096 affrighted,G1719 andG2532 gaveG1325 gloryG1391 to theG3588 GodG2316 of heaven.G3772

Rev_14:1 AndG2532 I looked,G1492 and,G2532 lo,G2400 a LambG721 stoodG2476 onG1909 theG3588 mountG3735 Sion,G4622 andG2532 withG3326 himG846 an hundred forty and four thousand,G1540 G5062 G5064 G5505 havingG2192 hisG848 Father'sG3962 nameG3686 writtenG1125 inG1909 theirG848 foreheads.G3359

Rev_14:3 AndG2532 they sungG103 as it wereG5613 a newG2537 songG5603 beforeG1799 theG3588 throne,G2362 andG2532 beforeG1799 theG3588 fourG5064 beasts,G2226 andG2532 theG3588 elders:G4245 andG2532 no manG3762 couldG1410 learnG3129 that songG5603 butG1508 theG3588 hundred and forty and four thousand,G1540 G5062 G5064 G5505 which were redeemedG59 fromG575 theG3588 earth.G1093

Rev_21:16 AndG2532 theG3588 cityG4172 liethG2749 foursquare,G5068 andG2532 theG3588 lengthG3372 (G848) isG2076 as largeG5118 asG3745 theG3588 breadth:G4114 andG2532 he measuredG3354 theG3588 cityG4172 with theG3588 reed,G2563 twelveG1427 thousandG5505 (G1909) furlongs.G4712 TheG3588 lengthG3372 andG2532 theG3588 breadthG4114 andG2532 theG3588 heightG5311 of itG846 areG2076 equal.G2470


Yet when the number is only one single thousand of something or one thousand plus another number that's less than two thousand, the Greek word chilioi G5507 is used:


2Pe_3:8 But,G1161 beloved,G27 be not ignorantG2990 G3361 of thisG5124 one thing,G1520 thatG3754 oneG3391 dayG2250 is withG3844 the LordG2962 asG5613 a thousandG5507 years,G2094 andG2532 a thousandG5507 yearsG2094 asG5613 oneG3391 day.G2250

Rev_11:3 AndG2532 I will giveG1325 power unto myG3450 twoG1417 witnesses,G3144 andG2532 they shall prophesyG4395 a thousand two hundred and threescoreG5507 G1250 G1835 days,G2250 clothedG4016 in sackcloth.G4526

Rev_12:6 AndG2532 theG3588 womanG1135 fledG5343 intoG1519 theG3588 wilderness,G2048 whereG3699 she hathG2192 a placeG5117 preparedG2090 ofG575 God,G2316 thatG2443 they should feedG5142 herG846 thereG1563 a thousand two hundred and threescoreG5507 G1250 G1835 days.G2250

Rev_14:20 AndG2532 theG3588 winepressG3025 was troddenG3961 withoutG1854 theG3588 city,G4172 andG2532 bloodG129 cameG1831 out ofG1537 theG3588 winepress,G3025 even untoG891 theG3588 horseG2462 bridles,G5469 by the space ofG575 a thousand and six hundredG5507 G1812 furlongs.G4712

Rev_20:2 AndG2532 he laid hold onG2902 theG3588 dragon,G1404 that oldG744 serpent,G3789 whichG3739 isG2076 the Devil,G1228 andG2532 Satan,G4567 andG2532 boundG1210 himG846 a thousandG5507 years,G2094

Rev_20:3 AndG2532 castG906 himG846 intoG1519 theG3588 bottomless pit,G12 andG2532 shut him up,G2808 G846 andG2532 set a sealG4972 uponG1883 him,G846 thatG2443 he should deceiveG4105 theG3588 nationsG1484 noG3361 more,G2089 tillG891 theG3588 thousandG5507 yearsG2094 should be fulfilled:G5055 andG2532 afterG3326 thatG5023 heG846 mustG1163 be loosedG3089 a littleG3398 season.G5550

Rev_20:4 AndG2532 I sawG1492 thrones,G2362 andG2532 they satG2523 uponG1909 them,G846 andG2532 judgmentG2917 was givenG1325 unto them:G846 andG2532 I saw theG3588 soulsG5590 of them that were beheadedG3990 forG1223 theG3588 witnessG3141 of Jesus,G2424 andG2532 forG1223 theG3588 wordG3056 of God,G2316 andG2532 whichG3748 had notG3756 worshippedG4352 theG3588 beast,G2342 neitherG3777 hisG846 image,G1504 neitherG2532 G3756 had receivedG2983 his markG5480 uponG1909 theirG848 foreheads,G3359 orG2532 inG1909 theirG848 hands;G5495 andG2532 they livedG2198 andG2532 reignedG936 withG3326 ChristG5547 a thousandG5507 years.G2094

Rev_20:5 ButG1161 theG3588 restG3062 of theG3588 deadG3498 lived not againG326 G3756 untilG2193 theG3588 thousandG5507 yearsG2094 were finished.G5055 ThisG3778 is theG3588 firstG4413 resurrection.G386

Rev_20:6 BlessedG3107 andG2532 holyG40 is he that hathG2192 partG3313 inG1722 theG3588 firstG4413 resurrection:G386 onG1909 suchG5130 theG3588 secondG1208 deathG2288 hathG2192 noG3756 power,G1849 butG235 they shall beG2071 priestsG2409 of GodG2316 andG2532 of Christ,G5547 andG2532 shall reignG936 withG3326 himG846 a thousandG5507 years.G2094

Rev_20:7 AndG2532 whenG3752 theG3588 thousandG5507 yearsG2094 are expired,G5055 SatanG4567 shall be loosedG3089 out ofG1537 hisG846 prison,G5438

Mar 5:13 AndG2532 forthwithG2112 JesusG2424 gave them leave.G2010 G846 AndG2532 theG3588 uncleanG169 spiritsG4151 went out,G1831 andG2532 enteredG1525 intoG1519 theG3588 swine:G5519 andG2532 theG3588 herdG34 ran violentlyG3729 downG2596 a steep placeG2911 intoG1519 theG3588 sea,G2281 (they(G1161) wereG2258 aboutG5613 two thousand; )G1367 andG2532 were chokedG4155 inG1722 theG3588 sea.G2281

Here we have a Greek word G1367 dischilioi. "Dis" means two or twice and chilioi (G5507) means a thousand so this word means two thousand. Naturally then if there was one chilioi (G5507) it would be exactly a thousand just as it is in every occurrence of the word in the NT.


This is indisputable evidence that the thousand years is exactly a thousand years.



Rev_11:3 AndG2532 I will giveG1325 power unto myG3450 twoG1417 witnesses,G3144 andG2532 they shall prophesyG4395 a thousand two hundred and threescoreG5507 G1250 G1835 days,G2250 clothedG4016 in sackcloth.G4526

G5507 always means exactly one thousand like it does here. To mean more it needs to have more added to it. Here we have G5507 as exactly one thousand and then 260 added to that one thousand. Guess what? If we removed the 260 we have how many? Exactly one thousand, G5507.

So when we have G5507 alone, it is exactly one thousand. And when scripture speaks of "thousands" in the plural it uses G5505 not G5507.

Rev_5:11 AndG2532 I beheld,G1492 andG2532 I heardG191 the voiceG5456 of manyG4183 angelsG32 round aboutG2943 theG3588 throneG2362 andG2532 theG3588 beastsG2226 andG2532 theG3588 elders:G4245 andG2532 theG3588 numberG706 of themG846 wasG2258 ten thousand times ten thousand,G3461 G3461 andG2532 thousands of thousands;G5505 G5505

If Revelation 20's thousand years was thousands of years like Amillennialism claims, the word needed would be G5505 especially the double appearance of the word as found in Revelation 5:11, "thousands of thousands" which is truly an unknown amount. G5507 strictly means only one thousand and no more. It cannot mean 1001, nor an unknown number of thousands or Millions etc.

I'll use an example to further explain the difference of the two words.

5505 is like a thousand dollar bill. There is just one in your hand but it's worth a thousand dollars and the word is written in the singular because of this.

5507 is like having one thousand dollar bills. That's worth the same exact amount, but it's a plural word because there is a thousand of something rather than one thing that equals a thousand. Imagine in your left hand a thousand dollar bill, and in your right hand a thousand dollar bills. Same amount but the way each amount is represented is different.

5507 is plural in this sense, not that it means more than a thousand or multiples of thousands like 2000. That is not what the plural aspect means but that is how Amillennialism wrongly misuses it's plurality.

 

[Adamina]

Here is proof that the thousand years takes place after the second coming:

Rev 2:25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.

That is the second coming.

Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

After "the end" comes, there is given power over the nations to those that are overcomers which naturally includes those who "are alive and remain" at the second coming. They will be given power over the nations.

Rev 2:27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.

After the second coming and after "the end" will the overcomers be given power over the nations, ruling them with a rod of iron. That proves the rod of iron rule over the nations for a thousand years does not even start until Christ has returned and has given overcomers this power to rule over the nations.

I also agree that Christ returns before the 1000yr period.

 

[Broken Fence]

Hi David,

The reason we will not is because God`s word tell us that our inheritance is with the Lord on His throne.

`To Him who overcomes, I will grant to sit with me on my throne as I also overcame and sat down with my Father on His throne.` (Rev. 3: 21)

Marilyn.

Couldn't some reign in heaven with God the Father and some reign on earth with Jesus. I think both are plausible. Couldn't God decide who goes up and who stays on earth?

 

[Marilyn C]

Couldn't some reign in heaven with God the Father and some reign on earth with Jesus. I think both are plausible. Couldn't God decide who goes up and who stays on earth?

Yes God has purposed that all come under Christ`s rule. He will rule from the highest, (Eph. 1: 20 & 21) with the Body of Christ, then the Old Testament saints will be in the New Jerusalem, further down over the earth, and finally Israel will rule over the nations of the new earth, as promised.

I have written about this in detail in my blogs here. Look under my name, and then `End Times,` & then `God`s Eternal Purposes.

 

[Marilyn C]

 

[Randy777]

This is my understanding from reading the NT. That is Christ's 2nd coming is on the last day. There are no other gatherings of believers. No pre-tribulation rapture.

Historic premillennialism is the designation made by premillennialists, now also known as post-tribulational premillennialism. The doctrine is called "historic" because many early church fathers (such as Ireneaus, Polycarp, Justin Martyr, and Papias) appear to have held it

In regard to the resurrection it was well understood and taught that Jesus would send His angels out to gather from the ends of the heavens to the ends of the earth. The resurrection of us all and those left alive on earth caught up and clothed with immortality. That it is a bodily resurrection. It is noted in the 1st resurrection in REV that there are those that remained faithful to Jesus. Therefore those not raised on that day must be those who suffer.

 

[Marilyn C]

This is my understanding from reading the NT. That is Christ's 2nd coming is on the last day. There are no other gatherings of believers. No pre-tribulation rapture.

Historic premillennialism is the designation made by premillennialists, now also known as post-tribulational premillennialism. The doctrine is called "historic" because many early church fathers (such as Ireneaus, Polycarp, Justin Martyr, and Papias) appear to have held it

In regard to the resurrection it was well understood and taught that Jesus would send His angels out to gather from the ends of the heavens to the ends of the earth. The resurrection of us all and those left alive on earth caught up and clothed with immortality. That it is a bodily resurrection. It is noted in the 1st resurrection in REV that there are those that remained faithful to Jesus. Therefore those not raised on that day must be those who suffer.

Hi Randy,

It seems to me you are confusing what the Lord has said to the people of Israel and what he says to the Body of Christ. We can`t just read God`s word as all about us. We don`t read newspapers etc that way. `Who is talking to whom,` is basic in language.

In the 4 gospels we read truths however there is no revelation of the Body of Christ till the Lord reveals it to the apostle Paul after He ascended to the Father and gave His Holy Spirit to guide the Body in to all truth.

Those in Rev. being resurrected come alive from the dead and are given their new bodies for the earth.

The Body of Christ is changed unto like Christ`s body that is suited for the highest realm. Different altogether.

 

[Randy777]

Hi Randy,

It seems to me you are confusing what the Lord has said to the people of Israel and what he says to the Body of Christ. We can`t just read God`s word as all about us. We don`t read newspapers etc that way. `Who is talking to whom,` is basic in language.

In the 4 gospels we read truths however there is no revelation of the Body of Christ till the Lord reveals it to the apostle Paul after He ascended to the Father and gave His Holy Spirit to guide the Body in to all truth.

Those in Rev. being resurrected come alive from the dead and are given their new bodies for the earth.

The Body of Christ is changed unto like Christ`s body that is suited for the highest realm. Different altogether.

I understand His message but I am having trouble understanding your message.

Those God calls His children.
children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God

What part of the resurrection that I outlined do you think I am confused about?

 

[Marilyn C]

I understand His message but I am having trouble understanding your message.

Those God calls His children.
children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God

What part of the resurrection that I outlined do you think I am confused about?

Hi Randy,

Many people are privileged to be called `God`s children` but all do not have the same inheritance.
There are those who looked to God before the flood, after the flood, in Israel, in the nations, then in the Body of Christ, and then those after us.

The last day refers to the last day of this earth and that is still a long way ahead. Then there is the Great White Throne judgment for all the dead in the earth & sea. They will be raised and judged on their works according to their conscience. Some who have never heard of Jesus will be judged how they lived righteously or evil. (Rev. 20: 11 - 15)

Now Jesus returns before that time to deliver Israel and judge the nations as to how they treated Israel. (Joel 3: 1 & 2) Those of the nations who looked after the Jews will go into the millennium and learn of God`s ways. (Micah 4: 1 - 3)

God sends His angels to gather in the persecuted Jews from around the world. They come back to Israel. (Isa. 66: 20 & 21)

Those that were martyred (in the trib) are resurrected to life and reign on earth.

The Body of Christ is not resurrected to earthly life but our bodies are CHANGED to be like the Lord`s and we shall reign in the highest heavenly realm. (Rev. 3: 21)

Good subject to look into. Remember `all are God`s children` but with different inheritances under CHRIST rule.

 

[Randy777]

Hi Randy,

Many people are privileged to be called `God`s children` but all do not have the same inheritance.
There are those who looked to God before the flood, after the flood, in Israel, in the nations, then in the Body of Christ, and then those after us.

The last day refers to the last day of this earth and that is still a long way ahead. Then there is the Great White Throne judgment for all the dead in the earth & sea. They will be raised and judged on their works according to their conscience. Some who have never heard of Jesus will be judged how they lived righteously or evil. (Rev. 20: 11 - 15)

Now Jesus returns before that time to deliver Israel and judge the nations as to how they treated Israel. (Joel 3: 1 & 2) Those of the nations who looked after the Jews will go into the millennium and learn of God`s ways. (Micah 4: 1 - 3)

God sends His angels to gather in the persecuted Jews from around the world. They come back to Israel. (Isa. 66: 20 & 21)

Those that were martyred (in the trib) are resurrected to life and reign on earth.

The Body of Christ is not resurrected to earthly life but our bodies are CHANGED to be like the Lord`s and we shall reign in the highest heavenly realm. (Rev. 3: 21)

Good subject to look into. Remember `all are God`s children` but with different inheritances under CHRIST rule.

I not aware of any christian body that teaches what you just wrote. I greatly disagree with you.

The body of Christ is resurrected to this earth. And the last day is the resurrection day. They understood that.
Martha answered, “I know he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

The gathering will be from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens. (ALL)
And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens

And the resurrection will be on this earth.
Worthy are You to take the scroll and open its seals,
because You were slain,
and by Your blood You purchased for God
those from every tribe and tongue and people and nation.
You have made them to be a kingdom
and priests to serve our God,
and they will reign upon the earth.”

To the one who is victorious and does my will to the end, I will give authority over the nations— that one ‘will rule them with an iron scepter and will dash them to pieces like pottery’ —just as I have received authority from my Father. I will also give that one the morning star. Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches

 

[ewq1938]

I not aware of any christian body that teaches what you just wrote. I greatly disagree with you.

The body of Christ is resurrected to this earth. And the last day is the resurrection day. They understood that.
Martha answered, “I know he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

What happens after the resurrection?

 

[Randy777]

What happens after the resurrection?

What is written after the 1000 years is over.

 

[Marilyn C]

I not aware of any christian body that teaches what you just wrote. I greatly disagree with you.

The body of Christ is resurrected to this earth. And the last day is the resurrection day. They understood that.
Martha answered, “I know he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”

The gathering will be from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens. (ALL)
And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens

And the resurrection will be on this earth.
Worthy are You to take the scroll and open its seals,
because You were slain,
and by Your blood You purchased for God
those from every tribe and tongue and people and nation.
You have made them to be a kingdom
and priests to serve our God,
and they will reign upon the earth.”

To the one who is victorious and does my will to the end, I will give authority over the nations— that one ‘will rule them with an iron scepter and will dash them to pieces like pottery’ —just as I have received authority from my Father. I will also give that one the morning star. Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches

Hi Randy,

Jesus is talking to Martha regarding those of Israel and the nations. They will go to the grave and then the GWT. However the Body of Christ when they die go to the General Assembly, (Heb. 12" 22 & 23) and their spirits are waiting to be changed to like the Lord`s. The Body of Christ is NOT judged for the Lord took our punishment on the cross. Praise His holy name.

As to Rev. 5: 10 that is a misinterpretation. The word in Greek is `epi` and means either `over or on.` Thus we need more understanding from scripture So let`s see what God says on that topic.


IN HEAVEN

Our inheritance, our hope, our place, our citizenship, all of which are IN HEAVEN.

`...to an inheritance incorruptible and undefiled and that does not fade away, reserved in heaven for you.` (1 Peter 1: 4 )

` ...because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of truth..`(Col. 1: 5)

` ...and raised us up together and made to sit in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus.`(Eph. 2: 6)

` For our citizenship is in heaven, from which we also eagerly await for the saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ.` (Phil. 3: 20)

 

[Randy777]

Hi Randy,

Jesus is talking to Martha regarding those of Israel and the nations. They will go to the grave and then the GWT. However the Body of Christ when they die go to the General Assembly, (Heb. 12" 22 & 23) and their spirits are waiting to be changed to like the Lord`s. The Body of Christ is NOT judged for the Lord took our punishment on the cross. Praise His holy name.

As to Rev. 5: 10 that is a misinterpretation. The word in Greek is `epi` and means either `over or on.` Thus we need more understanding from scripture So let`s see what God says on that topic.


IN HEAVEN

Our inheritance, our hope, our place, our citizenship, all of which are IN HEAVEN.

`...to an inheritance incorruptible and undefiled and that does not fade away, reserved in heaven for you.` (1 Peter 1: 4 )

` ...because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of truth..`(Col. 1: 5)

` ...and raised us up together and made to sit in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus.`(Eph. 2: 6)

` For our citizenship is in heaven, from which we also eagerly await for the saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ.` (Phil. 3: 20)

This is indeed the will of my Father, that all who see the Son and believe in him may have eternal life; and I will raise them up on the last day.

Jesus remains in heaven UNTIL His enemies are made His footstool.

'The Lord said to my Lord: "Sit at my right hand until I put your enemies under your feet."'

That happens at the 2nd coming in the great battle of God almighty.

 

[Marilyn C]

This is indeed the will of my Father, that all who see the Son and believe in him may have eternal life; and I will raise them up on the last day.

Jesus remains in heaven UNTIL His enemies are made His footstool.

'The Lord said to my Lord: "Sit at my right hand until I put your enemies under your feet."'

That happens at the 2nd coming in the great battle of God almighty.

Good scripture there, Ps. 110. And when are His enemies made His footstool? Yes at the beginning of the trib, so that the Son can bring the judgments upon the rebellious nations and put down all rule and authority and power. (1 Cor. 15: 23, Rev. 8 & 9)

`...the Father......has given Him, (Jesus) authority to execute judgment also,....` (John 3: 27)

 

[Randy777]

Good scripture there, Ps. 110. And when are His enemies made His footstool? Yes at the beginning of the trib, so that the Son can bring the judgments upon the rebellious nations and put down all rule and authority and power. (1 Cor. 15: 23, Rev. 8 & 9)

`...the Father......has given Him, (Jesus) authority to execute judgment also,....` (John 3: 27)

So those armies Jesus destroys at His 2nd coming are not His, (Gods), enemies?
Read Zach 14 as it speaks of that last day. A unique day.

And again Jesus will raise ALL of us up on the last day as that is His Fathers will just as Martha understood.