Physics and our place in the Universe

[Michael]

I wouldn't take Dad as an authority on what any group of scientists say about anything, if I were you.

Hey we agree on something at least.

 

[PsychoSarah]

I wouldn't take Dad as an authority on what any group of scientists say about anything, if I were you.

I don't.

 

[dad]

If that is true, it's only true because the Bible can be subjectively interpreted an almost infinite number of ways,

That is a good way to conflate issues. The connection between the stars and some influence on earth and a spiritual connection is what was the focus of discussion regarding God and the bible says in this thread. I haven't heard any of this agonizing bewilderment that it does indeed indicate exactly that. Your point is neutered. History also is undeniably in the same boat. You need to offer a boat that floats in the sea of debate.

as evidenced by the fact that your age estimates of the Earth based upon that book aren't even a majority viewpoint *within* the Christian community.

Doesn't matter at all. The point was that dates and cycles are not really some absolute certainty! Your point validates my point. That it?

 

[dad]

I wouldn't take Dad as an authority on what any group of scientists say about anything, if I were you.

I would show where time is not actually part of our laws and spacetime, if you claim science says something different Good luck with that.

 

[dad]

Science claims when it comes to physics is more spread out than in matters of biology.

The way life processes work is determined also by atoms and the laws that exist!

More like a group of scientists claim that our universe is like a bubble;

No, solar system. We were not talking about fringe science opinions on what shape the universe may or may not be here!

lots of different physics theories are as of yet roughly equal in support. You can't really say science as a whole claims much when it comes to physics, just certain groups.

Try to focus, Nasa claimed the bubble comparison for the solar system based on data. As I said, me and science are buddies.

It is like in biology, the debates are comparable to the two party political system of the United States.

Since they do not know the forces that governed atoms and life processes in the far past, any and all blather from bio boys and babes is baseless.

Other parties besides Democrat and Republican exist, but they are small and get relatively little political power and attention. In comparison, physics debates is comparable to that of middle eastern countries, which can have over a dozen political parties; in some cases so many that different parties have to make compromises with each other so that one of them has a chance of getting a member elected.

Moot comparison, because I have not heard any great heated debate within science over the Nasa comparison or idea on the solar system!? You?

 

[PsychoSarah]

Really, you haven't heard the debates over the shape of the universe? how can you claim to be so in tune with physics knowledge and not be aware of it?

 

[lesliedellow]

Try to focus, Nasa claimed the bubble comparison for the solar system based on data. As I said, me and science are buddies.

That's the best laugh I have had in a long long time.

 

[dad]

Really, you haven't heard the debates over the shape of the universe? how can you claim to be so in tune with physics knowledge and not be aware of it?

Of course, but they are no more relevant to the topic that underworked philosophers sitting around arguing how many angels could fit on the head of a pin!

 

[PsychoSarah]

Of course, but they are no more relevant to the topic that underworked philosophers sitting around arguing how many angels could fit on the head of a pin!

this is physics, not philosophy right now (although philosophy does like to butt in to many intellectual topics where it just serves to be annoying). Debates over the shape of the universe and many other topics show that in many fields there isnt a scientific consensus on the matters, thus to say that science claims anything about them would be fundamentally wrong.

 

[dad]

this is physics, not philosophy right now (although philosophy does like to butt in to many intellectual topics where it just serves to be annoying). Debates over the shape of the universe and many other topics show that in many fields there isnt a scientific consensus on the matters, thus to say that science claims anything about them would be fundamentally wrong.

The speculation from men of science (in bubble science) about how the universe is out of the bubble, using the laws of the bubble to construct the model, is at best, no better than philosophy.

Besides, the solar system doesn't seem to be under any great question here, which is the point. I see no one has dared challenge the fact that our forces and laws in the solar system are related to time.

Nor is there any real challenge to the historical earthquake of a fact that the stars were both considered influential, and connected to spirits!! It was also shown that God Almighty, in His Own words agrees!

It doesn't get any better than all that!

 

[dad]

Hey we agree on something at least.

Time really is a part of our world and how even atoms work. Not like we get a vote.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Who said time wasn't important?

 

[dad]

Who said time wasn't important?

Who said anything at all here that addresses the topic? If our laws involve time, and time is set from the stars, that means that all our life processes and laws are influenced by the heavens. It means that God was right, and the ancients too to a large degree, in that they realized a great tie existed with the stars and spirits.

I guess we can simply accept the OP and premise unchallenged by science or anything else here.


That was easy.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Who said anything at all here that addresses the topic? If our laws involve time, and time is set from the stars, that means that all our life processes and laws are influenced by the heavens. It means that God was right, and the ancients too to a large degree, in that they realized a great tie existed with the stars and spirits.

I guess we can simply accept the OP and premise unchallenged by science or anything else here.


That was easy.

Except our time isn't really set from the stars, though we do use the movement of them to make a measure of how much has past.

 

[dad]

Except our time isn't really set from the stars,

Oh? So we can rule that out then? How exactly do you propose to do that!? How would you know how God infuses time into our spacetime system? The bible seems to indicate a connection with time and the stars.

Now by time set to the stars, what I refer to is the way time exists here, in our solar system and spacetime. Now if you even claim to know HOW or why time exists as it does in the mixture of laws and forces we know here, I would be startled.

though we do use the movement of them to make a measure of how much has past.

We do that also, yes, but in no way does that mean the stars are relegated to that role.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Oh? So we can rule that out then? How exactly do you propose to do that!? How would you know how God infuses time into our spacetime system? The bible seems to indicate a connection with time and the stars.


We do that also, yes, but in no way does that mean the stars are relegated to that role.

How would you know? Just because you believe in a god and I don't doesn't make you the authority on everything about it, nor does it mean I can't be correct.

 

[dad]

How would you know?

That is the question! How would science know!?

Just because you believe in a god and I don't doesn't make you the authority on everything about it, nor does it mean I can't be correct.

God stated that the stars had influence, and makes it clear in the bible that there is also a spiritual connection.

You can't be correct about ..what?

 

[PsychoSarah]

That is the question! How would science know!?
God stated that the stars had influence, and makes it clear in the bible that there is also a spiritual connection.

You can't be correct about ..what?

I asked how would you know? God said nothing, humans wrote a book claiming it did, and you have no way of knowing if any of it is actually true. You disregard other religious texts so easily, and yet seem shocked and confused when others view the one you hold dear in the same way. How can you disregard Vishnu, Odin, Zeus, Allah, or any other deity? They have religious texts they claim to document real events as well, many of which have no other record beyond them, just like the bible does. Many of them have prophets or heroes which we part god or of godly origins. A few even claim that worshipping other deities makes people lesser or makes them inhuman. What makes your deity so different that you can disregard all the others and yet maintain a belief in it?

Remember, I don't view the bible as having any godly influence at all, and the musings and thoughts of people over 1000 years ago who lacked quite a bit in knowledge of the world don't faze me.

Even if stars didn't exist, time still would.

 

[dad]

I asked how would you know?

Right, but before going there it is good to point out the science doesn't know how time gets woven in to our spacetime fabric and laws! You admit this?

God said nothing, humans wrote a book claiming it did, and you have no way of knowing if any of it is actually true.

I have many ways actually. It's a bit like sticking your finger in a socket to find out if electricity is real. I tried it, it's real! I also read how the power was known through time with millions of others. I am not the only one that felt the power. I also checked the prophesies. They are mostly all history now! Done deal. So don't tell me I can't know or check it out.

Nowthen, the bible clearly estavlishes a connection to the stars with spirits...dare you dispute that?...anyone lurking dare? How about the constellations I already posted that God Personally was quoted as listing and claimed that influence was involved from the stars?? Anyone..?

You see, no one dare dispute the obvious, and irrefutable absolute facts I cited.

You disregard other religious texts so easily, and yet seem shocked and confused when others view the one you hold dear in the same way.

You may claim to disrespect the bible, what you cannot do is make it say anything else.

How can you disregard Vishnu, Odin, Zeus, Allah, or any other deity?

Easy. really. Evil spirits are not something I chose to regard in a way that involves respect or admiration.

They have religious texts they claim to document real events as well, many of which have no other record beyond them, just like the bible does. Many of them have prophets or heroes which we part god or of godly origins. A few even claim that worshipping other deities makes people lesser or makes them inhuman. What makes your deity so different that you can disregard all the others and yet maintain a belief in it?

Evil spirits exist, yes. God is greater than he that is in the world though. Much much much much much much greater. No contest.

Even if stars didn't exist, time still would.

Now you are making stuff up! How would you know? If God ordained time to exist on and near earth in a certain way, and stars were involved as a mechanism that ordered time here...you could not say time could exist independent of the way God intended.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Your god could just as easily be one of these so called evil spirits you claim the others to be, prove definitively that it couldn't be true. The bible is biased on the matter, just like every religious text is biased in favor of its deities, so you cannot use it in your proof.