Our Angels

[Duane Morse]

With God all things are possible. Man was first created male and female, then the male and female were split into two. And the two shall be one flesh. The two will be rejoined into one.
Apples into oranges.
The Truth can be stranger than you imagine.

 

[BT]

I know your joking now. At least I hope so.

 

[Duane Morse]

Joking about what?

 

[BT]

"With God all things are possible. Man was first created male and female, then the male and female were split into two. And the two shall be one flesh. The two will be rejoined into one.
Apples into oranges.
The Truth can be stranger than you imagine."

About that...I thought that was a joke because frankly it doesn't make sense. I'm sorry, you weren't kidding?

 

[Duane Morse]

Not at all. When God first formed Adam from the dust of the ground and breathed life into him, Adam was a being that was both male and female, but in a singular body.
It was later, on the sixth day, that God put Adam into a deep sleep and split the male and female aspects of Adam into two separate bodies.
It is for this reason that a man shall cleave to his wife, and the two shall be one flesh.
Adam and Eve are one in soul and essence. But the physical bodies occupied change, first as one, then two, then one again.

The two were one, then split, then rejoined.
That is what the tern "soul-mate" is all about. It comes right from the Bible's creation story.

 

[BT]

No actually Duane that is not in the Bible. Probably because it's ridiculous. God Created Man.

Genesis 2:7 "And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul."

The God created the garden and some rivers. And put man into the garden to tend it. And God realized that man was alone and that that was not good.

Genesis 2:18
"And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper suitable for him."

Then after Adam had named all the creatures, beasts, fowl, creepy things. He (God) created woman.

Genesis 2:21-22
"And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs; and closed up its place with flesh; And from the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man."

Where you came up with that idea that man was asexual, boggles the mind. I'm interested in knowing which version of the Bible you're reading from.

 

[Duane Morse]

The same one as you are, but I read more closely it seems.
Eve was taken out of Adam, she is not a separate creation. Adam was created male and female, in God's image. Then Eve, the female, is taken out of Adam, leaving Adam the male and Eve the female in separate bodies.
The soul is male and female, which is in the image of the male/female God.
The Father and Spirit.

Genesis 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

Hasn't this verse ever caught your attention?
Created he him - singular, male and female created he them- plural.
The two are one, and the one consists of both.

And created in that order, first as the singular him Adam, then taking the female out of Adam making them the male/female plural.
And the two shall be one flesh - future tense when the two are rejoined.

 

[healthwoman]

First- I am ABSOLUTELY not catholic, second, Duane- you said the issue of the angel was already cleared up. Maybe in your mind it is, but I am still believe we were created to resemble angels that were already dwelling with God. I DO NOT think we will become angels.

I do however tend to agree with you on the male/female thing. Wierd as it sounds, God would have created a COMPLETE being in the beginning. This is not spelled out in the scriptures and I'm not going around preaching about it or the angel thing. I believe our Father wants us to meditate on spiritual things, including these new concepts. It's not a distortion of scripture to give God credit for things 'we don't or can't understand'.

We weren't meant to know all at this point in time- we can't- it would blow our minds! 

Linda  

 

[4Jesus]

17th February 2003 at 10:12 AM Duane Morse said this in Post #7

When men see angels, the angels appear to look like men, do they not?
And when we get to heaven we shall be as the angels, do we not?
If angels look like men, and we are like the angels in heaven, then how do you differentiate between men and angels in heaven?
Matthew 22:30 - For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

I believe the meaning of this passage is that, the angels in heaven are asexual. The Sadducees had no confidence in a glorious new life after the resurrection but Jesus was telling them that life in heaven would not be as they knew it on earth.

This would also dispell the notion that some religious sects have that they will be re-united with multiple wives at the resurrection and they will be able to have sex in heaven and produce spiritual children. 

    

 

[Duane Morse]

healthwoman, actually the scriptures do spell it out if you read them correctly. God first formed Man in the image of God, male and female. Then after a time He put Adam to sleep, and separated Eve, the female, from the male. Eve comes from within Adam, just as the Spirit comes from within the Father. God is also male and female. It is His image.
Look at my avatar, what do you see? You see the symbol for true and perfect Love showing both the male and female of the whole. It begins, at the center, as two arcs that co-exist in the same space. Then it splits for two spaces, then it rejoins partially in the next and fully in the following space, then it splits, then rejoins, etc.
That little symbol is the pattern that we are based upon, because it is the pattern that God set up for the progression of Life.
Ever increasing Life based on a male/female whole that evolves and grows to perfection. It is one of the great mysteries that is so commonplace in our world that no one gives a second thought to.

It is the same with Jesus, the only begotten Son of the Highest. Jesus is the Father incarnate, which includes the Spirit. Man is the spirit within Jesus. We are one with Jesus just as Jesus is one with the Almighty.
There are seeming paradoxes all over the place. We come from Jesus, and Jesus comes from man through Mary. We are separate at the moment, but will again be rejoined with Jesus at the wedding, Jesus being the Bridegroom and redeemed man being the Bride.
The parallels are there to see if you only look. Jesus is the Son of God, and Man is a part of that Son, as the female spirit to the male father Jesus. The Bride for the Bridegroom.

And when I said the angel thing was cleared up I was only referring to that thing with Peter, whether he was an angel that looked like Peter or Peter himself. It was Peter himself after the Lord let him out of prison.
We may indeed have angels that resemble us, but the angels are niether male nor female, and actually they are both, but female in actual nature. Jesus is the only true male being the only begotten of the Father.

And to understand how we could also be the angels you would also have to understand time and the dimensions, which are very strange things indeed.

 

[Duane Morse]

4Jesus, do you recall what Jesus said about sex in heaven and children in heaven?
Matthew 22:30 - For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
Matthew 8:12 - But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

We are not supposed to marry in heaven, so sex is out of the question. And any children produced in heaven will be cast into the outer darkness.

Different place, conditions, and time; and different rules we must adhere to.

 

[BT]

Duane could I ask you what denomination you follow? Or.. is it something like the LDS? I'm asking as an honest question... because you're doctrine is flawed, and your interpretation isn't correct.. not even close actually. But if you're a JW or an LDS then I can understand it. If let us say you are an Evangelical, or a Baptist, or a Catholic even.. then I'll follow the thread further... is all I mean.

LDS = Latter Day Saints (aka Mormonism)
JW = Jehovah's Witnesses

 

[BT]

If you don't want to say which denomination... for fear that I will bash it (which is not my intent) ... are you a member of a.. I guess "Mainstream" church...

 

[Duane Morse]

I do not belong to any denomination.
Any church that I have attended has not wanted me around for long.

 

[healthwoman]

I am reading the scriptures correctly, I do know how to read. You are 'interpreting' this passage differently than I am. Unfortunately, there is no other scripture to compare this with.

 

[Duane Morse]

How many interpretations are there of the same scriptures?
I do not in any way want to imply that you are illiterate or unintelligent.
I am sorry if I gave you that impression.

 

[healthwoman]

there could be several interpretations of the same scriptures- how else would some people get the idea that there's going to be a so called 'rapture?

 

[Duane Morse]

Mark 10:6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. 7 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; 8 And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh. 9 What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

Matthew 19:3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? 4 And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, 5 And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? 6 Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. 7 They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? 8 He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.

There are a couple that hint at the nature of the soul of Man. But you are correct that it is not spelled out in detail.
But Jesus did say that there were things that the deciples were not able to bear at the time, that would be revealed at the correct time.
Maybe this is one of them.

 

[BT]

You don't believe that there will be a rapture healthwoman?


Duane why have you not been wanted? Have you caused discord amongst the brethren? Spread false doctrine (such as this)? I'm asking honestly NOT trying to take a shot at you... The Bible is for everyone but there is great danger in misinterpretation. I'm hoping that you aren't falling into that trap.

 

[Duane Morse]

The rapture thing is a big can of worms, if you ask me. I personally do not believe it will happen that way, but that we will all go through the time of troubles. I think the first resurrection at the end of that time is what the "rapture people" are seeing, but they misplace the timeline of the event.