Pastor Asking My Wife to Meet?

[brinny]

LoricaLady said: ↑
If the Pastor is concerned about a problem with the husband then he should have a woman counsel her. He especially should have a woman counsel her if the problem is about her marriage. There are wolves in sheep's clothing out there. Messiah told us there would be.

Very good point.

The pastor is very close to the family is one reason. There's still a probability, it's all innocent.

Just make sure to meet in public, tape the conversation.

 

[com7fy8]

The pastor and I are fairly close, talking/texting a few times a week.

You could have texted him about this, by now, so he can speak for himself.

He and I interacted Sunday as normal and my wife tried to respectfully steer clear as to not get in a conversation that could take him off his game him right before service.

She could have talked with him after the service, if she did not want to distract him.

Also, a spiritually sound pastor can take on anything, even right before a service, and still handle the public ministering well. So, do you consider him to be a sound and mature person? It seems you are not sure about him.

And you could have talked with him after service. And when you did talk, yes you could have said you want to hear what he has to say about the text messaging to your wife.

Of course, he does already have her address or he wouldn't have known how to reach her.

And you already could have phoned him and talked together with your wife, with him. Or, either of you could have phoned him, or both of you, separately.

So, if you were capable of talking "normal" with him so he did not know you had talked with your wife about this, this can mean you do not trust him. And my opinion is God has us with leaders we trust. I believe a trustworthy leader can be approached about any concern, and will welcome spouses to share everything with one another.

But, by the way, the pastor is not the one who has told you to keep this matter to yourself. By not talking with him, you have made sure he does not have an opportunity to show how he really is and speak for himself.

I do not know him; so I can't guarantee how he really is. If in fact you do not trust him, this does not prove who or how he really is.

But God can prove a person to you, if God wants you to trust someone . . . in my opinion.

 

[Albion]

And P.S. if the Pastor is interested in marital counseling, don't marital counseling sessions involve both spouses being there?

Customarily, some sessions involve both, and other sessions involve only one of the parties. The latter could be what is intended by the pastor in this case.

 

[spiritualchristian7]

If a pastor texted that to me, I would also be alarmed.
But I wouldn't really be convinced 100% that he's a predator (but maybe 80%? lol)
either way I would leave room for doubt and not jump into conclusion right away

My advice is for you and your wife to meet the pastor TOGETHER.
From there on you guys should discern whether or not the pastor has a pure aim..or a hidden agenda.

Having you around your wife would at least have a sense of security.

 

[Dave L]

I'm graciously asking for advice on a struggle that I can't seem to shake.

The background...

My wife and I serve as volunteer ministry leaders in a church of about 200. We've been at the church for about 5 yrs. Our pastor started this church about 10 years ago. The pastor and I are fairly close, talking/texting a few times a week.

About a month ago at a small group (with our pastor present) my wife shared that she was struggling with some career ambiguity/satisfaction, the idea of getting older, and some hopes and dreams not coming to fruition. She communicated in such a way that it didn't come across as emotionally-charged, excessively heavy or emergent. More like, "This is what's on my heart right now."

Last week, my wife received a text message from our pastor which read, "Hey, let's get together, just the two of us, I want to know whats on your heart. "

She shard the text with me and we discussed at depth. Candidly, I was surprised that he engaged 1:1, the playful context of the message, and that he didn't give me a heads up since we are so close.

We ultimately agreed that the intent was likely positive but the approach was somewhat off. Since it was a single incident we chalked it up to a bad choice and decided to cover it in grace and move on. He and I interacted Sunday as normal and my wife tried to respectfully steer clear as to not get in a conversation that could take him off his game him right before service.

Yesterday she received another text of a similar nature. I confess that I am now feeling protective and a little hurt that there has been no mention of his interaction with her to me even though we've had many conversations since. I still believe his intentions are good but I am confused and struggling with this adverse approach to what seems to be commonly accepted practices of healthy ministry relationships and appropriate male-female interactions.

At this point I believe we have to engage somehow but I want to do that respectfully and in a manner that protects my wife, the pastor, the church and the ministry.

The questions...

I know with a degree of certainty that other pastors whom I'm connected with or have served with in the past would not put themselves in such a position with another female, even with the best of intentions. I confess that I am more conservative on this matter and understand that there are other approaches. Even in the ministry we steward, I disciple the men 1:1 and she disciples the women 1:1. In instances where there is a need we attempt to meet it together. I can personally say that I have never approached a female to meet 1:1 and do my best to not open doors that could lead to those situations.

1. Am I being oversensitive, overly-conservative, jealous, or obstructive?

2. How should pastors (and other ministers) appropriately minister to opposite genders in the church or ensure that their spiritual development needs are being met?

Sounds like a bad situation that can only get worse.

 

[LoricaLady]

There is some good news about the Pastor and his advances toward your wife. Now you know. Now you know, at least in part, what he is really like. Others will still be sitting there, under his leadership, unaware, maybe even impressed by him.

 

[brinny]

Customarily, some sessions involve both, and other sessions involve only one of the parties. The latter could be what is intended by the pastor in this case.

As was posted earlier by a member, a female should've been this pastor's choice, rather than texting this man's wife, and both times with a "winking" smilie face.

There is something SERIOUSLY wrong with this picture.

(you can't see that big ol' red flag just a'wavin' my friend?)

 

[WorshipNico1]

Thank you all for the great dialog thus far.

I would respectfully add a defense that drawing the conclusion that the pastor believes I am "the problem" is illogical. The context of her share at small group did not reference our relationship (directly or indirectly) or our satisfaction with it in any means. It was all about her job, how she thought she might be doing something else, and how she dreamed of being a professional singer when she was younger. The pastor assuming that I am somehow responsible for my wife's career ambiguity or her getting older doesn't track.

Further, the pastor knows me well. We speak multiple times a week. If he thought I was somehow a source of the problem wouldn't I also be the appropriate source for the conversation? Assume that he doesn't want to come to me first without having more information...wouldn't it then be appropriate to have a female leader in the church meet with my wife or, even better, suggest he and his wife meet with my wife? There are so many better alternatives here...he's either oblivious, careless, or ruthless. I truly don't believe it's the latter. If I truly assess the situation I think he is clueless. While that is dangerous I believe that can be addressed. The approach in dealing with that is very different than one which confronts a potential "wolf."

I am still hurt and challenged to be in this situation. One way or another it is pointless headache at best and a massive challenge at worst.

 

[spiritualchristian7]

You could have texted him about this, by now, so he can speak for himself.

You could have talked with him after service. And when you did talk, yes you could have said you want to hear what he has to say about the text messaging to your wife.

Of course, he does already have her address or he wouldn't have known how to reach her.

And you already could have phoned him and talked together with your wife, with him.

So, if you were capable of talking "normal" with him so he did not know you had talked with your wife about this, this can mean you do not trust him. And my opinion is God has us with leaders we trust. I believe a trustworthy leader can be approached about any concern, and will welcome spouses to share everything with one another.

But, by the way, the pastor is not the one who has told you to keep this matter to yourself. By not talking with him, you have made sure he does not have an opportunity to show how he really is and speak for himself.

I do not know him; so I can't guarantee how he really is. If in fact you do not trust him, this does not prove who or how he really is.

But God can prove a person to you, if God wants you to trust someone . . . in my opinion.

I agree. I think it's good to test your pastor by asking him personally, and see (alnalyze) how he reacts when you confront him about it.

 

[brinny]

You could have texted him about this, by now, so he can speak for himself.

She could have talked with him after the service, if she did not want to distract him.

Also, a spiritually sound pastor can take on anything, even right before a service, and still handle the public ministering well. So, do you consider him to be a sound and mature person? It seems you are not sure about him.

And you could have talked with him after service. And when you did talk, yes you could have said you want to hear what he has to say about the text messaging to your wife.

Of course, he does already have her address or he wouldn't have known how to reach her.

And you already could have phoned him and talked together with your wife, with him. Or, either of you could have phoned him, or both of you, separately.

So, if you were capable of talking "normal" with him so he did not know you had talked with your wife about this, this can mean you do not trust him. And my opinion is God has us with leaders we trust. I believe a trustworthy leader can be approached about any concern, and will welcome spouses to share everything with one another.

But, by the way, the pastor is not the one who has told you to keep this matter to yourself. By not talking with him, you have made sure he does not have an opportunity to show how he really is and speak for himself.

I do not know him; so I can't guarantee how he really is. If in fact you do not trust him, this does not prove who or how he really is.

But God can prove a person to you, if God wants you to trust someone . . . in my opinion.

 

[Sanoy]

Thank God this husband, Nico, does have spiritual discernment, along with his wife. We, as God's own, are called to be discerning and wise, as it is written, we are to be as gentle as doves, and wise as serpents.

It is written that we are to be spiritually discerning and therefore to "expose" those works of darkness.

As it is stated in the video, we are to come out from the evils, especially in churches, and runnnnnnn. And not to just "runnnnn", but to "run for our lives".

How do you think these churches and downright cults at times, get all in the news after a history of evil and corruption, while the church members, after even knowing this, just stayed "silent" and sometimes were dragged right into it.

We are called to be "light" and "salt" and to shine that light smack into the middle of the darkest of places, and certainly not to give "refuge" and "cover" for Satan or his agents.

If I have any discernment it is to be hesitant about condemning someone with so little information, though my lack of information is somewhat a personal limitation.

 

[Rebecca4Christ]

I agree with the others,but I would have her meet with him anyway,just to see what is really going on with him,if she feels comfortable doing that.
If more inappropriate or suggestive behaviour follows,you will be dealing with full understanding of the situation.

 

[brinny]

If I have any discernment it is to be hesitant about condemning someone with so little information.

Discernment lines up with God's Word as is discerning when something is NOT of God. We are to discern when something or someone doesn't line up with God's Word. And to expose such darkness, especially if it's someone in church leadership.

The lack of accountability is worrisome. There should ALWAYS be accountability for especially pastors, etc.

 

[brinny]

I agree with the others,but I would have her meet with him anyway,just to see what is really going on with him,if she feels comfortable doing that.
If more inappropriate or suggestive behaviour follows,you will be dealing with full understanding of the situation.

Why invite a situation where it is possibly "her" word against "his".

There are other ways to deal with this.

There's a quote that says something like:

"When someone shows you who they are, believe them."

 

[Albion]

As was posted earlier by a member, a female should've been this pastor's choice, rather than texting this man's wife, and both times with a "winking" smilie face.

There is something SERIOUSLY wrong with this picture.

(you can't see that big ol' red flag just a'wavin' my friend?)

A female should have been this pastor's choice? You mean he should have farmed his congregant out to some other pastor or to a professional counselor before he even got to know what the issues are? I am not sure about that and if that had happened with any of us, I am sure that we would have been outraged, offended, betrayed, or something along those lines.

 

[LoricaLady]

If I have any discernment it is to be hesitant about condemning someone with so little information.

Discernment also means not naively trusting people when they are acting in very concerning ways. How do sexual predators act? They are well known to text their intended "alliances" for private meetings while they evade even mentioning the other person's spouse, much less notifying them.

Again, if a co worker had acted in the same way, I think everyone here would be concerned. It seems some are less concerned because a pastor did the texting, when really they should, I think, be doubly concerned because the pastor did the texting.

 

[Sanoy]

Discernment lines up with God's Word as is discerning when something is NOT of God. We are to discern when something or someone doesn't line up with God's Word. And to expose such darkness, especially if it's someone in church leadership.

The lack of accountability is worrisome. There should ALWAYS be accountability for especially pastors, etc.

We can act based on discernment, and we can mistakenly think we are acting on discernment. That is why I think it is good to gather as many resources as we can before we take what could be a detrimental action.

 

[Sanoy]

Pray to see the obvious, whatever it may be.

Discernment also means not naively trusting people when they are acting in very concerning ways. How do sexual predators act? They are well known to text their intended "alliances" for private meetings while they evade even mentioning the other person's spouse, much less notifying them.

Again, if a co worker had acted in the same way, I think everyone here would be concerned. It seems they are less concerned because a pastor did the texting, when really they should, I think, be doubly concerned because the pastor did the texting.

I'm not asking that he be trusted. I am asking that one gather sufficient information before making a judgement that could ruin an innocent man.

 

[brinny]

A female should have been this pastor's choice? You mean he should have farmed his congregant out to some other pastor or to a professional counselor before he even got to know what the issues are? I am not sure about that and if that had happened with any of us, I am sure that we would have been outraged, offended, betrayed, or something along those lines.

Yes. There should ALREADY be women in the church in a ministry to minister to women. Yes?

 

[com7fy8]

Last week, my wife received a text message from our pastor which read, "Hey, let's get together, just the two of us, I want to know whats on your heart. "

She shard the text with me and we discussed at depth. Candidly, I was surprised that he engaged 1:1, the playful context of the message, and that he didn't give me a heads up since we are so close.

I see more than one possibility.

Someone could be fishing for an affair, yes.

A pastor could feel you three have enough understanding together so he can one-on-one with either of you and not notify the other; he even could expect that she will let you know . . . if he considers you two to be companions in ministry.

Did she mention you while talking about her concerns? In case she did not talk about you, while talking about her concerns about dreams and hopes, someone could take this to mean she is feeling somehow separate or separating from you. But you make it clear, though, I would say, how you do share with each other.

You say >

my wife shared that she was struggling with some career ambiguity/satisfaction, the idea of getting older, and some hopes and dreams not coming to fruition.

Well, "hopes and dreams not coming to fruition" can be related to her marriage . . . with you. And so a person could take her to mean there is some problem in your marriage; and certainly for a lot of people marriage is connected with how they will meet their hopes and dreams. But as a pastor, I would not try to make a "date" alone with a woman who I felt could have marital issues. I might quickly make sure with her, with other people nearby, if she means there are marital problems. And I could offer for her to talk with my wife and have prayer together.

In case she said she has problems, I would need to pray about if I go directly to him, myself, or if I ask her to talk with him about talking with me. But if you are in ministry, it is the pastor's "business" to know what is going on, in any case, I would say. We need ministry people who are functioning as "examples to the flock." (1 Peter 5:3) This means our example in the sight of God, not only what we show to others.

How much have you two talked about her concerns ? ? ? ? You say you talked "in depth" about this matter. This can mean you two already are sharing about her concerns, and so it can be good that both of you together share with him. And invite his wife, possibly a valuable resource for his ministry, including counseling. Make it a family thing.

Even so > my opinion > if he has developed some rapport with her, he could feel he's ok to talk with her alone. But I'm not sure it is good to isolate her with him away from others. Keep it family, with various people in the know; she shared personally with the group; so possibly there is where he can draw out your wife, knowing you will be in the know about the group's talking.

Of course . . . her saying she is concerned about her dreams and hopes could be, for an evil person, an invitation to see if he can take advantage of her situation.

Now, if she ministers independently of you, he already could have had some private talks with her. But it could be good to have them while they two are on the floor with others around them. Often I see men and women having quick talks, even about very personal things; it can be done efficiently right where other people are nearby. Probably no one will be reading your lips.

But if you have ministered as a couple, and he is singling her out . . . at least get things so all three of you are in the know about what you're talking about. After all, if his intentions are more "good", he is going to want to get every side of the story, about any marital issues, and not only go with what she says. Or else, does he trust you? And if not, why does he go along with you being in ministry, if he doesn't trust you?

I think where there is trust, a pastor includes his wife in ministering and counseling > she is his helper and a very valuable resource for input and prayer and her example to people counseled by the pastor. So, I can see the value of all four of you getting in on this.

You can this to him.