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once saved always saved

Hentenza

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greatdivide46

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To believe once saved always saved one has to either ignore or dismiss all the passages that tell us the consequences of rejecting the salvation we once held so dear. The entire book of Hebrews is for the purpose of trying to convince people not to reject their salvation and return to their former lifestyles. If it were not possible to do that the book of Hebrews is unnecessary at best or a total sham at worst.
 
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DeaconDean

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You know, I love it when "Christians" quote Heb. 10:26 and think that says it all.

It only goes to show that they might have read the chapter, but they have failed to do as Paul instructed Timothy:

"Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." -1 Tim. 2:15 (KJV)

Study involves more than just reading the scriptures, it also involves reading commentary, studying the original language of the Bible.

Something that some do not do. And the three most important principles of biblical hermenutics is: "context, context, context".

Arthur W. Pink, in his "Exposition of Hebrews" addresses this in his introduction saying:


1. Introduction

In other words, the writer of Hebrews, was warning those newly converted Jews who were danger of reverting back (apostasy) to ritual Judaism and upon sinning, there remaineth no sacrfice for sin once they have been enlightened as to the sacrifice of Christ for sin "once for all".

I love it when people use this verse to tell Christians that once they sin, they are not saved, or have "apostasized.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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phoenixdem

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Oh dear, now we have Books of the Holy Bible that are unnecessary so we can begin tossing out Books of the Bible that we don't believe. Well...we can always include the Book of John and the Book of Romans.

John
6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that
cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the
will of him that sent me.
6:39 And this is the Father’s will which hath sent me, that of all which he
hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at
the last day.

Romans
8:33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that
justifieth.
8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is
risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh
intercession for us.
8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or
distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or
sword?
8:36 As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are
accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
8:37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him
that loved us.
8:38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor
principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
8:39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to

separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

There are other Books of which we can dispense because there are many verses that support each other in the promise of salvation for eternity, but we don't need them either.

I remember posting to one guy who wants to do away with the first ten chapters of Genesis because he was a teacher of the young, from what I understood, and he thought that they wouldn't accept the first ten chapters and they certainly wouldn't refute evolution.

Ok, why waste time. Let's do away with all of the Scriptures and see if Abdullah could persuade his brother Muslims to take us in.
 
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Hentenza

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Let me remind our esteemed guests that debating in a congregational forum where one is not a member is a violation of the CF posting rules. Please become familiar with the posting rules.


http://www.christianforums.com/rules/#faq_rule_0
 
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WinBySurrender

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<staff edit>
When Peter asked Jesus how many times he is to forgive a man who sins against him, he asked "Seven times?" That was being truly magnanimous in their culture, because the Pharisees said you only had to forgive three times. Yet Jesus answers, "No ... seventy times seven." Not 490 times and "that's it!" Always forgive, forgive forever, never refuse forgiveness. So do you suppose Jesus holds Himself to a lesser standard? Does He put a limit on the number or accumulation of sin? No. He always forgives. The shed blood of Jesus Christ says that any man who has faith in that sacrifice is bound to Christ forever. Jude 24 says it is up to Him, not us, to prevent our stumbling. Confession is necessary, but not for "re-salvation" - it is necessary for the restoration of fellowship, which is broken by sin, but not relationship, which cannot be broken. We did nothing to establish it, we can do nothing to sever it.
 
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LadyOfMystery

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I believe we have eternal security and I believe "once saved always saved" for these reasons:

People often think since we have free will that we can choose to not be saved anymore but what they forget is salvation is a gift he gave to us. If we could take it back, it's not really a gift it would be a trade. When you get a gift from someone, you accept it. If you change your mind later and try to give it back, they make accept it but in God's case there is no evidence that when someone says "Im not saved anymore" He did not take away their salvation. He did not accept it back. It's yours forever. You can bury it, forget it, ignore it but its still your gift living inside you ready for you to pick it up.
 
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suzybeezy

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MOD HAT ON

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greatdivide46

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I agree with you as to whom the letter to the Hebrews was written to. My question is if it is not possible for them to revert back to ritual Judaism why even warn them about such a thing? And according to OSAS once they were saved they will always be saved. In other words it would be impossible for them to revert back to ritual Judaism. Hence, there would be no point in warning them not to do that since there is no danger that they can even do that.
 
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DCJazz

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is this teaching true?
a man i used to talk to said that the once saved always saved teaching is baloney

I think it's biblical, yes.
After all, the original sin inherent in all mankind is forgiven through Christ. And it's that sin that separates us from God in the first place.

If there's a way to dislodge myself from that, then I have to question the authority of God and, by extension, question the point of Christ.

This verse comes to mind:

For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. (Romans 8:38-39, NIV I think.)

I count as a created being, don't I? So then to say that I can re-separate myself from God is blasphemy.
 
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Lindas Place

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If Hebrews 10 does not convince us that … Jesus saved us once for all time, and it is a sin to believe His blood did not save us completely… then nothing will… this is my favorite book… very encouraging.. if they continue to believe they can lose God’s salvation… which is what led them to return to animal sacrificing.. they are deliberately sinning after receiving the knowledge of the truth and God will judge His people…


Lets read it in context… This is Good News !

Hebrews 10
Christ’s Sacrifice Once for All
1 The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship. 2 If it could, would they not have stopped being offered? For the worshipers would have been cleansed once for all, and would no longer have felt guilty for their sins. 3 But those sacrifices are an annual reminder of sins, 4 because it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.
5 Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said:
“Sacrifice and offering you did not desire,
but a body you prepared for me;
6 with burnt offerings and sin offerings
you were not pleased.
7 Then I said, ‘Here I am—it is written about me in the scroll—
I have come to do your will, O God.’”
8 First he said, “Sacrifices and offerings, burnt offerings and sin offerings you did not desire, nor were you pleased with them” (although the law required them to be made). 9 Then he said, “Here I am, I have come to do your will.” He sets aside the first to establish the second. 10 And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
11 Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. 12 But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God. 13 Since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool, 14 because by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy.
15 The Holy Spirit also testifies to us about this. First he says:
16 “This is the covenant I will make with them
after that time, says the Lord.
I will put my laws in their hearts,
and I will write them on their minds.”
17 Then he adds:
“Their sins and lawless acts
I will remember no more.”
18 And where these have been forgiven, there is no longer any sacrifice for sin.

A Call to Persevere
19 Therefore, brothers, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus, 20 by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain, that is, his body, 21 and since we have a great priest over the house of God, 22 let us draw near to God with a sincere heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water. 23 Let us hold unswervingly to the hope we profess, for he who promised is faithful. 24 And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds. 25 Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.
26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, 27 but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. 28 Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God under foot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,” and again, “The Lord will judge his people.” 31 It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
32 Remember those earlier days after you had received the light, when you stood your ground in a great contest in the face of suffering. 33 Sometimes you were publicly exposed to insult and persecution; at other times you stood side by side with those who were so treated. 34 You sympathized with those in prison and joyfully accepted the confiscation of your property, because you knew that you yourselves had better and lasting possessions.
35 So do not throw away your confidence; it will be richly rewarded. 36 You need to persevere so that when you have done the will of God, you will receive what he has promised. 37 For in just a very little while,
“He who is coming will come and will not delay.
38 But my righteous one will live by faith.
And if he shrinks back,
I will not be pleased with him.”
39 But we are not of those who shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who believe and are saved.
 
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greatdivide46

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And why a call to persevere when it is impossible to do anything else? I guess I just don't get it. The book of Hebrews is encouraging to me too, simply because I recognize the possibility of losing one's salvation. For those who believe it is impossible to do that I just don't see how Hebrews can be all that encouraging.
 
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Lindas Place

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Once saved, not always saves...
Backsliders God will punish!
He only punishes His children.


because the Lord disciplines those he loves, and he punishes everyone he accepts as a son." Hebrews 12:6

Endure hardship as discipline; God is treating you as sons. For what son is not disciplined by his father? If you are not disciplined (and everyone undergoes discipline), then you are illegitimate children and not true sons. Hebrews 12:7-8
 
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