Prayer for Dead and Purgatory - and a Book

[~Anastasia~]

I didn't watch the whole series but I believe everyone died in a plane crash and the 'lost' island was actually Purgatory, so your comment hit the nail on the head!

(No bulls eye emoji sadly)

The final few episodes were extremely unsatisfying.

We binge-watched the first few seasons snowed in in a cabin in the woods. Every episode ended with usxwanting to know what cane next. Then we had to wait - I think almost 2 years to finally see the end.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

JJ Abrams was involved....so it was a disaster with no coherent trajectory....like everything else he does!!

I didn't watch the whole series but I believe everyone died in a plane crash and the 'lost' island was actually Purgatory, so your comment hit the nail on the head!

(No bulls eye emoji sadly)

 

[Chris V++]

JJ Abrams was involved....so it was a disaster with no coherent trajectory....like everything else he does!!

Now that is sacrilege! Have your eyes not seen the new Star Trek franchise?

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

You're talking to a Trekkie who has met much of the original cast and Next Generation cast....a guy littered with autographs who has memorized all 79 episodes and feature films.....a guy whose second religion after Orthodoxy is Starfleet....those "films" of Abrams were pure shlock!!! They were and are NOT true Star Trek. They lack anything cerebral, conceptual, or intellectual about them. They lack the soul of Gene Roddenberry's world. They are just shoot 'em up, blow 'em up mindless drivel for the typical American theater-goer in the new millennium who wants to see some explosions and hormonal hijynx.

If I were president, Abrams would be deported to Iran for theatrical blasphemies.

Now that is sacrilege! Have your eyes not seen the new Star Trek franchise?

 

[Chris V++]

You're talking to a Trekkie who has met much of the original cast and Next Generation cast....a guy littered with autographs who has memorized all 79 episodes and feature films.....a guy whose second religion after Orthodoxy is Starfleet....those "films" of Abrams were pure shlock!!! They were and are NOT true Star Trek. They lack anything cerebral, conceptual, or intellectual about them. They lack the soul of Gene Roddenberry's world. They are just shoot 'em up, blow 'em up mindless drivel for the typical American theater-goer in the new millennium who wants to see some explosions and hormonal hijynx.

If I were president, Abrams would be deported to Iran for theatrical blasphemies.

I can see how some might overlook the witty dialogue, exceptional acting, and interesting plot lines and character development as those qualities may have been eclipsed to a prejudicial viewer by the state of the art cinematography and ground breaking special effects. So in that regard I'll agree the movies were great to a fault. I don't understand the 'hormonal hijynx' observation considering the original Shatner Kirk was a major plaaayer.

 

[Chris V++]

no, hell is inescapable and only exists after Judgment Day. until that day, there is always hope.

I've never heard this before in Christianity. I was taught souls in purgatory were destined for Heaven provided they died absolved of mortal sins, but there is no hope for the unrepentant after death. Are there verses that address it directly or is it tradition or both? Thank you. (Hope I'm not wearing out my welcome.)

 

[ArmyMatt]

I've never heard this before in Christianity. I was taught souls in purgatory were destined for Heaven provided they died absolved of mortal sins, but there is no hope for the unrepentant after death. Are there verses that address it directly or is it tradition or both? Thank you. (Hope I'm not wearing out my welcome.)

sure, it says Christ preached in hades, even those that died in the Flood. so if the worst generation in human history had hope, how much more now?

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

You’ve got to be kidding....those films are not remotely Trek. They’re the Cliffs Notes for wannabe Trekkie millennials....dorm room fodder at best. CGI tofu.

I can see how some might overlook the witty dialogue, exceptional acting, and interesting plot lines and character development as those qualities may have been eclipsed to a prejudicial viewer by the state of the art cinematography and ground breaking special effects. So in that regard I'll agree the movies were great to a fault. I don't understand the 'hormonal hijynx' observation considering the original Shatner Kirk was a major plaaayer.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

You wore out your welcome with the JJ Abrams wet kisses!! I’m just kidding...

I've never heard this before in Christianity. I was taught souls in purgatory were destined for Heaven provided they died absolved of mortal sins, but there is no hope for the unrepentant after death. Are there verses that address it directly or is it tradition or both? Thank you. (Hope I'm not wearing my welcome.)

 

[Chris V++]

You’ve got to be kidding....those films are not remotely Trek. They’re the Cliffs Notes for wannabe Trekkie millennials....dorm room fodder at best. CGI tofu.

Mr. Costanza, we are just going to have to agree to disagree.

 

[Chris V++]

sure, it says Christ preached in hades, even those that died in the Flood. so if the worst generation in human history had hope, how much more now?

Thanks. Was this just for the spirits who passed before the resurrection and new covenant? Any verses suggesting opportunity for repentance for spirits who rejected Christ in the latter days? Thanks in advance.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Thanks. Was this just for the spirits who passed before the resurrection and new covenant? Any verses suggesting opportunity for repentance for spirits who rejected Christ in the latter days? Thanks in advance.

none from Scripture, but the lives of saints have examples. the only time though were we know folks will truly choose to reject Christ knowingly is on Judgment Day.

 

[abacabb3]

I am really interested - how does prayer for the deceased work if there is no Purgatory?

Not a wise guy here, really wanting to learn.

Also - if you were to recommend one book as an intro to Orthodoxy what would it be? I'm a busy father of four, so if you can recommend one that's shorter to start would be great too!

Good question.

In short, we are only saved by God's grace. Salvation is enjoying eternity with God, who we know from the transfiguration is like blindingly light to behold. By God's grace, the saved enjoy this light. The damned are tortured by it and call the mountains to cover them. So, we pray for the dead so that by His grace, they could come to know God and love Him, and not be in the darkness as those who hate the light.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I stood three feet from Gene Roddenberry, walked around a convention hall talking one on one with Majel Barrett, met Chekhov, Uhura, McCoy, saw WilliamShatner, met Q, met Riker and Troy, got autographs from all of them plus Picard, and memorized the Enterprise destruct sequence plus the Prefix code overrides for the Reliant. I own way too many books about anything and everything Star Trek, even Klingon dictionaries. Chris Pine and his gay wannabe Vulcan pal and Eomere posing as Bones fighting against a metrosexual Kahn is a disgrace. Gurney is a Star Trek authority. Too much street cred!! I’m the master!

Mr. Costanza, we are just going to have to agree to disagree.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Mr. Costanza, we are just going to have to agree to disagree.

 

[LizaMarie]

I've never heard this before in Christianity. I was taught souls in purgatory were destined for Heaven provided they died absolved of mortal sins, but there is no hope for the unrepentant after death. Are there verses that address it directly or is it tradition or both? Thank you. (Hope I'm not wearing out my welcome.)

Me neither! As a protestant both Lutheran and nondenominational we were taught that your eternal destiny is fixed after you take your last breath. I also understand that the RC teaches the same? Only that if you make Purgatory you are already destined for heaven but need some purging by fire of your sins that you were unable to shed during this life. I am going to have to digest this. diod the Early Fathers teach this? I always thought that Jesus preaching to the spirits in Prison was for people prior to the flood. God is outside time however and I do follow time travel stories.
And I actually liked the New Star Trek movie haven't seen the 3rd installment yet
(Runs to dodge tomatoes thrown by Gurney)

 

[Chris V++]

we were taught that your eternal destiny is fixed after you take your last breath.

It would be amazing if there was still hope for the unrepentant. If the Noah era spirits had a chance, what about the people who never heard the gospel in their entire lifetimes after the resurrection? There's the verse about some having the law 'written into their hearts' and may be justified that way. The standard thinking is usually the '...not one of you is righteous, no not one,' or ' for all have sinned and fallen short .... ' But even if there is hope for them, what about the people who heard and decided not to believe. Isn't that the 'unpardonable sin?' Is there any hope for the hardened atheists? I heard a radio pastor today remind us Jesus was forgiving the Romans and Jews even from the cross.

Great New! No star date set as of yet, but Star Trek 4 is currently in production. Don't worry, JJ Abrams is not directing. Spock is still a softy, presumably. He is half human, on his mother's side.
'Star Trek 4' News: Next Installment Promises Another First for the Franchise

 

[ArmyMatt]

It would be amazing if there was still hope for the unrepentant. If the Noah era spirits had a chance, what about the people who never heard the gospel in their entire lifetimes after the resurrection? There's the verse about some having the law 'written into their hearts' and may be justified that way. The standard thinking is usually the '...not one of you is righteous, no not one,' or ' for all have sinned and fallen short .... ' But even if there is hope for them, what about the people who heard and decided not to believe. Isn't that the 'unpardonable sin?' Is there any hope for the hardened atheists? I heard a radio pastor today remind us Jesus was forgiving the Romans and Jews even from the cross.

Great New! No star date set as of yet, but Star Trek 4 is currently in production. Don't worry, JJ Abrams is not directing. Spock is still a softy, presumably. He is half human, on his mother's side.
'Star Trek 4' News: Next Installment Promises Another First for the Franchise

hope runs out on Judgment Day, because that day is the day when everyone will willingly and knowingly follow Christ or reject Him.

 

[SashaMaria]

If God stands outside of time, then couldn't we technically pray even for our younger selves (let alone our deceased relatives? ) Wouldn't God have heard those prayers for our younger selves even before our present time? They already know time is relative and linked somehow to gravity. Apparently they have to reset clocks in satellites every so often to sync with our ground time .

Chris, there was an article about this subject in the National Catholic Register, a reputable Catholic news site, several months ago. I found the article very interesting and have posted the link here:
Is It Possible to Pray Across Time?

(I know this is an Eastern Orthodox sub-forum and posting a link to an RCC site may be offensive even if the article discusses this subject, so if this post and/or link is inappropriate, please have a moderator delete it).

 

[Chris V++]

Chris, there was an article about this subject in the National Catholic Register, a reputable Catholic news site, several months ago. I found the article very interesting and have posted the link here:
Is It Possible to Pray Across Time?

Thanks for the link. I love this topic. I'm already feeling my 5th grade self becoming less of a little punk!