Over 100 Police Agencies Pull Out Of Agreements To Guard DNC Convention

[Belk]

Cool. So now you're arguing that all this action to "defund the police" hasn't prevented the police from doing their job.

Can you provide evidence about how police in, let's say, New York have brought down the crime rate in recent months. Or, how about Seattle, since that's where you indicated you have some insider knowledge.

Nope. You don't get to shift the burden of proof. Your claim is that "Democrats want to defund police they simultaneously also want police to protect them personally ... despite having so handicapped law enforcement that law enforcement personnel cannot do their jobs." So let's see your evidence they are so handicapped they can't do their job.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

From your DailyWire article, the problem is not with the DNC, but with Milwaukee's policies on teargas and pepper spray.

The DNC could ask Trump to sent in federal agents, who are not bound by The cities policies...

 

[NightHawkeye]

Nope. You don't get to shift the burden of proof.

Didn't shift anything. You asked for proof earlier. I provided that.

I subsequently asked you to prove your claim. Point, counter-point. That's the way discussion works. I simply ask that you justify your claim now ... or remain silent. Stop the ad hominems. Stop the badgering.

 

[Belk]

Didn't shift anything. You asked for proof earlier. I provided that.

I disagree. It appears to me that you provided something tangential to your claims. To wit claiming that the move to change the police focus has so handicapped the police they can no longer do their job.

I subsequently asked you to prove your claim. Point, counter-point. That's the way discussion works.

Hmmm... you know what NHE, fair cop. You feel this a relevant point so allow me to respond.

As you can see in the linked article, defunding the police is the idea that police should be focused on actual crime and removed from the job of state nanny. to quote

there's evidence that less policing can lead to less crime. A 2017 report, which focused on several weeks in 2014 through 2015 when the New York Police Department purposely pulled back on "proactive policing," found that there were 2,100 fewer crime complaints during that time.

Defunding police: What it means and what it could look like - CNN

There you go. Evidence that more focused enforcement will reduce the crime rate.

I simply ask that you justify your claim now ... or remain silent.


Stop the ad hominems. Stop the badgering.

I am not going to remain silent and I am not trying to badger you. Nor do I feel I have made any ad hominem claims. I am simply trying to point out that your claims are unsubstantiated.

 

[NightHawkeye]

Hmmm... you know what NHE, fair cop. You feel this a relevant point so allow me to respond.

As you can see in the linked article, defunding the police is the idea that police should be focused on actual crime and removed from the job of state nanny. to quote

Defunding police: What it means and what it could look like - CNN

There you go. Evidence that more focused enforcement will reduce the crime rate.

No argument from me that the way police operate can be improved ... but improvement is not what "Defund the police" is about ... and that's certainly not what Minneapolis attempted to accomplish. Police would largely be replaced by social workers if the Minneapolis city council had its way.

I suppose you can argue that words don't actually mean what they mean ... but "Defund the police", has a very explicit definition and meaning. That said, I certainly agree with you that police departments can be improved. I would simply say that any such worthwhile improvements are likely to be incremental rather than revolutionary. Revolutionary changes, such "defunding the police" result in violence, destruction, criminal mischief and devolution of society. Just the way it is.

I am not going to remain silent and I am not trying to badger you. Nor do I feel I have made any ad hominem claims. I am simply trying to point out that your claims are unsubstantiated.

I thank you for making a sincere effort and providing evidence to engender continued reasonable discussion.

 

[Belk]

No argument from me that the way police operate can be improved ... but improvement is not what "Defund the police" is about ... and that's certainly not what Minneapolis attempted to accomplish.

Oh? What where they trying to accomplish and how do you know?

Police would largely be replaced by social workers if the Minneapolis city council had its way.

Where was that spelled out?

I suppose you can argue that words don't actually mean what they mean ... but "Defund the police", has a very explicit definition and meaning.

Yes, its meaning is contained in the article I linked and goes way beyond the simple meaning of the three word catch phrase.

That said, I certainly agree with you that police departments can be improved. I would simply say that any such worthwhile improvements are likely to be incremental rather than revolutionary. Revolutionary changes, such "defunding the police" result in violence, destruction, criminal mischief and devolution of society. Just the way it is.

Show me your evidence.

I thank you for making a sincere effort and providing evidence to engender continued reasonable discussion.

 

[NightHawkeye]

Oh? What where they trying to accomplish and how do you know?

Where was that spelled out?

You think they meant something other than what they said?

Yes, its meaning is contained in the article I linked and goes way beyond the simple meaning of the three word catch phrase.

Incorrect.

That article was an optimistic interpretation of what the producer of the article wanted to believe the phrase "Defund the police" meant ... nothing more.

The mayor of Seattle wanted to believe that CHAZ/CHOP equated with a "Summer of love". We all know now that that didn't happen.

 

[Belk]

You think they meant something other than what they said?

By all means, quote where they spoke of their intentions.

Incorrect.

That article was an optimistic interpretation of what the producer of the article wanted to believe the phrase "Defund the police" meant ... nothing more.

Very well. I await your evidence of what it actually means.

The mayor of Seattle wanted to believe that CHAZ/CHOP equated with a "Summer of love". We all know now that that didn't happen.

Indeed. She was forced to walk that back.

 

[Mountainmanbob]

Democrats want to defund police they simultaneously also want police to protect them personally ...

Yes, very confused.
M

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

Oh? What where they trying to accomplish and how do you know?

Where was that spelled out?

Since police departments cannot function long without money, it can't mean anything other than getting rid of the police.

 

[Belk]

Since police departments cannot function long without money, it can't mean anything other than getting rid of the police.

I do not find your claims credible.

 

[Fantine]

Hmm...so who would be picketing the DNC? Democrats wouldn't be picketing the DNC. Liberals wouldn't be picketing the DNC...

I guess it would be those Second Amendment right-wing agitators who came heavily armed to the Michigan State House, threatening the governor's life, necessitating legislators' walking into the capitol wearing kevlar vests and bringing guards. Although our democracy was being threatened by these armed thugs, Trump did nothing to stop them. He didn't call in the National Guard. He didn't use tear gas. Oh, no! He didn't even recognize them as being terroristic lawbreakers.

Just call off your attack dogs who are subverting the Democratic process and there won't be any problem.

Rightwingers acting as though their hands are clean. Ugh!

From the Associated Press (AP): Over 100 Police Agencies Pull Out Of Agreements To Guard DNC Convention

“Since the Milwaukee order was issued, more than 100 law enforcement agencies in Wisconsin and across the country decided against coming to Milwaukee, Morales told WTMJ-TV on Tuesday,” the Associated Press reported.​

Karma bites ...

.

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

Hmm...so who would be picketing the DNC? Democrats wouldn't be picketing the DNC. Liberals wouldn't be picketing the DNC...

Bernie Sanders and Jill Stein supporters were picketing the DNC in 2016. More famously, who was rioting in Chicago outside the DNC in 1968?

I guess it would be those Second Amendment right-wing agitators who came heavily armed to the Michigan State House, threatening the governor's life, necessitating legislators' walking into the capitol wearing kevlar vests and bringing guards. Although our democracy was being threatened by these armed thugs, Trump did nothing to stop them. He didn't call in the National Guard. He didn't use tear gas. Oh, no! He didn't even recognize them as being terroristic lawbreakers.

What law do you think they were breaking?

Rightwingers acting as though their hands are clean. Ugh!

Leftists can get away with getting their hands dirty - that's why it was necessary for Trump to send in federal agents. Anybody on the right, or perceived to be on the right gets a speck of dust on their hands, the full force of the law comes down on them. So it's a matter of practicality.

 

[Fantine]

What law do you think they were breaking?

You don't think threatening the life of the governor and forcing the closure of the legislature because the only way legislators could enter the building was wearing kevlar vests and bringing armed escorts is breaking the law?

Are you an American or do you live in a fascist dictatorship somewhere?

Shortly afterwards, right wing domestic terrorists hung the Democratic governor in effigy outside his home, frightening his young children. His offense? Closing off tours of the governor's mansion, their home, for pandemic safety...

Considering that domestic terrorists hung him in effigy on his lawn, I wonder if the home will ever be open for tours again. Who would welcome domestic terrorists into a home where you live with your young children?

 

[Searching1God]

No, you listed six cities. Since I work with the police in Seattle i know full well your claims there are inaccurate. The same for the other 5 I am certain. You should likely stop getting your news from hyperbolic web sites designed to feed your partisan bend.

Are you sure you work with the police in Seattle? or do you work AGAINST the police in Seattle? Seattle council members have tried to pass a ban on police that would prevent police officers from using tear gases and other crowd control measures, and a judge stepped in to block the ban.
Judge blocks Seattle's ban on tear gas, other crowd control weapons

 

[Belk]

Are you sure you work with the police in Seattle? or do you work AGAINST the police in Seattle?

I work for the city of Seattle. One of the city departments I support is the police. I literally work with the police and directly support them.

Seattle council members have tried to pass a ban on police that would prevent police officers from using tear gases and other crowd control measures, and a judge stepped in to block the ban.
Judge blocks Seattle's ban on tear gas, other crowd control weapons

OK. What is your point?

 

[SoldierOfTheKing]

You don't think threatening the life of the governor and forcing the closure of the legislature because the only way legislators could enter the building was wearing kevlar vests and bringing armed escorts is breaking the law?

They weren't threatening anybody's life.

Shortly afterwards, right wing domestic terrorists hung the Democratic governor in effigy outside his home, frightening his young children.

Constitutionally protected free speech.

 

[Fantine]

Fox News neglects to report news that makes their viewers look bad.