Pennsylvania family ordered to take down Jesus Christmas

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Different HOA places have different rules. Mala, my point is that there are double standards out there.
Can you point to a double standard in this case?
 
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mala

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Protestants are white? What color are Muslims? Brown?

I call my wife brownie... She's part Native American. :)

the ones that have been mainly responsible for the discrimination faced by minorities and also whine the most when they think that rules don't apply to them in this country are.
 
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All Englands Skies

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Just like all those negative connotations against the most merciful Allah are irrational or do only Christians get to pretend their deity has nothing to do with their religion in practice?

To be fair, if people take exception to anything Islamic, they are quickly labelled Islamophobes, bigots and haters, I rarely would see this "offense is subjective" stuff if people moaned about an Islamic message. You might personally see the two as the same, but lets face it, to most "atheists", "SJW's" and "liberals", the person getting offended by the Islamic message is the "bigot", any legalistic rules are thrown to the wayside and discounted. Its anti-muslim bigotry plain and simple

However people take exception to a Christian message, its due to 2000 years of our negative conduct, the Christian who moans is having a hissy fit, in fact its implied the Christian is the bigoted one and out come the endless legalistic arguments and technicalities over how the Christian broke some petty rules.

Those same people then argue over and over they are not bias against Christians, until blue in the face, though they consistently take whatever side of the argument is against the Christians in every single issue.

Sorry but if this was some Islamic message, put on a sign in front of a house at the end of Ramadan, which technically broke the rules of a HOA, most of the people citing the "well the Christians broke the rules" argument would be nowhere to be found in fact most of the same people would most likely accuse the HOA of being "Islamophobic" and the HOA would be the "bad guys", they'd claim that the "HOA made their decision, because of their on Islamophobia and bigotry, it highlights the wide spread of islamophobia in our communities"

Come on, man, you know that's how it would play out.

you personally might be consistent on this issue, but lets be honest, 90% of those taking your position would U-turn if the situations were reversed.
 
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All Englands Skies

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why is it that when "christians" don't get to ignore rules that apply to everyone else they bring up muslims doing something or other as if it were a viable argument and not a juvenile attempt to build a false demon to replace themselves... at the turn of the century it was the irish and the italians; african americans are still being scapegoated so nothings changed there, the hispanics are apparently all rapists, the hatians all have aids. poor poor white protestants.

Sorry Mala, but Muslims are brought up because Islam highlights the hypocrisy of attitudes in most cases.

Every time the way Muslims treat people is brought up, Muslims drag Christians into the argument, even if a Muslim is debating an atheist, Christian history gets a mention. Not just muslims, but the non-muslim "liberals" drag Christianity into it to defend the Muslim position

People also get tired of being called out as hypcrites by a group of people who grossly overlook their far worse level of hypocrisy currently in the world.

the ones that have been mainly responsible for the discrimination faced by minorities and also whine the most when they think that rules don't apply to them in this country are.

Same can be said for vast majority off places where Muslims are the main group, often Christians are made into scape goats and targeted. Also Muslims bemoan over and over how awful we are in the west, yet rarely hold yourself responsible for the rough treatment of minorities where your co-religionists have power.

So if "White Protestants" as you specifically stated are mainly responsible for the discrimination faced by minorities in the west, that means your religion, Islam, is mainly responsible for the treatment faced by minorities in Islamic lands and their second class status in history.

Now I know you'll reply to this, justifying your stance and horrified at the notion of "holding Islammainly responsible", even though your posts clearly indicated "White protestants" are main responsible for oppressing minorities, because I am just using your own criteria against you, but when we do it, we're hypocrites and unreasonable. I know from experience you'll take exception to this, that its unfair, hypocritical and unjust to hold Islam mainly responsible, yet its okay for you to hold white people and protestants mainly responsible for the treatment of non-white and non-protestant groups

But Muslims, the same people who bleat over and over about "Islamophobia" and being oppressed, never are hypocrites when they mainly overlook it when Muslims are persecuting minorities or worse still, try and justify it, when the way Muslims treat minorities is far worse than anything they face in the west. To the Muslims the bogeymen are the Christians, the Jews, "Westerners", all throughout history Muslims have had groups to blame also, however you're not wholly responsible for this and feel you have the "right" to complain about Islamophobia, though your religion has always attacked others and forced your sharia on others, the Christians of the Ottoman Empire hated Islam and had revolutions for that very reason.

Yet the "white" Protestant (and most likely all Christians in the end of any group) are not allowed to complain, because o their treatment of others.

As usual with most muslims who claim and shout "hypocrisy" they usually highlight their own bias and hypocrisy in the same paragraph.
 
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CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN

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To be fair, if people take exception to anything Islamic, they are quickly labelled Islamophobes, bigots and haters, I rarely would see this "offense is subjective" stuff if people moaned about an Islamic message. You might personally see the two as the same, but lets face it, to most "atheists", "SJW's" and "liberals", the person getting offended by the Islamic message is the "bigot", any legalistic rules are thrown to the wayside and discounted. Its anti-muslim bigotry plain and simple

However people take exception to a Christian message, its due to 2000 years of our negative conduct, the Christian who moans is having a hissy fit, in fact its implied the Christian is the bigoted one and out come the endless legalistic arguments and technicalities over how the Christian broke some petty rules.

Those same people then argue over and over they are not bias against Christians, until blue in the face, though they consistently take whatever side of the argument is against the Christians in every single issue.

Sorry but if this was some Islamic message, put on a sign in front of a house at the end of Ramadan, which technically broke the rules of a HOA, most of the people citing the "well the Christians broke the rules" argument would be nowhere to be found in fact most of the same people would most likely accuse the HOA of being "Islamophobic" and the HOA would be the "bad guys", they'd claim that the "HOA made their decision, because of their on Islamophobia and bigotry, it highlights the wide spread of islamophobia in our communities"

Come on, man, you know that's how it would play out.

you personally might be consistent on this issue, but lets be honest, 90% of those taking your position would U-turn if the situations were reversed.
Um Christians would have a huge problem if a Muslim did this. Some would destroy their property, call them names. Complain to HOA and neighbors. So they should expect the same. But my bet is a Muslims didn't say anything about it. Probably more like a friend he made mad.
 
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All Englands Skies

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Um Christians would have a huge problem if a Muslim did this. Some would destroy their property, call them names. Complain to HOA and neighbors. So they should expect the same. But my bet is a Muslims didn't say anything about it. Probably more like a friend he made mad.

I never said a Muslim complained.

My post was referencing the double standards of the social justice types and the way they'd view a situation that is the same, based on if the situation regarded a Christian or a Muslim, usually that take opposite views that contridict

As for the way the Christians would act, maybe that is the Christians in your area, you have a right to think we'd all resort to being cavemen brutes if that's what you see.

As for my area in the UK, if a Muslim took exception to a Christian message, he'd be free to spout off, but if I took exception to an Islamic message openly, id get death threats, my property most likely vandalised, some might try and assault me, they'd say how they will slit my throat for insulting Islam

But when you come to your conclusion about Christians in your area, your just highlighting what you see around you and its treated as fact, while my conclusion about muslims in my area, is "anecdotal" and treated like sensationalist crap, because when people criticize or tarnish Christians as one negative group, its fine, they're just highlighting what they see, but when people critisiz or tarnish Muslims as one negative group, even if based on their surrounding community, they should know better, its wrong to judge all as one and its "Islamophobic"

Why is this point so hard to understand?
 
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mala

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Sorry Mala, but Muslims are brought up because Islam highlights the hypocrisy of attitudes in most cases.

Every time the way Muslims treat people is brought up, Muslims drag Christians into the argument, even if a Muslim is debating an atheist, Christian history gets a mention. Not just muslims, but the non-muslim "liberals" drag Christianity into it to defend the Muslim position

People also get tired of being called out as hypcrites by a group of people who grossly overlook their far worse level of hypocrisy currently in the world.



Same can be said for vast majority off places where Muslims are the main group, often Christians are made into scape goats and targeted. Also Muslims bemoan over and over how awful we are in the west, yet rarely hold yourself responsible for the rough treatment of minorities where your co-religionists have power.

So if "White Protestants" as you specifically stated are mainly responsible for the discrimination faced by minorities in the west, that means your religion, Islam, is mainly responsible for the treatment faced by minorities in Islamic lands and their second class status in history.

Now I know you'll reply to this, justifying your stance and horrified at the notion of "holding Islammainly responsible", even though your posts clearly indicated "White protestants" are main responsible for oppressing minorities, because I am just using your own criteria against you, but when we do it, we're hypocrites and unreasonable. I know from experience you'll take exception to this, that its unfair, hypocritical and unjust to hold Islam mainly responsible, yet its okay for you to hold white people and protestants mainly responsible for the treatment of non-white and non-protestant groups

But Muslims, the same people who bleat over and over about "Islamophobia" and being oppressed, never are hypocrites when they mainly overlook it when Muslims are persecuting minorities or worse still, try and justify it, when the way Muslims treat minorities is far worse than anything they face in the west. To the Muslims the bogeymen are the Christians, the Jews, "Westerners", all throughout history Muslims have had groups to blame also, however you're not wholly responsible for this and feel you have the "right" to complain about Islamophobia, though your religion has always attacked others and forced your sharia on others, the Christians of the Ottoman Empire hated Islam and had revolutions for that very reason.

Yet the "white" Protestant (and most likely all Christians in the end of any group) are not allowed to complain, because o their treatment of others.

As usual with most muslims who claim and shout "hypocrisy" they usually highlight their own bias and hypocrisy in the same paragraph.

the only reason people bring up muslims (the favourite bogeyman of the far right) is because you are all too cowardly to face your own problems without having whataboutisms.
you seek to throw others in front of the bus to protect yourselves and the muck you dwell in.
you're tired of the hippocrates.
well i'm tired of the blatant racism and bigotry that pervades all such posts.
you basically state that i cannot make a point each and every time putting on the hairshirt and decrying my existence since in your eyes all muslims are always responsible for the actions of all muslims everywhere.
just like all blacks are responsible for the actions of all blacks everywhere; all hispanics and so on and so forth.
in a thread and in all topics in general where white (and i am specifying white here) christian protestants are shown to act like garbage; instead of addressing that singular issue you and your lot keep stating, "don't judge us, look at the muslims."
your entire post is an act of justifying cowardice.
 
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All Englands Skies

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the only reason people bring up muslims (the favourite bogeyman of the far right) is because you are all too cowardly to face your own problems without having whataboutisms.
you seek to throw others in front of the bus to protect yourselves and the muck you dwell in.
you're tired of the hippocrates.
well i'm tired of the blatant racism and bigotry that pervades all such posts.
you basically state that i cannot make a point each and every time putting on the hairshirt and decrying my existence since in your eyes all muslims are always responsible for the actions of all muslims everywhere.
just like all blacks are responsible for the actions of all blacks everywhere; all hispanics and so on and so forth.
in a thread and in all topics in general where white (and i am specifying white here) christian protestants are shown to act like garbage; instead of addressing that singular issue you and your lot keep stating, "don't judge us, look at the muslims."
your entire post is an act of justifying cowardice.

You clearly stated in your post how "white protestants" are responsible for the ill-treatment of minorities and also stated how your tired of intellectually lazy Christians constantly drag Islam into arguments

I point out how its hypocritical for you to hold "White protestants" responsible for the ill treatment of minorities, if by the same token your not going to hold Islam, your own religion, responsible for the ill-treatment of minorities in Islamic lands (which is currently far worse than any "Islamophobia" in the West)

I also point out how Muslims (and non-muslims supporting) always drag Christianity into everything, in every debate, even if debating non-Christians, if somebody is criticizing something negative within Islamic societies, Muslims will always bring up the "Wrongful deeds" of Christians and Christianity, to shine a light away from their own religion.

but in both these cases, its okay, when a Muslim is a hypocrite. Its "cowardice" that you don't play by the same rules.
 
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Aryeh Jay

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Mark and Lynn Wivell have lived in that community since 2005. The current revision to the HOA was made august 21st, 2006 and they agreed to abide by it.

There is nothing in the HOA about Muslims or Islam.

There is nothing in the HOA about Atheists.

Flying an ISIS flag is against the rules of the HOA.

Flying a Rainbow flag is against the rules of the HOA.

Hanging a “Free Speech” banner is against the rules of the HOA.


This is a copy of the Rules for that particular HOA.

http://www.linkshoa.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Courtyards-Rules-and-Regulations.pdf
 
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wing2000

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After reading the "Rules and Regulations", I retract my earlier statement indicating the HOA made the wrong decision based on "no signs".....There is a clause prohibiting "lawn displays or holiday banners" which would apply in this case....


19. Display of Christmas and similar holiday decorations, including exterior decorative lights, shall be permitted only from Thanksgiving Day of each year until January 15 of the following year. Display of decorations for other holidays, including, but not limited to, Independence Day and Halloween, shall be permitted for a period beginning ten (10) days prior to the date of the holiday and ending five (5) days after the date of the holiday. No lawn displays or holiday banners are permitted.
 
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JGG

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After reading the "Rules and Regulations", I retract my earlier statement indicating the HOA made the wrong decision based on "no signs".....There is a clause prohibiting "lawn displays or holiday banners" which would apply in this case....


19. Display of Christmas and similar holiday decorations, including exterior decorative lights, shall be permitted only from Thanksgiving Day of each year until January 15 of the following year. Display of decorations for other holidays, including, but not limited to, Independence Day and Halloween, shall be permitted for a period beginning ten (10) days prior to the date of the holiday and ending five (5) days after the date of the holiday. No lawn displays or holiday banners are permitted.

So ambiguous. What if I want to put up a Christmas banner?
 
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GeorgeJ

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So ambiguous. What if I want to put up a Christmas banner?
Only if it's one of Google's "fundamentalist secular Left" Global Festivities banners.
 
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GeorgeJ

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Is there anything to this thread other than another "I'm being persecuted because they won't let me break the rules?"
This is actually another one of those "Christians Being Persecuted! (But We're Omitting the Full Truth)" stories.
 
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bhsmte

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After reading the "Rules and Regulations", I retract my earlier statement indicating the HOA made the wrong decision based on "no signs".....There is a clause prohibiting "lawn displays or holiday banners" which would apply in this case....


19. Display of Christmas and similar holiday decorations, including exterior decorative lights, shall be permitted only from Thanksgiving Day of each year until January 15 of the following year. Display of decorations for other holidays, including, but not limited to, Independence Day and Halloween, shall be permitted for a period beginning ten (10) days prior to the date of the holiday and ending five (5) days after the date of the holiday. No lawn displays or holiday banners are permitted.

Good information, thanks. The HOA rules are valid, until such time they are legally challenged and a court rules they are not valid. Few people would spend the money to hire an attorney to challenge these rules, but as i already mentioned, i think they would have a valid argument.

If political signs with names are allowed during elections, why not names of religious figures during the holidays?
 
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Read All England Skies’ post. What he/she said.
Notably absent from their post, any citation of this HOA allowing Islamic or sexually explicit signs while requiring this one be taken down. Do you have one? If not are you going to retract the assertion?
 
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