Pastor Expels COVID Police From His Church

JustSomeBloke

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Landon Caeli

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Mayzoo

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Why were the government officials there?

From the article:

"the concern was that the people in attendance were not adhering to the government’s COVID-19 public health orders, which are in place to ensure everyone’s safety.”

AKA: failure to obey Romans 13 as covid health measure are not immoral or against God's Law.
 
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Landon Caeli

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Some people really do love playing victim.

Does that mean you disagree that the police were "Gestapo, Nazi, Communist, Fascist, psychopaths"..?

(I really enjoyed that part of the video)
 
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High Fidelity

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Does that mean you disagree that the police were "Gestapo, Nazi, Communist, Fascist, psychopaths"..?

(I really enjoyed that part of the video)

People violating the law should expect a visit from the police. Religion is no exception.
 
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Benam

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I'm sorry, but anyone who thinks this is "oppression" clearly has no idea what that really means, and those Christians who experience real oppression (think China and similar places) would probably roll their eyes at you.

When they do the exact same thing to the restaurants, and they are, are the restaurants being oppressed? When they don't allow the hair dressers to open for business, and they are, are they oppressing hair dressers? When they break up a house party of young people, and they are, are they oppressing youth? When they prevent people from crossing borders or taking flights, are they oppressing travelers?

Sure, it's not always fair. Costco and Walmart here are chock full of people. They may be wearing masks but they sure aren't staying 6 feet apart. But they are allowed to operate. And sure, a church or restaurant or hair dresser etc. may be able to pull off the masking and distancing to a better degree and may technically be safer than a Big Store, but don't kid yourself that anyone is targeting churches specifically, or that anyone is using the pandemic as an excuse to deliberately harm religion or small business. I would guess those that do believe this are of the same ilk as those who think the pandemic is a hoax, vaccines are bad, the earth is flat, and the moon landing was faked.

And calling the officers who are tasked with breaking up these meetings "gestapo", "Nazi", and so on is highly offensive, especially to people who have had to deal with the real thing.

I'd like to get back to regular in-person church services as soon as anyone, but I'm not going to defy *temporary* restrictions that are legal, meant to help stop the spread of a deadly pandemic, and based on sound scientific reasoning to do so.

Real oppression would be trying to *permanently* shut down churches *specifically*, arresting people who practice Christianity (or worse), etc. I hope you never have to experience real oppression, and I'm thankful I never have either.
 
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JustSomeBloke

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People violating the law should expect a visit from the police. Religion is no exception.
I'm just guessing, but maybe in the absence of a warrant (which the pastor referred to several times in the video), Canadian police are not allowed to enter private property, or have to leave private property when asked to. If that turns out to be the case, would you support the police visiting themselves for violating the law?

Maybe there's a Canadian on here who can help us out with Canadian law on police powers, or lack of, to enter private properties without a warrant.

When they do the exact same thing to the restaurants, and they are, are the restaurants being oppressed? When they don't allow the hair dressers to open for business, and they are, are they oppressing hair dressers? When they break up a house party of young people, and they are, are they oppressing youth? When they prevent people from crossing borders or taking flights, are they oppressing travelers?
Having your hair done or holding a party isn't generally considered an undeniable human right, whereas practising the religion of your choice usually is considered an undeniable human right, except in oppressive countries such as China, North Korea etc.

Interestingly, a Scottish court recently ruled on this, and that is of great interest to me, as I reside in the UK.
Covid in Scotland: Places of worship can open now after court win
 
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ThatRobGuy

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I think this is a case where restrictions that negatively impact everyone are being portrayed as "restrictions against Christians" in order to "play Martyr" so to speak.

Given the types of restrictions being enforced in that country, the same would've happened in an LCBO or Adult book store had people not been following the rules.


Now, for the record...I can sympathize with the church in question... If Justin T. is going to personally attend certain types of protests amid covid, but then still advocate for measures that would prevent people from attending church, I can see why they'd be a tad "miffed" by that.

But, none the less, the restrictions happening aren't disproportionately impacting Christian churches more than any other type of enterprise.
 
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Benam

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I'm Canadian, but not a lawyer etc.

In general, police need either a search warrant or arrest warrant to enter private property without permission. There are exceptions though. If they are chasing someone who enters a private property they can follow them in, for example. Also if they have reason to believe that activities inside the premises are endangering the health or safety of the people inside.

One could argue that ignoring public health orders against activities that could spread a deadly virus might fall under that second exception.
 
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com7fy8

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"Gestapo, Nazi, Communist, Fascist, psychopaths"..?
I understand that communists fought against the Nazi-Fascist-Gestapo people; so it would be interesting if someone claims that communists and Hitlarian people joined forces in a police raid of a church.

Also if they have reason to believe that activities inside the premises are endangering the health or safety of the people inside.

One could argue that ignoring public health orders against activities that could spread a deadly virus might fall under that second exception.
An issue could be how much of a difference it could make, if they had to take the time to get a warrant. In the case of a private property activity which could cause deaths and major illness, dilly-dallying until there is a warrant would not work.

I would say that if there were real oppression, ones who do not mask could be executed under charges of betraying the state and the safety of the people. They could be charged with conspiracy to commit murder by helping to spread a deadly virus. And they could be charged with a hate crime of discriminating against seniors and medically compromised people who could suffer and die because of their unsafe activities.

But this has not been the way it has been handled . . . I would say. It seems the authorities want people to be considerate of one another, to care about each other enough to obey the regulations. They are trying to avoid using law and force . . . it seems to me . . . in a number of places. And I agree that love needs to be the motivating reason.

Where I am, in the United States, it seems we have people who are upset that they are required to wear a mask. But they are mainly concerned only about their own so-called rights. They do not say anything about the rights of seniors and medically in-trouble people who are the ones who could suffer because of the anti-maskers.
 
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Estrid

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Some people really do love playing victim.

Blessed are they who...
It's a half step from there to seeking it out that
one can feel good.

FTM, the church has quite the history and habit of oppression
to answer fof.
 
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Lost4words

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Does that mean you disagree that the police were "Gestapo, Nazi, Communist, Fascist, psychopaths"..?

(I really enjoyed that part of the video)

A true Christian wouldnt hurl abuses like that though. Did Jesus hurl abuses? No.
 
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JustSomeBloke

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A true Christian wouldnt hurl abuses like that though. Did Jesus hurl abuses? No.

What would Jesus do? I guess we'll never know, but perhaps he would have made a whip from cords and driven them from the premises, as per John Chapter 2 Verses 13-17.

13 When it was almost time for the Jewish Passover, Jesus went up to Jerusalem. 14 In the temple courts he found people selling cattle, sheep and doves, and others sitting at tables exchanging money. 15 So he made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple courts, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables. 16 To those who sold doves he said, “Get these out of here! Stop turning my Father’s house into a market!” 17 His disciples remembered that it is written: “Zeal for your house will consume me.”
 
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