Peace and Safety: The Whole World Wants It

[Douggg]

You forget that Jesus warned about that coming false messiah the deceived Jews will believe is the real Messiah. If rabbi accept that as the prophesied Messiah, then deceived Christian pastors will also accept that one as our Lord Jesus. And that was our Lord's point of warning in Matt.24:23-26.

No, the questionable pastors will turn away from Jesus - not think Judaism's perceived messiah is Jesus. The person is going to just continue with the Judaism line for the past two thousand years that Jesus was not the messiah.

There is no way the person is going to be giving the impression he is Jesus.

Differently, false Christs like John Miller of Australia, and Jose Miranda (deceased) of the United States, for example, claim to be Jesus. Also there is the guy over in Russia, Vissarion.

List of people claimed to be Jesus - Wikipedia

 

[Douggg]

I mentioned that "Jacob" in Ezek.39 is put for all 12 tribes. You didn't read what all I wrote. The "house of Israel" title after God split old Israel into two separate kingdoms is about the ten northern tribes only (see 1 Kings 11 thru 2 Kings 17). God made Ezekiel a prophet to the "house of Israel" specifically, i.e., the ten tribes.

From wikipedia -
According to the Bible, Ezekiel and his wife lived on the bank of the Chebar River, in Tel Abib[5] in Babylonia with other exiles from Judah. Ezekiel 1:1, 3:15

___________________________________________________________________

The Ezekiel 38/39 prophecy of Gog/Magog is end times Ezekiel 38:8, and the northern and southern kingdom will have been restored as one kingdom. There is no separate northern kingdom of Israel, anymore. The house of Israel in Ezekiel 39 is talking about the entire whole house of Israel, the twelve tribes.

Get out your history map showing the Kingdom of Israel (Ephraim) and the Kingdom of Judah. The northern and southern kingdoms.

Now look at a modern map of Israel. Israel is no longer separated as two kingdoms. Ezekiel 37:16-22 has been fulfilled.

Ezekiel 39 is yet to be fulfilled. The house of Israel in that chapter is all twelve tribes.

 

[keras]

Keras, you are taking the Ezekiel 21:1-7 passage out of the Tanach which was intended for the generation that was about to go into the Babylon captivity - and making it a status for the Jews forever. So that one can be ignored.

Zechariah 13:7-9, on the other hand, is end times and indicates that two thirds of Israel will be killed during the great tribulation, and one third will survive it.

Both of these opinions are wrong.
Ezekiel 20:45-48 and Ezekiel 21:1-7 are clearly end times prophesies, as they have never been fulfilled as described. They will apply to the third swing of the Sword, Ezekiel 21:14. Babylon first, then Rome and next by the Lord Himself.

Zechariah 13:9, if you actually read it; says the remaining third will be passed thru fire and be refined like silver or gold. Any refining process means skimming off the dross or slag, so that third will become much less, in other words: Only a remnant will be saved. Romans 9:27

 

[Emmy]

Dear Davy. Peace and safety, the whole world wants it. What can we do to help? In Matthew 22: 35-40: Jesus tells us: " The first and great Commandment is: Love God with all thy hearts, with all thy souls, and with all thy minds. The second is like it, love thy neighbour as thyself." Love is very catching, and the Bible tells us: give up your selfish wishes and wants, start loving
and caring, God wants loving sons and daughters. Give up our selfish attitudes, and start loving and caring. In Matthew 7:7-10: we are told: "Ask and you shall receive. We ask God for love and Compassion, then thank God and share all love and compassion all around us. God is Love and God wants loving men and women. Let us follow Jesus back to God, and ask God to Bless us. Satan and all his followers will run away from love. I say this with love,Davy. Greetings from Emmy, your sister in Christ.

 

[Davy]

From wikipedia -
According to the Bible, Ezekiel and his wife lived on the bank of the Chebar River, in Tel Abib[5] in Babylonia with other exiles from Judah. Ezekiel 1:1, 3:15

___________________________________________________________________

The Ezekiel 38/39 prophecy of Gog/Magog is end times Ezekiel 38:8, and the northern and southern kingdom will have been restored as one kingdom. There is no separate northern kingdom of Israel, anymore. The house of Israel in Ezekiel 39 is talking about the entire whole house of Israel, the twelve tribes.

Get out your history map showing the Kingdom of Israel (Ephraim) and the Kingdom of Judah. The northern and southern kingdoms.

Now look at a modern map of Israel. Israel is no longer separated as two kingdoms. Ezekiel 37:16-22 has been fulfilled.

Ezekiel 39 is yet to be fulfilled. The house of Israel in that chapter is all twelve tribes.

The ten tribes of Israel have never returned as a people. What you're talking about having returned are Jews of the "house of Judah" (Sephardic) and other Jews (Ashkenazi) which were foreigners long ago that converted to Judaism, which is why the Israeli government only accepts Jews returning. The northern kingdom of the house of Israel, i.e., the ten tribes, were never known as Jews. Per Josephus, the title of Jew is the name those who returned from the Babylon captivity took and it comes from the name Judah. The ten tribes never went into the Babylon captivity.

The house of Israel (ten tribes) were also scattered in the area of Persia north of Babylon, and that is where God sent Ezekiel to go speak to the house of Israel. By the time of Ezekiel's day, the ten tribes had long since been split by God from the house of Judah in Jerusalem, and the ten tribes had long since been removed from the promised lands:

Ezek 3:1
3:1 Moreover He said unto me, Son of man, eat that thou findest; eat this roll, and go speak unto the house of Israel.
KJV

Ezek 3:4-5
4 And he said unto me, Son of man, go, get thee unto the house of Israel, and speak with My words unto them.

5 For thou art not sent to a people of a strange speech and of an hard language, but to the house of Israel;
KJV

 

[Davy]

Dear Davy. Peace and safety, the whole world wants it. What can we do to help? In Matthew 22: 35-40: Jesus tells us: " The first and great Commandment is: Love God with all thy hearts, with all thy souls, and with all thy minds. The second is like it, love thy neighbour as thyself." Love is very catching, and the Bible tells us: give up your selfish wishes and wants, start loving
and caring, God wants loving sons and daughters. Give up our selfish attitudes, and start loving and caring. In Matthew 7:7-10: we are told: "Ask and you shall receive. We ask God for love and Compassion, then thank God and share all love and compassion all around us. God is Love and God wants loving men and women. Let us follow Jesus back to God, and ask God to Bless us. Satan and all his followers will run away from love. I say this with love,Davy. Greetings from Emmy, your sister in Christ.

Indeed we are to love our neighbor as our self. But those who do that aren't the problem. It's those in the world that continue to hate the good people, and especially those that want to kill Christ's servants that are the problem. They work for the devil, and the devil we are not... commanded to love; not in this world, and not in the next.

Furthermore, the good people of the world that still... reject Christ Jesus as their Savior will perish also. We cannot do our own Salvation. Christ Jesus is the ONLY Way to Eternal Life. There is none other way.

 

[Douggg]

The ten tribes of Israel have never returned as a people. What you're talking about having returned are Jews of the "house of Judah" (Sephardic) and other Jews (Ashkenazi) which were foreigners long ago that converted to Judaism, which is why the Israeli government only accepts Jews returning. The northern kingdom of the house of Israel, i.e., the ten tribes, were never known as Jews. Per Josephus, the title of Jew is the name those who returned from the Babylon captivity took and it comes from the name Judah. The ten tribes never went into the Babylon captivity.

The house of Israel (ten tribes) were also scattered in the area of Persia north of Babylon, and that is where God sent Ezekiel to go speak to the house of Israel. By the time of Ezekiel's day, the ten tribes had long since been split by God from the house of Judah in Jerusalem, and the ten tribes had long since been removed from the promised lands:

Ezek 3:1
3:1 Moreover He said unto me, Son of man, eat that thou findest; eat this roll, and go speak unto the house of Israel.
KJV

Ezek 3:4-5
4 And he said unto me, Son of man, go, get thee unto the house of Israel, and speak with My words unto them.

5 For thou art not sent to a people of a strange speech and of an hard language, but to the house of Israel;
KJV

Davy, the northern ten tribes never returned en-masse like the southern two tribes. They trickled in.

Of course, everyone in the land of Israel was still exiled again in 70 AD, thereabouts, into the nations.

Nonetheless, the prophecy of Ezekiel 37:11-22, in the end times the reuniting of the tribes instead of being two nations, has been fulfilled 100% certain because the current map of the nation of Israel shows it.

 

[keras]

Nonetheless, the prophecy of Ezekiel 37:11-22, in the end times the reuniting of the tribes instead of being two nations, has been fulfilled 100% certain because the current map of the nation of Israel shows it.

The current State of Israel is only a tiny portion of the holy Land.
God gave Abraham all that area from the Euphrates to the Nile. Genesis 15:18 To his descendants, who are now every faithful Christian. Romans 9:6-9
So please cease from making wild and un-Biblical statements, this forum is for people to understand what the Prophets actually said, not what you or anyone, would like to think will happen.

 

[Douggg]

The current State of Israel is only a tiny portion of the holy Land.
God gave Abraham all that area from the Euphrates to the Nile. Genesis 15:18 To his descendants, who are now every faithful Christian. Romans 9:6-9
So please cease from making wild and un-Biblical statements, this forum is for people to understand what the Prophets actually said, not what you or anyone, would like to think will happen.

Keras, the prophecy regards joining of the sticks of Ephraim and Judah back into one nation. That's the prophecy. It was Israel at the time at Solomon's death, the spit took place.

Go look at any historical maps of the northern kingdom and the southern kingdom, following Solomon's death. The modern state of Israel overlays them both.

The prophecy in Ezekiel 37 was not to fulfill the total land promised to Abraham.

 

[keras]

Go look at any historical maps of the northern kingdom and the southern kingdom, following Solomon's death. The modern state of Israel overlays them both.

This proves that God's people, the descendants of the Patriarchs have never yet achieved what God intended. They are now peoples from every race, nation and language, every faithful Christian, who WILL be the nation that bears the proper fruit. Matthew 21:43

 

[Davy]

No, the questionable pastors will turn away from Jesus - not think Judaism's perceived messiah is Jesus. The person is going to just continue with the Judaism line for the past two thousand years that Jesus was not the messiah.

Then you are not really keeping up with world events, including in Jerusalem, for decades now some Christian Church organizations have been sending funds to the orthodox Jews in Jerusalem in preparation for their new temple and sacrifices. In 1997 there was a corporation called Jesus, Inc. that was sending the Jews red heifers. Some of these Christian supporters believe that to help the Jews fulfill their ultimate goals for Jerusalem is a way to help usher in Christ's return.

Then there's Christian Churches and organizations that support the idea of "one world government" because they believe it's their duty to fulfill Christ's kingdom with peace here on earth today, and that Jesus' coming is only a spiritual coming, and not a literal bodily return to this earth.

Those Christians, like yourself, are deceived about the pseudo-Christ that is coming to Jerusalem to play God, and are in danger of succumbing to the "strong delusion" which Apostle Paul warned of in 2 Thessalonians 2.

 

[Davy]

Davy, the northern ten tribes never returned en-masse like the southern two tribes. They trickled in.

Of course, everyone in the land of Israel was still exiled again in 70 AD, thereabouts, into the nations.

Nonetheless, the prophecy of Ezekiel 37:11-22, in the end times the reuniting of the tribes instead of being two nations, has been fulfilled 100% certain because the current map of the nation of Israel shows it.

That is a falsehood. The Ezekiel 37 prophecy has never... been fulfilled to this day. It is still future to us after Christ's return, and it's easy to know that when it is read in simplicity:

Ezek 37:22
22 And I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel; and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all:
KJV

There has not been a king of Judah in Jerusalem since the days of Zedekiah, king of Judah, in the days of Jeremiah the prophet. A king of the tribe of Judah, of the house of David, is this requirement to show this prophecy fulfilled.


Ezek 37:24
24 And David My servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in My judgments, and observe My statutes, and do them.
KJV

Again, no king in Jerusalem of the house of David today. Nor are they in Jerusalem walking in all of God's judgments and statutes today.


Ezek 37:25
25 And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and My servant David shall be their prince for ever.
KJV

There it is yet again, a 3rd time for major emphasis. Must be a king of the house of David there.


Ezek 37:26-28
26 Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set My sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore.

27 My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

28 And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when My sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.
KJV

The Jews have no "sanctuary" there in Jerusalem today. That is speaking of the Millennial sanctuary of Ezekiel 40-47, which is for Christ's future reign after His return. For the majority of Jews in Israel today, the New Covenant is still rejected.

The fact that you PURPOSEFULLY MISREPRESENT THE WORD OF GOD IN EZEKIEL 37, saying those things have been fulfilled already, that makes you a false one.

I refuse to have any further conversations with you.

 

[Douggg]

The fact that you PURPOSEFULLY MISREPRESENT THE WORD OF GOD IN EZEKIEL 37, saying those things have been fulfilled already, that makes you a false one.

I refuse to have any further conversations with you.

I never said that Israel has the one King over them. They don't have any king over them. And when they do have the King, the rightful King of Israel, of course is Jesus.

Anyone knows that part of the prophecy in Ezekiel 37 has not been fulfilled. I have no idea why you are making an issue out of something that is obvious.

The parts about Israel a single nation again has been fulfilled though. The maps show it.

 

[Gell]

Kushner: US to Unveil Middle East Peace Plan Soon

 

[Douggg]

Jesus is going to gather all the tribes back to the lands promised to their fathers, and that is the timing of the Ezek.39:25 verse. It's for the day of Christ's coming and thereafter, not before the tribulation.

Davy, you are not understanding that Ezekiel 39 is divided into two parts. It is not stated in the text as such. A person must understand the entire end times flow of events to know it.

The first part of Ezekiel 39 - verse 1-16 is about the Gog/Magog attack and destruction of Gog's army . That event will take place before the 7 years begin. Right before it.

The 7 years begin right after Gog's army is destroyed. And the Jews will think the little horn coming from Europe is their messiah. The 7 years in Revelation take part then.

At the end of the 7 years is the feast on the dead bodies in Ezekiel 39 - verses 17-20, the Armageddon feast. The rest of Ezekiel 39 is Jesus speaking after he has returned to earth and gathered all of the house of Israel back to the land of Israel.

Here are the two parts of Ezekiel 39. I highlighted the first part in blue and second part in green. I annotated where the 7 years of Revelation take part in between in red.

39:1 Therefore, thou son of man, prophesy against Gog, and say, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:


2 And I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel:


3 And I will smite thy bow out of thy left hand, and will cause thine arrows to fall out of thy right hand.


4 Thou shalt fall upon the mountains of Israel, thou, and all thy bands, and the people that is with thee: I will give thee unto the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field to be devoured.


5 Thou shalt fall upon the open field: for I have spoken it, saith the Lord God.


6 And I will send a fire on Magog, and among them that dwell carelessly in the isles: and they shall know that I am the Lord.


7 So will I make my holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them pollute my holy name any more: and the heathen shall know that I am the Lord, the Holy One in Israel.


8 Behold, it is come, and it is done, saith the Lord God; this is the day whereof I have spoken.


9 And they that dwell in the cities of Israel shall go forth, and shall set on fire and burn the weapons, both the shields and the bucklers, the bows and the arrows, and the handstaves, and the spears, and they shall burn them with fire seven years:


10 So that they shall take no wood out of the field, neither cut down any out of the forests; for they shall burn the weapons with fire: and they shall spoil those that spoiled them, and rob those that robbed them, saith the Lord God.


11 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will give unto Gog a place there of graves in Israel, the valley of the passengers on the east of the sea: and it shall stop the noses of the passengers: and there shall they bury Gog and all his multitude: and they shall call it The valley of Hamongog.


12 And seven months shall the house of Israel be burying of them, that they may cleanse the land.


13 Yea, all the people of the land shall bury them; and it shall be to them a renown the day that I shall be glorified, saith the Lord God.


14 And they shall sever out men of continual employment, passing through the land to bury with the passengers those that remain upon the face of the earth, to cleanse it: after the end of seven months shall they search.


15 And the passengers that pass through the land, when any seeth a man's bone, then shall he set up a sign by it, till the buriers have buried it in the valley of Hamongog.


16 And also the name of the city shall be Hamonah. Thus shall they cleanse the land.

[Davy, right here is where the 7 years in Revelation and the 70th week of Daniel 9 take place. Verse 17 below is at Armageddon at the end of the 7 years]

17 And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord God; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.


18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.


19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.


20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord God.


21 And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see my judgment that I have executed, and my hand that I have laid upon them.


22 So the house of Israel shall know that I am the Lord their God from that day and forward.


23 And the heathen shall know that the house of Israel went into captivity for their iniquity: because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies: so fell they all by the sword.


24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them.


25 Therefore thus saith the Lord God; Now will I bring again the captivity of Jacob, and have mercy upon the whole house of Israel, and will be jealous for my holy name;


26 After that they have borne their shame, and all their trespasses whereby they have trespassed against me, when they dwelt safely in their land, and none made them afraid.


27 When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations;


28 Then shall they know that I am the Lord their God, which caused them to be led into captivity among the heathen: but I have gathered them unto their own land, and have left none of them any more there.


29 Neither will I hide my face any more from them: for I have poured out my spirit upon the house of Israel, saith the Lord God.

 

[Davy]

Davy, you are not understanding that Ezekiel 39 is divided into two parts. It is not stated in the text as such. A person must understand the entire end times flow of events to know it.

The first part of Ezekiel 39 - verse 1-16 is about the Gog/Magog attack and destruction of Gog's army . That event will take place before the 7 years begin. Right before it.

The 7 years begin right after Gog's army is destroyed. And the Jews will think the little horn coming from Europe is their messiah. The 7 years in Revelation take part then.

At the end of the 7 years is the feast on the dead bodies in Ezekiel 39 - verses 17-20, the Armageddon feast. The rest of Ezekiel 39 is Jesus speaking after he has returned to earth and gathered all of the house of Israel back to the land of Israel.

....

I think belief in a pre-trib rapture theory is clouding your understanding. The coming Antichrist is not going to be coming from the EU. It's not going to be a pope either. Nor is the 2nd beast of Rev.13:11 just a 'system' either those like Ken Klein like to preach. The coming Antichrist will come from among the Jews.

The alignment of nations in Ezek.38 is almost complete today, its head nation points to Russia, for that is who is allied to today's Persia, Libya, Gomer (old Soviet satellites like Armenia), Sudan (part of old Ethiopia), etc., Turkey only not converted to ally with Russia yet, but will (as old Togarmah). Those will be the armies out of the northern quarters coming upon Israel.

Furthermore, who made up the "house of the Israel" after the old split of 1 Kings 11?

The Ezekiel 39 chapter flow moves back and forward in time. The destruction of Gog is the same destruction events after verse 16; both are a direct link to the one time event of Armageddon in Rev.16 on the 7th Vial. If there is a short war prior to the coming tribulation, it will be a mimic only, and not... the real Armageddon destruction of Gog event on the last 7th Vial.

 

[Douggg]

I think belief in a pre-trib rapture theory is clouding your understanding.

Look over at my data below the cross and empty grave picture. Does it say "pre-trib" rapture?

Anytime rapture takes into consideration that the rapture may not happen until after the 7 years begin.

 

[Douggg]

I think belief in a pre-trib rapture theory is clouding your understanding. The coming Antichrist is not going to be coming from the EU. It's not going to be a pope either. Nor is the 2nd beast of Rev.13:11 just a 'system' either those like Ken Klein like to preach. The coming Antichrist will come from among the Jews.

There are not Jews in Europe? Yes, he has to be a Jew.

 

[Douggg]

Furthermore, who made up the "house of the Israel" after the old split of 1 Kings 11?

We are past the northern nation and the southern nation. It is one nation over there. We passed that on May 14, 1948. We are passed the Jews possessing Jerusalem again. And as you pointed out, the Gog/Magog nations are there in the middle east.

The next likely event ( excluding the possible destruction of Damascus) will be something happens that is the catalyst for the EU to become a ten leader form of government. Likely a combination of financial and political crisis to the EU's existence.

 

[Davy]

Look over at my data below the cross and empty grave picture. Does it say "pre-trib" rapture?

Anytime rapture takes into consideration that the rapture may not happen until after the 7 years begin.

The idea of an "anytime rapture" is... the pre-trib rapture theory. That's why the pre-trib rapture theory is also known as the 'any moment' doctrine.