Poll: what's next for a post-Roe v Wade America?

[TLK Valentine]

With the leaked SCOTUS draft, it's looking like Roe v Wade is going to be overturned after nearly fifty years.

Conservatives have wanted this, so my question is, once you get it, what comes next?

(I'm hoping to hear mostly from the anti-abortion members, although I am including a "pro-choice" option as a control group)

Let's define our terms for the poll:

• "The Arizona Plan" -- GOP candidate Blake Masters wants to overturn Griswold v Connecticut (1965), the Supreme Court case which legalized contraception, and served as a precedent for Roe v Wade. He's getting some flak for it even by the GOP, but suppose his idea catches on? GOP Senate candidate Blake Masters wants to allow states to ban contraception use
• "The McConnell Plan" -- Mitch McConnell teased an idea about A GOP congress passing a nationwide abortion ban. He has withdrawn the idea upon realizing that President Biden would certainly burn the word "VETO" onto any such bill with a magnifying glass, but does that mean that should the GOP take Congress (and they probably will), that they shouldn't try?
• "The Texas Plan" -- the Texas legislature has made abortion a civil, not criminal, offense, and authorized absolutely anybody to sue absolutely anyone involved in an abortion for a guaranteed $10,000 judgement. What if this went nationwide? Lawsuit against Texas abortion ban 'effectively over'
• "The Louisiana Plan" -- The Louisiana legislature introduced (and recently withdrew) a bill classifying abortion as homicide. Although the bill is currently being reworked to eliminate the criminal penalties, for the purpose of this poll, let's assume the bill goes forward as it was, nationally: Abortion. Is. Murder. No more murder charge for women in Louisiana abortion bill

IOW, anti-abortion folks, you're finally getting what you wanted: Roe v Wade is history...

What now?

 

[DragonFox91]

States s/ follow the Texas plan.

 

[hislegacy]

I am prolife. Not Anti abortion

same as Pro Abortion is notAnti life

sort of the same as including the "ic" on Democratic.

 

[Blade]

I don't mean this at the op watching reading its clear most don't truly understand what Roe VS Wade was is. Its not part of the constitution. Leave it up to the States.

 

[TLK Valentine]

States s/ follow the Texas plan.

since civil law isn't bound by state lines, i.e., anyone, anywhere, can sue, that would be a nationwide plan in all but name, wouldn't it?

 

[Nithavela]

They'll probably make their "national abortion ban" end run as soon as they have the president, the house and the senate and will run on that during the mid terms and the 2024 election.

 

[TLK Valentine]

I am prolife. Not Anti abortion

same as Pro Abortion is notAnti life

So you're saying that you're holistically pro-life? It's not just the unborn you're looking to save? That's great!

Because I've noticed that the political party which is anti-Abortion is also, for example, pro-Capital Punishment... which in and of itself is not hypocritical; it just means that their "pro-life" ideals are narrowly focused -- which might get confusing under the umbrella term of "pro-life."

Also, there are studies that show that with comprehensive sex education and easy access to contraception, abortion rates drop, legal or not... and yet, many "pro-life" people oppose such measures.
Again, not hypocritical, but certainly puzzling.

I'm just using the term in regards to this specific issue: Roe v Wade.

 

[Hammster]

It should be up to the states.

 

[TLK Valentine]

I don't mean this at the op watching reading its clear most don't truly understand what Roe VS Wade was is. Its not part of the constitution. Leave it up to the States.

...which is precisely why the first option on my poll is "do nothing; leave it up to the states."

But there's a lot of talk from different sources about doing ... something... and I'm curious about seeing what folks around here think.

 

[TLK Valentine]

It should be up to the states.

Well, Missouri seems to think differently, since their proposed law will use Texas-style enforcement to allow anyone to sue a Missouri resident who gets an abortion... even out of state.

Missouri wants to stop out-of-state abortions. Other states could follow.

I was going to edit the poll to include this option, but it's so close to the "Nationwide Texas Plan" that I said never mind...

 

[Belk]

It should be up to the states.

Why should it be up to the states?

 

[hislegacy]

I'm just using the term in regards to this specific issue: Roe v Wade.

So am I.

 

[Hammster]

Why should it be up to the states?

Because it’s not specified in the Constitution.

 

[Norbert L]

Conservatives have wanted this, so my question is, once you get it, what comes next?

Other things come to mind. Location of medical practice will be higher on the list after graduation now. Likewise when people move across state lines.

Embolden state politicians that don't like the federal branch with a dose of testosterone. I'm sure other judgements will come.

 

[Fantine]

I expect that the Supreme Court will try to end other laws based on the 14th Amendment's right to privacy--LGBTQ protections, contraception laws, even voting laws.

Sort of like the proverb about WWII...they came for the Jews and I wasn't Jewish, etc., etc.....and then they came for me.

We are on dangerous ground. Our democracy is hanging by a gossamer thread and many people don't realize it.

If only my grandma's Irish birth could grant Irish citizenship to my children as well as me and I'd be packing my bags...

 

[civilwarbuff]

Sort of like the proverb about WWII...they came for the Jews and I wasn't Jewish, etc., etc.....and then they came for me.

It is not a proverb....it is a poem.....
Martin Niemöller: "First they came for the Socialists..."

Sort of like the proverb about WWII...they came for the Jews and I wasn't Jewish, etc., etc.....and then they came for me.

We are on dangerous ground. Our democracy is hanging by a gossamer thread and many people don't realize it.

You mean like when they came for the Japanese-Americans in 1942 and put them in concentration camps? Or the 1950's when they came after the people who were Communists (but really weren't)? That gossamer thread seems to be pretty strong to survive those times........

 

[TLK Valentine]

So am I.

So your "pro-life" beliefs extend beyond the unborn, then?

 

[Fantine]

It is not a proverb....it is a poem.....
Martin Niemöller: "First they came for the Socialists..."

You mean like when they came for the Japanese-Americans in 1942 and put them in concentration camps? Or the 1950's when they came after the people who were Communists (but really weren't)? That gossamer thread seems to be pretty strong to survive those times........

In a country with 2.1 million incarcerated, the largest per capita percentage in the world (639 per 100,000), most of them poor, black, or undocumented, do you really think we're that far from 1942?

Some of the stats in this article are shocking! Most people in jail are not convicted, but are incarcerated awaiting trial, because they can't afford bail, often for misdemeanors.

445,000 people who are not legally convicted are in local jails. Another 64,000 are in federal jails awaiting trial.

Mass Incarceration: The Whole Pie 2022 | Prison Policy Initiative

Our governor wanted to spend a large state surplus (which should have been used for COVID relief) to build more jails. What's wrong with this picture?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Because it’s not specified in the Constitution.

Ok, fair enough.

Personally, I think it was a mistake to have never codified Roe into federal law; the SCOTUS decision should have treated as a stopgap measure and Congress should've jumped into action to secure it decades ago...But that's spilt milk now.

 

[hislegacy]

So your "pro-life" beliefs extend beyond the unborn, then?

My request was along the lines of:

Second, another way to add civility to the conversation here is proper names. The names of the two main political parties are the Republican party (RNC) whose members are Republicans, and the Democratic Party (DNC) whose members are Democrats. It is not the "Democrat" party. The use of Democrat party was started as a pejorative term and was meant to be derogatory
​

That is why I said:

I am prolife. Not Anti abortion

same as Pro Abortion is not Anti life
sort of the same as including the "ic" in Democratic.

I was asking you to add civility to the conversation by properly addressing those who are pro life properly. The term Anti abortion is used in the pejorative and many find it a derogatory reference. The ONLY people who call the movement anti abortion are the ones who oppose them. The group is called Pro Life on a national level and has been identified by that name for more than 2 decades.

I'm asking for you to extend a similar courtesy please.

As for your query, my stance on the death penalty is not changed, if it helps your understanding, I'll state it this way.

The very moment an unborn child is charged, tried and found guilty of capital murder with special circumstances, I support that unborn child to suffer, just like anyone else, the death penalty.

Yes, that sounds ridiculous because the argument IMHO is just that - ridiculous.​