Praying in Tongues

[Dave Darling]

Hey, something interesting- if you pray in tongues, have you noticed that you seem to be saying something different in your tongue language based on what you are thinking about? This often happens with me.

 

[sandman]

Hey, something interesting- if you pray in tongues, have you noticed that you seem to be saying something different in your tongue language based on what you are thinking about? This often happens with me.

I think that is one of the cool things about speaking in tongues (SIT) …. You can think about a person and SIT for them (its prefect prayer) …because you are not using your mind when you SIT.

 

[ARBITER01]

Hey, something interesting- if you pray in tongues, have you noticed that you seem to be saying something different in your tongue language based on what you are thinking about? This often happens with me.

I can read a book, think about something else, or talk with Jesus while praying in tongues. It arises out of our spirit, not our mind, so yea, it is able to happen all the time.

 

[Blade]

Yes amen. I find though when I start it ..then at some point He takes over and and then I .. not have to but have to keep my mind on Him because His presences comes and .. for me I am not just some thing He uses meaning I can do what ever I want while He prays? No... anyway.

 

[Saint JOHN]

Hey, something interesting- if you pray in tongues, have you noticed that you seem to be saying something different in your tongue language based on what you are thinking about? This often happens with me.

Ro 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

as Jesus Christ said :

Joh 4:24 God [is] a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship [him] in spirit and in truth.

ie : Joh 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

so according to the word how to worship in spirit..

1Co 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

this is a command of Jesus Christ which most sudo Christians disobey or make excuses. See mark 16v16 + to verify a believer (Gods way )

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments!

1Co 14:2 For he that speaketh in an [unknown] tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth [him]; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

many make excuses eg;

1Co 14:18 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:........ but "in the church" no more than 3 with corresponding interpretation and at most 2-3 prophecy


this is how a church ( people not a building ) was, and is run.

 

[tturt]

Since there's a diversities of tongues (I Cor 12) seems there would be differences. Supporting the OP imo

Here's a list of Biblical purposes for tongues:
-Personal prayer language - Speaking to/with God
-Intercessory prayer language - Praying for others in the Spirit
-Warfare language - Tongues directly aimed at demonic strongholds
-Prophetic language - Addressing the whole church/preferably with interpretation
-Singing in the Spirit - Singing in tongues/worship activity
-Praise language - Magnifying the Lord in worship tongues
-Evangelistic language - Speaking the message of God to a people in their own language (not learned by the speaker).
(Saint Steven gave permission to use his basic list).

There's over 6500 languages and some are unusual including clicking sounds. But God isn't limited to those.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Since there's a diversities of tongues (I Cor 12) seems there would be differences. Supporting the OP imo

Here's a list of Biblical purposes for tongues:
-Personal prayer language - Speaking to/with God
-Intercessory prayer language - Praying for others in the Spirit
-Warfare language - Tongues directly aimed at demonic strongholds
-Prophetic language - Addressing the whole church/preferably with interpretation
-Singing in the Spirit - Singing in tongues/worship activity
-Praise language - Magnifying the Lord in worship tongues
-Evangelistic language - Speaking the message of God to a people in their own language (not learned by the speaker).
(Saint Steven gave permission to use his basic list).

There's over 6500 languages and some are unusual including clicking sounds. But God isn't limited to those.

These days I don't bother with all these definitions. I base my faith in my use of tongues on 1 Corinthians 14:2. Furthermore I believe all believers can pray in tongues, and it is not an "Apostolic gift" as some claim as limited to the first century Apostles. Paul said "I would that you all speak in tongues". Why would he say that if the gift was limited to just the Apostles? Doesn't make sense, other than that Paul is showing that the ability to pray in tongues is there for all believers who want to receive it.

I don't worry about the language I use. When I pray in the Spirit, I ask the Lord to guide my tongue so I can pray the most appropriate prayer for the occasion, whether it be praise, fellowship or intercession. Then I just trust the Lord to receive my prayer and to act in accordance with His sovereignty.

We can get tied up in the mechanics of it all instead of just using it for which it was designed.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Ro 8:26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.

as Jesus Christ said :

Joh 4:24 God [is] a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship [him] in spirit and in truth.

ie : Joh 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

so according to the word how to worship in spirit..

1Co 14:14 For if I pray in an [unknown] tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

this is a command of Jesus Christ which most sudo Christians disobey or make excuses. See mark 16v16 + to verify a believer (Gods way )

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments!

1Co 14:2 For he that speaketh in an [unknown] tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth [him]; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

many make excuses eg;

1Co 14:18 I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:........ but "in the church" no more than 3 with corresponding interpretation and at most 2-3 prophecy


this is how a church ( people not a building ) was, and is run.

Personal prayer in tongues is available to all believers and usually done in the private prayer room of the believer. It is not an "Apostolic Sign Gift" at all. If it was, Paul would not have said, "I would that you all speak with tongues."

The Gift of Tongues spoken public in church is a ministry gift accompanied by Interpretation of Tongues. It is not for all believers, but only for those to whom the Spirit has endowed the gift for ministry in the church. That is why Paul limits the public speaking of tongues to two or three, because there may be just two or three who have that particular gift for the public church gathering. This is why he says, "Do all speak with tongues?" The answer is clear - no. But he is talking about the public ministry of tongues and not the private praying in tongues which he supports by saying, "I would that you all speak with tongues". Otherwise one statement would contradict the other, wouldn't it?

Many cessationists either deliberately or in ignorance, confuse the two types of tongues. I think that often they have a blind spot concerning tongues, possibly because they have observed the widespread misuse of it in the kuckoobananatown meetings where along with the jerking, shaking, falling over, uncontrolled stupidity, there is uncontrolled babbling in what they think is tongues but is actual gibberish in the flesh. But when tongues is used according to Paul's teaching in 1 Corinthians 14, then it is the true gift.

If we read 1 Corinthians 14 without any religious prejudice, we can clearly see the distinction that Paul makes between private praying in tongues (speaking to God mysteries in the Spirit), and public speaking in tongues requiring interpretation so that all may be edified. Further more, Paul says that he prays and sings with his understanding (his normal language) and prays and sings in the Spirit (in tongues). But he doesn't do it in the church gathering otherwise he would be contradicting his own teaching about the preference of prophecy unless the tongues is interpreted. And when he says, "I thank God I speak in tongues more than you all", it is obvious that he does it outside of the church gathering and when he is praying in private.

But then I am using my common sense brain when reading 1 Corinthians 14, rather than allowing religious prejudice to corrupt my thinking. As a former Pentecostal I had no problem with people babbling away in public meetings. Although I have no problem in praying quietly in tongues in support of people being prayed for at an altar call, because I am doing as Paul says, "To myself and to God", I have doubts that those who babble away in public without interpretation are actually praying in tongues at all. But praying out loud in tongues during a church prayer meeting where public visitors don't attend, I have no problem with that at all, because everyone in that meeting know exactly what they are doing, and the meeting is not for public ministry but for corporate prayer. This means that the group can choose to pray with the understanding or with the Spirit as they see fit.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Not all believers have the Holy Spirit enabled gift "diversities of tongues." But all believers can pray from their born-again spirit.

1 Corinthians 14:14 KJV
14. For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

I will go one step further and say all believers HAVE done this. Perhaps you were interceding under a burden from the Holy Spirit. Perhaps you were praising God with hymns and spiritual songs. Perhaps you were moaning or sighing or crying out. In each of these cases you were praying with sounds that you could not articulate in your natural language. I think people are expecting to be taken over by the Holy Spirit and that He will speak through you. That is not the way it works. You have an utterance. You cannot put what you are feeling (for the lack of a better word) into words, so you simply groan forth or sigh, or cry. This sounding is essentially meaningless to all who hear you. But God can hear it, see into your spirit, and know the meaning of your cry.

1 Corinthians 14:2 KJV
2. For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

I will be so bold as to say you have all prophesied. Just as there are two kinds of tongues (one is the gift of the Holy Spirit, on and expression of your born again spirit), there are two kinds of prophesying. Tongues are when you cannot articulate your inner move. Prophesying is when you can articulate what you mean. You do this when you praise in songs and hymns from out the spirit of Christ in you as apposed to the Holy Spirit utterance. I write songs from that bubble up within me.

Ephesians 5:18-20 KJV
18. And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;
19. Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;
20. Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;


Psalms 45:1 ISV
1. My heart is overflowing with good news; I speak what I have composed to the king; my tongue is like the pen of an articulate scribe.

The idea is to have a song "bubble up" from within.

Amos knew it.
Amos 3:8 ISV
8. A lion has roared! Who will not fear? The Lord GOD has spoken! Who will not prophesy?

David taught his singers to do it.

1 Chronicles 25:1-3 KJV
1. Moreover David and the captains of the host separated to the service of the sons of Asaph, and of Heman, and of Jeduthun, who should prophesy with harps, with psalteries, and with cymbals: and the number of the workmen according to their service was:
2. Of the sons of Asaph; Zaccur, and Joseph, and Nethaniah, and Asarelah, the sons of Asaph under the hands of Asaph, which prophesied according to the order of the king.
3. Of Jeduthun: the sons of Jeduthun; Gedaliah, and Zeri, and Jeshaiah, Hashabiah, and Mattithiah, six, under the hands of their father Jeduthun, who prophesied with a harp, to give thanks and to praise the LORD.

1 Corinthians 14:31-32 KJV
31. For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.
32. And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets.

Of course this has nothing to do with prediction or "this saith the Lord." This manifestation will only occur with the Holy Spirit enabled gifts, specifically the Word of Wisdom. The WOW is the gift to know things from the mind of God that cannot be known by any other means, including the future.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Not all believers have the Holy Spirit enabled gift "diversities of tongues." But all believers can pray from their born-again spirit.

1 Corinthians 14:14 KJV
14. For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

I will go one step further and say all believers HAVE done this. Perhaps you were interceding under a burden from the Holy Spirit. Perhaps you were praising God with hymns and spiritual songs. Perhaps you were moaning or sighing or crying out. In each of these cases you were praying with sounds that you could not articulate in your natural language. I think people are expecting to be taken over by the Holy Spirit and that He will speak through you. That is not the way it works. You have an utterance. You cannot put what you are feeling (for the lack of a better word) into words, so you simply groan forth or sigh, or cry. This sounding is essentially meaningless to all who hear you. But God can hear it, see into your spirit, and know the meaning of your cry.

1 Corinthians 14:2 KJV
2. For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

I will be so bold as to say you have all prophesied. Just as there are two kinds of tongues (one is the gift of the Holy Spirit, on and expression of your born again spirit), there are two kinds of prophesying. Tongues are when you cannot articulate your inner move. Prophesying is when you can articulate what you mean. You do this when you praise in songs and hymns from out the spirit of Christ in you as apposed to the Holy Spirit utterance. I write songs from that bubble up within me.

Ephesians 5:18-20 KJV
18. And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;
19. Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;
20. Giving thanks always for all things unto God and the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ;


Psalms 45:1 ISV
1. My heart is overflowing with good news; I speak what I have composed to the king; my tongue is like the pen of an articulate scribe.

The idea is to have a song "bubble up" from within.

Amos knew it.
Amos 3:8 ISV
8. A lion has roared! Who will not fear? The Lord GOD has spoken! Who will not prophesy?

David taught his singers to do it.

1 Chronicles 25:1-3 KJV
1. Moreover David and the captains of the host separated to the service of the sons of Asaph, and of Heman, and of Jeduthun, who should prophesy with harps, with psalteries, and with cymbals: and the number of the workmen according to their service was:
2. Of the sons of Asaph; Zaccur, and Joseph, and Nethaniah, and Asarelah, the sons of Asaph under the hands of Asaph, which prophesied according to the order of the king.
3. Of Jeduthun: the sons of Jeduthun; Gedaliah, and Zeri, and Jeshaiah, Hashabiah, and Mattithiah, six, under the hands of their father Jeduthun, who prophesied with a harp, to give thanks and to praise the LORD.

1 Corinthians 14:31-32 KJV
31. For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.
32. And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets.

Of course this has nothing to do with prediction or "this saith the Lord." This manifestation will only occur with the Holy Spirit enabled gifts, specifically the Word of Wisdom. The WOW is the gift to know things from the mind of God that cannot be known by any other means, including the future.

In my previous post I made the distinction of praying with tongues which all believers have the ability to do, because all who are genuinely converted have the Holy Spirit in them. This is supported by Paul saying under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, "I would that you all speak with tongues", and that not all believers have the ministry gift of tongues which is said publicly and accompanied by interpretation (not necessarily translation) of tongues. This is supported by Paul saying, "Do all speak in tongues?" meaning do all have the public ministry of tongues and interpretation? Ministry gifts are not for novices in the faith. They are for those in the church who are recognised by their maturity that they are fit for ministry, and the Holy Spirit will not distribute spiritual gifts to babes in Christ, in spite of some Pentecostal and Charismatic churches that think He does.

We must be careful not to muddy the waters by quoting Scriptures out of context that do not directly relate to the actual gift of tongues. The Holy Spirit interceding through us with groaning that cannot be uttered is not directly associated with the gift of tongues as described in 1 Corinthians 14.

You are correct in quoting 1 Corinthians 14:2 to describe personal praying in tongues which all believers can do, and that, as you correctly pointed out with Scriptural support that they pray from their own born-again spirit.

This makes me think that the public ministry of tongues along with interpretation of tongues and prophecy does come from the Holy Spirit, because the Scripture says that the Holy Spirit distributes these gifts according to His own will. This means that the public ministry of tongues in the fellowship gathering does come through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit rather than from the believer's own spirit. This is because the believer will not speak out in tongues unless prompted by the Holy Spirit to do so, and therefore what he says in tongues is from the Holy Spirit who gives him the words, and then the interpreter receives words from the Holy Spirit to interpret the tongue.

As a side note, this is why there have been instances where someone has spoken in tongues in a meeting in a language they have never learned and someone who incidentally has understood that language has sensed that God is speaking to him or her. An example of this is where a European man spoke in tongues and a Cantonese lady heard him say in Cantonese, "You need to go forward and receive Christ as your Saviour." and so she did and was saved. In another meeting a woman spoke in tongues, and a Welsh woman heard her own language spoken fluently without any trace of an accent and wondered how someone outside of Wales could speak that native language so fluently. So she knew that God was speaking encouragement to her in the Spirit. I had the personal experience of praying quietly in tongues in a meeting, and a NZ Maori friend sitting beside me told me that I was speaking encouraging things to her in the Maori language, which I had never learned at that time. I had a friend who was praying in a church prayer meeting, and a Ghanaian visitor stopped him and told him that he was praising God in his own rural village dialect. There was no way that my friend could ever have known that dialect, because Badu had never spoken it in his presence. So these are wonderful examples of where the Holy Spirit Himself has inspired people to speak in tongues for a specific purpose.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

In my previous post I made the distinction of praying with tongues which all believers have the ability to do, because all who are genuinely converted have the Holy Spirit in them. This is supported by Paul saying under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, "I would that you all speak with tongues", and that not all believers have the ministry gift of tongues which is said publicly and accompanied by interpretation (not necessarily translation) of tongues. This is supported by Paul saying, "Do all speak in tongues?" meaning do all have the public ministry of tongues and interpretation? Ministry gifts are not for novices in the faith. They are for those in the church who are recognised by their maturity that they are fit for ministry, and the Holy Spirit will not distribute spiritual gifts to babes in Christ, in spite of some Pentecostal and Charismatic churches that think He does.

We must be careful not to muddy the waters by quoting Scriptures out of context that do not directly relate to the actual gift of tongues. The Holy Spirit interceding through us with groaning that cannot be uttered is not directly associated with the gift of tongues as described in 1 Corinthians 14.

You are correct in quoting 1 Corinthians 14:2 to describe personal praying in tongues which all believers can do, and that, as you correctly pointed out with Scriptural support that they pray from their own born-again spirit.

This makes me think that the public ministry of tongues along with interpretation of tongues and prophecy does come from the Holy Spirit, because the Scripture says that the Holy Spirit distributes these gifts according to His own will. This means that the public ministry of tongues in the fellowship gathering does come through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit rather than from the believer's own spirit. This is because the believer will not speak out in tongues unless prompted by the Holy Spirit to do so, and therefore what he says in tongues is from the Holy Spirit who gives him the words, and then the interpreter receives words from the Holy Spirit to interpret the tongue.

As a side note, this is why there have been instances where someone has spoken in tongues in a meeting in a language they have never learned and someone who incidentally has understood that language has sensed that God is speaking to him or her. An example of this is where a European man spoke in tongues and a Cantonese lady heard him say in Cantonese, "You need to go forward and receive Christ as your Saviour." and so she did and was saved. In another meeting a woman spoke in tongues, and a Welsh woman heard her own language spoken fluently without any trace of an accent and wondered how someone outside of Wales could speak that native language so fluently. So she knew that God was speaking encouragement to her in the Spirit. I had the personal experience of praying quietly in tongues in a meeting, and a NZ Maori friend sitting beside me told me that I was speaking encouraging things to her in the Maori language, which I had never learned at that time. I had a friend who was praying in a church prayer meeting, and a Ghanaian visitor stopped him and told him that he was praising God in his own rural village dialect. There was no way that my friend could ever have known that dialect, because Badu had never spoken it in his presence. So these are wonderful examples of where the Holy Spirit Himself has inspired people to speak in tongues for a specific purpose.

Thank you for your comments. We think alike in many of these points.

 

[ARBITER01]

In my previous post I made the distinction of praying with tongues which all believers have the ability to do, because all who are genuinely converted have the Holy Spirit in them.

I do have to disagree with a part of this Oscarr.

Of course, anyone who is truly born again by the blood of Jesus has been sealed with The Holy Spirit inside. There's no question about that. They were Spiritually immersed and added to the body of Christ when they were born again.

The contention point here for me, is when did they receive the gifts of The Spirit. Scripture can be somewhat confusing on this a bit. When the jewish believers and Cornelius's house were converted, scripture can make it seem as if they received the gifts at the same time they were born again, but when we look at examples after these two events, the new believers received them separately, for example,...

Act 19:2 and he said to them, "Did ye receive the Holy Spirit, after having believed?" And they said to him, "Nay, we did not even hear whether there is a Holy Spirit."
Act 19:3 And he said, "Into what, then, were ye immersed?" And they said, "Into John's immersion."
Act 19:4 And Paul said, "John immersed with an immersion of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him coming after him; that is, on Jesus."
Act 19:5 And, having heard this, they were immersed into the name of the Lord Jesus;
Act 19:6 and, Paul having laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they were speaking with tongues, and prophesying.

They were unaware of The Holy Spirit since believing. They were also unaware of Jesus. They believed GOD and the immersion of John, but were untrained in righteousness. After being water immersed in the name of Jesus, Paul places his hands upon them and they then received the filling of The Holy Spirit, with the gifts also being activated.

I do take this example as being complete for every believer, including the 120 in Acts 2 and Cornelius's house. They were born again, but received the filling of The Holy Spirit immediately following that event. Basically back to back events minus the water immersion. Anyone of us normally receives the filling of The Spirit following our water immersion on the name of Jesus, just like in acts 19.

It happened that way for me after I was immersed in the name of Jesus.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

I do have to disagree with a part of this Oscarr.

Of course, anyone who is truly born again by the blood of Jesus has been sealed with The Holy Spirit inside. There's no question about that. They were Spiritually immersed and added to the body of Christ when they were born again.

The contention point here for me, is when did they receive the gifts of The Spirit. Scripture can be somewhat confusing on this a bit. When the jewish believers and Cornelius's house were converted, scripture can make it seem as if they received the gifts at the same time they were born again, but when we look at examples after these two events, the new believers received them separately, for example,...

Act 19:2 and he said to them, "Did ye receive the Holy Spirit, after having believed?" And they said to him, "Nay, we did not even hear whether there is a Holy Spirit."
Act 19:3 And he said, "Into what, then, were ye immersed?" And they said, "Into John's immersion."
Act 19:4 And Paul said, "John immersed with an immersion of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe on Him coming after him; that is, on Jesus."
Act 19:5 And, having heard this, they were immersed into the name of the Lord Jesus;
Act 19:6 and, Paul having laid hands on them, the Holy Spirit came upon them, and they were speaking with tongues, and prophesying.

They were unaware of The Holy Spirit since believing. They were also unaware of Jesus. They believed GOD and the immersion of John, but were untrained in righteousness. After being water immersed in the name of Jesus, Paul places his hands upon them and they then received the filling of The Holy Spirit, with the gifts also being activated.

I do take this example as being complete for every believer, including the 120 in Acts 2 and Cornelius's house. They were born again, but received the filling of The Holy Spirit immediately following that event. Basically back to back events minus the water immersion. Anyone of us normally receives the filling of The Spirit following our water immersion on the name of Jesus, just like in acts 19.

It happened that way for me after I was immersed in the name of Jesus.

I didn't try to analyse all this. All I did was to ask the Lord for a better way and I accepted what He told me, and over the last 40 years it has worked for all the ones I have helped to receive the gift. They have all acknowledged that the tongues they received were genuine and that even after being encouraged by me, they very quickly said that they started speaking languages that they never made up, but just flowed out of them.

The steps I have described are steps of faith, and in my experience, God has always honoured their faith. I have the view that if someone received what they think is tongues involuntarily without exercising faith in God's Word, they are more likely to have received something else. This is because the Scripture says that without faith it is impossible to please God. True faith is strongly based in the promises of God's Word, and not in an involuntary experience. This is why we have to be grounded in the promises in God's Word to ensure that what we receive is genuine. Faith in experiences can cause problems and distract away from the way tongues should be used as God designed it.

 

[ARBITER01]

I didn't try to analyse all this. All I did was to ask the Lord for a better way and I accepted what He told me, and over the last 40 years it has worked for all the ones I have helped to receive the gift. They have all acknowledged that the tongues they received were genuine and that even after being encouraged by me, they very quickly said that they started speaking languages that they never made up, but just flowed out of them.

The steps I have described are steps of faith, and in my experience, God has always honoured their faith. I have the view that if someone received what they think is tongues involuntarily without exercising faith in God's Word, they are more likely to have received something else. This is because the Scripture says that without faith it is impossible to please God. True faith is strongly based in the promises of God's Word, and not in an involuntary experience. This is why we have to be grounded in the promises in God's Word to ensure that what we receive is genuine. Faith in experiences can cause problems and distract away from the way tongues should be used as God designed it.

Hey Oscarr,..... if you are going to promote a strict adherence to scripture,..... then do understand that scripture does address this as being a separate event, apart from being born again.

This was the experience that Jesus had, and it is to be ours also.

Again,..... if you are going to push scripture in our faces, make sure you do understand that the same scripture you are pushing before us describes a filling event of The Holy Spirit separate from the born again event.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Hey Oscarr,..... if you are going to promote a strict adherence to scripture,..... then do understand that scripture does address this as being a separate event, apart from being born again.

This was the experience that Jesus had, and it is to be ours also.

Again,..... if you are going to push scripture in our faces, make sure you do understand that the same scripture you are pushing before us describes a filling event of The Holy Spirit separate from the born again event.

I won't respond to this. I am not going to go into a useless acrimonious debate. I don't want to muddy the waters for those who desire the gift and who are being helped by my advice.

 

[ARBITER01]

I won't respond to this. I am not going to go into a useless acrimonious debate. I don't want to muddy the waters for those who desire the gift and who are being helped by my advice.

Oh I'm sure you don't want to.

But like I said, if you are going to be strict about scripture on this subject as you say that you are, then make sure you are presenting it all to us. Jesus had to be filled with The Holy Spirit, and so do we.

It's not the gift that we are to seek, it is the giver (The Holy Spirit), and that requires a separate filling from our born again experience, as described in scripture.

 

[tturt]

Any believer can speak in tongues and they're given by the Holy Spirit.

Tongues are a sign - To unbelievers By believers

"Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not:"

"And these signs shall follow them that believe; ...they shall speak with new tongues; (I Cor 14:22 and Mark 16:17)

 

[Joy]

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