Obesity enabler or supportive husband?

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We’ve been married for 20 years. Both 49 with 1 child in school still. She’s clinically obese to The point of being partially disabled( can’t walk more than 10-15 minutes a day). Also has cholesterol of 350+, and recently diagnosed as “pre diabetic”.

But she feels her weight is under control(though she’s gained 50lb in the last 2 years), the amount of red meat she eats - 40+ ounces per week - doesn’t matter (because “her cholesterol is hereditary” ), and her eating sweets and candy also don’t matter (because “the fatty tissue is causing the insulin problems”). The quotes are her rationales.

I lay this this out to highlight the severity of the problem and the depth of the dilemma.

since she can’t really walk, I shop , clean, cook, kid, etc. Part of having her Weight “under control” involves her making menus of what she will eat throughout the week. This involves moderately complex multi ingredient recipies ( some that are rich, some that are light versions of comfort foods,a handful that are truly healthy) that she says she needs “because these are the foods I will eat”. In addition to those, she keeps on hand nutrition-less snacks, sugary sweets, and the occasional bucket of fried chicken.

here’s the kicker - since she can’t really walk to shop or prep food, I shop for and cook everything (as well as clean before and after). According to her, all of this stuff is “on her plan” to lose weight and if I don’t help make it happen then I’m “part of the problem and not the solution”.

it gets deeper in that, of course this plan doesn’t work. There is a decade of evidence to show this. But, when I question the plan, the discussion becomes about how I am “not invested enough” in the plan and that is why the plan isn’t working. These are walkout-level arguments where she has previously left with the kid for the day. (And a few times has ended up going to KFC to cool off - no lie).

When she returns, to keep the peace (and the marriage!?) I pick back up with the plan.

so, the question as the title states: am I enabling or supportive?

And if you have and advice, I am in need of guidance.

FYI:
- she has declined counseling saying this further shows I am not invested in working with her
- I have never commented negatively on her weight (in fact she has lingering resentment because “I never told her she was gaining weight” with the first 100 pounds
- if I offer and/or cook up healthy meals, and she wants something else, she will force herself up, cook what she wants, then blame me for the pain that it causes her and brings this up As further evidence that I am not on board with the plan
 
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Sabertooth

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If you guys share a family practice/GP doctor, you should bring these questions to him/her. Most couples (like us) have authorized medical disclosure to their spouse.

If your wife hasn't authorized such a disclosure, you are still allowed to voice your concerns and request general advice whether you share the same doctor or not. (They just wouldn't be able to share the specifics of her condition or conversations.)
 
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Thanks for the response. But the doctors opinion isn’t the issue. He’s said lose weight, eat better, cut down on red meat, exccercise, etc. Among other things, she believes pork isn’t red meat. She also didn’t accept the idea of caloric deficit for about 15 years. That’s what I’m dealing with.

But my question still stands: is this enabling or supporting?

and what’s a proper response?
 
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Endeavourer

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The proper response is to not go along with anything you aren't enthusiastic about.

This is a complex problem which is involving significant gaslighting and manipulation by her in order to feed her food addictions. I'd recommend you post your initial post on the forums marriagebuilders.com, which is a site run by an amazing Christian marriage counselor who at one time in his career ran a chain of addiction clinics. His experience is that a spouse will always choose a hit over their marriage so addictions must be addressed before a marriage can be worked on. Per your description, this has been what you have been living with.

The forums are free and are run by volunteers who have been intensely trained in Dr. Harley's methods and have access to Dr. Harley's opinion in person if there are any questions about their advice to posters.

My sincere advice would be to carefully and meticulously follow the advice you receive at marriagebuilders. Dr. Harley has put a lifetime of study into what works to save marriages from addictions and poor behaviors.

Discussion Forum (Marriage Builders®)
 
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We’ve been married for 20 years. Both 49 with 1 child in school still. She’s clinically obese to The point of being partially disabled( can’t walk more than 10-15 minutes a day). Also has cholesterol of 350+, and recently diagnosed as “pre diabetic”.

But she feels her weight is under control(though she’s gained 50lb in the last 2 years), the amount of red meat she eats - 40+ ounces per week - doesn’t matter (because “her cholesterol is hereditary” ), and her eating sweets and candy also don’t matter (because “the fatty tissue is causing the insulin problems”). The quotes are her rationales.

I lay this this out to highlight the severity of the problem and the depth of the dilemma.

since she can’t really walk, I shop , clean, cook, kid, etc. Part of having her Weight “under control” involves her making menus of what she will eat throughout the week. This involves moderately complex multi ingredient recipies ( some that are rich, some that are light versions of comfort foods,a handful that are truly healthy) that she says she needs “because these are the foods I will eat”. In addition to those, she keeps on hand nutrition-less snacks, sugary sweets, and the occasional bucket of fried chicken.

here’s the kicker - since she can’t really walk to shop or prep food, I shop for and cook everything (as well as clean before and after). According to her, all of this stuff is “on her plan” to lose weight and if I don’t help make it happen then I’m “part of the problem and not the solution”.

it gets deeper in that, of course this plan doesn’t work. There is a decade of evidence to show this. But, when I question the plan, the discussion becomes about how I am “not invested enough” in the plan and that is why the plan isn’t working. These are walkout-level arguments where she has previously left with the kid for the day. (And a few times has ended up going to KFC to cool off - no lie).

When she returns, to keep the peace (and the marriage!?) I pick back up with the plan.

so, the question as the title states: am I enabling or supportive?

And if you have and advice, I am in need of guidance.

FYI:
- she has declined counseling saying this further shows I am not invested in working with her
- I have never commented negatively on her weight (in fact she has lingering resentment because “I never told her she was gaining weight” with the first 100 pounds
- if I offer and/or cook up healthy meals, and she wants something else, she will force herself up, cook what she wants, then blame me for the pain that it causes her and brings this up As further evidence that I am not on board with the plan

That's a very difficult position to be in. I would go with the advice of the other member and seek a professional.
 
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That's a very difficult position to be in. I would go with the advice of the other member and seek a professional.
Arc F1:
Thanks for those words. I have done one sided counseling a few times over. It seems to boil down to “you can’t change / control her. You can only change / control your actions”. And “Why do you want to control her?”. Another very insightful counselor said “ you will be dealing with intense homeostasis, so be very prepared”. He also teased out over the course of a few months that I had likely grown up in a narcissistic Family cycle, which explained why I am such a pleaser and would accept behavior that was so obviously toXic.

But There was very little proscriptive from those folks beyond “love unconditionally”, “ show her “you love her to build intimacy throughout each day, week, month”. “Set boundaries.” But The last guy at one point asked, do you think she will divorce you. It came a bit out of the blue, but he was jumping to the endpoint. How was this going to play out when it ultimately came to a head. It’s seemed like she would a few times. she’s even said “I don’t know why I married you” and “why I stay with you”. But if she left, she’d need so much support that it seems unlikely.

I was one this site a few years back and received great advice , I think from Endeavourer and others, on love banks, giver / taker aspects of our personalities, and a few other things. I went gung ho for several months. But her eating habits didn’t change, which lessened my buy in over time. And, small mistakes (forgetting an item at the grocery store) brought on teary-eyed sessions that put me right back into the position of being part of the problem. There just wasn’t enough positive feedback for my efforts at the sixth month mark. I still am attentive and loving , give small gifts, cook special meals, have quality time and dates, etc, I just don’t see them changing anything.
 
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Its enabling, but you need to change the way you look at the problem.
She is obese because of a few reasons: Our bodys tell us to stop eating because of two things, jaw fatigue and nutritional intake. She continues to eat because her body IS NOT telling her she is full, AKA, nutritional deficiency's. Get off of processed foods, non-organic foods and the like. Only buy organic, especially fruits and vegetables. Sounds like there are underlying emotional issues as well. I highly encourage you to click on the link below, Helps to emotional stability. We cannot change other people but we can change ourselves... How old is she?
 
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Endeavourer

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But There was very little proscriptive from those folks beyond “love unconditionally”, “ show her “you love her to build intimacy throughout each day, week, month”.

Ugh. This is just so damaging to the person being rolled under the other person's self centric behaviors.

she’s even said “I don’t know why I married you” and “why I stay with you”.

Simply gaslighting and manipulation. The stages of manipulation are: a) selfish demand, defined as the spouse wanting something the other person doesn't even if at the other's expense, b) disrespectful judgments designed to make it too painful for the other person not to comply, and if that doesn't work, it's usually followed by (c) an anger outburst the escalate the pain so the other person complies. Your wife cycles through these stages frequently.. because they work on you. I will assign the word "abuse" to this cycle, since I'd define abuse as anything one spouse purposefully does at the other's expense. The scale of abuse is that it can be rare and fleeting, or it can be hardened, persistent and unrelenting.

One of the hardest things for a target of abuse to absorb is how their behaviors and acquiescence help enable the abuse to continue. There is a tinge of "blaming the victim" in this, which is just really hard for the target to accept. However, the target is not to be blamed - but the target needs to learn behaviors that will set boundaries in order to not have to dwell with those behaviors.

I was one this site a few years back and received great advice , I think from Endeavourer and others, on love banks, giver / taker aspects of our personalities, and a few other things. I went gung ho for several months.

But her eating habits didn’t change, which lessened my buy in over time.

This is the intense homeostasis that the other counselor referenced. Her addiction is stronger than her care for you.

Marriagebuilders will provide extensive, step by step help you push through this. As you have discovered, going half measures or trying to follow your own way in this has not been successful. I would urge you to trust, literally blindly, the advice on that site and do it even if it's hard and you fear the disruption it might cause. Your situation **needs** disruption. It will likely come down to her having to experience the reality she has created for herself in its full measure - without you protecting her from it.

**Your behaviors thus far are protecting her from the consequences of her actions.**

One way or another, you will have successful change. Either she will join you in a marriage of mutual extraordinary care or you will have removed all doubt that she will ever chose to do that and then can make decisions accordingly.

One of the steps marriagebuilders walks you through, if that happens, will be a therapeutic separation... where you give her the message that you love her and want to be married forever, but you need the pattern of mutual care to change. When she is willing to change this pattern you are very much looking forward to resuming the marriage. This step is recommended fairly soon for women, who are not created in a way they can sustain long term damaging relationships, but the recommendation for men is usually made after about 6 months of work without results. Each situation is different but those are averages.

((hugs and prayers))
 
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I'm sorry this is happening to you.

Its okay to admit you enable - why? It's the only way to learn to move forward. Learn about these tendencies, and learn more about yourself. This isn't a slam, putdown, etc. The reason I say this is if you can recognize traits in yourself...then you can learn how to combat those behaviors. Next thing you recognize is that you have grown. That's not a small thing either even if it is one tiny step at a time.

You are dealing with an addict in a sense. Food addicts will say just about anything to make you give them their drug. Your first step is to work on yourself, because you don't get anywhere if you don't. One of you needs to step forward, and she really doesn't have any incentive to do so does she? If she throws a big enough fit - she pretty much gets what she wants.

Learning about enabling behavior, and how to painfully and slowly learn to grow beyond that? It will be best for you - first of all - and for her. Learning about your traits, and what might be motivating them can be empowering. You need to be empowered in order to find a path forward. Once you learn what is triggering you? You find the tools to stop yourself, and it might at first feel like it is overwhelming. The first step always is. Then you find out you didn't die, and it makes it easier going forward.

I remember when I was young woman, and had to step up to a bully in my life that would run me over - and I tried the nice and understanding approach until it did great damage to ME! The soft approach that to many don't recognize that gives the bully the green light signal to continue isn't the way to go always. To many refuse to recognize this as well. Talk about getting the short end of the stick from the bully and the advice givers at the same time. It crushed me more. One day and I don't know what came over me - the bully started the normal show and I just got up and walked away. They continued of course, but so did I. I didn't respond to the triggers in the bully's speech that they knew always worked on me. I just kept going. After I had my private cry I realized I felt better, and actually got angry at the experience. I started to walk away in the future when conversations became irrational once again...and heard how I was always walking away when things got rough, walking away from reality, etc. The bully was wrong. Walking away was power to me. I recognized a no win circumstance, and I refused to stay and be the whipping boy. That was my first step, and I was shaking at times. Today, when I get into uncomfortable circumstances with others besides the bully? There are times I have to push myself again...to walk away. I'm good at it with the bully of my past, but doing it under other circumstances I recognized was not the same kind of easy I overcome with them. My trait that I had to overcome. It happens less and less today, and it may always be there. Yet, I find the strength to do it so much easier than so many years ago. I also remind myself to pat myself on the back when I do. I'm good with it, and its their problem if they don't like it.

You need to find that one something in your life that maybe hard and agonizing at first, but you know deep down needs to happen...then do it. Then do it again. Then learn to just keep on doing each time. It may never stop being messy, but it's okay. Happily ever after is for fairytales. I don't live in a story book.

I remember a couple of weeks ago I was dealing with a jerk on something. They needed my help, and was being as ugly as a person could be - they were frustrated but I didn't need the attitude taken out on me. I told them, "If I have to ask you to stop again? I'm out of here, and you can figure it out by yourself. I'm done. Your MOVE!" They stopped, but I know I would have left if they didn't. lol couldn't say that when I was a young person. Chances are they would continue to get warnings, because my anxiety or whatever it was at that point had me frozen in fear. Learning about my fear and how to overcome it was the best thing I did for me - and others.

You can do it too!
 
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Endeavourer

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I'm sorry this is happening to you.

Its okay to admit you enable - why? It's the only way to learn to move forward. Learn about these tendencies, and learn more about yourself. This isn't a slam, putdown, etc. The reason I say this is if you can recognize traits in yourself...then you can learn how to combat those behaviors. Next thing you recognize is that you have grown. That's not a small thing either even if it is one tiny step at a time.

You are dealing with an addict in a sense. Food addicts will say just about anything to make you give them their drug. Your first step is to work on yourself, because you don't get anywhere if you don't. One of you needs to step forward, and she really doesn't have any incentive to do so does she? If she throws a big enough fit - she pretty much gets what she wants.

Learning about enabling behavior, and how to painfully and slowly learn to grow beyond that? It will be best for you - first of all - and for her. Learning about your traits, and what might be motivating them can be empowering. You need to be empowered in order to find a path forward. Once you learn what is triggering you? You find the tools to stop yourself, and it might at first feel like it is overwhelming. The first step always is. Then you find out you didn't die, and it makes it easier going forward.

I remember when I was young woman, and had to step up to a bully in my life that would run me over - and I tried the nice and understanding approach until it did great damage to ME! The soft approach that to many don't recognize that gives the bully the green light signal to continue isn't the way to go always. To many refuse to recognize this as well. Talk about getting the short end of the stick from the bully and the advice givers at the same time. It crushed me more. One day and I don't know what came over me - the bully started the normal show and I just got up and walked away. They continued of course, but so did I. I didn't respond to the triggers in the bully's speech that they knew always worked on me. I just kept going. After I had my private cry I realized I felt better, and actually got angry at the experience. I started to walk away in the future when conversations became irrational once again...and heard how I was always walking away when things got rough, walking away from reality, etc. The bully was wrong. Walking away was power to me. I recognized a no win circumstance, and I refused to stay and be the whipping boy. That was my first step, and I was shaking at times. Today, when I get into uncomfortable circumstances with others besides the bully? There are times I have to push myself again...to walk away. I'm good at it with the bully of my past, but doing it under other circumstances I recognized was not the same kind of easy I overcome with them. My trait that I had to overcome. It happens less and less today, and it may always be there. Yet, I find the strength to do it so much easier than so many years ago. I also remind myself to pat myself on the back when I do. I'm good with it, and its their problem if they don't like it.

You need to find that one something in your life that maybe hard and agonizing at first, but you know deep down needs to happen...then do it. Then do it again. Then learn to just keep on doing each time. It may never stop being messy, but it's okay. Happily ever after is for fairytales. I don't live in a story book.

I remember a couple of weeks ago I was dealing with a jerk on something. They needed my help, and was being as ugly as a person could be - they were frustrated but I didn't need the attitude taken out on me. I told them, "If I have to ask you to stop again? I'm out of here, and you can figure it out by yourself. I'm done. Your MOVE!" They stopped, but I know I would have left if they didn't. lol couldn't say that when I was a young person. Chances are they would continue to get warnings, because my anxiety or whatever it was at that point had me frozen in fear. Learning about my fear and how to overcome it was the best thing I did for me - and others.

You can do it too!

Great post!

There are a lot of smaller "walking away" type of steps that can be used before engaging the ultimate one of a therapeutic marital separation - one being whether or not she will accept "I'm not enthusiastic about that" as a point of caring for her husband.
 
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Its enabling, but you need to change the way you look at the problem.
She is obese because of a few reasons: Our bodys tell us to stop eating because of two things, jaw fatigue and nutritional intake. She continues to eat because her body IS NOT telling her she is full, AKA, nutritional deficiency's. Get off of processed foods, non-organic foods and the like. Only buy organic, especially fruits and vegetables. Sounds like there are underlying emotional issues as well. I highly encourage you to click on the link below, Helps to emotional stability. We cannot change other people but we can change ourselves... How old is she?

Thanks for this.

Buying / cooking organic and healthy doesn’t seem to be the issue. She will only eat this way for about 36 hours at a time.

we are both 49

The issue with stomach fullness response also doesn’t appear to be the issue. For a very long time she would eat until she was “uncomfortable” 2-3 times per week. She would openly acknowledge this behavior. She admits now that she ate and kept eating because it made her happy.

I’ll check out the link.

PS: removing processed foods from the house is met with a great deal of resistance.
 
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Simply gaslighting and manipulation. The stages of manipulation are: a) selfish demand, defined as the spouse wanting something the other person doesn't even if at the other's expense, b) disrespectful judgments designed to make it too painful for the other person not to comply, and if that doesn't work, it's usually followed by (c) an anger outburst the escalate the pain so the other person complies. Your wife cycles through these stages frequently.. because they work on you.

**Your behaviors thus far are protecting her from the consequences of her actions.**

((hugs and prayers))

I’m trembling reading this. It’s the blueprint of our interactions around this topic (and two others) for over a decade. I keep journals and I keep seeing myself writing - why must every disagreement, no matter how small, over these three topics end either with her anger, her tears, or my capitulation. Those three stages you laid out, It’s like clockwork.... I guess because they work.

and I do see that I’m helping to keep the status who going
 
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Endeavourer

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I’m trembling reading this. It’s the blueprint of our interactions around this topic (and two others) for over a decade. I keep journals and I keep seeing myself writing - why must every disagreement, no matter how small, over these three topics end either with her anger, her tears, or my capitulation. Those three stages you laid out, It’s like clockwork.... I guess because they work.

and I do see that I’m helping to keep the status who going

I'm so sorry. Happyheart is an MD. You should respond to her and follow her suggestions. If you do, other amazing veterans of great marriage building expertise will chime in and help you break that cycle.
 
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I'm sorry this is happening to you.

Its okay to admit you enable - why? It's the only way to learn to move forward. Learn about these tendencies, and learn more about yourself. This isn't a slam, putdown, etc. The reason I say this is if you can recognize traits in yourself...then you can learn how to combat those behaviors. Next thing you recognize is that you have grown. That's not a small thing either even if it is one tiny step at a time.

You are dealing with an addict in a sense. Food addicts will say just about anything to make you give them their drug. Your first step is to work on yourself, because you don't get anywhere if you don't. One of you needs to step forward, and she really doesn't have any incentive to do so does she? If she throws a big enough fit - she pretty much gets what she wants.

Learning about enabling behavior, and how to painfully and slowly learn to grow beyond that? It will be best for you - first of all - and for her. Learning about your traits, and what might be motivating them can be empowering. You need to be empowered in order to find a path forward. Once you learn what is triggering you? You find the tools to stop yourself, and it might at first feel like it is overwhelming. The first step always is. Then you find out you didn't die, and it makes it easier going forward.

I remember when I was young woman, and had to step up to a bully in my life that would run me over - and I tried the nice and understanding approach until it did great damage to ME! The soft approach that to many don't recognize that gives the bully the green light signal to continue isn't the way to go always. To many refuse to recognize this as well. Talk about getting the short end of the stick from the bully and the advice givers at the same time. It crushed me more. One day and I don't know what came over me - the bully started the normal show and I just got up and walked away. They continued of course, but so did I. I didn't respond to the triggers in the bully's speech that they knew always worked on me. I just kept going. After I had my private cry I realized I felt better, and actually got angry at the experience. I started to walk away in the future when conversations became irrational once again...and heard how I was always walking away when things got rough, walking away from reality, etc. The bully was wrong. Walking away was power to me. I recognized a no win circumstance, and I refused to stay and be the whipping boy. That was my first step, and I was shaking at times. Today, when I get into uncomfortable circumstances with others besides the bully? There are times I have to push myself again...to walk away. I'm good at it with the bully of my past, but doing it under other circumstances I recognized was not the same kind of easy I overcome with them. My trait that I had to overcome. It happens less and less today, and it may always be there. Yet, I find the strength to do it so much easier than so many years ago. I also remind myself to pat myself on the back when I do. I'm good with it, and its their problem if they don't like it.

You need to find that one something in your life that maybe hard and agonizing at first, but you know deep down needs to happen...then do it. Then do it again. Then learn to just keep on doing each time. It may never stop being messy, but it's okay. Happily ever after is for fairytales. I don't live in a story book.

I remember a couple of weeks ago I was dealing with a jerk on something. They needed my help, and was being as ugly as a person could be - they were frustrated but I didn't need the attitude taken out on me. I told them, "If I have to ask you to stop again? I'm out of here, and you can figure it out by yourself. I'm done. Your MOVE!" They stopped, but I know I would have left if they didn't. lol couldn't say that when I was a young person. Chances are they would continue to get warnings, because my anxiety or whatever it was at that point had me frozen in fear. Learning about my fear and how to overcome it was the best thing I did for me - and others.

You can do it too!

thank you so much for your story. Hearing what others have gone through pits things in perspective. Not in terms of what is / not reasonable and what can / not be done about it. Your words are inspiring.
 
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