Old Earth

[JoshuaDaryl]

Do not assume a person who takes the Bible literally, also assumes a young earth. I myself ascribe to the Gap theory.


In The Beginning May
3
by Michael Snow


In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.

When thinking about creation, Christians often turn to geologists and astronomers and even high school science teachers as they seek understanding. And though there is much to learn, there is much that leads astray. But for all the claims about the authority of Scripture, who ever begins there? Instead of beginning with science, read first about Scripture. Read commentaries.

“In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. And the earth was without form and void and darkness covered the face of the deep…”

“…And God said, ‘Let there be light’…”

How much time elapsed in the age of the earth between the creation of the universe in verse 1 and “Let there be light” in verse 3? We have no clue in Scripture. [But many Christians, unfamiliar with this Scripture, seem to assume that “the beginning” equals “let there be light.”]

The Text

Gen 1:1 is not a preface, it is an absolute statement (G. Ch. Aalders: “this is the rendition that is found in every ancient translation, without exception”); “heavens and earth” is a merism, a figure of speech that signifies the whole, i.e. “the universe.”

Verse 2 tells us about the state of the earth following God’s act of creation in verse 1. Calvin, long before the evolution debate, wrote, “before God had perfected the world it was an undigested mass…this mass, however confused it might be, was rendered stable, for the time, by the secret efficacy of the Spirit.” [Whatever the cosmology of Calvin's day, he saw an earth in verse two that would need further work in verses 3 and following, thus an elapse of unknown time. You can read Calvin’s commentaries, free, online.]

NICOT: “Verse 2 then, describes the situation prior to the detailed creation that is spelled out in vv 3ff” [underline mine]. How much time elapsed before verse 3, “Let there be light?,” Scripture is silent.

Time

But time compression, in describing events, occurs regularly in Scripture. In Genesis 4, we leap from the conception of Cain in verse one, to the birth of Abel in verse two, and with Abel now being a shepherd in that same verse.

Anyone who reads the Old Testament will see these leaps of time again and again.

The Earth

Three conditions of the earth are described in v.2, the last being ‘darkness’ for which God provides the remedy in v. 3, “Let there be light…”

And in the following verses he provides the remedies for the other two conditions.

There is a wonderful symmetry here: Days one to three have been called, “Days of Preparation” and the last three, “Days of Filling” or from the general to the particular . e.g. day one has ‘light’ ; day four has lights (sun/moon/stars) set in order. Day two has sky and day five has birds of the sky, etc.

In these verses “heaven” and “earth” are used in a limited sense. “The dry land he called earth” [not the planet]. The heavens, here, as the NIV translates it, is our “sky.”

Days

Day One and the days that follow are the week in which God sets his creation in order for the creation of man.

“For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day” Exodus 20:11.

This verse is often wrongly used. [See, here] Here, speaking of that week, “the LORD made” not created as in Gen. 1:1. “Made” has can have the same connotation as our “making” our bed. We set in order what is already there. [In this case, the remedy for the messy conditions described in verse 2.]

Thus, this verse [Exodus 20:11] is parallel with what we read of the “days” of the week as described: …heavens, earth, sea, and all that is in them [the exact things named in the days of the week], NOT with the universe, the “heavens and earth,” of Genesis 1:1 [It does not reflect on the creation of the universe but on preparing “earth” for man; setting in order the earth that is dark and empty].

A completely unnecessary conflict among some Christians concerns the notion of a Scriptural age of the earth. The ability of devout Christians to fool themselves about their own knowledge is seen in the 17th Century scholars, Bishop Usher and John Lightfoot of Cambridge. The presumptions and false premises of devout and diligent Christians led to setting a date for the creation of the universe. Lightfoot’s first assessment was September 17, 3928 B.C. [What was happening on September 16th?!] Of course, as the first two verses of Genesis show, genealogies [which have their own problems of understanding] do not have anything to do with the age of the earth.

John Calvin, in the 16th Century, made many wise comments on Genesis: “He who would learn astronomy…let him go elsewhere….”

”Moses wrote in a popular style things which without instruction, all ordinary persons, endued with common sense, are able to understand; but astronomers investigate with great labor whatever the sagacity of the human mind can comprehend. Nevertheless, this study is not to be reprobated, nor this science to be condemned, because some frantic persons are wont boldly to reject whatever is unknown to them. For astronomy is not only pleasant, but also very useful to be known: it cannot be denied that this art unfolds the admirable wisdom of God.”

 

[Skala]

Why assume a gap theory?

You've only personally been alive less than 100 years. Thus, you only truly know for absolute fact that the earth has been around for as long as you have been around. You have no idea how long the earth has existed, further than your own existence.

You weren't around 500 years ago to know if the earth existed then.

You weren't around 5000 years ago to know if the earth existed then.

Why do you believe the earth was around millions of years ago? You weren't there. You can't prove it.

It's much easier to simply believe that God created a mature earth, and that the human race can be traced through the Bible back to Adam.

 

[miamited]

Hi JD,

I have found that for one to understand the age of the creation, one must know God.

By that, I mean being thoroughly familiar with His word and understanding 'why' God created this realm. I believe that God created this world for this:

Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.

I believe that God created this universe in which we live near instantaneously. All in the time that we ascribe as six rotations of our planet. He populated the earth with man and His purpose in creating mankind and all of the universe which supports the eternal life of our planet is that one day He will cull from among all of the people who have lived, a body of people who will be His. On that day, God will be the God of those that He harvests from the earth and they will be His people. On that day, God will have completed the purpose for which He created this realm. Praise God!

God created this realm in which we live for a purpose and the Scriptures delineate for us how He is accomplishing that purpose. For me, the earth and the universe did not come about through some natural processes that science tries to convince us it did. No! The earth and the universe in which we live came about by the command of God who was setting in motion a plan which will be culminated on the day that He harvests those who are His from the earth. It is a perfect plan for God to attain His goal.

He created man and created a place for him to live. He has allowed man to live however he chooses, but has set among us His words that tell us who He is and why this realm exist and what we can do if we choose to be one of those people who will eternally live in peace with God. Where we will be His people and He will be our God.

I have found that by understanding this ultimate purpose of God, any idea that would teach that the created realm came about through some natural processes becomes just so much foolishness to me. This realm in which we live exists for nothing more than to provide a home for mankind. It was created by God as that home for mankind. For it to have existed for some eons of age prior to God's creating the first man just seems silly to me.

Finally, though old earthers will deny it vehemently, it does rob us of the full awareness of just how powerful and perfect this God, who created all things, really is. He merely spoke, and the earth appeared out of nothing spinning in a black inky void of nothingness. He just spoke, and the atmosphere of our earth was created. He just spoke, and all the plants and animals came to be. He just spoke, and the heavens of our universe was filled with a myriad of celestial bodies. He just lovingly stooped down upon the earth that He had only days earlier created and made man and set him in the garden. Everything both seen and unseen in this realm, God created that man might have life. Selah!

That's how I understand the how and the why of God's creating this realm in which man lives.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

 

[JoshuaDaryl]

Hi JD,

I have found that for one to understand the age of the creation, one must know God.

By that, I mean being thoroughly familiar with His word and understanding 'why' God created this realm. I believe that God created this world for this:

Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.

I believe that God created this universe in which we live near instantaneously. All in the time that we ascribe as six rotations of our planet. He populated the earth with man and His purpose in creating mankind and all of the universe which supports the eternal life of our planet is that one day He will cull from among all of the people who have lived, a body of people who will be His. On that day, God will be the God of those that He harvests from the earth and they will be His people. On that day, God will have completed the purpose for which He created this realm. Praise God!

God created this realm in which we live for a purpose and the Scriptures delineate for us how He is accomplishing that purpose. For me, the earth and the universe did not come about through some natural processes that science tries to convince us it did. No! The earth and the universe in which we live came about by the command of God who was setting in motion a plan which will be culminated on the day that He harvests those who are His from the earth. It is a perfect plan for God to attain His goal.

He created man and created a place for him to live. He has allowed man to live however he chooses, but has set among us His words that tell us who He is and why this realm exist and what we can do if we choose to be one of those people who will eternally live in peace with God. Where we will be His people and He will be our God.

I have found that by understanding this ultimate purpose of God, any idea that would teach that the created realm came about through some natural processes becomes just so much foolishness to me. This realm in which we live exists for nothing more than to provide a home for mankind. It was created by God as that home for mankind. For it to have existed for some eons of age prior to God's creating the first man just seems silly to me.

Finally, though old earthers will deny it vehemently, it does rob us of the full awareness of just how powerful and perfect this God, who created all things, really is. He merely spoke, and the earth appeared out of nothing spinning in a black inky void of nothingness. He just spoke, and the atmosphere of our earth was created. He just spoke, and all the plants and animals came to be. He just spoke, and the heavens of our universe was filled with a myriad of celestial bodies. He just lovingly stooped down upon the earth that He had only days earlier created and made man and set him in the garden. Everything both seen and unseen in this realm, God created that man might have life. Selah!

That's how I understand the how and the why of God's creating this realm in which man lives.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted

Totally agree, and if you understand the Gap Theory it also agrees. It just states that the earth was here without form and void. Some, myself included believe that there was an earth before this one. That during this earth is when Lucifer rebelled and was cast from heaven with one third of the angels, they hit the earth and destroyed it. I believe that is what happened to the dinosaurs. When you read Genesis 1, the earth is there, lifeless, void, a total mess. There are evidences for this, all around. by Genesis 3, over the next 6 days, God remodeled the planet.

In Christ
Josh

 

[Bluelion]

You have a few problems with that theory, one is light was created the first day, night and morning were day one, it then Goes by days. we know a day is 24hr however the sun which we get are days was not created, so was it 24 hours. It is interesting. Adam named all animals on the earth seems that day must have been longer, or God showed them to Adam in a way we do not understand, I think God showed them to Adam. The big question is was it 7 days or 7 thousand years. I believe it was 7 days, and in a young earth. That the earth Like man was created with the appearance of age.

 

[th1bill]

Josh,
There is a never discussed and never preached passage that God spoke three times that we must never add to nor never subtract from His word. For the Gap Theory to stand, both forbidden acts must be completed and that might, just, send a man to Hell. There is a rule I was taught by a few gray headed old men when I first entered God's service, high lighters were not invented and yet God did high light passages worthy of particular attention. Our LORD did this by repeating certain things twice and if we see God stating a thing three times we had better never find ourselves on the wrong side of that point.

We find this command, with the penalty prescribed, once in the Pentateuch, once in the Revelation and once more, I ave forgotten the address. The Gap Theory, like the Theory of Evolution, is of man and has no part with the men or sons of God.

 

[JoshuaDaryl]

Josh,
There is a never discussed and never preached passage that God spoke three times that we must never add to nor never subtract from His word. For the Gap Theory to stand, both forbidden acts must be completed and that might, just, send a man to Hell. There is a rule I was taught by a few gray headed old men when I first entered God's service, high lighters were not invented and yet God did high light passages worthy of particular attention. Our LORD did this by repeating certain things twice and if we see God stating a thing three times we had better never find ourselves on the wrong side of that point.

We find this command, with the penalty prescribed, once in the Pentateuch, once in the Revelation and once more, I ave forgotten the address. The Gap Theory, like the Theory of Evolution, is of man and has no part with the men or sons of God.

The theory comes not by adding or detracting anything, it has to do with the interpretation of the original language into english. I know just enough about translating languages to understand that the english language is a very unique language, in that it changes constantly, and it is very mechanical. Most of the old tongues were set, mature, this is why science uses Latin. The old tongues often used the same words for multiple meanings, it is the emphasis and the punctuation, combined with the context of the sentence it was in that determined meaning. Also the old languages did not set apart time, Genesis is a perfect example of this, from the beginning to the end we jump thousands of years. The example in the article I posted shows that in one verse Eve conceived Cain in the next verse she gives birth to Able, and in the same verse Able is a shepherd and I would guess at least in his teens, two verses covers close to two decades at least.

So in Genesis 1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. period, thats it
2 The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was[a] on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. What happened, there was no day one, nothing, God created space, planets, earth, nothing else. Then if you check your Bible there is a space between verses1,2 space then verse 3

3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 And God saw the light, that it was good; and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness He called Night. So the evening and the morning were the first day. This is where creation began, or thats my interpretation, for what it is worth. I just find it interesting to contemplate. No matter what, our God is an awesome God.

 

[JoshuaDaryl]

Now something interesting, looking at the Jewish Bible it is presented a bit differently...

Parashah 1: B’resheet (In the beginning) 1:1–6:8

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was unformed and void, darkness was on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God hovered over the surface of the water. 3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. So there was evening, and there was morning, one day.

This perspective clearly does not support the Gap theory, hmmmm, thus why it is good to converse and exchange ideas with the brethren, and why differing Bible interpretations can be useful.

 

[JoshuaDaryl]

I think I like how the Jewish Bible lays out the creation..



Genesis 1
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
Parashah 1: B’resheet (In the beginning) 1:1–6:8

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was unformed and void, darkness was on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God hovered over the surface of the water. 3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. So there was evening, and there was morning, one day.

6 God said, “Let there be a dome in the middle of the water; let it divide the water from the water.” 7 God made the dome and divided the water under the dome from the water above the dome; that is how it was, 8 and God called the dome Sky. So there was evening, and there was morning, a second day.

9 God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered together into one place, and let dry land appear,” and that is how it was. 10 God called the dry land Earth, the gathering together of the water he called Seas, and God saw that it was good.

11 God said, “Let the earth put forth grass, seed-producing plants, and fruit trees, each yielding its own kind of seed-bearing fruit, on the earth”; and that is how it was. 12 The earth brought forth grass, plants each yielding its own kind of seed, and trees each producing its own kind of seed-bearing fruit; and God saw that it was good. 13 So there was evening, and there was morning, a third day.

(A: ii) 14 God said, “Let there be lights in the dome of the sky to divide the day from the night; let them be for signs, seasons, days and years; 15 and let them be for lights in the dome of the sky to give light to the earth”; and that is how it was. 16 God made the two great lights — the larger light to rule the day and the smaller light to rule the night — and the stars. 17 God put them in the dome of the sky to give light to the earth, 18 to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness; and God saw that it was good. 19 So there was evening, and there was morning, a fourth day.

20 God said, “Let the water swarm with swarms of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth in the open dome of the sky.” 21 God created the great sea creatures and every living thing that creeps, so that the water swarmed with all kinds of them, and there was every kind of winged bird; and God saw that it was good. 22 Then God blessed them, saying, “Be fruitful, multiply and fill the water of the seas, and let birds multiply on the earth.” 23 So there was evening, and there was morning, a fifth day.

(A: iii) 24 God said, “Let the earth bring forth each kind of living creature — each kind of livestock, crawling animal and wild beast”; and that is how it was. 25 God made each kind of wild beast, each kind of livestock and every kind of animal that crawls along the ground; and God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, “Let us make humankind in our image, in the likeness of ourselves; and let them rule over the fish in the sea, the birds in the air, the animals, and over all the earth, and over every crawling creature that crawls on the earth.”

27 So God created humankind in his own image;
in the image of God he created him:
male and female he created them.
28 God blessed them: God said to them, “Be fruitful, multiply, fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea, the birds in the air and every living creature that crawls on the earth.” 29 Then God said, “Here! Throughout the whole earth I am giving you as food every seed-bearing plant and every tree with seed-bearing fruit. 30 And to every wild animal, bird in the air and creature crawling on the earth, in which there is a living soul, I am giving as food every kind of green plant.” And that is how it was. 31 God saw everything that he had made, and indeed it was very good. So there was evening, and there was morning, a sixth day.

 

[th1bill]

My next point, if it had been needed was the original teachings of the Rabbis. I prefer the NASB for it's word for word attempt at the translation of the Original Manuscripts. About that command from God, as you have found in your follow up, it is impossible to support the errant theory without adding to God's word, even if, just, in thought. I just wanted you to examine and to see. God blees.

 

[Bluelion]

Now something interesting, looking at the Jewish Bible it is presented a bit differently...

Parashah 1: B’resheet (In the beginning) 1:1–6:8

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was unformed and void, darkness was on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God hovered over the surface of the water. 3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. So there was evening, and there was morning, one day.

This perspective clearly does not support the Gap theory, hmmmm, thus why it is good to converse and exchange ideas with the brethren, and why differing Bible interpretations can be useful.

You see in the passage God spirit was hovering over the waters. Water has special important because God spirit was so close to it, though I am not sure what. look at water are body's are what 2 3rds water, we drink water to sustain our bodies, and a water baptism. any one have any more info on this?

sorry off topic I know but i do Love finding out secrets

 

[sheina]

Exodus 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Here's a link from Answers In Genesis about the age of the earth. There are some really good links to articles listed on this page:

Age Of The Earth

 

[now faith]

You have a few problems with that theory, one is light was created the first day, night and morning were day one, it then Goes by days. we know a day is 24hr however the sun which we get are days was not created, so was it 24 hours. It is interesting. Adam named all animals on the earth seems that day must have been longer, or God showed them to Adam in a way we do not understand, I think God showed them to Adam. The big question is was it 7 days or 7 thousand years. I believe it was 7 days, and in a young earth. That the earth Like man was created with the appearance of age.

I cannot debate,so I will post verse and mention verse on as a key that would make no mention of a gap,unless 1 and 2 were reversed.

Genesis: 1. 1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. 3. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4. And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. 5. And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day. 14. And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: 15. And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so. 16. And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. 17. And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, 18. And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.

 

[Bluelion]

I cannot debate,so I will post verse and mention verse on as a key that would make no mention of a gap,unless 1 and 2 were reversed.

Genesis: 1. 1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. 3. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4. And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. 5. And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day. 14. And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: 15. And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so. 16. And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. 17. And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, 18. And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.

Thank you brother

It is clear time was set up the second day, sense God is going by days and says days even after time has come to be it is clear He is going by days.

I must say sometimes I feel like a log in the ocean being tossed about, but God has hold of the rope on the log

 

[JoshuaDaryl]

Exodus 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Here's a link from Answers In Genesis about the age of the earth. There are some really good links to articles listed on this page:

Age Of The Earth

very interesting

 

[JoshuaDaryl]

You see in the passage God spirit was hovering over the waters. Water has special important because God spirit was so close to it, though I am not sure what. look at water are body's are what 2 3rds water, we drink water to sustain our bodies, and a water baptism. any one have any more info on this?

sorry off topic I know but i do Love finding out secrets

there could be something there