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Pope Francis assures atheists: You don’t have to believe in God to go to heaven

Discussion in 'One Bread, One Body - Catholic' started by Benam, Oct 29, 2020.

  1. Benam

    Benam New Member Supporter

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    In comments likely to enhance his progressive reputation, Pope Francis has written a long, open letter to the founder of La Repubblica newspaper, Eugenio Scalfari, stating that non-believers would be forgiven by God if they followed their consciences.

    Pope tells atheists: You don't have to believe in God to go to heaven

    If true and in context, I have to say I'd be rather disappointed in him...
     
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  2. pdudgeon

    pdudgeon Traditional Catholic Supporter

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    Where to begin?

    Firstly, the Pope refers us to our conscience.
    What is necessary to understand here is that it is highly likely that there would be a differing outcome were the comparison to be between a well taught Catholic child (who has been trained to memorize the correct answers, and who can understand them) and a child who doesn't have that advantage.
    Their consciences would likely be differing, and so would their actions when faced with a problem requiring a moral choice.





    Against that, we have a God who is merciful, and who understands that the child without the training is subject to the morals of the adults around him.

    And by God's grace, it is probable that as the child grows up, they will at some time encounter around them a problem, a circumstance, or a person, that is bigger and more powerful than they themselves are, and that they don't know how to handle.
    And that's usually when God steps in:
    When they need help,
    when they can't manage,
    and when they are ready to listen.

    Hopefully they will see the opportunity before them, and begin to learn as an adult what they missed as a child. :crossrc:
    I think that's what the Pope was referring to.
     
  3. concretecamper

    concretecamper Member of His Church

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    Nothing new here. The CCC says as much. However, I wouldnt hang my hat on the word "may"
     
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  4. Chrystal-J

    Chrystal-J the one who stands firm to the end will be saved Supporter

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    “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life." John 3:16

    Pope Francis has gone off the rails and needs to resign.
     
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  5. Lady Bug

    Lady Bug Let's get real Supporter

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    Last edited: Oct 29, 2020
  6. eastcoast_bsc

    eastcoast_bsc Veteran

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    The article is from 2015
     
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  7. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    This is five year old 'news' you do know? Do you know?

    And you do know it's an 'interview' with Scalfari, an old man who is in the habit of not making notes of his interviews? So Scalfari writes whatever he thinks he remembers. Scalfari is notoriously inaccurate.

    Point is it's old news that may be unreliable news at that, and even then it would be the opinion of one man and not a change in teaching in the Catholic Church. Pope Francis can't make up doctrine. His opinions really are his own opinions.

    Now IF you wanted to be current you would be focusing on his most recent erroneous opinion on homosexual domestic partnerships. Those at least were recorded on video, even if the version just made public were spliced multiple times.

    You say you would be 'rather disappointed in him'. Well, Catholics are scandalized by what he said. I don't think you know the half of it. And the half you might know I'll bet you don't know what to make of it.

    Pope Francis is someone we are very disappointed with. But he's not changed the faith. He could try to make an infallible statement but I suspect the Holy Spirit would prevent that.
     
  8. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    We hammered through this one when it happened about five years ago. It was part of a Scalfari interview, and Scalfari, an old man who does not take notes, is an unreliable reporter. So we don't know what Francis may have actually said. And of course pope Francis does not clarify his statements, so between that and Scalfari's unreliability we don't really know what he actually said. We can only guess. Did he mean that all atheists go to heaven? Maybe. But since he does not clarify we will never know.

    Do all atheists go to heaven? A rare bird one might if her ignorance was invincible. But it might not go so well with most of them, who according to Romans 1 ought to have known better. If pope Francis said all atheists go to heaven it's just another blunder of a personal opinion in a chief pastor who should have known better. It changed nothing in actuality, except to make pope Francis less and less reliable.
     
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  9. Basil the Great

    Basil the Great Well-Known Member Supporter

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    This line of thought is about as far from the Cantate Domino Papal Bull as one can get. Having said that, it is a little unfair to totally blame Pope Francis in this matter. Vatican II really opened up the door when it became the first Council/Pope to state authoritatively that the doctrine of invincible ignorance could be used to save souls that were not members of the visible Catholic Church.
     
  10. Benam

    Benam New Member Supporter

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    My apologies, I didn't realize it was that old. It came up in a news feed for me and I hadn't heard of it before so assumed it was new.
     
  11. chevyontheriver

    chevyontheriver Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yup. Old news. We discussed it then right here and were quite critical of him. He is a pretty sloppy theologian, actually no theologian at all, as his undisciplined opinions show. It is of concern, but so far these opinions have done little but lose him support from faithful Catholics. They have encouraged the liberal Protestant leaning side of Catholicism though they have actually changed nothing in Catholic teaching. If he wanted to do that he would have to try an infallible statement. But then God might intervene to silence him if he actually tried.
     
  12. FreeinChrist

    FreeinChrist CF Advisory team Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    ADVISOR HAT


    [​IMG]


    This thread had a clean up of problematic posts. Folks, pay attention to what forum you are in. Also, there is this site rule:

    Congregational Forum Restrictions
    Members who do not truly share the core beliefs and teachings of a specific congregational forum may post in fellowship or ask questions, but they may not teach or debate within the forum.​
     
  13. Stabat

    Stabat Stat Crux, dum volvitur orbis Supporter

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    Isn't that neat...?
     
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