Officer Brailsford Acquitted in Execution of Compliant Unarmed Man

[Rick Otto]

Ex-police officer acquitted in killing of man who begged 'do not shoot me'

Texas man fatally shot by Mesa officer begged for life


I didn't notice any swearing, so this should be okay to post here:

I await our gilded leader's swift condemnation of this verdict.

Looks like cold blooded murder by a thoroughly unprofessional, emotionally adolescent sociopath on steroids.

 

[Rick Otto]

Seems like a waste of money...you're more likely to be killed by lightning than wrongfully killed by police.

I understand everyone gets upset when it happens...but it a nation with this much crime and this many police encounters, eventually some of them will go wrong.

Wrong? The cop walked away. Nothing he did was found to be wrong.
Do you have two definitions of"wrong"?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Again, you seem to be misunderstanding. Nobody said exact... Nor did I say it has to precisely mirror population rates.

However, if the law is being enforced equally, and the treatment of citizens by police is supposed to be applied consistently, then one would expect the outcome to be much more close to equal than a disparity of 2.7 to 1.

I bolded the part that is the flawed premise...

Why would you expect them to be "more close to equal"?

You're intentionally asking a loaded question here.

No...I'm just poking holes in garbage logic.

So, even though I know you're going to twist this answer into claiming that I'm "working off of a flawed premise", I'll answer this as concisely as I can.

The rates do not have to be exact mirrors of population sizes, however, a disparity of 2.7:1 is a reasonable cause for concern and worth looking into.


Why don't you just come out with what you're trying to imply here? We all know what you're getting at.

Why do you think that there's a more than 10 to 1 disparity between men and women on these incidents?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Wrong? The cop walked away. Nothing he did was found to be wrong.
Do you have two definitions of"wrong"?

No...I consider the cop's actions to be wrong regardless of verdict in this case.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I bolded the part that is the flawed premise...

Why would you expect them to be "more close to equal"?

...because when a white person is acting out violently vs. a black person, I don't expect the police officer to react differently in those two situations.

 

[Ana the Ist]

...because when a white person is acting out violently vs. a black person, I don't expect the police officer to react differently in those two situations.

What makes you think they do?

 

[Ana the Ist]

...because when a white person is acting out violently vs. a black person, I don't expect the police officer to react differently in those two situations.

The best figures I could come up with is that about 30 women will be killed by police this year...out of almost a thousand.

Even if I boost that number way up to 50...by your "logic" men should only be killed by police 48-49 times because that would be "more equal" to their population rates.

Do you really think there's some crazy amount of sexism going on in every police department all across the U.S.??

Or maybe...just maybe...men actually commit more violent crimes than women and therefore end up in situations where they find themselves more likely to be killed by police?

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Do you really think there's some crazy amount of sexism going on in every police department all across the U.S.??

Or maybe...just maybe...men actually commit more violent crimes than women and therefore end up in situations where they find themselves more likely to be killed by police?

Couple different things can explain that.

One, most cops are male, men are stronger than women, so men are less likely to need to use a gun when apprehending a woman as he can usually just use strength.

Two, there is scientifically sound data pertaining to brain chemistry that absolutely suggests that men have more of natural tendency to be aggressive compared to their female counterparts.


Are you suggesting that one of these two things is true when evaluating the racial disparity with the use of force? Is there some study that I missed that would indicate that black people have a natural tendency toward violent outbursts? Sounds like the kind of "studies" that used to get released in the papers in the south back in the 1940's

 

[Ana the Ist]

Couple different things can explain that.

One, most cops are male, men are stronger than women, so men are less likely to need to use a gun when apprehending a woman as he can usually just use strength.

Two, there is scientifically sound data pertaining to brain chemistry that absolutely suggests that men have more of natural tendency to be aggressive compared to their female counterparts.

Yet neither of those things actually explain why men commit far more violent crimes.

I'd also like to see what science and "brain chemistry" you're talking about...as far as I know, there's no causal link between testosterone levels and violence.

Are you suggesting that one of these two things is true when evaluating the racial disparity with the use of force? Is there some study that I missed that would indicate that black people have a natural tendency toward violent outbursts? Sounds like the kind of "studies" that used to get released in the papers in the south back in the 1940's

I'm suggesting that when 6% of a population commits at least 50% of the violent crimes...yes, we would expect them to run into these incidents more often.

Obviously circumstances have to be accounted for in some fashion. A cop isn't all that likely to gun down the cashier who rings up his coffee in the morning...so simply "interacting" with a cop isn't of much use in this discussion.

Rather, it seems that being engaged in violent behavior, and crimes especially, would be the biggest causal factor.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I'm suggesting that when 6% of a population commits at least 50% of the violent crimes...yes, we would expect them to run into these incidents more often.

Obviously circumstances have to be accounted for in some fashion. A cop isn't all that likely to gun down the cashier who rings up his coffee in the morning...so simply "interacting" with a cop isn't of much use in this discussion.

Rather, it seems that being engaged in violent behavior, and crimes especially, would be the biggest causal factor.

So it would seem we keep going in circles here. Like I said before, is there a particular point you'd like to just directly make about the black community instead of indirectly implying it?

Clearly that's what you're going for here so why not just directly say it?

Or are you going for the old "Liberal policies have wrecked the black community" angle?

In either case, it seems like you're trying to steer the conversation toward the "if a group is getting roughed up by the police more than another, it's probably their own darn fault" talking points.

 

[Auriga]

So it would seem we keep going in circles here. Like I said before, is there a particular point you'd like to just directly make about the black community instead of indirectly implying it?

Clearly that's what you're going for here so why not just directly say it?

Or are you going for the old "Liberal policies have wrecked the black community" angle?

Speaking of the black community, why hasn't Black Lives Matter protested about this shooting? I mean, it was clearly an execution. It doesn't get more obvious than this.

 

[Ana the Ist]

So it would seem we keep going in circles here. Like I said before, is there a particular point you'd like to just directly make about the black community instead of indirectly implying it?

Clearly that's what you're going for here so why not just directly say it?

Or are you going for the old "Liberal policies have wrecked the black community" angle?

Lol what have I been saying this whole time?

When a segment of the population commits such a massively disproportionate amount of the violent crimes...they're probably going to be subject to a disproportionate number of these incidents. I'm not sure how many ways I can state it....

You've already dismissed any examination of cultural factors out of hand...for reasons I can only guess. I've somewhat charitably left those out....just for you buddy.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Speaking of the black community, why hasn't Black Lives Matter protested about this shooting? I mean, it was clearly an execution. It doesn't get more obvious than this.

Black Lives Matter Supporters Call Attention to Graphic Video of Arizona Shooting

 

[Auriga]

Black Lives Matter Supporters Call Attention to Graphic Video of Arizona Shooting

Well, it's nice to see them say a few things about it--their supporters, anyway. I'm just surprised that this wasn't something to have a protest out in the streets about, being that it was so well documented as to what happened, and yet the shooter still got away with it.

 

[RDKirk]

Speaking of the black community, why hasn't Black Lives Matter protested about this shooting? I mean, it was clearly an execution. It doesn't get more obvious than this.

Why do you expect a group called "Black Lives Matter" to protest it for you?

Why doesn't "All Lives Matter" protest the shooting?

After every one of these shootings, I always ask: "Why don't white people seem to care about police unjustly shooting white people?"

Take the juries, for instance. They don't seem to care, and they're mostly (if not wholly) white.

 

[RDKirk]

Well, it's nice to see them say a few things about it--their supporters, anyway. I'm just surprised that this wasn't something to have a protest out in the streets about, being that it was so well documented as to what happened, and yet the shooter still got away with it.

Why aren't you out in the streets? Have you so much as written an angry letter to a legislator?

 

[Auriga]

Why do you expect a group called "Black Lives Matter" to protest it for you?

I guess I was hoping they would think that it wasn't only black lives that mattered. What we've seen so far is that they'll go out and riot in the streets and set fires to businesses and police cars when a black person is shot, even if he had just committed a crime--but when a white person is shot lying on the floor trying to comply with police instructions, they remain surprisingly quiet and peaceful.

 

[Auriga]

Why aren't you out in the streets?

I guess I don't believe in violence as being the answer.

Have you so much as written an angry letter to a legislator?

It wasn't a legislator that shot the guy.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Why doesn't "All Lives Matter" protest the shooting?

Is "All Lives Matter" actually a protest group?

 

[Ana the Ist]

In either case, it seems like you're trying to steer the conversation toward the "if a group is getting roughed up by the police more than another, it's probably their own darn fault" talking points.

Since you decided to tack that on afterwards...I'll address it separately.

You brought up a disparity. You blamed racist cops for it. You did, as far as I can tell, exactly zero examination of other possibilities...and you also seem highly critical of any other possibilities without ever examining them. Why is that? Are you genuinely interested in examining the causes of a disparity? Or is it just easier to blame cops...and get yourself a nice pat on the back for it?

Let's run with your Jewish family analogy...

Same 500 families, same 2 Jewish ones...but in this hypothetical, those two Jewish families are committing 50% of the violent crime in that community. Would you expect to see them encounter the police at a largely disproportional rate? Would you expect them to become involved in incidents of police violence at a higher rate?

You could, of course, blame the cops for being anti-semitic...but you'd probably go a lot further towards actually solving the problem if you figured out why those two Jewish families were committing so many violent crimes.